Prince William to become a SAR driver

[sss]

Prince William is to train to become a full-time pilot with the Royal Air Force's Search and Rescue Force, Clarence House said.

The young royal, who learned to fly earlier this year with the RAF, said he wanted to "serve operationally" and joining the unit will allow him to fulfil this ambition.

William has spent much of this year not only on attachment with the Air Force but with the Royal Navy and other units of the Armed Forces.

The Prince, an officer in the Household Cavalry Regiment, said: "It has been a real privilege to have spent the past year understanding and experiencing all aspects of the British Armed Forces.

"I now want to build on the experience and training I have received to serve operationally - especially because, for good reasons, I was not able to deploy to Afghanistan this year with D Squadron of the Household Cavalry Regiment.

"The time I spent with the RAF earlier this year made me realise how much I love flying.

"Joining Search and Rescue is a perfect opportunity for me to serve in the Forces operationally, while contributing to a vital part of the country's emergency services."

William to be full-time RAF pilot - News - Virgin Media (http://latestnews.virginmedia.com/news/uk/2008/09/15/william_to_be_full_time_raf_pilot)

guess he did not want to fly CHC's new cabs then

[johned0]

BBC NEWS | UK | William to train as rescue pilot (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7616497.stm)

I wonder what special lessons Crab would teach HRH ? - Suggestions on a postcard, please ;)

John

[chcoffshore]

At least he will have a job to go back to in a couple of years when the civvies take over, un like some!:{

[unstable load]

More out of curiosity than anything else, does anyone know if he has what it takes to do the job by way of skills/ability?

[SASless]

Humble Pie eating Crab.....now there's a sight!:ok:

A cross word to his Co-Jo and off to join the Junglie's in a flash after Mummy asks a fav from the Boss Crab!:uhoh:

[HeliJedi]

Alot of crustaceans in that family..........

Do CHC hire crustaceans????

[Heliringer]

I thought the deal was he has a go at the three services, He gets wings and sea time, aswell as the Army stuff BUT did anyone think he might want to do this full time when they gave away the wings?

[PO dust devil]

Nice Work if you can get it.......I once met a member of the Royal Family....Believe me, I was impressed and would like to pursue that line of work operationally. To whom should I address my CV?:rolleyes:

DD

[Fareastdriver]

Give the poor sod a chance. He cannot do anything in the army because our loyal media would fill the internet with where he is going or what he was doing before he had blacked his face. The Navy is no use because he would be picked out of a rowboat by some middle eastern patrol boat so that leaves the RAF. Stovies and likewise are out for the same reason so that leaves SAR. Mum runs the shop so he can choose.
The good thing about it that the paparazzi, having monitored every form of communication in the SAR world, may well slide down a wet grassy slope and pitch themselves, and their cameras, over a two hundred foot cliff trying to get an exclusive shot.

[airborne_artist]

Mum runs the shop His mum is 6' below ground. Think you'll find the shop is his Granny's :}

His eyesight is another problem that seems to have been "overcome" :E

[Ioan]

"The time I spent with the RAF earlier this year made me realize how much I love flying"

Good luck to him, if he's genuinely got the skills to do the job then I'm just gonna be jealous. Made me smile to see that he'd got the bug too!

[SASless]

Second in line....with the pace of advancement shown so far....fat chance he has of ever making it to the front office. Jug Ears must be crying in his Port!

[[email protected]]

To my knowledge it has not been decided which SAR flight he will go to but he would certainly be welcome at Chiv.

As to his capability for the job - having never flown a Sea King or any SAR training before he was able to complete drum winching in light winds and a live standard deck, all in 1 hour 30. I know this will invite comments about how easy SAR must therefore be but William is no idiot and can fly a helicopter perfectly well.

Whichever flight he goes to will see an upturn in its job tally as countless females put themselves in peril in the hope of being rescued by a Prince:ok:

[airborne_artist]

Crab - it was said of his uncle that he was living proof that you could teach a monkey to do anything. The problem was getting Andrew through Dartmouth. He had to have extra tuition with the brother of a mate to get him through :ok:

[DBChopper]

Just goes to show it's not what you know, but who what family you happen to be born into. The sooner we have a society based on merit and not a ancestry the better.

So aside from training to fly SAR, which bit of his life would you like then? :hmm:

Good luck to him - I really can't think of a more worthwhile occupation (it's certainly a cut above the level that his "Really Useful" uncle has achieved :E)

[SASless]

There...ya see? Crab is at it already!

[Rescue1]

I did hear over a month ago that he was going to join Lossie, At the time I didn't believe it as he was off sailing round the world, so it must be true and my bet would be lossie will be where he ends up.
So Crab off your knees lad :)although he'll prob need a batman if you fancy a move.:)

[FloaterNorthWest]

My money is on Wattisham, closer to the clubs in London. :}

[ShyTorque]

Have you seen the size of the cabin in the bloody Sea King? I could get dozens of fellows in that thing for a bach party...

Chopin' might be more appropriate. And what's wrong with Brahms or Mozart?

Crab could teach him a thing or two about royalty :E

[Whirlygig]

Well I hope he gets a Handel on it when he enLizsts for SAR.

Cheers

Whirls

[BlenderPilot]

LAST TWO MONARCHS WE HAD AROUND HERE IN MEXICO WERE DECAPITATED, Funny how Royalty get's treated differently around the world. :O

Hope this doesn't offend anyone . . . .

[SASless]

Spoiled their constitutions did it?

[Freewheel]

I'm surprised....

Nearly 12 hours since the first post and crab has only been on here once. Then, only to imply that Wills shares the gifted touch that crab thinks is only possessed by those conducting SAR in the RAF.

Good luck to William, lots of us are jealous at him being able to slot in on request (me too) but good on him for taking the opportunity, since he seems to enjoy it. Far better for him to be fully occupied and active in something worthwhile than opening garden shows for the next 50 odd years.

[CYHeli]

I'm trying to imagine the nickname that he would use if he was to start posting here...:p
And to think of little ol' us mixing with the likes of 'im on here.:ok:

[212man]

it's certainly a cut above the level that his "Really Useful" uncle has achieved

What: Operational Sea King co-pilot during the Falklands conflict then Lynx pilot and Q.W.I. (amongst other roles)?

[HUMS]

His other Uncle maybe (who worked at the Really useful group).....?

[Senior Pilot]

Plus he hosted a really nice reunion thrash for the rest of the squadron at Mum's place last year :ok:

[212man]

His other Uncle maybe (who worked at the Really useful group).....?

Oh yes, silly me! I'd forgotten about him.....for some reason:E

[[email protected]]

Freewheel - give me a chance, I was airborne for 6:30 of those 12 hours:ok:

Whichever flight he goes to, William will be in the RAFSAR Force as SARH approaches - I bet that makes a whole load of high ranking officers pay attention to what they have allowed to happen to Military SAR:)

In deciding which flight he goes to, given that the 3As are newer and more serviceable than the 3s - it comes down to a choice between Wattisham and Chiv. It depends on whether he wants to do any SAROps on his tour really:):):)

[heli1]

C'mon guys...give him a chance.Does it matter which branch of the sevices he flies with ,so long as he is joining the helicopter club.Remember once Phillip flew them ,so did Charles and so did Andrew...all with the Navy (if you don't include the sadly defunct RAF Queens Flight) ,so maybe its the Air Force's turn ?

If it encourages a few more youngsters to volunteer and follow his example perhaps we can overcome the shortage of helo pilots !!

