ESTA - Q & A's (Merged)

[cwatters]

The media suggests that only about two thirds of the expected number of people have fillied in the necessary forms and those who haven't might be refused travel over the next three days...

US visa warning for Brits - mirror.co.uk (http://www.mirror.co.uk/sunday-mirror/2009/01/11/us-visa-warning-for-brits-115875-21031787/)

Under new rules, Britons travelling to the States on the visa waiver scheme must fill in an online travel authorisation form at least 72 hours before.

Brits In Usa Ban - The Sunday Mail (http://www.sundaymail.co.uk/news/newsfeed/2009/01/11/brits-in-usa-ban-78057-21031678/)

Those who have not registered are likely to be sent home, the Foreign Office warned last night.

Might be a lot of people at airports tomorrow trying to fill forms or worse reschedule flights.

[strake]

Just to clarify, it's 72 hours before the first time you travel after 12th January 2009 . After that, you don't need to fill in the online form for two years. It's basically an electronic version of the Visa waiver form.

Also, if you have any type of US visa, you don't need to fill out the online form.

Despite having filled this form out online, you will still need to fill out a normal waiver form before arrival.

I'm flying to Chicago on Tuesday. Can't wait to see the fun 'n games at LHR.

[beamender99]

From the Daily Telegraph. Last Updated: 3:21PM GMT 06 Jan 2009

From Monday, all British citizens travelling to the United States by air or by sea must fill out an online Electronic System for Travel Authorisation (ESTA) at least 72 hours before departure. The permit is free – beware of companies advertising on the internet that charge for it.
An approved ESTA is valid for two years and can be used for multiple entries into the US. For each new visit you must update, online, information about your flights and where you are staying. You don’t have to fill in the accommodation section before arrival in the US
if you are on a fly-drive holiday. However, the immigration officer will ask for the address and telephone number of a hotel for the first night (even if you haven’t booked anywhere), so have a name ready. If you are staying with friends and relatives, you will be asked for their full address (with postcode) and telephone number.
If you don’t have internet access, the US Embassy suggests you ask a computer-literate friend, a librarian, or a travel agent to process the application. Only travellers entering the US overland from Canada or Mexico will continue to fill in the old green I-94 visa-waiver forms.
The ESTA website can be found at https://esta.cbp.dhs.gov (https://esta.cbp.dhs.gov/) or by clicking on a link from www.usembassy.org.uk (http://www.usembassy.org.uk/).

[raffele]

From 12th January 2009 it will not be necessary to fill an I-94W form as well as ESTA - ESTA is mandatory, the I-94W form is only required as well if the passenger is arriving on a carrier that isn't able to validate passenger's ESTA status as part of the boarding procedure (and obviously those carriers will issue I-94W forms onboard the aircraft)

[strake]

Virgin advise that "for the foreseeable future" they still require you to fill in the waiver form as normal.

Hello Strake and Happy New Year!
We are sure this has been brought to your attention already, however we
thought a quick reminder may prove useful!

Each time you fly out to the US, you’ll be used to completing the green
Visa Waiver form if you do not have a visa, well now the US Customs and Border Protection will soon
be introducing an automated system to determine if a passenger is eligible
to visit the United States under the Visa Waiver Program (VWP). The
Electronic System For Travel Authorisation (ESTA) was introduced as a
voluntary scheme from 01 August 2008 however this will become mandatory for
travel on 12 January 2009 and passengers should be advised to apply for one
if travelling on/after this date.

Passengers travelling to the US under the Visa Waiver Programme may now apply in advance of travel for a travel
authority using the Electronic System for Travel Authorization (ESTA) website.

Once granted, a travel authority is valid for two years. Before each new trip to the US, you must update your travel
plans and address details via the ESTA website. It is your responsibility to make the application and to ensure that
you have a valid travel authority before you travel.

From 12 January 2009, all Visa Waiver nationals (unless they have a visa or residency card) will only be able to
travel if they have a confirmed travel authority via the ESTA website. Department of Homeland Security recommend
passengers should apply for a travel authority at least 72 hours before departure. In usual circumstances a response
(ESTA granted or denied) is given in seconds. For a small minority of passengers the decision will take up to 72
hours. If an ESTA is denied then passengers must obtain a visa for your journey.

