BMI - Body Mass Index - or Bl**dy Misleading Info

[BUPA]

Morning Ladies and Gents,

I have finally started my application for pilot in the RAF, and have been to my local AFCO to fill in some initial forms.

When reading and signing a medical/fitness form there was a part about ‘weight in relation to height’ (or similar) – obviously relating to BMI. My BMI makes me slightly ‘overweight.’ I don’t consider my self overweight and I exercised four times a week. I do intend to get my BMI down to the ‘accepted’ level, but if I don’t (thinking that losing muscle rather then fat is going to be hard…) how is this likely to influence my application/selection?

I, and I’m sure other board members, know how c#*p BMI actually is, not taking into account muscle mass etc, but do the RAF see this too?

Thanks,

BUPA

[anotherthing]

Don't worry about it, BMI is a load of tosh, and is only a very rough guide... international rugby players (backs, not forwards) often fall into the obese category.

I was 'borderline obese' according to BMI - at a time when I cycled everyday, went to the gym 4-5 times a week and ran circa 100 miles a week (and completed marathons in a respectable time). The scale does not take into account the differing weight of fat and muscle etc.

As long as you are fit and healthy and not too overweight, you will be fine.

[K.Whyjelly]

Upon being accepted for my first airline job many moons ago, the company MO requested my attendance in his office prior to being accepted by the company. The reason being that he had had a look at my medical details and according to the accepted facts with regards BMI I was a borderline obese case. Upon entering his office and meeting the Doc for the first time he looked up from his notes, gave me the once over with his eyes and muttered "Ahh, that explains it"! In front of him stood 6'3" of muscle packed gorgeousness that was a young KY ( happy days!!). Rugby playing at second row and rowing had built lots of muscle and not much fat but still my BMI was 29 and "borderline". Got the job but as a parting shot the MO shouted out to try and lose a bit of weight.....just doing his job I suppose.

Subsequent medicals (with my own AME) have been no problem. Mate in the pub some years back stated that BMI tables were drawn up by life insurance companies in the 1930's and that the reason the tables haven't been changed to reflect 21st century man is because these companies make a mint loading the premiums using outdated statistics. True or not it sounds feasible

[CapSizer]

Another oddity about BMI is that it doesn't make any logical sense when you look at units. Engineers like dimensionless numbers, because these can be used irrespective of scale (think angle of attack, lift coefficient, Reynolds number, etc.) The BMI is not even close to dimensionless, having units of kg/m^2. Assuming that people are approximately equally dense (we all just about float), and more or less similarly built, mass should be close to proportional to length^3, which would give BMI the unit of Length. So it is little wonder that tall guys battle with BMI. So yes, it is Bl**dy Misleading Info.

[Wader2]

At one gym a few years (16) ago the PT did a whole body fat measurement as far as I can recall. It simply involved lying on the couch and having a couple of electrodes put on you.

I seem to remember it measured fat and muscle and as such was a more sensible measure. It had nothing to do with height, weight, age, or pinch an inch.

Some people are so hard fat that you couldn't pinch an inch if you tried.

[airborne_artist]

Assuming that people are approximately equally dense

Not quite true, though. Bone is twice as dense as fat, and muscle about 10% more dense than fat.

BMI favours people with average to slim shapes. If you are broad across the shoulders/chest/hips (in basic skeletal structure), and then well muscled on top, you'll have a high BMI regardless. Not many prop-forwards have a BMI less than 28, but I wouldn't call them unfit.

[tonker]

And if you did i'd stamp on your Bo**cks and gouge your eyes out:ok:

[Mr C Hinecap]

Unfortunately, for someone applying for a commission in the RAF, it does matter - regardless of how tosh we all think it is. I believe OASC are being pretty damned hard over on the figures for entry - given the feedback I've seen elsewhere from recent applicants.

BMI isn't that far out for people of an average build - those of us at the anthropomorphic ends of the scale certainly don't fit on it. BUPA - just because you don't think you are overweight does not equate to a wholly objective assessment does it? Perhaps you are.

[airborne_artist]

And to give it an aircrew perspective, a stockily built (and thus higher BMI) individual will normally be able to withstand high G more easily than a lanky racing snake.

And if you did i'd stamp on your Bo**cks and gouge your eyes out

I'd hate to think what the Field Gunners had in the way of a BMI - I wouldn't argue with them, either :eek:

[FlightTester]

Had a mate at Bruggen - powerlifter, about five foot eight in all dimensions and used to pull two 48KVA Houchins around the hangar for a light workout.

SMO told him to lose some weight because his BMI was 29+ and he was "obese"!:mad:

[Tourist]

BUPA

Dry your eyes princess.
Eat less pies.

[Tight Seat]

Or join the Herc fleet and feel at home....fatty.

[Bertie Thruster]

BUPA; if your waist measurement is greater than half your height then you are probably carrying too much fat, no matter how muscular you are.