[Crabette]

During his brief tenure with the RAF SAR unit he was ‘lured’ into the prospect of the role…..no doubt to save the plight of RAF SAR from 2012, probably by ‘Crab’ himself. :}

The good news being, that after a few years as Crabs co-joe, he will be the second best pilot in the whole SAR world and a really unbiased, future Monarch. :ok:

You could put lipstick on 'Crab' and he’ll still be a RAF SAR pilot.

Don’t worry Crab old chap, your MBE/OBE/MVO will be assured after all your training of HRH. :)

[SASless]

If ever a "Wokka Willy", "See King 2 B", perhaps we will know!

[HRH SARboy]

One is really flattered at all this interest in my new hobby, but you must give me a chance - I just want to be one of the lads! I taught my brother all he knows about partying at the top-notch clubs with all the high class totty - just a shame about his choice of uniform on occasions, if you know what I mean???
Talking of high-class totty - Crabette, you sound like a pilot with promise - fancy being my stick buddy;)?
Crab, just remind me where you wanted the case of Bolly dropping off again? I've got one of my chaps popping down with it tomorrow.
Now, just remind me again, which colour uniform I have to wear on Thursdays, and am I a Flight Lieutenant now, or a sub-lieutenant, or a Corporal of Horse?? Oh no, thats the chaps in front of gran's gaff, isnt it?
Well, must dash, I have to go and have some fawning gits interview me at a flower show. At least the local lasses sometimes flash me their norks at these events. Toodle pip!

[topendtorque]

HRH SARboy


what a monica, wrong wrong, it should be, "a cut above the petunias" or at least "not a camomile, maybe a chameleon".
Which may lead one into the stories we keep hearing about english SAR.

And what's this about crabs on their knees? I thought they was already standing?:{

[Bladecrack]

Did anyone else notice the number of times his choice of career was referred to as "dangerous" by reporters on the news last night? Its the same old story with the media, anything to do with helicopters must be dangerous :ugh:

Yes, naturally there is an element of risk in SAR duties for HRH but surely this can be offset to a large degree by good training and the skilled and professional conduct of RAF crews on SAR missions?

[SASless]

Even if he were to get the chop....is there not a queue behind him for the top job?:oh:

It ain't exactly one has to interview for the position and have the CV with all the right work experience and licenses which other more mundane pursuits require.:E

[xxxchopperpilot]

Well done and best of luck. Who would of thought: a pilot being treated like a king.

[ppng]

Provided he's not as big a w@nker as his uncle, I reckon we should give the lad a chance to prove himself. I say stand or fall on your own merit whomever you are.

[MK10]

Aye, let the laddie prove himself..............why do we B:(ritish want people to fail before they even start??:(

[Exo.]

We don't, we just like queuing. It's polite.

[MK10]

Do we like queuing.or are we just polite??

[ninefromten]

Are we going to bring back Uncle Bob to teach the lad. At least the debriefs will keep him out of the bar!!

[leopold bloom]

Are we going to bring back Uncle Bob to teach the lad. At least the debriefs will keep him out of the bar!!
How appropriate, a King to teach a Prince!:)

[teeteringhead]

Are we going to bring back Uncle Bob to teach the lad. ... he who (allegedly) used to answer the 'phone on TQF.

"Queens's Flight - King speaking!"

[Chopper Doc Junior]

He is going to Middle Wallop first to have a go at playing with the apaches. Some folk get all the fun.

[MK10]

Is that cowboys and Indians then??

[SASless]

Custer got done in by a Sioux....what chance does Willy have with an Apache?:E

[airdoggy]

I personally think it is pretty cool. You have to give him some credit for choosing to serve his country in this capacity, especially since there were probably several other options. I have to admit, it makes me feel pretty good when I strap on my rescue helicopter knowing that the Prince William is doing the same thing. :D

[Pink Panther]

Ye, fair play to him. I hope it all works out well.:ok:

[SASless]

I know the British Military wear any number and combinations of uniforms....hat badges....and hats.....but could someone tell me just which uniform Willy would wear on a formal occasion. Brown, Blue, or Off Blue would suffice.

As he has served in all the services less the Royal Marines....doesn't his Bat Man get a bit overburdened at times trying to guess which rig the Gent should turn out in?

[Pandalet]

What, no jokes about putting one's Willy in a chopper? C'mon, it's Friday and everything!

[MartinCh]

interesting thread. Had some laugh.
On a serious note, wasn't there some 'hour requirements', or heavy helicopter experience etc on a standard requirements for the job?

Guess it's just for the plebs, innit?
Queues are for losers who can't have their own shop/bank/whatever.

Why would anyone queue for the SAR job if they can afford buying their own big chopper incl running costs? I bet he'd have enough backyard space to park the big heli whenever he wishes.

Plus having experience flying winching operations is useful for picking up and dropping off mates who live in built up areas. Private pro winchman at his service included.

Call me old-fashioned (can I be at my age??), but after those few :mad:-up with 'misusing' aircraft for inappropriate tasks/sorties, I have little confidence in his decision making skills and 'real accountability'.

Yeah, I'm jealous too. Not because of his family, fiancee/wife, etc, but because of his (financial) means. Whether he pays his dues on his way towards the ultimate heli flying job or takes shortcuts afforded to those very few chosen (born into) ones, it's still kinda positive way to up the future heli pros training.

[[email protected]]

First tourist pilots come to SAR straight from training with about 300 hours having completed DHFS, SARTU and the Sea King OCU (which William will have done albeit with a reduced DHFS element).

Once on the front line they spend 6 months Limited Combat Ready (LCR) before conducting a CR check but they are still full crew members on operations, they are just learning the ropes. They also spend a lot of their time in the RHS doing continuation training to improve their handling and SAR skills.

After their second CR, a year later, they should be receiving Operational Captaincy training with SARexs and flying SAROps in RHS under supervision of QHI or senior captain. Once deemed ready they undergo an Op Capt check with the OC of the Sqn. By this stage they will typically have 6 -800 hours.

William would be expected to follow exactly the same path and achieve captaincy in the same time frame as other first tourists.

[topendtorque]

What, no jokes about putting one's Willy in a chopper? C'mon, it's Friday and everything

OK I'll bite Pandalet.

'Willy gets to play with a big chopper with crabs!'
tet 2008.

[HRH SARboy]

Its "Wills", chaps, not "Willy"! .... One wouldn't want to be the butt of any of your jokes.
Watch it, because one day when I have finished poling, you may be asking me to lay my sword on your shoulders, and I wouldnt want to get the wrong idea!!

[topendtorque]

lay my sword on your shoulders,


Pork sword old chap?

and I wouldnt want to get the wrong idea!!

oh dear, I think you already have

[choppertop]

Does Prince William's (further) good fortune to be selected for SAR training mean that some other less fortunate, privileged, wealthy, over-indulged individual without a life of splendour to opt in or out of will be denied the training place taken by His Royal Highness?

[SASless]

We all cannot be born Farmer's Sons.

[choppertop]

Indeed not. But he could pay for it and should so some other less lucky kid isn't denied the place taken by him. Just my feeling.

[[email protected]]

Why should he pay for it? He is a serving officer in the military who has been given the posting of his choice (happens everyday to lots of others as well).
The anti-royalist sentiments expressed here really do sound petty and small-minded.

[Heliringer]

Yeah Crab, He's a serving officer who need not attend OASC and can just pick his choice of jobs. Not many officers around that can do this, at least not that I remember. It's a ****'n joke and a shame for the others who are doing the hard yards to get Wings and become operational.
Yeah I know he will be King but I think it's time to move on from that outdated and irrelevant system too.