From 12 January 2009, we cannot fly any passenger to the US until either a travel authority has been granted, or the
passenger provides a visa or residency card. The travel authorisation can be obtained by the passenger visiting a
customs and Border Protection ( CBP ) website and making an application, we have included a link below for your
convenience :

https://esta.cbp.dhs.gov/


For the foreseeable future all passengers will still be required to
complete the Visa Waiver Form (I-94W) and their Advance Passenger
Information (API) as normal even though they have received ESTA clearance.
Kind regards

XXXXX

Personal Account Executive
PAMS (Personal Account Management Service )
Virgin Atlantic Airways - The Office (GNW) , Manor Royal ,Crawley
West Sussex.RH10 9NU

[TightSlot]

Well, I'm off to LAX tomorrow (12th) and expect to be doing the documents service in flight i.e. distributing Customs Forms & I94W's.

I'll let you know how this went.

P.S. - My being away from the forum for a few hours should not be viewed as an incentive to vice! I may be tempted to log-on via ACARS just to check on you...

[5711N0205W]

You don’t have to fill in the accommodation section before arrival in the US if you are on a fly-drive holiday. However, the immigration officer will ask for the address and telephone number of a hotel for the first night (even if you haven’t booked anywhere), so have a name ready.

We will be arriving in Seattle and immediately heading by road to Vancouver, what should one do in this case, put in the Canadian address, will this be acceptable?

[WHBM]

There are a number of details that I can't find answers for. I haven't actually done the procedure yet.

1. Is it possible to apply "speculatively" now for an ESTA, or must you have a definite flight and arrival arranged first.

2. Why can't the form details be incorporated as part of the on-line booking by the airlines ? Why does it have to be a separate process.

3. Why is the ESTA a) Valid for 2 years, but then b) You need to visit the website for each arrival. Are these not somehow contradictory.

4. If making a second visit how do you cross-reference the original ESTA.

5. If during the 2 years you change your passport do you need a complete new application ?

6. As I understand it the "72 hours before" is just a recommendation and it will actually normally come back in seconds. So is this something that could end up being done at check-in if needed ? Or for F class passengers only ?

7. How do you demonstrate to check-in that you have an ESTA ? Do you just give a reference number ? What if you just make one up, or use somebody else's ? Are they checked on-line as part of the check-in process ? Likewise for on-line check-in, how do you demonstrate you have one ? And if you do on-line check-in is it going to be one of those things which, annoyingly, "Fast" Bag Drop ask to see all over again, slowing down the Bag Drop process ?

8. Will there still be an I-94W stub, or equivalent, to be handed in on departure from the US, or not ? Are the days of these over ?

We will be arriving in Seattle and immediately heading by road to Vancouver, what should one do in this casePut the words "In Transit" if you will be leaving the US before the end of the arrival day. This has always been the case on paper I-94W forms. The officer will ask what you are doing, and that will be fine. They are used to it.

[raffele]

In response to WHBM:

1. You can apply whenever you like. You should find various mentions in the ESTA documentation (on the USCBP site, rather than the ESTA application site) informing you that you need not have definite travel plans in order to apply. However, as its valid for 2 years, it makes sense to apply as late as possible to your next departure

2. No idea. Its stupid - you have to give all this data to the airlines already before you depart. Theoretically its the same thing... Its for the same purpose - to pre-screen passengers before they board a flight for the States

3. It's valid for 2 years, but you need to visit the site for each visit to update the flight information and your address for the first night. Again, see answer to 2 above.

4. I assume there is a unique identifier attached to each applicant - you are advised to note down the application number and so on in order to allow you to manage your ESTA in the future

5. I believe you just update the ESTA to show the new passport number.

6. The 72 hours is not a recommendation, more a "apply by" date. The idea is - you apply for ESTA, you get the response usually immediately. Some cases may need to be investigated, and therefore prompt a delayed response. And of course, if it comes back as denied you need to visit the nearest Embassy to enquire about it and possibly get a visa.

7. I'm not quite sure about this one. Part of the ESTA is the hope that one day it can replace the I-94W form and the current situation is that from today, you do not need to fill an I-94W form if the carrier can send and receive passenger ESTA statuses. I suppose there is some addition to the already present datalink carriers have with the US government for forwarding advance passenger information so at check-in, if the airline's systems check with the ESTA database and find no match, it can be investigated before the passenger passes through to Departures.

