Which Flying School (Ireland)?

[glennmcl08]

Hey guys, im new to the forum so let me introduce myself.

My name is Glenn and im 18 soon 19 living in Northern Ireland, well its been my dream to pursue a career in aviation since i was no age. I signed up for the army a year ago and am due to start basic training in 4 weeks :sad: but i came across PTC, very pricey but sounds good, plus my girlfriend lives there but ive heard alot of negative comments on this forum about it... i need to make a decision quickly otherwise ill have to head on in the army (army air corps)

I need to find a school that offers me a good comprehensive package, and needs to be 100% funded by means of a loan because i am unemployed at the moment, or will be if i resign my app from the british army.

Oh and all i want to do is fly for a living, wether its small aircraft, ME or commercial airlines, or even instructing i just need to know of a good integrated course in ireland or possibly the UK that will set me up for when i graduate,

Thanks.

[preduk]

PTC has been slaughtered on this forum a number of times, I would do a quick search to see all the comments.

These days, its going to be hard getting the funding, I believe you can borrow up to 25k unsecured from most banks (won't pay for all of the training though) so you would need to secure a loan probably on your house (which is very dodgy at the moment).

Personally if I were you and you want to become an airline pilot you would be better off getting a job saving up and going modular, take your time as most airlines aren't recruiting at the moment.

Best of Luck.

[Nearly There]

Join the AAC, you be surprised of the opputunities open to you if you knuckle down, keep your head down and be a good soldier.

Imagine the conversation in the bank, Im 18, unemployed and need to borrow circa 70k to fund flight training!
Not a chance in hell at the moment, the banks are hardly lending to home owners with equity in their property.
Even if you did get the cash, how would you make the monthly payments, being a full time student with no income? and with no gaurentee of a job at the end!

Its possible to apply for aircrew with the AAC once in, the careers office should be able to give you more details on that.

Your 18, serve your time, enjoy it, save the pennies and review it all again in 5 years, you will be early 20s, with cash in the bank, sensible head on your shoulders, and armed forces on your CV.

Good luck:ok:

[corsair]

Presumably there is a reason you haven't considered the RAF or RN? There is no integrated course in Ireland. PTC doesn't claim theirs is but they won't stop you thinking it is. To be fair to PTC I do think improvement is on the cards. They are aware of their problems. If they survive this downturn. However I doubt if you will get funding. Things are pretty dead at the moment. However Cityjet, I think are still taking on cadets through FTE and CTC. Have a look at the website.

The girlfriend thing obviously impacts your thinking. But to be frank. I would stick with the Army Air Corps. You will get lots of experience and maybe even fly with them. I tried to join years ago. Pity I couldn't. Five years from now, you will still be only 23. That is very young still, believe me.

[glennmcl08]

Yeah well its mainly the fact that i want to stay home now, i was in the army at 16 and i discharged on week 10 of basic because i couldnt cope being away from family, friends, girlfriend etc. also to become aircrew in the AAC takes along time, up to 5 years just to do rear crewman, and anywhere up to 12 years to just get a consideration for pilot training, needless to say the AAC holds only approximately 90 odd aircraft between 3,000+ AAC soldiers, and you dont have to be in the AAC to apply for pilot so it is a very big field and i only have GCSE's no A-levels which doesnt bring out much light from me.

I wanted to join the RAF from a young age, i walked into the careers office at 15 and tried asking for info but they turned me away and said come back when you get your grades, i went into rebel mode and walked over to the army desk and signed up in the heat of the moment. But now that you mentioned it i might actually think of going into the RAF now, something like weapons systems operator, something to keep me working around aircraft, and give me enough money to fund my own modular training package.

Well thanks for your reply's guys its going to be a tough decision as i have 4 weeks left and im nowhere near as fit as i should be, especially after finishing a detox from all the alcohol during the xmas period lol but just to note i had a word with the missus and she is fine with moving to the UK, so if you know of any good quality flying schools you could recommend for a young wannabe pilot please do let me know :ok:

Oh and one more thing. Assuming i get my PPL, if i then done a ME/MEIR course would this be good enough to get a job in flying? Because if im funding myself i wont be able to afford the ATPL until a good few years down the line, or could i possibly just get a PPL and build hours and maybe become an instructor? im not sure how many hours schools like instructors to have if you could tell me that be great.