Anyway rant over, Viva the Republic
:D

[[email protected]]

But he did complete Sandhurst completely on his own merit which is proper leadership and OQs, not the 18 week joke that Cranwell used to be. The only thing OASC would test him on is pilot aptitude, which has clearly got, so what is your problem with him? Green-eyed monster perhaps.
He is going to have to do quite enough 'hard yards' to get operational on a SAR Sqn - he will earn his place on the front-line just like everyone else.

[choppertop]

Prince Wills can't help his accident of birth -- no dispute about that. Nor should we knock his willingness to serve in the forces. Or even his aptitude. But given his massive and undeniable good fortune to be born to immense privilege it seems ALL WRONG that his choice to fly copters rather than cutting ribbons like his gran might deny a flying opportunity to some other mere mortal. So that's why I think he should pay for it. Nothing anti-Royal. Just fair. Ok, comrades?

[parabellum]

Choppertop - you are a left wing total nutter, think budgets, the cost to train William will not come from the same budget as the guy/girl behind him in line for helicopter training, it will come from a one off "Future King" budget. I will happily pay taxes to any system that preserves the Monarchy.

You whinge a lot but you don't say a lot.

[topendtorque]

I must say choppertop, you left me for dead there, i was wondering where you were coming from.

at least pandalet was trying to inject some humour into what seems like a drab subject?

or perhaps she was just musing out loud about some worry that some willy was going to mess with crabs big chopper??

dammed if I know where it's all at. but one thing for sure is that if wills wants to learn about self insurance in the low level sphere, then he should do a couple of thousand mustering hours first.

[choppertop]

Left wing? What's left wing about fairness?? I don't have views one way or the other about monarchy. It's a bit old fashioned in this day and age (laughable really) but, hey, if the people want it, let 'em have it. The people obviously DO want it, so let's keep having it.

But it bugs me how the Royals want it all: to live like Kings and play at being paupers. If playing at paupers doesn't cost us mere mortals anything, financially or otherwise, then fine. But if Royals dabbling with the ordinary man means the ordinary man is displaced, then the Royals need to pay. Because they've got enough privileges already.

Simple common sense. Innit??

[Whirlygig]

the cost to train William will not come from the same budget as the guy/girl behind him in line for helicopter training, it will come from a one off "Future King" budget.

Laugh? I nearly paid my taxes! :D

You cannot really believe that the UK Government's Finance Department can actually carry out a budget recharge across Departments? They don't know what a debit is unless they sit with a window on their left!

Cheers

Whirls

[[email protected]]

I still don't see where you get this idea that William taking up flying duties will prevent anyone else from doing so. All pilots go through training and once qualified, are posted to operational duties. It is not a case of chopping someone else to make way for him - towards the end of 60 Sqn at DHFS, a streaming board is held to see where the front-line places on the various OCUs need to be filled by first tourists - some go SAR, some go SH but they all get places. The only difference with William is that he is not allowed to go SH and therefore his streaming to SAR is already decided.

I cannot stress enough that he will not be 'playing' or 'dabbling', he is going to do a proper SAR tour and will be tested just like any new pilot; he will have to make the grade and, from what I have seen of him already, he will do so without favour or preferential treatment

[Bladecrack]

I agree with Crab. I would certainly have a moan if he wasn't going to do something useful considering his position and the career choices open to him.

However he is going to do something worthwile, and his brother has been making the effort and doing his best in the service of his gran recently too, so why dont you all find something worthwile to complain about? :ugh:

BC

[serf]

Sounds like you've made your mind up already crab, are you to have any part in his training?

[timex]

But it bugs me how the Royals want it all: to live like Kings and play at being paupers. If playing at paupers doesn't cost us mere mortals anything, financially or otherwise, then fine. But if Royals dabbling with the ordinary man means the ordinary man is displaced, then the Royals need to pay. Because they've got enough privileges already.

Chopper, what about his brother in Afghan, or his uncle who fought in the Falklands? Slightly more than "dabbling"...?

[ShyTorque]

But if Royals dabbling with the ordinary man means the ordinary man is displaced, then the Royals need to pay. Because they've got enough privileges already.

Depends what you mean by privileges. I, for one (speaking as an ex-just about the poorest kid on the block), wouldn't want to swap my life for his. As an ex SAR pilot myself, I wish him every success and a lot of luck because he will need it, let alone doing it all under the public spotlight.

[choppertop]

... Prince Edward??

[wrecking ball]

I am amazed they are letting the future king fly on an ac that is as old and unreliable as a mk 3 or 3a. Having said that they are off state that much it should be quite safe for the lad. He may crack 200hrs in a tour. Should have waited for a few years and let him do SAR on a 92.

[SASless]

The only difference with William is that he is not allowed to go SH and therefore his streaming to SAR is already decided.

I just have to ask......"why?".

[SirVivr]

Crab:

I am impressed that HRH has chosen SAR.

How else to prove his devotion?

Being a target in other operations is suicidal.

I don't believe that you or others will let him overextend himself.

Just an opinion from a 20 year Bristow pilot.

Cheers,

SirVivr

Capt. C Alexander

[[email protected]]

Serf - I have at least met and flown with him before making my mind up - unlike many on this forum:) If he comes to Chiv I will be his flight QHI but his flight hasn't been decided yet.

SASless - after the hassle that went with Harry's det to the 'stan, Wills can't go SH since it would either be there or Iraq to get his operational time. I seem to remember it was an American news team that blew the gaff on Harry;)

Sir Vivr - he won't be allowed to overextend himself any more than any other first tourist pilot but they do have to be allowed to make mistakes in order for them to learn.

[parabellum]

Whirls - I'm sure you are right, what I know about accounting wouldn't fill the back of a postage stamp but my point was that I didn't believe that any aspiring RAF pilot would lose his slot to make way for William. The RAF know full well that his career will be a short one, like his father's in the RN, before he is inundated with public duties, so as far as establishment numbers are concerned he will probably be supernumerary in the big picture.

[SASless]

Crab...

Ah that's right....forgive me for forgetting....being targeted by the Taliban/Al Qeada and all that I guess is what you are referring to.

Now talk about privileges of birth....must be a generational change after the Falklands or something.

[Non-PC Plod]

Its easy to talk about the priveledges of birth, but people forget about the huge restrictions on freedom that members of the Royal Family have to live with.
I remember Charles coming to visit my unit in N. Ireland back in the 90s. He really wanted to stay in the mess, and then go and paint in the Mourne mountains. However, he was not allowed to do either for security reasons.
I would imagine that W. has very little personal freedom as we mortals know it. I guess he would like to do a lot of the things that other people his age do. - Go to the pub & get p***ed; go backpacking around the world; chase girls; go to Glastonbury Festival; Play in a Band; etc etc.
Can you imagine either the Royal Household or the British Press letting him get on with a normal life like this if he wanted to?
I would imagine he has been given a shortlist of a couple of jobs he will be allowed to do - probably 1. Naval Officer ( except Commando pilot), or 2. RAF SAR pilot. I really cant think of anything else that they would be likely to let him (as future king) do. He wouldnt be allowed on combat operations, and it wouldnt look good if he drifted around doing anything other than serving his country.
Rather him than me. And people suggest he should PAY for the priveledge of being a prisoner to his ancestry??? Cut him some slack!