8. See 7 above. It all depends on this thing regarding carriers being able to send and receive passenger ESTA statuses. I think there is some paperless admin legislation attached/being attached to the ESTA programme so in theory at some point the I-94W could become non-existant and the ESTA operate similarly to the Australian electronic visa.

Various bits of information above are somewhere on this site: http://www.cbp.gov/xp/cgov/travel/id_visa/esta/

[PAXboy]

TSI may be tempted to log-on ..I knew there was a reason they installed LAN connections at the seat in Biz... . Now, surely, you can trust us for just a teensy-weensy hop to little old LAX???? :} (Feels a bit like when teacher puts the class on best behaviour as they have to go pick something up from the office. :E)

[Final 3 Greens]

I may be tempted to log-on ..


Where's Rainboe? :E

[jettesen]

so this 72hr before malarky, what if i book today to fly tomorrow???? how does that work?? ( which i have done many times in the past!)

[PAXboy]

It doesn't work jettesen - you don't fly.

The carrier will not confirm your booking until you have the ESTA ref number. As strake said:
Just to clarify, it's 72 hours before the first time you travel after 12th January 2009 . After that, you don't need to fill in the online form for two years.
Once you have an ESTA ref, you can update with subsequent journeys, for two years and then open a new request.

If you think that you are going to be travelling in the next couple of months, then get an Esta ref now.

[raffele]

Since I posted the answers to WHBM's questions I have since read that the 72 hour limit is advisory - you could apply in the check in queue from your PDA or laptop if you wanted to, but obviously it makes sense not to leave it too late incase the ESTA is denied and you have to go through the process of going to the Embassy etc etc etc

See http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7823779.stm - half way down, just below the quote box

[Final 3 Greens]

Got my application # today.

Have no intention of visiting the USA, but if something comes up, I can at least check in.

I hope that the European authorities will soon impose a reciprocal system the other way.

[WHBM]

What did you do for the questions about flight number and airline Just leave them blank ?

[strake]

In case it's of use to anyone:

Came through LHR with Northwest for a direct to MSP. On check-in I proudly stated I had filled in my ESTA form. The agent looked a bit blank and said "Yeah, we heard about that, started yesterday". They then asked me all the API stuff as usual and gave me an I94W to fill in.
So, I did and on arriving in the Immigration hall, noticed that everyone there had normal green meanies clutched in their hands. When I approached the desk, we were doing right fingers, right thumb then left finger, left thumb and mug-shot. I gave him the I-94W and had another go at the ESTA declaration. The response was "Huh?"
I get a strong feeling of disconnect between airlines, airports and Homeland Security on this, for the time being at least.
My advice, fill in the top part of the ESTA form to get your application number. If you can, go back to it when you know a flight number and address to update. Then fill in the I94W as normal. Just deal with it as more PITA "stuff" to get into the USA.

To update, a colleague who followed me in the next day said the Border people commented that they had seen the ESTA info for him on the screen.

I'm guessing that at the moment, they are running the whole system up to let everyone get used to it.

[MR7958]

The new US immigration system (ESTA) has been up and running for a few days now. What are people's experiences of getting into America under the new regime? Do you still need to fill out the paper visa waiver form? Do the queues at airports seem to be shorter, or moving more quickly?

I am flying LHR to JFK in a few weeks and am keen to find out (a) whether the new system is a total nightmare, and (b) whether it might make the miserable process of lining up to get into the country quicker.

Thanks

[mcgoo]

They havn't really implemented it yet, I flew into Orlando on Monday afternoon and still had to fill out the visa waiver form, being January I didn't expect many delays at immigration anyway but from touchdown, through immigration, customs, bag collection to leaving the airport in the car was about 15 minutes.

[raffele]

The system's actually been running since 1st August 08

It will take a while for the I-94W forms to get phased out - its all depends on a small part of the system, which is whether individual airlines can send and receive information relating to individual passenger's ESTA statuses. When that system is in place (if it isn't already) and up and running, those green forms will start to disappear.

From what I've heard there hasn't been any major problems so far so I guess no news is good news

[TightSlot]

Update, as promised...

