IR simulator hours

[jerezflyer]

Hi,

Just considering doing the IR before the CPL after passing the ATPL exams, as it is a good way to gain the minimum 150 for the CPL instead of simply hour building (if I can afford it) my question is do the 35 odd simulator hours in the IR course count towards the minimum 150 hours for the CPL?

Thanks.

[Superpilot]

No they don't :ok:

[Eurotraveller]

Also, don't forget you will need 100hrs P1 for the CPL issue, so if you avoid hour building now depending on the P1 time you currently have you might have to do some at the end of your training to get the P1 time to have the CPL issued (none of the IR course is logged as P1, apart from the skills test at the end which is logged as P1S if successful - same goes for the CPL skills test).

I did the IR before CPL, found myself in the very situation described above and had to do a bit of hour building at the very end to bump up my P1 hours for license issue.

However, apart from that doing the IR first worked out quite well for me, especially welcome was the reduction in required training hours for the CPL (from 25 to 15 hours) although don't forget your IR training requirement is 5 hours longer than it would be for a CPL holder!

Very best of luck with your training whatever you decide to do.

Eurotraveller

[johnnyDB]

doing CPL first does however rids you of your 36 month period for finishing the CPL and gives you time to save for the IR.

[PAPI-74]

I did the CPL in a twin first and had a much easier IR knowing the aircraft that much better.
It cost a bit more but gave me 56hrs twin.

Hey! Whatever suits you.

[greekboy]

Hi JohnnyDP

What do you mean by that 36 month period?

gb

[live2excel]

What do you mean by that 36 month period?

I think it's a bit like the PPL - for the PPL once you complete your written exams you have 24 months to get your licence - same for ATPL exams I believe, except you have 36 months to gain a professional licence (a CPL)

:ok:

[bajadj]

I was under the impression that you also have to gain you IR in the 36months as well as the CPL. I could be wrong though.

[Bearing 123]

Absolutely right!!! Remember its a FATPL you are working for and that means completing the CPL/IR in the 36 months preceeding the date of you last exam pass. If you don't do both in this time frame you have to resit the writtens:eek:

[jerezflyer]

thanks guys...in conclusion then,
1. the IR sim hours do not count towards the minimum 150 hours for starting the CPL course
2. you need 100 PIC for licence issue anyway, so hour building packages gives you PIC time not the IR or CPL course
3. you must get both CPL and IR in no particular order within 36 months of passing ATPL exams

I currently have a PPL with 70 hours TT, of which 35 hours are PIC, so I need a minimum of a further 65 PIC through hour building.

[Eurotraveller]

jerezflyer,

That all looks about right, keep in mind you can hour build to 100hrs P1 either before or after completing the CPL/IR courses, but for most it makes sense to do it before since you need 150hrs total to start the CPL anyway.

With your hours, you'd still be considerably shy of the 150 hours you needed to start the CPL even after completing a 55 hour IR course (several hours of which you couldn't count towards the 150hrs total anyway as it would be in the sim).

Hope that makes sense.

Eurotraveller

[LH2]

ISTR there is a minimum P1 time requirement for starting the IR (70hr?) and the MEP. You need to hour build those, then you can use your IR training hours (about 35 actual flight hours IIRC) as part of your hour building towards the 150 required to start CPL training.

Then, unless you have been a very slow learner, after your CPL skills test you will only have about 165-170hr so will need to hour build some more to bring it all up to 200TT (100P1).

Needless to say, best way to hour build is to grab a plane for 4-5 days and fly as far as you can in that time (and back, unless you are ferrying or you have crashed). For best results, do it with another pilot so you get to divide the hours and multiply the experience.

[LH2]

Sorry, I just noticed you did not mention anything about MEP. Do you intend to do a single engine IR?

[johnnyDB]

yup, sorry i was wrong, you do indeed also need the IR as to keep your ATPL theory valid.

[Eurotraveller]

LH2,

The 70 hrs P1 is required for the issue of the MEP rating, although you can start the MEP training before you have the 70 hours P1 should you want to for any reason. To "apply" for the IR (to use LASORs terminology), the only pre-requirement is 50 hours P1 cross-country time, although again I suppose you could do the course, pass the test, then build the required P1 cross-country time before you become an "applicant" for the license by sending your paperwork off to the CAA.

You're quite correct that you also need 200 hours total (as well as 100 hours P1) to get the CPL issued, I forgot to mention that. All of this needs to be factored in when planning when to hour build up to the required time.