[TorqueOfTheDevil]

his brother in Afghan, or his uncle who fought in the Falklands


Exactly - neither of them were as close to the throne, so the risk was deemed acceptable. Whatever any of us on here think about whether or not Wills should be allowed to be shot at, this decision clearly wasn't his - any more than it was Harry's decision to come home early from Afghanistan once his cover had been blown.

On the issue of whether he can hack it, I daresay he would be chopped if he couldn't cope - in the same way the Edward 'resigned' from the Marines. From what I've heard, I doubt he'd want to be a dead weight to those around him - but with luck all this will be pure conjecture and he will do very well.

[choppertop]

...people forget about the huge restrictions on freedom that members of the Royal Family have to live with...

It's their choice. Great Uncle Edward (the 8th) worked that one out.

And I don't think their status has stopped them doing any less travelling, boozing or shagging really...

Do we really need to pity these hugely feather-bedded individuals?

[SASless]

Royal Restraint of Freedom.....oh dear me!

Isn't that sort of like...well...errrr...complaining about the quality of the caviar at a banquet paid for by someone else?

Gimmee a Break here!

As noted....all one has to do is volunteer out of the program and take up a trade of some sort.

You will have to forgive me...but being a mere Yank....with a couple of hundred years of time to forget exactly why we raised our center digit to some of the lad's ancestors....he and his clan will get no concern from me about the trials and tribulations of being a "Royal".

As an individual and helicopter pilot....and thus one of the brothers (and perhaps sisters, Whirls...)...he is welcome to share a pint at the bar. Now in that venue....perhaps I would give him a listen and some sympathy. (cor...almost said empathy:oh:)

We prefer to take a full measure of a man over here....and not look at the pedigree papers alone.

[Oldlae]

It is likely that Wills will be stationed in the South, ease of access to his dad, social occasions etc and Chiv must be top of the list, look out crab, you might become more famous.

[Cyclic Hotline]

I take it he must be a PPRuNer by now? :cool:

Mind you, he might have to fight to get on the computer at work!:eek:

[[email protected]]

Oldlae - at least it might put our long-overdue accommodation rebuild back to the top of someones list:)

[timex]

We prefer to take a full measure of a man over here....and not look at the pedigree papers alone.

SASLESS, we have the Royal Family you have the Kennedy and the Bush "Families", I know which one I'd rather have...:ok::ok:

[windowseatplease]

Top Gun William, prince of the pilots, is quite a spectacle | Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1118285/Top-Gun-William-prince-pilots-quite-spectacle.html)

[oldbeefer]

There are dozens of qualified pilots and students wearing CFS - nothing new or unusual in this at all. Mountain and molehill springs to mind.

[John Eacott]

Despite the obvious safety implications, would anyone else with less than 20-20 vision be allowed to be a pilot? No.

Errr: yes :hmm:

I started in the RN with 6/18 (20/60) eyesight, as a helicopter pilot. Still flying 42 years later, still without a Guide Dog :p

[parabellum]

There again, they could be clear glass treated to react to sunlight, just easier to wear from the start than having to faf around when busy and the sun comes out!:)



Ivor - the red mist rising from your republican politics is starting to show!;)

[SASless]

Timex,

I must withdraw my statement in light of some late developments in New York.

DNA is the trump card it seems!

But then this is the season for change now ain't it!

[lup]

Good for him, I hope he does well and gets the support and enjoyment I have in the last 31 years in our exclusive profession.

Lup:ok:

[krypton_john]

Crab, meet your new co-pilot:

Rescue pilot role for Prince William (http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/europe/4141237/Recscue-pilot-role-for-Prince-William)

Prince William will start work as a search and rescue helicopter pilot for Britain's Royal Air Force after graduating from training on Friday (Saturday, NZT), his office said.
William, second in line to the throne and the eldest son of Prince Charles and his deceased first wife Princess Diana, will co-pilot Sea King helicopters as part of a four-man crew based at RAF Valley in Anglesey on the north west coast of Wales.
"The course has been challenging, but I have enjoyed it immensely," said William, 28, who now has the rank of Flight Lieutenant.
"I absolutely love flying, so it will be an honour to serve operationally with the search and rescue Force, helping to provide such a vital emergency service."
The prince completed 70 hours of flying time augmented by 50 hours in a simulator as part of training to get to grips with the helicopter.
William's younger brother Harry has served on the front line in Afghanistan with the British armed forces.

[Furia]

Hmm I guess I am missing something here.
70 hours real + 50 hours simulator and he is "qualified" to make SAR Ops as copilot???? :eek:

I guess he must have more flight experience but the article make it looks like he can jump into a copilot seat in SAR Ops with such low hours.

[Epiphany]

He has already qualified as an RAF helicopter pilot. The SAR training is additional to that.

It may surprise those non-mil people to know that a pilots course is approximately 200 hours and there are many military pilots flying operationally with only a few hundred hours total time.

[Flyin'ematlast]

For those who've read Chickenhawk (are there any helo pilots who don't?) it's no surprise. If I recall correctly Mason went into combat flying in Vietnam with under 100 hours TOTAL time!

Best of luck to William :ok:. He seems to be shaping up OK and it may give him a useful grounding in real life before he inherits his proper job.

Ian.

[Horror box]

Yes it is "just a couple of hundred hours" but it is definitely not just a couple hundred hours of hours building. Almost all of those hours were with an instructor except for a few solo and mutual solo sorties which were part of the syllabus to consolidate skills learnt, and essentially each trip is pretty much a chop ride, or can lead to one. It is a very intensive and stressful course, and most definitely not an attendance course, and he has done very well to make the grade, as did his younger brother. There is a huge amount learnt in those few hundred hours, and the pilots who come out at the other end, whilst they lack experience, their ability levels are generally very high considering the low number of hours.
I think the general British public has every right to be very proud of the two young royals, whether you are a supporter of the monarchy or not, as they are both making a considerable contribution to the nation and working bloody hard to do it, and setting an extremely good example to the youth of today. They are truly getting where they are by hard work, made only harder by their positions. This is certainly not the case with every Royal Family around the world.

[Epiphany]

Well said HB.

[PPRuNeUser0211]

Well said that man. There's certainly a big difference between 45 hrs gaining one's ppl (dual etc) then hours building for a couple of hundred, than 200 hours of being thrashed senseless by a military QHI!

Also, remember he's not going straight into a captaincy role, but will do a captaincy check in the next couple of years, having gained many more hours operational experience. (

[Heliringer]

HB, said like a true royalist and proud subject!

Me on the other hand would say, Harry with his poor results should never have gained a spot at Sandbags and I don't really think any of the two would ever have been chopped from any course they ATTENDED!.

Just my opinion as a Colonial. Viva the Gothenbergs,sorry Saxon,sorry Windsor, what are they called this century?

[Horror box]

I am not a great Royalist, and I have nothing against them either, nor am I a subject any more, but I know the training system they have been through, and I know they did it and passed on their own merit. By all accounts from some of the instructors who flew with them, they both actually did quite well.

[Heliringer]

The dad crashed a 146 and the crew still defend him!

They can't do anything wrong.They are ROYAL!

[Epiphany]

Heliringer,

Seems we are not the only ones. When was the last time Australians voted for a Republic?

I have been fortunate enough to meet many of the Royals and they are on the whole - considering the fact that they have little choice in how they live their lives - very good people. Which is more than I can say for most politicians and why I am very happy that our Head of State is Her Majesty the Queen and not Gordon Brown - or Julia Gillard.

