Falklands Airbridge

[davaar lad]

Anyone know who will be operating the flights to ASI/MPA from October?
understand the contract is up for renewal.

SMK

[C130 Techie]

No announcement as yet. Believe that the MOD are pushing for return to a 747. Last year the new contract wasn't announced until towards the end of August.

[minigundiplomat]

Anyone know who will be operating the flights to ASI/MPA from October?

Cheapest bidder ?

[JackRyan]

I think the next Omni Air panini is going to kill me

[High_Expect]

I've never slept on a Herc :ugh:

[blue monday]

I've never slept on a Herc :ugh:

I managed it once - was very tired though and it was very empty - loadies hammock did the trick

[The Helpful Stacker]

The roof of a soft-top Land Rover was the most comfortable place I've ever found to sleep on a herc.

[formertonkaplum]

So who is doing the route at the moment? With What ?

Are they using a frame big enough to do the trip in one?

If it's a civvi lease aircraft, I do hope it has In Flight Entertainment ?

FTP

[BEagle]

Now, now that's quite enough of that kind of talk!

Your caring MoD is doubtless scouring 't Interweb for the cheapest and nastiest deal it can find. In-flight entertainment will be limited to cockroach racing and competitions to guess what the fluid dribbling out of the engine cowlings might be.

In-flight catering? The good old S1 box....with extra Robirch pork pie if you're particularly unlucky!

Or they could always send you via Madrid to Santiago and thence to Base Aerea Gringo by LAN Chile......

[Green Flash]

Nah, you'll be going on the next BAS airframe swap!:eek:

[Double Zero]

If the world around it goes monochrome, and the trolley-dollies DESPITE wearing scanty kit are dancing on the wings, just start casually whistling, walk past & keep going. Same applies if the ( aircraft ) name begins with 'Spruce'...

[Mobile Muppet]

Omni currently run the SA air bridge and word on the street is the Falkland Island government and the Det are not to happy with it. It seems more priority 1 bubble wrap can be sent down on a 747 than a DC10. And this is influencing who gets the next contract.

MM

[C130 Techie]

It seems more priority 1 bubble wrap can be sent down on a 747 than a DC10.

Also more fresh fruit and veg, mail and less important things like spares including the odd aircraft engine that the DC10 can't carry.

[The Helpful Stacker]

And if a part located in the Falklands is U/S and needs repairing as a matter of urgency as it is a high demand/short supply item then the bubble wrap to pack it for shipping back to the UK can go Priority 1.

You don't make the call, someone who gets paid a bit more money than you does.

Of course if you joined the correct side of TG18 you'd know this.:ok:

[Mobile Muppet]

Two bites...nice :)

TBH it was actually ment tongue in cheek. having done 3 tours down south i know quite well how the system works.

MM

[The Helpful Stacker]

Actually you seem to have been caught out twice, nice attempt to play it as fishing though.

Oh and 'down south' makes it sound so wary considering its a good way of getting out of a proper operational tour.

[Mobile Muppet]

Ahh Mr Stacker,

Chill out, didnt realise the bubble wrap comment would upset you so much lol

MM

[Ayla]

Perhaps the RAF Tristars weren't that bad after all, even if their choice of entry into the Widewake loop didn't please all!

[Hairbus]

I believe Air Atlanta did a reasonable job at one time. Nice young ladies as well so I hear.:ok:

[frodo_monkey]

Nice young ladies as well so I hear

You hear wrong - on all three counts... :yuk:

[C130 Techie]

I believe Air Atlanta did a reasonable job at one time. Nice young ladies as well so I hear.

Absolutely right, particularly regarding the nice young ladies.:E Unfortunately their aircraft were old 747s that had been retired from the charter world and although still pretty reliable were struggling.

Oh and 'down south' makes it sound so wary considering its a good way of getting out of a proper operational tour.

Careful THS there are still a good many people around who get to do both. You can, quite rightly, no longer volunteer for the Falklands in the hope of getting out of a desert tour but it is still an OOA of either 4 or 6 months and whilst no one is shooting at you it still puts stresses and strains on peoples lives.