[Pink&Ginger]

BMI and waist circumference are now a ‘survey’ part of the 'all singing - all dancing' RAF twice-yearly Fatness Fitness Test, along with the ‘mandatory’ shuttle-run ‘beep-test’, press-ups and sit-ups.
Whether, or not, some bright spark desk-jockey starts mandating BMI and waist circumference is yet to be seen – although unlikely due to the previous comments.

Don’t fret, be fit when you join and then feel free to balloon thereafter!!! (Herc comment noted!!):ok:

[Dan Winterland]

The BMI was invented in the 1930s by a Belgian economist to assess the quality of nutrition in populations.

Thirteen of the England World Cup winning Rugby squad in 2003 were clinically obese according to their BMI.


It's bollox.



DW (BMI 26.6)

[Tim McLelland]

I remember a spell in hospital, post surgery. The nurses talking about BMI and for amusement they measured mine and I was also in the obese category according to the figures. It was quite laughable as I hardly had an inch of fat on my body, as the nurses pointed-out (I used to hit the gym a lot back then). They agreed it was complete rubbish too. One sincerely hopes that the MoD's quacks regard BMI in much the same way!

[Wader2]

BUPA; if your waist measurement is greater than half your height then you are probably carrying too much fat, no matter how muscular you are.

B*gga, I'm too short by a good 10 inches.

[philrigger]

;)

Ref BUPA definitian. Thats ridiculous ! How could I possibly get to be 8' 4" ?

[green granite]

Suffering as I do from bad lungs I recently attended a rehabilitation course at Papworth Hospital. We had a talk from the Hospital dietician which consisted of "you will worship the great god the BMI". If over, then diet if you're under then eat fried food etc. When I pointed out that I was under weight because of muscle wastage and all that eating fried foods etc would do is make me put the weight back on as fat which is unhealthy, all I got was a mumble about needing protein and the subject was changed rapidly. :ugh:

[parabellum]

Just for info: (and I think it is bollox too!).



Body mass index - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_mass_index)

[India69]

Biggin Hill 1966"Your a bit overweight but youll loose it in the first 6 months" - I did - but it found me later

[Dan Winterland]

The Wiki entry doesn't think much of it either. The author must be fat!

Mrs W is a bit of a fitness freak has a set of scales made in Japan which pass a current through you feet and tell you how much body fat you have. After you've given them certain information such as age and height, it then categorises you. At 21% bodyfat (yesterday) it categotised me as "6" which translates as "Lean muscular".

I like those scales!

[BEagle]

But then again, for a Wookie, that's probably correct, Dan!

What excellent scales!

Anyway, what's wrong with bmi - it's the second largest airline at London Airport, according to its website.

[Jimmy Macintosh]

Just from the opposite side of things:

My BMI is 22.2, but I can tell you now I'm slightly fat and incredibly unfit. I used to have a BMI of 22, but cycled 20+ miles a day and circuit trained twice a week. It seems the muscle I've lost has allowed a lot more fat in.

The biggest thing I notice now? that my belt buckle is warm when I stand up after sitting down for any length of time.

Body fat percentage has skyrocketed. 9% to about 18%.

People still call me skinny.

[jpboy]

BUPA

Do not assume you will get any commonsense re BMI from the medics at Cranwell, pass/fail.... next. Sorry to put it so bluntly.

Find out what the limit is and ensure that you are under it. Initial entry medicals have strict pass/fail criteria, once in there is some flexibility within acceptable limits of degradation/expansion!

Mates attempting to rejoin with over 20 yrs experience and having never failed a medical whilst serving are coming a cropper when attempting to rejoin because the quacks assess them to initial entrant standards. BMI has been one of the issues. Look on the bright side, sorting it in your twenties should be a damn sight easier than trying to undo 20 yrs abuse in your forties.

[Bertie Thruster]

Look on the bright side, sorting it in your twenties should be a damn sight easier than trying to undo 20 yrs abuse in your forties

10 years ago I struggled to loose weight in my forties but last year I finally found a simple way;

BMI 29 to BMI 25 in just two months. (For me that meant loosing just over 2 stone.)

Could not have been easier and with no extra exercise!

Just used a well known English VLCD and monitored its effectiveness using 'ketostiks'.

To me, in hindsight, it seems simple; one spend years eating extra sandwiches and "glueing" them all over one's body, like a mobile larder. The only way to use up all those 'old sandwiches' is to stop eating new ones for a while!

[flash8]

Without blowing my own trumpet I probably would grade myself as "athletic level" fitness. Some cheapo Body Fat/BMI Calculator from Superdrug (that should have warned me) gives me a BMI of 32... which according to googled content makes me bloody fat. Complete bolleux.

I so much refused to believe the Superdrug machine that I forced my whole family to go through the humiliating ordeal with the "machine" right down to my six year old little girl (I am not sure if that counts as mental cruelty). All of them scored between 12 and 20 so something is amiss.

flash.