P.S I didn't realise that you were on board the Royal Flight 146 on Islay that day. Please tell us what happened?

[Tallsar]

HR
Whatever your personal views of monarchy and the individuals who are our Royal family, it is not a bad thing that many of us still remain loyal to our Head of State and Commander in Chief, and her potential successors. Its our system...it works, and has proven better in many ways than the so called democratic process that has replaced it (as far as head of state is concerned anyway) in many countries ..not least that former colony across the Atlantic!

Your comments re Harry's and William's abilities in flying rotary are facile and based more on prejudice than fact. Both are competent enough and rest assured they would not be unleashed if they could not succeed on their own merit. There is too much at stake to do otherwise, not least the risk to the lives they will fly with or support on operations.

Still they are damned both ways...as the demise of their uncle Edward showed some years ago when he had the courage to withdraw from Royal Marines training when he was clearly not going to succeed and was obviously motivated by other career possibilities. The UK press hounded him mercilessly for it despite it being the right thing to do. Both H and W are capable men who carry their parents' better characteristics...not least in knowing that if they felt they couldn't hack it they would soon move on.....

Welcome on board Flt lt Wales.......flying a SAR Sea King in the UK SRR is one of the best and most demanding jobs in aviation......I wish you well

[PAPI-74]

Where is the difference between a mil guy being paid to train and fly and a civi, who has to re-mortgage his family house, leave his wife and kids and focus on the flying ahead?
Whether the training role is for Bristow's out to oil rigs, low level fisheries patrols, or 737, you cannot tell me that the mil is any harder - it is just different and concentrated. I have met mil chaps that don't know what a hold is and shiver when it is time to do a NDB approach when the ILS aids are u/s - civi bread and butter.
And my hour building took me into 5 different countries. More than a SAR pilot would see or an RAF boy during training.
How long would it take to get 3000hrs experience - probably a whole career?

Get over yourselves.

[Epiphany]

Whether the training role is for Bristow's out to oil rigs, low level fisheries patrols, or 737, you cannot tell me that the mil is any harder - it is just different and concentrated. I have met mil chaps that don't know what a hold is and shiver when it is time to do a NDB approach when the ILS aids are u/s - civi bread and butter.

Just as you would probably crap yourself if asked to fly an insertion into a hot LZ at night on goggles.

No idea what your point is as the thread is about Prince William qualifying as a UK SAR pilot.

[Neptunus Rex]

Well said Epiphany.

A glance at PAPI's public profile shows that he/she cannot be taken seriously. Perhaps he/she would benefit from a journey along the Road to Damascus?

[skadi]

Hmm I guess I am missing something here.
70 hours real + 50 hours simulator and he is "qualified" to make SAR Ops as copilot???? http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/eek.gif

I guess he must have more flight experience but the article make it looks like he can jump into a copilot seat in SAR Ops with such low hours.

I did almost identical hours for the military typerating on the Seaking and was then qualified as copilot for SAR Ops, so whats the problem?

skadi

[PAPI-74]

My comments were in response to the hints that civi flying is just a jolly about and unstructured. It maybe at PPL level but this isn’t a professional qualification. 200 hrs is a lot of flying (the basic level for CPL training) and many skills can be learnt in this time. Even NOE using NVG’s with a full crew on boad.
And I can tell you that the huge bang of lightning strike, with women and babies behind you is pretty focusing too.
I am very proud of both the Royals, and my time in the services, but my comments were generated from other parts of the thread.

[Droopystop]

PAPI,

who has to re-mortgage his family house, leave his wife and kids and focus on the flying ahead?

That says to me someone has their priorities all wrong.

And my hour building took me into 5 different countries. More than a SAR pilot would see or an RAF boy during training.

Flying in 5 different countries is harder than hovering over a moving deck at night on fuel minima....how?

How long would it take to get 3000hrs experience - probably a whole career?

So what? 3000 hours sat behind an autopilot vs 300 hours SAR - who would you want to save your wife and kids (if you still have them of course).

The helicopter world is full of all sorts of people with all sorts of background with all sorts of experience. It doesn't necessarily make one a better pilot than another. But there is one common trait that all the good pilots I have met have: Respect.

[Horror box]

PAPI,
no inference intended from my posts. I learnt my trade in the military and have continued it into the civilian world. I have respect for both sides, and have met equally professional and proficient pilots in both worlds, and I will always respect those sorts of people. The sort of person who takes his job seriously and understands his weaknesses as well as strengths and realises he doesn't know it all. I don't and probably never will have much time for those who continually harp on about why one is inherently better than the other. I am sick of both military pilots who claim to be better than civi, and civi pilots with a chip on their shoulder about being rejected form the military or regretting not having joined up when they had the chance, and then claiming that their training system is the same as a military one because they paid for it (Of these I genuinely have not met many). It is not - get over it. The good pilot realises this and makes up for it over time through gaining experience, and by the time he has been in the industry for a few years and has 5000hrs the differences is just personality, and then the civi pilot begins to be a more versatile creature in my experience.
I have flown with 300hr military pilots and civi pilots and I am sorry to offend, but there really is no comparison at that stage, and that is purely due to the intensity of the training. After the PPL is complete, he very often works as an "instructor" to gain hours to get to CPL, and whilst that is valuable experience, it is not the same as the highly instructed USL, NVG Low-level formation (50'), night confined areas, map reading skills, general handling, IFR (IMC), winching, deck landings etc etc that Flt Wales had been doing before getting up to 300 hrs. On top of that he had a check ride every few weeks where he could have been binned completely, and if he had not been up to the grade he would have been.
After a few thousand hours though the civi guy has also become very competent and extremely good at his job and in his environment, and generally becomes far more of a specialist, especially when it comes to procedural flying. The point is it is two different worlds, two different requirements, but both equally competent in their own sphere, and I take absolutely nothing away form the guy who has worked his nuts off to become an IFR captain flying a multi-crew machine offshore or someone who has flown several thousand hours utility single pilot - they have just done it a different way. So lets just say "well done to the two Princes" and welcome to the fold.

[PAPI-74]

Eloquently put.:ok:

[HeliAviator]

As an ex mil rotary QHI of some 2000+ instuctional time, I was at SARTU when "Wills" underwent his basic SAR training. He was and is a very capable pilot, easily passing SARTU's exacting standards and whilst I can not comment on his SeaKIng SAR training, from what I have witnessed he will make an excellent SAR pilot. He also makes a good cup of tea! :ok:

[Horror box]

He also makes a good cup of tea!
Very good to hear, and I think this also says an awful lot about the lad and future king.

[cyclic]

I think we have the two most credible Royals in a long time. From what I have seen and heard the boys have done an excellent job. For any family, they have come from very difficult circumstances and despite their privilege have acquitted themselves with considerable dignity and honour. Good luck to Flt Lt Windsor on his SAR tour.

[klaus_a_e]

As this turns out to be more like a “royalty” discussion, where I as an Austrian can’t really comment I would like to get back to the apparently usual low time military training.
I have a high regard for the training military pilots get and there is surely no comparison to a civil low time trying to stack up flight time, but I’m not sure if we compare the right things. In civil flying there is no 200h SAR pilot! In no company in Europe or America pilots for EMS / SAR are having below 1500 - 2000h. Flying 2000 hours in civil aviation will put you in a lot of situations military training won’t get you in!
No matter how intense the training was, I think as a SAR pilot one should have more experience (they could get it through flying “normally” in the troops or where ever within the Army).
Anyhow it is a great chance for those two guys and I wish them all the best!