Objective

Documents and paperwork requirements remain as before - no change. All visitors to the USA, entering by air without a US visa in their passport should complete an ESTA form online, and also the I-94W. Customs forms continue to be required (and will be so into the future) for each surname/family name travelling.

There is a grace period and amnesty for non-completion of ESTA in effect. The duration of this period has not been advised.

Subjective

US immigration and Customs officers and procedures continue to degrade international respect for the USA at a rate that is invisible only to US lawmakers: Only Iraq (and arguably Kyoto) have the capacity to madden non-US citizens more rapidly. I'm not exaggerating - I see the results by the thousand quite regularly, and often have to advise customers not to express their real opinions to officers on arrival . I love the USA with passion - always have: It saddens me to see the country I love diminish its' own reputation abroad quite so unnecessarily.

The ESTA implementation has been frankly chaotic - communication, IT and management of the project have all been sloppy, leaving a wake of confused and irritated airlines and passengers who are still waiting for clarification and deadlines. Depressing, and avoidable stuff...


EDIT

P.S. - Just for good measure, due to another error by US Immigration, there are currently two different printed versions of the I-94W in circulation - there are slightly different questions on each one. Immigration have given a dispensation to airlines to use the newer (incorrect) version that Immigration themselves distributed, in parallell for a period of time that has not been specified.

[VAFFPAX]

Thanks very much for that short and sweet summary TightSlot. I know what you mean about the US... and it is embarrassing for friends and colleagues who have the distinct displeasure of having to endure this, especially when they are citizens of the country.

S.

[NYCSavage]

Me and a friend are having a friendly debate about this new waste of time!

I think that the ESTA you complete online is a travel authorisation and you still need to complete a Visa Waiver Green Form on the plane.

He thinks the ESTA form covers both the travel authorisation AND the Visa Waiver.

Can anyone tell me who is right?

Thank you

[loungee]

At the moment you are correct as both have to be completed.
The aim seems to be that eventually the ESTA will replace the visa waiver form but when is anyones guess having read the other posts on the subject in this forum !

[NYCSavage]

Thank you for clearing that up - grinning like a cheshire cat now! lol

[candoo]

HELP!!

Travelling 2nd week in Feb to USA just filled out my online ESTA.

TRAVEL PERMISSION REFUSED

I regularly travel to the States no problem, last time in October, I have nothing in my history which would cause a problem.

Biggest difficulty is on the site there is nowhere to ask why I was refused. Does this mean I am shafted. What should I do?

The only thing I can think of is my new passport arrived this morning and I entered the details from that. Maybe the systems have not yet registered new document numbers.......

Any advise greatly appreciated!

Candoo

[oldcadet]

Hello

Question from a newcomer here - please bear with me as this may seem a little complicated

I am flying to San Diego via Newark at the end of the week - have already completed the ESTA form and received approval, no problem. From San Diego we are taking a boat trip, and flying back from Mexico via Houston (all flights with Continental or subsidiaries). Do we need to register a "changed details" on the ESTA website to cover the return flight (2 weeks later, transit only)?:confused:

Any advice most welcome.

Oc

[strake]

candoo,

On the basis that you are not a known terrorist (!)and you are a citizen of a waiver country, my advice would be to try again. I am pretty sure the system does not identify you by passport numbers as I have two ESTA's due to dual nationality.
Take particular care with the details and the final two questions which ask if you are the traveller or their agent...make sure you only fill out one.
I am presuming you gave back (or had taken back) the exit stub when you last left the States.

oldcadet,

No. As with the "real" I-94W, you only need enter your first stop in the USA.

Just so you know how "good" the system is, I went back to my ESTA after two days to fill out my destination. I then realised I had not made a note of my application number and the system has no method of recalling it. So,I just filled out a new application with the same details and "Hey Presto!", a new application number. I subsequently travelled without any problem.

[candoo]

Strake - that did occur to me as I still have the green stub but the last three times I have travelled to the States it has not been taken off me. This may be a red herring as my wife successfully applied and she still has her green stub in her passport!

Various other forums suggest it is the passport update thing and waiting 10 days to re-apply to avoid highlighting yourself making multiple entries.

I am loathed to call the US Embassy for the same reason, maybe I will try BA.