Glenn :cool:

[preduk]

I was speaking to an FO from Ryanair who had recently left the AAC to become an airline pilot.

He was promised time after time the opportunity to become flight crew and never did, they kept telling him they guarantee he would be going to aircrew after a tour in Iraq or Afghan, but when he came back he wouldn't hear anything.

Got sick of it and went into civi flying.

I was looking at the RN, but I think it's a single mans career very hard to do when you have a family to look after.

[corsair]

Yeah well its mainly the fact that i want to stay home now

Admirable though that is, joining any service isn't going to allow to stay home. You're bound to be sent to Britain at the very least and then sandy places and tropical places. In fact you're best option would be to join the Irish Air Corps. They don't go anywhere. :hmm: Not that they are recruiting at the moment.

Maybe you need to look into things a bit more deeply. Now is not a good time to start flying training as you may have noticed in other threads.

[ivanwhitemac]

Hey I'm from Co Wexford am I'm currently in Algonquin Flight Centre, Canada, an Irish owned flight school, and I highly recommend it. The full package cost just under 70,000 euro, and it includes accomodation, transport, food along with the training. I don't have much time to type tonight but feel free to ask me any questions! their website is Pilot.ie - Airplane Homepage (http://www.pilot.ie) good luck!!!

[bombsaway80]

Might wanna think carefully about how you go to Algonquin Flight School now that the so called "Canadian Aviation Academy" (an Irish recruitment agency) are involved with the school. A serious number of complaints from former students about these guys....http://www.pprune.org/professional-pilot-training-includes-ground-studies/337637-canadian-aviation-academy.html
Its also worth bearing in mind that these guys regularly plant stories on this forum that try to paint a very rosy picture of things when they are anything but.
Mr. White, I have a few questions for you- how many students have graduated , how many have secured work through the Canadian Aviation Academy, and why are students waiting around for the last six months to finish their training because there isn't a twin engine plane available? How many planes are online now between how many students? Also to correct you, the school is not Irish owned, rather they have a minority share. I await your answers Sir.
Try contacting the school directly for a quote. Algonquin Flight Centre - Welcome (http://www.algonquinflightcentre.com/)
Notice if you click on the foreign students link it takes away from the AFC homepage and to the Canadian Avaition Academys where they are charging double what it would cost if you went to AFC directly. It's your call, just make sure you have all the facts...

[ivanwhitemac]

Bombsaway, who are you anyway? What is your association with AFC/CAA? If you can't answer those two questions, your opinion is worthless. At least I am using my name and I have stated that I am a current student.
Are you an applicant who didn't get accepted? Are you a student who failed to attend classes and flights? Are you one of the students who cancelled flights and ground school constantly for no real apparent reason?
Both myself and other current students are all completely satisfied with the setup and our progress on the course to date.
I don't know where you are getting your information from, but all the current students are overly satisfied.
About the twin, as a student of the flight school, I physically saw C-GTNA flying in November, and it is now back online as of this week. The props were sent for their scheduled maintenance. Where are you getting 6 months from??

[bombsaway80]

Lets just say I have seen things very closely, and I know exactly what I am talking about. Now I'm not going to give you my name so that certain people can ring me up and give me crap. So if that makes my opinion worthless in your view, tough. Now I'm sure you've been brainwashed into believing that all the former students were 'troublesome', how convenient that everybody was wrong and CAA were right as usual..:ugh:
Well the twin is finally up and running is it? Does that mean it is now ready for the multi IFR portion of training now so?
What about the ridiculous claims of having a king air, or a piper navajo? Also, I hear they sold the 172s before Christmas, is that correct?
You forgot to answer my other questions by the way-how many students have graduated, how many are now working, how many planes are online now, how many students are there? Also, why are they claiming to get you a JAA licence when they don't have a JAA instructor at the school?
Your friend winto22 used to do the same thing, coming on here trying to plug the place and please the management while conveniently dodging the hard questions.

