Wanting to be a commercial 737/747 Pilot

[Dangus125]

Hello All,

I am 15 and currently living in Australia, I want to be a 737 or 747 Pilot i was just wanting some experienced pilot advice on this subject. On the easiest quickest ways to become a International Pilot.

Would it be easier to join the Air-Force become a Fighter Pilot then after my minimum service time is up Apply for a commercial job?

And also what subjects should i take at School and What is the average pay rate for a 737,747 Pilot?



Help would be MUCH Appreciated.


Desmond:)

[Chilli Corneto]

There's no easy, quick way to become a Pilot. :=

You'll have to start working hard now and for the duration of your flying career. 40+ years.

At 15 I would suggest you do Maths & Physics at school then look at some sort of back up plan. I.e. do an apprenticeship in a trade like an electrician. Just in case something happens that means you can no longer fly. Loss of medical for example.

If you went on an integrated full time course at 18 then the chances are you might get into a jet or turbo prop when you qualify but you probably won't see a 747 until you're at least 30+. And that's if you're in the RHS by the time you're 20. Your first few years as a FO will be doing short haul stuff all around the country, getting up at stupid O'clock in the morning and working till you're shattered. You won't see the glitzy high life of long haul travel for many many years. Many people will argue that it isn't even glamourous anyway. :hmm:

You could look at the Military too.

Keep you sights aimed low. Don't fall into the egotistical trap of 'I want to be an airline pilot and anything smaller than a scarebus or Boeing is no good' :ugh:

If you get the chance to fly something and be paid to do it, don't turn your nose up at it.

Remain realistic, work hard, save money where you can when you're employeed and never give up. You patience will tested to it's extremes!!!

Good luck.

Chilli.

[Vems]

If you're doing it for the money then please, don't do it.

I wouldn't want you around when I'm in the air.

[Mikehotel152]

I suggest you read the thread behind this link (http://www.pprune.org/professional-pilot-training-includes-ground-studies/131649-archive-reference-threads-posting-guidelines-read-before-you-post-question.html) as it will answer most of your questions.

Anyhow, there are no experienced pilots in this part of Pprune. We're pretty much all wannabes. All except for WWW, but he's really actually a wannabe wannabe...;):p

[Easy Glider]

Vems...... Just cuious what you think gives you the right to tell someone why they should or shouldn't do a job, (any job,) for the money????? Believe me, I ONLY fly because I get paid at the end of the month______no other reason! If I won the lottery or inherited vast wealth......I would stop flying.....simple as that.

[fabbe92]

Just wondering since I have heard that you have to work hard for your entire career, and I am fully prepared to do that. You have to get up early and work for 12 hours back and forward and do longhauls and be out of town for several days when you are older. Okay that is a part of the job and sine I like it anyway I think I have the pilot disorder in my brain like all the airline pilots:}. But since all I hear is work and sacrifice, work and scrifice will there be anything at the end of the tunnel? The pay doesn´t matter and the biggest pay for me is that I get to fly. But will the day come when you lean back and say, ahhhhhh, I am finally there?


Thanks and lets not argue again and I appologize once again for the other thread.
//Fabbe92:ok:

[The Ginger Prince]

Hello mate - saw your question and I thought I would chip in with my thoughts.

You go for it chap.

I wanted to do the same at your age but was academically weak. I'm now in my forties and just embarking on my dream career. I have worked in another industry to get the money together to fund the training and have studied to get the brain sharp enough to do the job.

School subjects; Maths, Physics, IT, Technical, and a language or two.

The first thing to remember is that training costs money so you will need to get that together first. Modular training where you do bits at a time is historically the cheapest and at times of good employment no barrier to getting a job. Integrated training is the other option, this takes you from the pavement to a First Officers job in one process but costs considerably more. Some airlines prefer this method - some don't. If you have access to the sum of money needed to do this say £70-80,000 then it is the most time efficient way to do it.

Now as for the military option it is important to look at this as not just a stepping stone but another career option in itself. Military life is not for everyone but speaking from personal experience it can also be a very rewarding one.
Beware though that becoming a fast jet jock is NOT a given and is harder to get into than a lot of airline jobs. Be prepared to be tested, and pushed and tested and pushed to your limits again and again. Flash job though.