[strake]

candoo,

If you really have left the USA that many times without returning the stub of your I-94W and you still have one, then that is a no-no and could be the cause of your problem. It is taken very seriously and you are possibly going to have to provide detailed proof of departure to rectify. Worst case is that you will need to apply for a visa.
See below for info from US Consulate:
Sometimes due to an oversight the card is not removed. If this occurs, the passenger's departure from the United States will not be registered with the CBP.

If this happens, the next time you apply to enter the United States, your visa may be subject to cancellation and/or you may be denied entry into the United States. In particular, visitors who remain beyond their permitted stay in the United States under the Visa Waiver Program cannot reenter the U.S. in the future without obtaining a visa. If this occurs and you arrive at a U.S. port of entry seeking admission under the Visa Waiver Program without a visa, United States immigration officials may deny you entry into the U.S. Therefore, visitors must ensure that they surrender the I-94 or I-94W stub to the transport carrier before they depart the United States.



I still have the I-94 or I-94W in my possession; what should I do?
If you have left the United States and are still in possession of the I-94 or I-94W it is in your best interest to forward it to the appropriate authorities so that your record is corrected and that you do not experience any problems on future travel to the United States as a result.

It is very important that you complete the back of the card listing the port of departure and date of departure from the United States and the carrier/flight information. The I-94 or I-94W together with a letter of explanation and evidence of your departure from the U.S. should be sent to:




DHS-CBP SBU, 1084 South Laurel Road
London, Kentucky 40744
USA






Do not mail the I-94/I-94W to the Embassy. Doing so will only delay the update of the departure information. The CBP office in London cannot update the arrival and departure system.



What evidence of my departure from the United States do you require?
The evidence can come from a variety of sources, including but not limited to:

Original boarding passes you used to depart the United States;


Entry or departure stamps in your passport to indicate you entered another country after you departed the United States (please copy all passport pages that are not completely blank and include the biographic page containing your photograph);


Dated pay slips or vouchers from your employer to indicate that you worked in another country after you departed the United States;


Dated bank records showing transactions in your home country to indicate that you were in another country after your left the United States;


School records showing your attendance at a school outside the United States to indicate you were in another country after you left the United States;


Dated credit card receipts with the credit card number deleted for purchases you made after you departed the United States to indicate you were in another country after you left the United States.
Please send legible copies or the original material where possible. If you send original materials please retain a copy for your records; the originals will not be returned to you. It will assist the CBP if you include an explanation letter.



I no longer have the card!
If you left the United States with the I-94 or I-94W in your possession but no longer have the card, you should write to: DHS-CBP SBU, 1084 South Laurel Road, London, Kentucky 40744, USA U.S.A. with the following information:

Name;


date and place of birth;


country of citizenship;


date of arrival in the U.S.;


date of departure from the United States;


airline or carrier departed on;


flight number or name of vessel.
If departure was via a land border port please enter "land" instead of carrier information.

You must also include evidence of your departure as noted above.

[muppetbum]

having your I94w still in your passport is not a problem if you left via a comercial carrier

Answer (http://help.cbp.gov/cgi-bin/customs.cfg/php/enduser/std_adp.php?p_faqid=752&p_created=1077641280&p_sid=RGQ8g3Hh&p_lva=&p_sp=cF9zcmNoPTEmcF9zb3J0X2J5PSZwX2dyaWRzb3J0PSZwX3Jvd19jbnQ 9OCZwX3Byb2RzPTAmcF9jYXRzPTAmcF9wdj0mcF9jdj0mcF9zZWFyY2hfdHl wZT1hbnN3ZXJzLnNlYXJjaF9ubCZwX3BhZ2U9MSZwX3NlYXJjaF90ZXh0PUk tOTQ*&p_li=&p_topview=1)

'm sorry for the long link but it just goes to show how dep this info is buried !
Other half has this prolem all the tim as they rarely take the form out on the USA/Canada border and he never knows when he might be going back , to see if its worth keeping or not!

[Globaliser]

P.S. - Just for good measure, due to another error by US Immigration, there are currently two different printed versions of the I-94W in circulation - there are slightly different questions on each one.Moreover, the newer version asks for the date on which your visa was issued, and the city.

Someone obviously forgot the meaning of the "W" in I-94W!