[chcoffshore]

In no company in Europe or America pilots for EMS / SAR are having below 1500 - 2000h


Really, well i think you should look at the minimum requirements for a SAR CHC CG co-pilot :hmm:

[Thomas coupling]

Klaus - a - e: read the thread heading: "Prince William: crab's new co-pilot. It's NOT about low time SAR pilots :ugh:

Secondly - 40 years of experience and training shows that the RAF just about have it right (the way they do it) don't you think.
ALL co-pilots are low hours and operate under the close scrutiny of a very experienced Captain until it's time for them to take any responsibility for the flight. Don't think for one moment, these low time SAR pilots have any say in strategy whilst airborne - just like civvy street. They do as they are told until they get their Captaincy and then they are let loose.
They're certainly not a liability - especially as helicopters don't really need a second pilot, do they? [It's a regulatory issue].

[Epiphany]

Prince William has qualified as a SAR co-pilot - not a SAR Captain. He will be sitting next to an experienced SAR Captain and will learn on the job as there is no better place.

I had 2000 military flying behind me when I started SAR training and apart from airmanship and general handling skills it did not really help. Crew co-ordination, use of automation, radar approaches to a small ship and hovering next to a small, pitching deck on a dark, stormy night were all very new to me.

I was very happy to be a co-pilot and learn from someone who knew what he was doing. Those of you commenting on SAR flying who have no experience of SAR really have no idea of what is involved.

[JimL]

No aircraft requires two pilots to be flown (it is a contradiction in terms); it is the safety of operations that dictates the crew numbers. Regulations are a side effect of the safety case (they reflect the regulator's assessment rather than the operator's).

Jim

[Fly_For_Fun]

Flying 2000 hours in civil aviation will put you in a lot of situations military training won’t get you in!
Unless you have flown in the military not sure how you could make this statement.

In any case to pass the British military pilots course is indeed a great achievement for both of the young royals, and to go on to SAR is fantastic, as is being selected to go onto the WAH64D. Well done both of you.

[skadi]

No aircraft requires two pilots to be flown

Then try to handle a single "COMP FREEZE" on the Seaking as lonesome pilot....
And a double failure would be even worse!

skadi

[Epiphany]

No one claimed they did.

[Epiphany]

That's because when it started most were UK pilots and I would guess that most still are. The thread is about UK military SAR so it is not surprising that is what is being discussed.

This is still the most civilised, informative helicopter forum that I know of for some reason too.

Why are you Colonials so sensitive about Old World superiority anyway? ;)

[Hummingfrog]

Skadi

In my time on the Seaking we used to practise double comp freeze with the engines in manual as a single pilot - testing but no real drama if you followed the SOPs. I believe the Fisheads used to fly the MK4 Commando single pilot - so if they could do it it can't be that difficult:E

Well done to Flt Lt Wales - Valley is one of the more demanding flights to be on - second only to Lossie of course!!

HF

[skadi]

I believe the Fisheads used to fly the MK4 Commando single pilot - so if they could do it it can't be that difficulthttp://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/evil.gif

I heard that too, but they fly with crewchiefs in the left seat for just that case?

In my time on the Seaking we used to practise double comp freeze with the engines in manual as a single pilot


Interesting, how did you do that manually without more than two hands??? Just playing with NR?
In our Navy minimum crew were 2 pilots.

skadi

[Hilife]

Britons didn't invent helicopter SAR, y'know.

That would have been our cousins on the other side of the Pond, both hoisting in an R-5 (In Long Island Sound, Connecticut, 1945) and landing (CSAR, Burma, 1944) in a YR-4. The latter was to rescue the pilot and 3 wounded British soldiers, so at least some involvement for us Brit’s in the early days ;).

[Treg]

Interesting take on CRM????

Don't think for one moment, these low time SAR pilots have any say in strategy whilst airborne - just like civvy street. They do as they are told until they get their Captaincy and then they are let loose.

[CYHeli]

I like the bent on it all from the Daily Star,
But high-flying Harry claims his skills as an Apache pilot – the most difficult chopper in the world to fly – will easily outstrip William’s.

The pal added: “He may be second but his training is tougher and his skills are greater. He is in the helicopter equivalent of an F1 racing car while William is running a Transit van.”


And it will all put a dent on his social life... But his qualification is a blow for girlfriend Kate Middleton, 28, who did not join him at Friday’s passing-out ceremony.

William will have to quit the cottage they have been sharing in Wales and live on the base so he can respond to emergency calls.

Full article here -
Link here (http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/view/154451/Prince-William-taunts-Prince-Harry/)

[HeliAviator]

The Daily Star, a quality newspaper, both informative and knowledgable. NOT! :yuk:

[klaus_a_e]

:rolleyes:I appologise guys – you got that wrong: I never said that the RAF isn’t doing it right! Those guys are having a whole lot experience the pilots in the civil word will never get. AND I admire them for their training!
BUT I do have my experience and we also have military guys flying in our civil fleet now so I do think I can make my statement. My point is if you put two pilots in a certain mission in a cockpit (an yes I know you can fly this aircrafts with one pilot – heck you can fly a 747 with one pilot but there is a reason why regs require two guys up front) I would expect those pilots to have certain requirements where for my understanding SAR is on which would require more experience compared to some other missions where they could get some confidence before they jump into a SAR mission.
Thomas coupling I got your point and I agree that it is a great chance to learn but I also agree with Treg: I makes me thing about CRM.


Really, well i think you should look at the minimum requirements for a SAR CHC CG co-pilot http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/yeees.gif

What are the CHC SAR Co requirements?

Take it easy

[Freewheel]

(posted in full recognition of the unlikelihood of it being read by one of those mentioned herein)

Congratulations Wills (and the others on your course) on completing your course.

Commiserations on winding up with crab:E:E:E:E:E:E :p

[Thomas coupling]

Treg: you've got me on that..bang to rights. I apologise. My inference was that there is of course - dialogue and 'team effort' but the buck stops with the Captain, not the cojo.

Skadi: Like Hummingfrog - many years ago when I flew the Queen of the skies, we did practice flying double manual with one pilot!
We set both throttles to a gentle descent setting on mega long finals and flew it onto the runway.
It's not the end of the world. Single comp failure was a walk in the park by comparison.

[Fly_For_Fun]

Freewheel, only one ended up with the girlie's outfit, the other is in the army.http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/thumbs.gif

[skadi]

Skadi: Like Hummingfrog - many years ago when I flew the Queen of the skies, we did practice flying double manual with one pilot!
We set both throttles to a gentle descent setting on mega long finals and flew it onto the runway.
It's not the end of the world. Single comp failure was a walk in the park by comparison.

Thanks, thats what I thought.
But we didnt practice that as single pilot ( even not in the simulator ), but many times with two.

skadi

[Treg]

No problem TC

[Corax]

You were referring to the US of A right? Pls do not lump Canadians in with "them". :=

1812-2012 - 200th Anniversary of the British & Canadian defeat of the American agressors. :}

[Pink Panther]

Prince William takes part in first flight as search and rescue flight | Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1317875/Prince-William-takes-flight-search-rescue-flight.html):ok:

[Wiretensioner]

oh great. And who were the rest of the crew? No doubt we will have to get 'first night call out', first job in Snowdonia, etc. Give the guy a break.

Wiretensioner

[leopold bloom]

Working class people with regional accents I expect? "Give him a break"! Since when did you start being nice to pilots, have you bumped your head?