[corsair]

ivan mate, you come across a bit too... official. Not a bit like a 19 year old student pilot.

[ivanwhitemac]

Bombsaway, I have read the same material as you, and I have fully understood it.

The school never claimed that they have a King Air/ Piper Navajo, they claim that they give students the opportunity to get a type rating on a King Air/Navajo, if they want it.
As for the 172's, I have seen Irish students flying in both of them in recent weeks, as well as Canadian students.
As for the students graduating, I am not a company person, and I don't have contact with former students.
When I signed up for the course, it was clearly stated that they send you to Greece to do the JAA, which is totally optional, and not compulsory.
With a name like Bombsaway, I doubt you ever wanted a career in civil aviation. Maybe you should have tried the military. Oh, no you would have needed a set of balls for that!:D

[2close]

If you want to become aircrew in the AAC you may be better off going into another regiment or corps, knuckling down for a couple of years, get yourself a stripe or two on your arm (the Military Police or a tech trade is a quick way of achieving this), rack up a couple of good Annual Reports, then applying through the system for transfer.

A teeth-arm unit would be the best as these are the units you would be eventually supporting and operational experience is very useful, however, promotion is slower and if I recall correctly you have to be a JNCO to apply for aircrew selection. As long as you like dust, heat and living in a sh*t-hole for 6 months at a time you're OK. The missus had better get used to that idea as well; the army has a lot of operational commitments now and you can pretty much guarantee you're going to get a suntan at some point in the relatively near future.

But I must say you do sound very indecisive and not sure what you really want to do. The first thing you need to do is figure out exactly what it is you want and what you are prepared to sacrifice to get it. Once you've got that sussed then work out your plan - you're young, you've got plenty of time, a few years in the forces won't hurt (we hope!) and you may be able to either get into aircrew or at least save some money towards your training which may show the bank some commitment on your part which will make them more inclined to lend you the rest (no guarantees there though!).

At the moment, I reckon you've got more chance knitting a jumper out of fog than getting money out of the bank for a CPL/IR course. In any case, neither the flight training nor the air transport industries are in the best of shapes so now may not be the best of times to be going into training.

Whatever you decide, I wish you all the best.

2close

[bombsaway80]

With a name like Bombsaway, I doubt you ever wanted a career in civil aviation. Maybe you should have tried the military. Oh, no you would have needed a set of balls for that!:D
Meeeeeooooww, saucer of milk for Ivan!:ouch:
Look, I'm not going to bother my arse arguing, all you need to do is read the Canadian Aviation Academy thread and it speaks for itself. Anyway, back to the topic, as KeithTo said....

[mrb338]

I am 21 and just about to go into my last term of an aerospace engineering degree in Queen's University Belfast. Like Glenn I have been set on becoming an airline pilot since a very young age, and now I'm at a stage where some big decisions need to be made. People have asked me if I would consider joining the army but I know that it is not for me.

I also have been advised not to go to PTC, but I've heard of a training school in Cork (Atlantic Flight Training).

I have a good part time job at the minute, and if now is not the time to start training, I am probably going to try and get a second part time job at the airport or go full time in the current job. Probably like most people at this stage, money is my main limiting factor!

On a full time wage I would probably be able to afford a PPL next year. Is this advisable or is it better to wait until I can afford to do the whole course?

Its probably very hard to tell at the minute, but does anyone have any idea at what point the airlines may be in a position to start recruiting again?

[Pjlot]

I know this is thread drift but I want to add a comment here in relation to CAA - Algonquin - PRI or whatever their new identity is this month.

One thing that strikes me about the posts that are made on this website from students defending CAA or Algonquin is that they are all outstanding comments. All the posts seem to follow the same lines. All these comments seem to follow the lines of a sales pitch! They always include the everything included sales pitch & how perfect the place and the "too good to be true" opportunities.