The Military will help develop you as a person and bring out your leadership skills at the same time - all very useful in the cockpit enviroment.
You never know you may actually find yourself liking it and staying. I have a number of friends in the forces who wouldn't want to do anything else - but also some who have served their time and are now looking for a new challenge. Everybody is different. Give yourself a chance to find out what you want.

If you do go down this route - I would advise that you do this with your eyes open and not as a stepping stone. You'll probably go bonkers with frustration waiting to be rotated out if that's all you want.

Right now get yourself up to your local airfield and start looking for any kind of part-time job that is available from emptying the bins to sweeping the hangar floor. Pilots are a decent bunch at heart and I'm sure you will soon be offered a back seat or two which will help you understand what's involved and give you a good background for when you start the PPL.

The important thing is you want to fly. I think that's enough.:D

[Whirlygig]

Easy Glider, why did you become a pilot then? If you just wanted a job that paid well, you'd have had much less heartache if you'd become an accountant or dentist :}

Or did you come from the military, trained to fly, left with no other trade or profession and thus feel that there was no alternative? Agreed that there aren't many things more soul destroying than being in a job you don't enjoy but you always have a choice even if you believe you're trapped.

And I agree with Vems, that working with someone in that situation is not good for morale all round. It is far better to work with people, in whatever profession, who are enthusiastic and love their job.

Cheers

Whirls

[Easy Glider]

Whirlygig...the vast, vast, VAST majority of who work, do so simply for the pay check at the end of the month. If you ask almost anyone whether they would continue working following a large lottery win/inheritance or whatever, the answer would almost certainly be a resounding "no!"

I got into aviation primarily by accident, (no I wasn't in the military.) I don't hate it but certainly don't love it either and if I didn't have bills to pay I wouldn't do it. What I am saying is that if someone wants to do a job for the pay, there is nothing wrong with that and no one has the right to critisize them for their employment choices.

[Whirlygig]

True, I'd give up my day job and become a full-tine pilot :ok:. However, yours and my stories are examples that it makes sense to start on a career which you love rather than fall into.

In my profession, I've trained students who were obviosly in it for the money and it's demoralising for me to train someone who shows no real keenness for the job; I try not to recruit those anymore.

You could always change career :} and do something you've always wanted to do since you were a child.

Cheers

Whirls

[White Otter]

fabbe - I think you have that moment the first time you get to enough money to live off from flying. I was having a conversation with my instructor about a guy on the same frequency as us who was flying a Spitfire and he was saying how lucky that guy was, but then he said I suppose any job that pays you to fly is good. Very true.

[Easy Glider]

I'm quite sure no one will listen, (you guys never do on this forum,) but at the end of the day flying is just a job!! When you have done it for 15 years, believe me, you will be FAR more interested in what you are actually being paid, and what your terms and conditions are rather than "the love of the job". The trouble is, most non pilots or wannabes wont listen to the guys who are actually doing the job when they say that its actually not that great. At the airline I work for, (large UK based,) many many of my colleagues are looking to go and do something completely different outside the flying field. One guy who left the police to do fly instead dislikes it so much, he's trying to re join his old constabulary!!!

[SweetChariotXV]

But will the day come when you lean back and say, ahhhhhh, I am finally there?

I never forget speaking to a Captain when I was a younger lad in Air Cadets. I was telling him how my only experience to date was flying gliders. And obviously all I wanted to do was fly something more powerful, with an engine.

He turned to me and told me the following story which I always remembered:

When he was younger, his dream was to fly -anything!

Some time later he found his dream fullfilled getting flying lessons in a glider. He loved it, but then the thought hit him... I would love to fly a POWERED aircraft!

Then he got in some little single engined plane and got what he wanted. Brilliant! After a little while, and through getting licenced, he then thought, hey I wouldn't mind flying something more powerful, with two engines...

Sitting in his twin engined turbo prop sometime later, dream fullfilled, he sat there thinking to himself, you know, I would love to fly a JET! That is when I will be there..