[zorab64]

Daily Mail in typical form, I see - this was neither a Search or a Rescue, it was a Medevac, most appropriately carried out by Rescue 122 as the safest, best trained and probably most cost effective manner of ensuring a workers' medical condition was treated quickly.

Yes, of course there'll be "first" this & "first" that but, with any luck, the press will get bored eventually, just as they did with Prince Andrew 30+ years ago (when all we heard about was what the "second-in-line to the throne" was getting up to), and let Flt Lt Wales get on with his job. When William was born, many spliced the mainbrace in celebration of a new heir - many others celebrated that the 2nd-in-line had now become 3rd, so the press could go off & terrorise his brother, sister in law and usurper instead; and let the new 3rd-in-line get on with his job.

In the meanwhile, take the press coverage with a large pinch of salt and live with it as positive advertising for the SAR fleet, RAF and Military in general - as it's nothing new. The average member of the public has no idea of what the different arms of the services are about unless they hear snippets of this sort - and I'd promote that they need all the support the public can provide, since it takes such a large slice of our, ever diminishing, public money!

On a separate note, TCs comment brings back memories of a shared SPLOT who made a double manual, very slow "carrier deck" landing (onto a runway) the culmination of a first Captaincy check ride. All members of the crew had "died", & the now single pilot learnt the real meaning of "one-armed-paper-hangar"!:eek: It might not be practiced in the Sim, or generally with a single pilot, but knowing it wasn't impossible certainly did wonders for a young aviator's confidence in both himself and the venerable Queen of the Skies. :ok:

[TorqueOfTheDevil]

it was a Medevac


Strictly speaking it was a Medrescue - Medevac is a transfer between two medical establishments:8

[zorab64]

One can be pedantic or argue that it was a Medical Evacuation sincemedevac refers to the moving of a patient either from the point of injury, or a casualty collection point, to a medical facility

Not sure when the familar term "Medevac" has been defined to the detail you mention, Torque, but probably the same person who invented the term "Medrescue" - sounds like a wishy-washy one to me! :8

[421dog]

Oh cut the poor guy a break!

He flew out into the wilds of the North Atlantic in a machine with a glide ratio akin to a brick, picked up some poor guy off of a little bitty oil rig and delivered him safely to hospital.

As one who's most terrifying aviation experiences involved hovering Bell 47's,
I salute him!



(via my Iphone while waiting for clearance on a pleasant evening with two turbines and fixed wings)

[TorqueOfTheDevil]

Zorab,

As it happens the ARCC have indeed defined it the way I stated. I fully accept that medevac is the usual term for this kind of job, but in the rarified world of UK SAR, technically it's a Medrescue:8:8.

TOTD

[zorab64]

Thanks TOTD - but the cynical might argue that it's just a new definition to justify the "rescue" statistics of the "rarified world of UK SAR"

Detailed definitions notwithstanding, my earlier point re press & royalty interest still stand, whatever the actual task. :hmm:
Z

[Agaricus bisporus]

Dog, Morecambe Bay is hardly the "wilds of the N Atlantic", and the glide ratio of his machine is relevant, well, precisely how?

Seems to me that even gash civvies manage just fine landing on those scary dangerous platforms in "moderately gusty" conditions hundreds of times a day, seven days a week.

How the daily hate manages to create "news" where none exists!

Having said that, BZ to both the princes on achieving their current positions. Shame neither joined the Navy though.

[Vie sans frontieres]

Shame neither joined the Navy though.

Don't you think the palace have had enough scandals to deal with over the years?:ooh:

[Wiretensioner]

Leopold


It's either old age or the chemo tablets

Wiretensioner

[sunnywa]

From a republican Aussie, well done William Wales for graduating a demanding course and I hope you get to spend a few years doing the job for real without the hassle of royal duties.

Good luck, have fun and I hope your Sea Queen keeps on turning. :ok:

[Savoia]

Duke of Cambridge to be deployed in Falkland Islands next spring

http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/02052/PW_2052323c.jpg

The Duke, a Flight Lieutenant with the RAF, will be posted to the remote outcrop in the South Atlantic from February to March where he will fly search and rescue helicopter missions. His deployment was announced in the summer but it has taken until now to work out when he could serve on the British overseas territory.

The 30th anniversary of the Falklands War will be commemorated next year and the Duke's arrival may inflame relations between the British and Argentine Governments. His duties will be to respond, as the co-pilot of two Sea King helicopters, to any crises – such as rescues – or natural disasters.

Flight Lieutenant Wales, as he is known, will be based at RAF Mount Pleasant, home to 2,000 servicemen and opened by his uncle the Duke of York, who served as a helicopter pilot in the 1982 war to regain the islands.

Conditions on the base have been described as "bleak" although the base has a range of sporting facilities including gym, swimming pool, a golf course and karting track.

Based at RAF Valley in Anglesey, north Wales, the Duke of Cambridge qualified as an RAF Search and Rescue Force (Sarf) helicopter co-pilot last September. In recent months he has been intensifying his work with the aim of qualifying for a captaincy.

The experience he will gain in the South Atlantic and the flying hours he will notch up answering emergency call-outs will help him achieve his goal. The Duke's dates have also been chosen to avoid clashing with the Queen's 2012 Diamond Jubilee celebrations.

The Duke will be available to take part in national events staged over an extended four-day bank holiday weekend in June when it is expected he will join the Queen and other senior royals for the Thames Diamond Jubilee Pageant.

The dates also mean that he and the Duchess will be able to join the Queen for the royal family's traditional gathering at Sandringham. The Duke should miss the worst of the Falklands weather but if he does venture out the MoD has a long list of items servicemen and women should bring with them.

On its website, suggested clothing includes walking socks, fleeces and thermal underwear while officers have to bring a shirt and tie. Under luxury items, the Duke is advised to take with him lavatory rolls, tissues, washing powder, toothpaste and his favourite shampoo. As there are no cash machines on the islands, the royal will have to cash cheques with the public cashier.

The MoD said in a statement that William would "complete a routine deployment to the Falkland Islands as part of a crew of four RAF personnel during the period February to March 2012.

"This deployment forms part of a normal squadron crew rotation and will form part of Flt Lt Wales' training and career progression as a Search and Rescue pilot within the RAF." The Duke will be posted alone, with the Duchess remaining behind at their home at Kensington Palace.

Last night The Duke, accompanied by the Duchess, attended a black-tie reception in aid of the National Memorial Arboretum Appeal at St James's Palace.

The Duke launched the appeal - which aims to raise £12 million to develop the Arboretum in Alrewas, Staffordshire, into a world-renowned centre for remembrance - and became its patron. In a speech he said: "For Britons today, and for generations of Britons to come, the example of dedicating one’s life to helping and protecting others and to the service of our country remains core to our values as a Nation. Nowhere is this lesson better taught than through contemplation of the names inscribed on the memorials in Staffordshire.‬‪‬‪"

So far half the sum needed has been donated or pledged, the Duke said.

The Duke of Cambridge to be deployed on Falklands without Kate - Telegraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/theroyalfamily/8882254/The-Duke-of-Cambridge-to-be-deployed-on-Falklands-without-Kate.html)

[malabo]

Good on him for leaving the feathered nest. FI isn't all that bad, it is a lot closer to the equator than Aberdeen. And he will be there in summer.

He seems hopeful to build hours, not easy to do there with the infrequent calls and the sub-50% dispatch reliability of the old Sea Kings. I hear CHC is covering SAR there with the L2 until something more reliable is provided by the UK.