[VAFFPAX]

Candoo, if you try again, and your ESTA is refused a second time, make an appointment with the US Embassy on Grosvenor Square and get a visa instead. That way they'll either tell you why your ESTA was refused, or they'll tell you they are refusing you a visa, or they'll say everything's ok and here's a 2-year visa (be aware that in my early days they first started with a 1-year, then extended that for another 5, and then finally another 10, so you might only get a 1-year visa).

But the good thing about the visa is that you don't apply for an ESTA in that case because a) it doesn't apply to people with visas, and b) they've actually seen you at the embassy and authorised a visa based on that information.

S.

[EastMids]

1. Is it possible to apply "speculatively" now for an ESTA, or must you have a definite flight and arrival arranged first.

Yes, it is possible to apply speculatively, and I'd suggest its a good idea to do so. The flight details and address are optional items. Apply as soon as possible, as there is a risk the application could be "travel denied" - having a non-refundable, non-changable ticket and then getting refused electronic permission to travel (thus needing to plan and make a visa visit to the US embassy for a visa) would be a stressful experience!

3. Why is the ESTA a) Valid for 2 years, but then b) You need to visit the website for each arrival. Are these not somehow contradictory.

Maybe, but you don't apply for an ESTA each time you travel - you merely update the existing application to reflect the flight you are taking and the address you are staying at. So whilst there is a risk that a first application could be denied, updates for subsequent journeys (within the two years) are just that - updates that won't result in a denial.

4. If making a second visit how do you cross-reference the original ESTA.

When the ESTA application is approved, you get a reference number. You MUST make a note of this and use it to update the flight/accommodation details for subsequent entries. Note that even though they ask for an e-mail address, they do not e-mail the ESTA reference number to you, so you MUST write it down and keep it (although there is nothing to stop you applying again with the same passport number at a later date).

5. If during the 2 years you change your passport do you need a complete new application ?

Yes, one ESTA application per passport.

6. As I understand it the "72 hours before" is just a recommendation and it will actually normally come back in seconds. So is this something that could end up being done at check-in if needed ? Or for F class passengers only ?

Lufthansa have done just that at some airports in Germany - installed a PC adjacent to check-in/departure gates for ESTA. However of course, as the result of an application to travel could be "travel denied" it would be risky to do the application at the airport just before you [want to] depart.

7. How do you demonstrate to check-in that you have an ESTA ? Do you just give a reference number ? What if you just make one up, or use somebody else's ? Are they checked on-line as part of the check-in process ? Likewise for on-line check-in, how do you demonstrate you have one ? And if you do on-line check-in is it going to be one of those things which, annoyingly, "Fast" Bag Drop ask to see all over again, slowing down the Bag Drop process ?

Dunno because I wasn't asked for the reference at checkin. However, on arrival it was evident that immigration knew I had applied, so I assume its keyed to passport number somehow.

8. Will there still be an I-94W stub, or equivalent, to be handed in on departure from the US, or not ? Are the days of these over ?

Yes, still the green form for now. In theory it goes, eventually!!!

A

[candoo]

Good news waited 10 days reapplied and all is well :ok:

Only advice I can offer is check and re-check you have filled it in correctly!

[Mike Whiskey Romeo]

Hi all,

I am due to travel to the States in a few weeks. As you may already know the new visa requirements which came into effect on January 12 require that I fill out an online ESTA (Electronic System for Travel Application) before I travel. My travel agent sent me a link to the online application but the link seems dead.

I've also tried googling it but the same result.

I also note that there are some websites that are charging a fee for the application. As far as I know the application through a legit webpage is free.

Has anyone had the same experience as me?
If so can you point me in the right direction?
For reference, the link I was given is: https://esta.cbp.dhs.gov/esta

Thanks in advance,

Mike

[Gassy]

That link works for me.

[Mike Whiskey Romeo]

Hmm seems Google chrome still has a few glitches,
Don't know why i didn't think to try Firefox before.

Thanks Gassy

[raffele]

Thats the right link and it works - perhaps try a different browser/computer?

[Mark in CA]

Could be a problem with the browser's encryption (note the https in the link) or the web site does not recognize the Chrome browser as secure.