A few years later, on a 737, and being on it for some time, he thought, I will be there when I'm on a big jet like a dc-10, tristar or 747, that is what I want to fly!

So sitting on his 747 sometime later, he thought thats it, surely I must be here, I've reached it!

Then, one day, looking out of his window... he saw gliders flying, catching thermols, enjoying simple flight. And he thought...

You know, that is what I want to fly!

The moral to the story, in terms of passion for flying, not talking money earnt, is the passion it seems is like a cycle, you start off building your dream on a basic aircraft, wanting something better and more powerful. Then when you get to the top one day, a modern jet for example. And you sit there and think, geez, I'd love to do some flying on a chipmunk or cessna!

Good luck to all, although I really hope money is not the driving force of your ambitions to become a pilot.

[Reluctant737]

Easy Glider,

If 'many many' of your colleagues want out of the game, you must be involved in, to be frank, a pretty crappy operation.

Your words (and from what you say, your fellow pilots' words) sound to me like they come from someone more bitter over years of heeding to their companies questionable Ts and Cs as opposed to the job itself. I can understand your words, times are indeed tough and it's easy to feel shadowed by our problems.

There are lots of operators out there mate, perhaps when things pick up you will find what you're looking for elsewhere :ok:

Ad

[ford cortina]

Reluctant 737, you beat me to it, I was told a similar story by my Instructor in Blackpool once,

In a Glider you look up and see a Cessna 172 and think thats flying,
The Cessna Pilot looks up and sees a Twin Prop and thinks thats flying,
The Twin Prop Pilot looks up and sees a Jet and thinks thats flying,
The Jet Pilot looks up and sees the Space Shuttle and thinks thats flying,
The Space Shuttle Commander looks down and sees the Glider pilot and turns to one of the other Astronauts and says 'Now that's Flying'

Whatever you fly, enjoy it
FC up above the clouds

[Easy Glider]

Reluctant... actually considered to be one of the better outfits, (or at least used to be.) No names obviously but a "large long haul" U.K operator.

[ford cortina]

To be fair though, I do get paid quite well to fly, but if I won the lottery I would fly just for pleasure, maybe a nice Extra Sport 300 acrobatic airplane.
I don't work for a 'Red Hot' Airline just a small operator in a far off land

[fabbe92]

So there isn´t any 55 year old captain that still loves getting up in the morning and going to work? Any old captain that still loves to push the trothle forward?

Flying is my life and I know that this is wath I want to do. I will do it for free so money doesn´t matter at all. But when I am older I want to wake up in the morning and be happy because I have to go to work.

If the Airline industry isn´t like that, then maybe I should try the airforce. But it seems that I will enjoy it untill retirement and I know a few captains that are senior but still loves it. Tought there are many pilots who doesn´t care anymore that just want to earn some money for their families.

[Whirlygig]

Whilst there may be a number of dissatisfied airline pilots, I know of not one similarly dissatisfied helicopter pilot - what does that tell you!!

Anyone can become disgruntled with a job after a couple of decades but to START a career with no other interest than the money is sad for the person and demoralising for the colleagues.

Cheers

Whirls

[White Otter]

Thats probably because with helicopters you'll be doing it all by hand whereas in an airliner a lot of the time you'll be monitoring the autopilot.

[BelArgUSA]