There are remarkable similarities in relation to all these posts!

Are these posts being made by one person using the names of some of the students? Are the students being handed a draft of what to type or are they being supervised as they type. After reading allot of the posts from some students etc I have to say they all seem to sound too perfect to be true. If we are to believe what we read from the students about how fabulous the place is why have we not read articles in any of the aviation magazines in relation to the outstanding performance of this FTO! New students seem to have in-depth knowledge of all past disgruntled students and the goings on. It is highly unprofessional for any FTO to discuss in-depth the issues they had with past disgruntled students or to allow that sort of childish tittle tattle to be communicated through the students! And no I have no association or past association with the said FTO!

Anyway enough and back to the real thread issue.

glennmcl08

DO your research on all FTO's before committing. You are 18 so you have many years ahead of you to complete training. As for securing a loan. To be realistic I think you will find it near impossible to borrow the amount of money you need from the banks. The fact you are unemployed will go against you big time. Take your time with the training what’s the hurry! Take your time to research and understand all involved. Take the training slow and steady over a few years and then speed it up to complete when the industry picks up. Mainly be realistic with yourself. Why have you signed up to the army when you know that you are going to find it extremely tough being away from your family and you didn't survive because of the same issue before? Don't get me wrong if you miss you family you miss them there is nothing wrong with that just be realistic with yourself. Don't put yourself into a situation that you are going to struggle to cope with because you miss those close to you!

[preduk]

Pjlot,

They are also always brand new users to the forum. I remember the owners pathetic attempt to scare people with legal action, personally I think it's the staff at CAA and would love to track their IPs to see exactly where they are coming from.

[civil aviation]

Wondering why you are bothering with all the obvious Canada B.....S when, if you don't want to train in Britain or Ireland, the obvious, cheaper and well-known route is to one of several JAA FTO's in Florida (e.g. Ormond Beach Aviation - Home Page - Welcome! (http://www.flyoba.com) learn to fly, helicopter training, private and commercial pilot training with OFT (http://www.flyoft.com) European Flight Training - the Difference is the Approach.™ (http://www.flyeft.com) etc)

[prionsa]

mrb i know exactly how you feel i could have wrote that post myself and changed the name :) i'm in exactly the same situation, 21 finishing aeronuatical engineering in the university of limerick, ive been researching and reading for ages about becoming a pilot, along with solid reputable sources from these forums ive spoken to high up industry members within emirates airbus the iaa and jetairways....all say the same thing...now is not the time for learning to fly.

it breaks my heart because im screaming to start my career as a pilot too but thats the harsh truth. ptc in waterford are to be avoided, too many people have had bad experiences with them to ignore and their rates are through the roof. i live beside the training facilities in cork airport and to be honest its more of a ppl flying club set up.

banks arent going to loan you the money, even if you graduate there's no job there for you.just debt. my plan is to spend next year doing a masters and keep a close eye on the industry. oaa seem the most reputable flight training school for when things pick up again, and they will. the advice ive been given has been the same from everyone, aim to graduate flight school around 2013 so try and get into it in 2012.oh and work your ass off in betweeen to start chipping away at the loan.its approx 77k to go all the way but add living expenses for a year onto that too.more like 87k.

on the otherhand keep looking for sponsorship and if it gets you anywhere send me on the info too and put in a good word for me :) best of luck

[Pjlot]

It's been proven in a previous thread what this FTO are capable and how underhanded management are there.

One of the Mods proved this by posting that CAA had been in contact and told pprune that they would buy one years advertising if pprune deleted the CAA thread!

Also it was posted by mods that all the new posts in the CAA thread defending the FTO were from the same IP address which basically means the same PC!

If this organisation is prepared to carry on in this unprofessional manner what respect is a HIGHLY PROFESSIONAL industry to have for this crowd! Management and Pilots working in the airlines read these forums also and will form their own judgement!



If they are capable of trying to buy their way out of a simple problem on a forum like this, what other issues do they try to buy themselves out of. If that is their mentality then it potentially opens a can of worms!

