View Full Version : IAF Mig 21 ejection
tonker
24th Dec 2008, 10:08
In interesting amateur video of i can only guess a trial by the IAF.
At least he can't claim he wrestled with the controls to avoid the buildings:E
LiveLeak.com - Ejection by a IAF pilot (http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=55f_1230069258)
scarecrow450
24th Dec 2008, 10:17
Nice video, but think its real as it crashed :ugh:
Well - was the trial a success? We need to know.
aviate1138
24th Dec 2008, 10:29
Nice video?
Appalling video. Unfocussed, incorrectly framed, jerky, not even "Amateur" quality!
Humbug.
Happy Christmas all........
Unfocussed, incorrectly framed, jerky, not even "Amateur" quality! - tempted to say the same about the pilot! Possibly a tad 'handle happy'?
glad rag
24th Dec 2008, 11:31
Lot of smoke whilst aircraft on runway other mig gets up sharpish enough.....
scarecrow450
24th Dec 2008, 12:14
Sorry guess it was a trial, well he seemed to get out ok ?
I know that its the IAF, but somehow I imagine that a trial might be carried out in more clinical conditions. Looks real to me !
May or may not be important but the windsock is visible in second 53 of the video and appears to be almost horizontal and direction on the tail of the departing aircraft.
This looks real. It has the dry scrub vegetation of the Punjab, where both the Indian AF and the Pakistan AF operate. Taken by some amateurs speaking either Urdu or Hindi (which are indistiguishable for most common words). The speaker refers to a popular Indian movie "Rang de Basanti" made in Hindi in India whose theme was corruption in spares procurement leading to MiG-21 crashes. But Hindi movies are seen widely in Pakistan (and the Middle East and Africa!).
I may be wrong but this looks like a Pakistan Air Force F-7P (Chinese built Mig-21) crash. I couldn't tell if it had the extended radome like all Indian Mig-21s. Couldn't tell from a side view if it had the broad chord tail that all existing Indian Mig-21 have (we have only the Mig-21 Bisons/Bis in operational squadrons and Mig-21 MFs in training squadrons).
The rescue helicopter in the picture is a Alouette III which both the PAF and IAF fly in the role. (The IAF flies the license built Chetak version of the Alouette). No saffron, white, green roundel markings on it makes me suspicious that this isn't an IAF helicopter.
The overalls worn by some of the personal all seem to be green. It could still be the IAF since they just moved to green overalls but the transition is only a few months old, so there would have been more of the blue overalls.
I haven't been around IAF bases a lot lately, but the vehicles in use seemed unfamiliar. The clincher for me was what looked like the Crescent marking of the PAF on the side of the ambulance at 2:48 on the video.
The pilot wasn't handle happy, the MiG-21 ejection seats have a "coffin corner" just after takeoff - I think it the envelope is 0/90 kts. So if you leave it too late after rotation you could be in a bad spot. Looked like the engine wasn't producing too much power, otherwise the aircraft would have climbed very rapidly.
Still, I'll share the video with my IAF contacts and report back.
Cheers
Worf
a "coffin corner" just after takeoff - I think it the envelope is 0/90 kts. So if you leave it too late after rotation you could be in a bad spot.- Hmm! - I think you have been fed duff gen? At rotate the seat is well within that envelope - which is 'standard' for a pre-rocket seat.
Most of us try to stay with the a/c (if it is flying, which it obviously was) long enough to try and park the wreckage in the best place. I managed 1:20 I think it was.........
BOAC,
The F-7P has a Martin Baker 0/0 seat. The PAF was very good about insisting on Martin Baker seats for all its aircraft including the Mig-19. The ejection seats for the MiG-21 depended on the mark but here is a quote from an article
"4) The CK ejection seat, one of the best for high speed high altitude ejection simply was not good enough for low level by modern standards. One of the clever features of the CK seat was that as the seat left the cockpit the canopy- which was hinged to the front of the windshield in the FL - attached itself to the top of the ejection seat and rotated itself until it covered the entire front of the ejection seat- thus giving unparalled blast protection when ejecting at supersonic speed. I remember a Martin Baker engineer getting very interested in how the thing worked. I had seen the seat but he had not! Unfortunately I was not able to help him. The semi -encapsulation feature delayed ejection in that it took too long to get rid of the canopy after clearing the aircraft and this delayed clear release and deployment of the Parachute. The 300 kmph, 100 meters minimum parameters meant that many low level ejections were unsuccessful."
MiG-21 Accidents - Prodyut M Das (http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/Info/Aircraft/MiG-Prodyut.html)
So IAF MiG-21 pilots were told to eject rather than stay in the airplane if the engine so much as burped on takeoff. Probably SOP for all MiG-21 pilots.
The 0/90 thing may indeed be duff gen. I just got back from a Gnat reunion, and the Ajeet had a 0/90 seat which floated to the top of my already weakened brain! :)
Worf
TEEJ,
There have been many IAF MiG crashes. I would actually love some footage of one of them, but this isn't IAF for the reasons mentioned.
Tezpur mentioned in the article is tropical (close to the border with Burma), and the vegetation isn't like the one seen in the picture. I know I have been there. I was in Jorhat across the Brahmaputra river from Tezpur. The MiGs from the now defunct MOFTU (MiG Operational Fighter Training Unit) at Tezpur used to come across to Jorhat airfield to practice landings.