"Flying is my life..." to quote one of our 15 or 16 years old future A-380 captains.
Saying that, "your life" - at 15...? Since you graduated out of diapers...?
Well, flying has been my life too. I just retired 2 months ago.
And yes, I did it for the money.
xxx
When I was 15, I wanted to be a F-104 pilot and shoot down 5 MiGs...!
Back then, no Pprune...
Wannabees wanted to be "Top Gun" Jockeys, at Mach 2.0 and FL 550.
We did not talk TCAS, Cat.III ILS and FMS/EICAS.
We talked AIM-9 Sidewinders, and M-61 cannon.
So I got out of the military ASAP, and got an airline pilot job.
You see, in the airlines, pilots earn three times the salary of military pilots.
"Just a job"... Oh, I loved it, the first few years.
Then came the layoffs, base changes, airline bankruptcy...
Working overseas, far from family and friends.
Then you settle overseas, when you visit back home, nobody knows you.
xxx
My airline career - 1969 to 2008... that is 39 years.
Why did I stay until age 65 birthday...? - For the money...
I got a little airplane. Piper L-21...
Hardly ever fly it, I lease it out for banner and glider towing operator.
Probably will sell it. I do not "miss" flying per se.
I miss the travel, and the crews who all were friends or family to me.
xxx
So "you want to be a commercial 737/747 pilot"...? -
What particular type will you fly...? Based where...? LHR or LGW...?
Is the 737-700 ok, or do you insist on a 737-800...?
Will you consider flying Airbus A-390s... (after the 797...?)
I wish I had been able to plan my pilot career as well.
xxx
:suspect:
Happy contrails

[aileron buzz]

john travolta, profession: pilot, Career:highly paid hollywood actor.

[Boing7117]

EasyGlider - I think it IS worth criticising someone who does a job purely for the pay check, particularly a 15 year old who's looking for some advice on a future career in aviation.

I don't understand the mentality of people who CHOOSE to go into a career just for the cash. To spend the next 40+ years of your life working in something that makes you smile once at the end of each month is a complete waste of your life and probably your own abilities.

Granted, some people END UP in a position that pays well. They reach a point in their life where everything else is rosy (house, kids, spouse, responsibilities) - except their job. To change careers would result in an uprooting of everything - and for those people, I have sympathy and understanding of why they're not doing what they'd really like to do.

I've come across way too many people of my generation (and a heck of a lot more from my parents generation) who in the main, didn't have the opportunity to go and do a job THAT THEY LOVE TO DO.

My advice to Dangus125 - a young chap - with an entire lifetime ahead - go and do the airline flying because you love to fly and don't want to do anything else. If you have the opportunity available to you and you really really want it - go get it. The money is secondary - you'll earn some but it won't be the reason for doing this job. You'll fly because you love to fly. You wouldn't quit if you won the lottery. When someone asks you about flying, you can sit there and talk about it until the cows come home.

Unfortunately, I think Easy Glider has ENDED UP in a flightdeck and it's a shame he doesn't love the job for the reasons it should be loved.

Dangus125 - don't focus on the aircraft type. It won't matter what type you end up flying. Keep an open mind. If you love flying - you'll be happy whatever type you end up in (and if you really wanted to change types when you become a pilot, it might involve a change in the company you work for but you'll probably end up flying something you've always kept a torch for).

Best of luck.

[preduk]

Couldn't agree more about the glider story. I know a number of senior captains, training captains and ex mil pilots who still get a buzz going to some random place for lunch in a Bulldog or similar.

[redsnail]

Dangus125,

I'd spend a bit of time reading the Dununda and Godzone forums. Since you're currently in Oz that's where I'd start.

You're still in school so I would focus the bulk of my activities there.
Get the best grades you can. Don't automatically pick 3 or 4 unit maths etc, do the subjects you like but remember, that science and maths subjects are looked upon favourably. Qantas has a fondness for HSC (year 12) maths and physics. (there are short courses to assist there should your studies not go quite to plan).

Play sport. Team sports are best. It's important to learn those communication and cooperation skills. May as well have fun rather than being lectured about it in a dry CRM course...

Get a part time job if you haven't got one already and start saving! You'll need loads either way. There are very few "cadetships" going where you don't pay something. RAAF is very competitive.

If you have some access to transport, get yourself to a local GA field (if there are any left) and have a chat to folks. Gliding is cheap (comparatively so) and is a good intro.

My personal opinion airline flying is a bit boring/routine most of the time compared to my job. If you want to get a feel for what GA's like, go to Jetblast and read "Checkboard's" stories.

Finally, are you healthy? If you have insulin dependent diabetes or vision issues, then the chances of becoming a pilot diminish greatly. (In Australia you can hold an ATPL with colour vision defects BUT you cannot fly commercially o'seas)