The most remarkable issue is the lack of professionalism from this organisation seen on a previous CAA threat when CAA LEGAL (Eddie Russell) threatened Legal action for so called Criminal Damage! CAA LEGAL was posted over 5 days after the thread had last been posted on which brought the thread back to the lime light! Then there were all the new PLANTS from the same IP address posting comments that they were emailing students training with CAA at the moment and they were all "completely or overly satisfied"! This IP was an IP in the FTO!!!! All these planted posts rose the issues with CAA to the top of the threads again which digs up all the negativity about CAA again!

If management there had any level of common sense they would refrain from posting any comments here on this site and in Damage Limitation should also ask their students to refrain from getting involved in debates about how perfect CAA are and then resorting to personal attacks this simple carries the debate on and keeps the thread HIGHLIGHTED.


Every time they post here about how perfect they are and the claims they have made it starts a whole debate again which results in more damage to an already damages reputation.

PS - May be the extra 45K they take in on every student fee is being saved to set the infamous aerobatic team!

[preduk]

Aye, that was the legal noticed that I slaughtered him for, guys a fool obviously.

I never knew about them buying advertising either - thats just poor business.

[bombsaway80]

PS - May be the extra 45K they take in on every student fee is being saved to set the infamous aerobatic team!

No I think they're saving for a space shuttle this year Pjlot......:ok:
Maybe these guys should run their ads in the weekly world news? Although people can only be so gullible hehe

[Cloud Chaser]

You say that you are in Northern Ireland, have a look at:
Ulster Flying Club - Home (http://www.ulsterflyingclub.plus.com/), based at Newtownards, County Down.
No commercial training, but very good at private level.
Can cover PPL, Night, and hours building.
Very new fleet of C172 including Garmin1000 models.

[HomerJay]

One of the Mods proved this by posting that CAA had been in contact and told PPRuNe that they would buy one years advertising if PPRuNe deleted the CAA thread!

Also it was posted by mods that all the new posts in the CAA thread defending the FTO were from the same IP address which basically means the same PC!

link?

and possibly sticky the thread for a bit?

This is serious money these lads are going to be spending and there's possible spammers around:=

[Possum3]

I have been following this thread and am puzzled by references to the above abbreviation, would some kind soul please enlighten me as to what the abbreviation means? I entered it into the search box on the forum and PPrune had apparantly never heard of it.

[bsal]

What is PTC?
I have been following this thread and am puzzled by references to the above abbreviation, would some kind soul please enlighten me as to what the abbreviation means? I entered it into the search box on the forum and PPRuNe had apparantly never heard of it.


PTC means Pilot Training College (Of Ireland). Anyone thinking of training in Ireland should consider National Flight Centre, Weston Airport. National Flight Centre - Home (http://www.nfc.ie/) they are a really good school.

[Pjlot]

Quote

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They removed the post themselves having also tried to get the whole thread removed using a year's proposed advertising on PPRuNe as leverage.

I suspect you can work out for yourselves our reaction to that.http://static.pprune.org/images/smilies/thumbs.gif

It's also been great seeing the agrarian revolution in action with plants sprouting in abundance. Many of you have spotted it yourself - inept naivety but bless anyway.

My particular favourite was this far more 'sophisticated' attempt suggesting independence of thought and opinion:

Quote:
"I don’t mean to minimize what you have went through but I’m in regular mail contact with some of the lads over there."
Pity it was sent from the same IP address in Canada as the other happy new sign ups.

Email? Couldn't they just talk to each other?

Rob



Link

http://www.pprune.org/professional-pilot-training-includes-ground-studies/337637-canadian-aviation-academy-4.html

[bombsaway80]

Believe me guys, the above is nothing compared to other antics I've heard about. All will be coming out shortly in a national newspaper, I'll post the article as soon as its printed.

and possibly sticky the thread for a bit?
Good idea, how does one go about doing that?
I promise I'll keep everything on the proper thread after this....:O