Worf
TEEEJ
25th Dec 2008, 02:50
Hi Worf,
You are quite correct. I've deleted that post as the info was incorrect.
My apologies. I found that link on the you tube site.
It is indeed a Pakistan Air Force ejection
At 01:32 you can see a Pakistani roundel on the Alouette III.
Ejection by a IAF Pilot - Video (http://www.metacafe.com/watch/2195401/ejection_by_a_iaf_pilot/)
TJ
I was going to say it looked like a 'classic' rapid low-speed MB separation with no sign of a 'canopy shield' etc, so it being PAF makes sense. I still stand by the 'handle happy' comment there, especiallly since:
a/c the right way up
engine seems to be doing something
?0/0 seat?
Given that you really need 'to be there', but I like to think that I and my 'mates' would have waited a moment or two longer. It only just missed the complex, and that was definitley luck and no judgement.
PS Worf - we had a ?Bala Naidoo? (excuse spelling) on exchange on the RAF Gnat - is he still around?
BEagle
25th Dec 2008, 18:26
Was Bala an exchange pilot? I thought that he was RAF.
A great chap.
One of his students (whose father was Jamaican) was having problems getting to grips with formation in the Gnat (din't we all?). So Bala hailed him cheerily with the words "Well now, soul brother, let's go and do some formation!"
This was in the days when we had silly callsigns like 'Milvus', 'Outward', 'Fervent', 'Sambar' etc. So Bala, being the Boss, decided upon 'Sambar'. When he came to the check-in though, Bala called "Sambo, check-in".....and off they went announcing themselves as Sambo formation on every frequency change.
This broke the ice for his stude, who was a great chap with a terrific sense of humour. He never looked back and went on to become a Jaguar flight commander in later years. Possibly all thanks to Bala's novel methods!
Re. the ejection video, I hope that the only thing which was damaged was the MiG?
One of his students (whose father was Jamaican) Ex regiment officer with a deficit of toes?
K.Whyjelly
25th Dec 2008, 20:47
One of his students (whose father was Jamaican) was having problems getting to grips with formation in the Gnat (din't we all?). So Bala hailed him cheerily with the words "Well now, soul brother, let's go and do some formation!
This broke the ice for his stude, who was a great chap with a terrific sense of humour. He never looked back and went on to become a Jaguar flight commander in later years.
Think this could be Ozzy Osbourne who was boss at 41Sqn back in the early 80's..................top Jag mate. You may of course know different Beags.
BEagle
25th Dec 2008, 21:08
http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a341/nw969/Internet/zxzxz.jpg
It was indeed Ozzy! I went through UAS, Cranwell, Valley and Brawdy with him and his wonderful sense of humour.
Anyone know where he is now?
I remember doing the student led SAP (or 'ATT' as it was termed on 234 Sqn) with him - I was No. 3 to Ozzy's lead, with staff mates in No. 2 and 4 positions. This went well, apart from a couple of items:
"Lead from 4, right, 1 o'clock high, mast on hill!"
"Lead visual"
"But Ozzy, it's only 80 ft high!"
On the guns attack, No. 2 called "I forgot my guns master". So Ozzy leads us around for a re-attack with throttle fully open. Coming off target, I see him charging off towards Brawdy with the rest of us trailing in his dust. "2, buster" "So is 3!" "And 4 - will you slow down, you bugger!"
We all have a good chuckle at the debrief. Then it's Ozzy's turn...
"Who called the guns master?"
"I did", said 'Chalky' White, (No.2).
"Right then, Chalky, that's 2 pigs. One for forgetting and another for not knowing that a Mk6A doesn't even have a guns master switch!"
Another of his priceless line book entries was after a composite strafe/10deg dive bombing range sortie when he'd had a Mk6A rather than a Mk9. The 6A had one less anti 'g' bottle than the 9, so was prone to running out of anti 'g' later in the sortie. "After that last dive, I blacked out completely!", he announced to the QWI doing the clack....clack...clack...rangey....hmmm....ride up....early pickle thing in the cine room - who could only see Ozzy's eyes and smile in the dark and pi$$ed himself laughing.
What fun it was back then. TWU at Brawdy in the spring of '76! Superb instruction (apart from one nasty sod who got his comeuppance years later), some great characters and some excellent chums!
Was Bala an exchange pilot? I thought that he was RAF. - could be right - a while ago!
ecureilx
26th Dec 2008, 02:09
I noticed the Ambulances had the Crescent - which is used in Pakistan, instead of the Cross, as used in India...
It is PAF, after all
There was a Naidu on Gnat Mk 1s (a contemporary of my father) but I don't think there was ever an IAF Gnat exchange instructor. There were a quite few who did the CFS course, the DFCL (Day Fighter Combat Leader) and the PAI courses but no one who actually did an exchange stint in the 60s-70s-80s timeframe. The only attachments for more than courses were for ETPS trained test pilots as far as I know. UK trained instructors were needed too badly at home.
Exchange postings to the UK and USA are relatively new and started only in the late 90s. My good friend was the first T-38 exchange instructor with the USAF in the 1996-99 timeframe.
Talking about the Gnat reunion - Beagle and others on the RAF Gnat might enjoy the site Gnat50Years (http://gnat50years.in/) which has some truly amazing stories which included the development of the Gnat at Chilbolton with Folland. The RAF Gnat was an entirely different machine of course.
Worf