[212man]

it is a lot closer to the equator than Aberdeen.

It's about the same lattitude South as London is North, so I'm not sure I'd categorise that as "a lot closer" :p

[Savoia]

.. sub-50% dispatch reliability of the old Sea Kings.

I suppose one shouldn't be surprised given their length of service. Presumably the 'T' models being offered by Sikorsky offer a better dispatch rate!

[inputshaft]

Oh gee, here we go again.

Malabo, you're completely wrong both in your stats and assumption about CHC. Crab is closer, though, as usual, an implication creeps in that doesn't need to be there. The oil rig crew change-over in the Falklands is based on a once every 2 weeks charter flight. Hence, as many ducks as possible need to be in a row in that period. The oil company were not willing to accept even the small chance that no RAF SAR would ground the crew change flights, so they paid for a very limited SAR service to support the passenger Super Puma. It's day VMC, open water only because that's all that's needed and has been paid for. VMC works 95% of the time because of the limited approach facilities in the Falklands that limit IFR passenger flights, day and overwater are obvious.

The CHC limited offshore oil SAR service has absolutely nothing to do with the overall SAR cover for the Islands. That is provided by the RAF and the RAF only. Night medevacs or training trips to the rig are only launched if RAF cover is available - which it usually is.

Oh, "only one pilot who has actually done SAR" is, of course, Crab's code for "only one ex-RAF Sea King pilot". The rest don't count, I suppose ;)

[inputshaft]

Thanks Jon,

And, in an effort to get this thread back on topic, I will certainly promise to dig into my wallet and buy HRH a coffee and a slice of bakewell tart in the West Store, if he ever makes it into Stanley.

[Dop]

BBC News (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-latin-america-15703340): The Duke of Cambridge's posting to the Falkland Islands has been condemned by Argentina as a "provocative act".

Oh dear. How sad. Never mind.

[XV490]

Six weeks? A penguin-spotting holiday! I've been to the the treeless, windy void - and, as I recall, the only Guinness was at Stanley's Upland Goose hotel. Is it still all nasty, innocuous and fair-haired tinned beer at MPA?

[louisnewmark]

Some good stuff coming out here (esp Inputshaft's healthy dose of straightforward reality!), but how on earth did 'Prince William to Become a SAR Driver' degenerate into an argument about a single niche-contract L2?

:confused:

Louis

Not any more: see Falklands Oil (http://www.pprune.org/rotorheads/406349-falklands-oil-5.html) :ok:

Splot

[rotornut]

World News: Prince William joins rescue mission after cargo ship sinks amid strong winds - thestar.com (http://www.thestar.com/news/world/article/1093215--prince-william-joins-rescue-mission-after-cargo-ship-sinks-amid-strong-winds?bn=1)

[pr00ne]

So, with the SARH news, 2013 Prince William out of a job.

[TorqueOfTheDevil]

2013 Prince William out of a job


How do you figure that out? The mil SAR units aren't due to start transitioning until 2015:confused:

[Gordy]

The second in line to the British throne, who is a Royal Air Force helicopter and known professionally as Flight Lt. William Wales

Wish I was a "helicopter"... :confused: :eek:

[Fareastdriver]

He could finish his LHS training at Valley. Strong rumours in Scotland that he will get his command at Lossie. After a couple of years Auntie Betty, God Bless Her, will be getting on a bit, so public duties will become larger on the horizon.

[OafOrfUxAche]

Strong rumours in Scotland that he will get his command at Lossie.

.
WTF??:*

[frogy]

Hi everyone, have just read that prince william has now passed his Operational Captaincy for flying in the RAF, as I understand it he has 2yrs of experience, is this the normal amount of time it would take for a pilot in the military to qualify for Operational Captaincy?
Thank you.

[g-mady]

ouch! := Im sure Kate doesn't care!

[OvertHawk]

Frogy.

With respect - If you need to ask then you don't need to know!

If that was an innocent question then i apologise for slamming the door on you, but you must consider that it is also exactly the kind of question that a slack-arsed journo' who can't be bothered to get of his ass to do any research for a decent story would ask.

The RAF has comprehensive training and evaluation systems to ensure that those who hold SAR Commands (and any flying or ground post for that matter) are capable and suitably trained. I have no doubt that he would not be where he is if he had not thoroughly satisfied those requirements. His position and the attention he attracts will make it tougher for him to advance in these jobs, not easier!

Good luck to him! :ok: He's doing a tough job, full-time with a heck of a lot of other things on his plate too! :D

OH

[IMO]

Yes but he needs to shave his hair to the wood. I was posted at valley and my fringe ended up in Galway. Strap a pair on baldy and lop it off, kate will love it! That reminds me to put shredded wheat on the shopping list this week

[grumpytroll]

I graduated flight school in March of 87. Then went to UH-60 transition for two months. Then went to 101st Airborne Division. Late January of 88 I was checked out as PIC. Thats NVG, Instrument, Tactical etc. 7-8 months was not unheard of. Believe me, I am no Chuck Yeagar. We once did a 5 ship mission with a WO1 in every seat in the spring of 88. Exciting days! Two years of training would definitely have weeded out the weeds and certainly provided exceptional training for command of an aircraft. Just imagine an A-10 pilot is the aircraft commander on his/her checkride! An F-16 pilot is aircraft commander immediately after his/her checkride. Same for many, many military aircraft. None of this training lasts two years for goodness sakes. Sheesh.

Cheers, Doug

P.S. I sold the brewpub. Had a great run. We won alot of awards including Gold, Silver and Bronze at the World Beer Cup.

[OafOrfUxAche]

Believe me, I am no Chuck Yeagar [sic]


No sh1t Sherlock!

[Al-bert]

I've also had the misfortune to operate alongside 'no Chuck Yeagar's'.
Their comprehensive training was very noticeable :rolleyes:

[[email protected]]

After completion of the Sea King OCU, the normal expectation for an ab initio to achieve Op Captaincy is between 18 months and 2 years but can be longer.

Grumpy troll, PIC is not the same as Operational Captaincy - all SAR pilots leave the OCU as PIC having done a procedural instrument rating, NVG and mountain and maritime SAR.

[SASless]

The RAF has comprehensive training and evaluation systems to ensure that those who hold SAR Commands (and any flying or ground post for that matter) are capable and suitably trained.

Up and until they get to AVM, AM rank perhaps.

[[email protected]]

Up and until they get to AVM, AM rank perhaps.fortunately they don't get to go in a cockpit very often at that exalted level:)

[OvertHawk]

SAS - that's fair comment! :}

[Al-bert]

had to let a certain AVM 'have a go' a long time ago in a Leu Wessex. His take off scattered the starter crew and just missed the houchin with the tail wheel before I could arrest the unbriefed spot turn! Didn't let him have another go - like a Bear with a sore head he was! ;)

[topendtorque]

Back when I was stripling of a lad at boarding school in Brisbane I had a mate who was the son of the Padre at Amberley. I think it was the year of the Mirage intro 1963 or so, and there was an Aussie tour of a B47. I think it was to try to gen up a lease / loan deal in the interim between the Canberra and F111. That deal culminated in the F4.

Everyone turned out to watch it depart.

Turns out up in the front seats was a most very senior pin from each of USAAF and RAAF who both forgot to turn the rocket assist on until it was almost too late. Legend has it that a servo which was located on a low rise a couple of miles off the end of the active runway on the major Southern highway, had every glass pane blown out.