[PAXboy]

The summation of our knowledge in this forum, is in this active thread:
http://www.pprune.org/passengers-slf-self-loading-freight/357630-esta-q-merged.html

[raffele]

Sounds like Chrome has the same problem as the latest version of Safari regarding encrypted sites - the encryption in Safari has been upgraded beyond what websites currently used causing compatibility problems

[RevMan2]

ESTA - a really good idea constrained by the usual terminal thickness of American bureaucrats.

Applied for and was granted approval in December, tried to update my profile for a trip in April

LH422/09APR

Flight Number contains invalid characters.

So you look at the online help function

Enter the flight number for the airline on which you will be traveling to the United States, if your travel information is available. The flight number is optional to complete the application.

No format outline. Nothing

I gave up after trying a range of permutations, but you'd think that even DHSS would think of conforming to IATA/ICAO flight numbering conventions.

Then again - maybe not from an organisation that assigns North Dakota a higher alphabetical sort than New Hampshire in a drop down list.

Thinks: maybe the sort's not alphabetical after all. Maybe it's based on population numbers. Or mean annual temperature. Or the height of the capital above sea level...

(Someone I once worked with reckoned that the USA was run by about 10,000 people who were just so much smarter than anyone else on the planet. And the other 300 million were a bunch of lemmings...)

[muppetbum]

I nearly got caught out as well , when you type esta into google the first site I got up wanted to charge $495 dollars to fill in the form for me :eek:

I personally can't believe that the online process checks anything. My clearance came back within seconds. I don't think the form asks the right questions anyway, basically its name and passport number and a load of questions that no one in their right mind will answer yes to!
You'd think that just from my date of birth the system could figure out that there is no way I could have been a member of the nazi party in the 40s!

Still it didn't ask for my maiden name , this being the root of my potential problems , so I'm happy :)

[radeng]

Someone asked 'what happens if you change your passport?'

You can't update ESTA with the new passport number. You have to apply again.

How do I know? How do you think I found out?

Getting a replacement passport in Newport was a doddle. 1130 am appointment. Arrive 1125, out by 1133. Passport delivered by courier 6 days later (they only guarantee 7!) Don't figure on sitting around there....although they aren't currently very busy. But still very friendly, polite and helpful.

[Pinkman]

Just to clarify:

You actually DONT have to update your ESTA with the new trip information. Its not mandatory. Once you have it, you have it for two years, then you apply again. They like you to update it but you dont have to. You also dont have to show your ESTA authorisation number.

I didnt read the thing properly and wrongly assumed they would email me. (They dont). It wont now let me update my trip without the number. And if you try to enter your passport again as a new number it will tell you that its already in the system. But I have since been across the pond and it wasnt an issue, even when the destination was different. Everyone was very polite and helpful.

You still have to do the airline pre-auth and fill in the green VWP form.

If anyone knows how to get your ESTA authorisation number again without waiting two years for it to run out, do tell.....

[candoo]

After initial good news of getting permission to travel it was a different matter on arrival in BOS.

Usual questions at immigration, fingerprints etc... then excuse me Sir just one more step and you are clear to enter the USA please follow my colleague to Secondary Immigration. Went through all the usual questions and answers again except he asked me if I had ever applied for diplomatic immunity in the USA - no I said, yes you have he said, no I said, yes you have he said it is on your ESTA documentation.

After a LOT of further questioning during which I struggled to bite my tongue, due to the line of questioning in front of all around, I was let in.

I now know why my original ESTA application was refused. I waited 10 days and reapplied and was accepted, I do not believe the system removed (or wanted to remove) my error on the first application.

All my fault I know but the system could surely be made more user friendly. Especially so as if you make a mistake and get the Homeland Security guard who just got ditched by his wife it may cause a lot of unecessary grief.

I repeat my original advice - check, check and check again before submitting your application.

[candoo]

Even more confusing today

My Brother who is UK by birth but is married to a US National has a UK passport but a permanent residency status over there.

ESTA - yes or no?

Forgot to add airlines are particularly unhelpful on this

[TightSlot]

FYI - As of 12th March completion of the online ESTA process has become mandatory - no ESTA, no boarding an aircraft heading for the USA, no excuses. Customers attempting to check-in without an ESTA are being sent off to an internet cafe to complete the formalities.

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c57/TightSlot/computer_says_no.jpg

candoo - does yo bro have a resident alien green card? If yes, no ESTA is required. If not, has he previously been completing a green I94W or a white I94 immigration form - if green, ESTA is now required, if white, ESTA is not required.

[capt ronweb]

Very strange, planned my latest trip and got the ESTA for myself and herindoors, MAN-LAS and back, great time but NOBODY, ANYWHERE asked to see said form, not before boarding in Man and certainly not at LAS going in, just all the usual forms as before,prints etc... no mention of ESTA. Oh and btw the best site to get the form is BA, log on and scroll down or search ESTA and as the man says 15 seconds later it's through, no errors though, that's the hitch. No doubt someone will eventually tell the dept of imm and nat. that there is a new form from the visa waiver countries. good luck to you all, oh and a "Happy St Patricks Day" tomorrow:). Capt Ronweb.

[Donkey497]

FYI - As of 12th March completion of the online ESTA process has become mandatory

Really hate to disagree Tightslot, but I just got back from yet another EDI/EWR/IAH round trip on Friday (13th) and when clearing immigration at EWR I asked when the green & white I-94 forms would be phased out. The guy on the desk said that they had hoped that it would be last week, but they were still having some issues ( i.e. the system doesn't work) in getting accurate information down to the immigration desks at some of the major gateway airports, not to mention some of th smaller ones. He told me that another trial was due shortly, but it wasn't certain if this was the final fix/rollout.

Got to compliment the guys at EWR & ATL on the immigration desks always polite, helpful & willing to answer questions. Just wish the guys at the major UK gateway airports could match them.

[raffele]

FYI - As of 12th March completion of the online ESTA process has become mandatory
Really hate to disagree Tightslot, but I just got back from yet another EDI/EWR/IAH round trip on Friday (13th) and when clearing immigration at EWR I asked when the green & white I-94 forms would be phased out.

Just to pick you up on a technicality Donkey497 - whilst there may still be issues with the ESTA system (as there are with anything new - the heated debate of the A380 issues helps clarify this) TightSlot mentioned the mandatory completion of ESTA forms, and not the phasing out of the I-94s. Obviously, if there are some hiccups, then CBP and DHS will use their discretion, but TightSlot's comment remains valid and correct.

Slightly different note - in all honesty, I'm surprised they expected to do away with the I-94s so soon. I expected it to be late summer at least...

[Donkey497]

Must admit that I thought the ESTA completion was mandatory a couple of months ago, but fairynuff, I'm not going to lose any sleep.

[TightSlot]

ESTA was planned to be mandatory from 12th January, but wasn't - largely because of the poor publicity on the subject: It was estimated that approx 30% of passengers on the day knew nothing about the new system. Therefore, an ESTA amnesty was set in force i.e. although it was strongly recommended to have completed ESTA, it was not mandatory. The amnesty period ended on 12th March and ESTA completion is now mandatory.

Completion in-flight of the I94W will continue for the foreseeable future - remember that ESTA is neither a Visa nor a permit to enter the USA: It is simply a permission to board an aircraft with a destination in the USA (Electronic System for Travel Authorization).

It is also worth remembering that ESTA completion is only required for people travelling under the VWP (Visa Waiver Program) i.e. those completing the Green I94W forms in-flight. Everybody else (Immigrant & Non-Immigrant Visa Holders, US & Canadian Citizens, US Resident Aliens etc.) does not have to complete ESTA.

[candoo]

Brother got by with his permanent residency.

I know from experience that they do not need to ask you for your ESTA details as at primary immigration this is picked up. If you have done it correctly you would never even know it.

It is still a bit hit and miss, this has to be one of the most badly advertised procedures adopted of recent times.

[muppetbum]

When we went to vegas last week the guy at YYZ seemed confused by the extra piece of paper we offered him. When we told him it was our ESTA authorisation he asked us " how did you find out about that?"

He hadn't heard of PPRUNE either !!

Still he was a bit more clued up than the queue managing muppets at Pearson, who when looking at our paperwork to see if we were worthy of joining the queue, looked at our green form and insisted " you don't need that" and was about to remove it from us, the "yes I do" "no you don't anymore" continued for a few moments until I tapped the very obvious EU passport in my hand and pointed out " I'm not a Canadian citiizen!"

I'm sure this was why the DHS guy was actually nice to us , after witnessing this !