[Double Zero]

One would have thought anyone 'fishing' would at least learn to spell ; also if involved in a " plummet " (C: Daily Mail ) I might even be distracted from the nice young ladies, though of course that's a factor involving time & motion.

[Pontious]

How frequent is the service? How many rotations per week?

Cheers

Ponsh.

[Walrus75]

Unfortunately their aircraft were old 747s that had been retired from the charter world and although still pretty reliable were struggling.

... which wasn't helped by the Movers modifying engine cowlings by driving tractors into 'em ;)
Luvverly big leather seats tho... if you were lucky enough to get one, almost worth going all that way down there! :)

[The Right Stuff]

My one trip to the Falklands was with Air Atlanta; I was lucky enough to get the "luvverly big leather seats" up front on the way there and also on the way back, and both trips also involved the "nice young ladies".

Here's the 747 I flew on landing at MPA, taken from my temporary 'office' for my work at MPA:

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z146/neatsolution/DSCF1829.jpg

[adminblunty]

Who cares who gets it, it can't be worse than travelling by VC10, Tristar or a C130.

[Slavedriver]

Don't happen to know when that photo was taken do you? Just that there is a reasonable chance it's me sitting up there in the upper deck pointy bit trying to make sure the two "aviators" perched in front aren't trying to kill me. :E

[The Right Stuff]

Yes, I took the above photo 16th June 2006.

I'm trying to remember the name of the captain, I think he was Canadian. I asked for a look at the flight deck on the flight out, but not surprisingly was refused. However, he came down for a chat, and I had a look upstairs after we'd landed at MPA. The panel looked fairly basic with all steam driven instruments. The captain likened flying a 747 into Ascension and MPA to farm strip flying, and I think the divert for MPA was Rio.

[BEagle]

I'm sure a few pennies could be saved by turning off the heating in the DeathStar as well....and the hot water.

A very stupid and naive post, brandnew. Robbing Peter to pay Paul is never a good course of action.

If Brown and Browner insist on continuing their desert adventurism to please GeeDubya, then they must pay the price.

[Pontious]

I think it'll be better than the previous contractors.
:ok::ok:

[C130 Techie]

Brandnew

Your post is extremely naive and spiteful. As I stated previously there are many people doing Falklands tours in addition to Sandpit tours. One particular example of this is the RIC (Resident Infantry Company) who use their time in the Islands as a ramp up to going into Afghanistan. The Falklands is an additional burden for many individuals and for sections supporting this theatre as well as the 2 'operational' theatres.

I don't recall anyone here suggesting that this should be a luxury charter. The choice of airframe has a major bearing on the availability of aircraft spares etc and with the loss of the 747 service this means that larger items have to be delivered by an RAF Tristar or C17 which diverts already stretched resources away from the 2 theatres of war.

[BEagle]

C130 Techie, our little pongo helicopter hero may well send you a spiteful Private Message fuel of invective and personal abuse as he did to me after I made a similar observation concerning the tone and content of his post...

[C130 Techie]

Thanks for the warning BEags.

[Seldomfitforpurpose]

With TG18 in close attendance whoever gets the contract had better make sure their collision damage insurance is up to date.................:E

[CONSTELLATION1]

Rumour control says Flyglobespan have the contract. Presumably using their B-767.

[unclenelli]

Flyglobespan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Globespan)

[BEagle]

Good grief....:eek:!!

See FlyGlobespan Reviews and FlyGlobespan Passenger Opinions about FlyGlobespan product and FlyGlobespan service standards (http://www.airlinequality.com/Forum/flygspan.htm) .

[Wycombe]

....which will presumably mean less available freight uplift than all the recent providers.

Last time I think a 76' was on the route was during GW1, when Britannia operated IIRC.

[Pontious]

How much freight capacity is normally needed for BZZ-ASI-MPA & back?

[Mobile Muppet]

Lets just say they want as much air frt as they can. But by the time the fresh rats, AOGs and mail get chucked on there is not much space left for anything else. Usualy 4 ACP are sent.
I seem to remeber someone telling me the ship that goes down south (twice a month) often turned up half full (or half empty).

MM

[C130 Techie]

The larger freight capacity is to cater for larger items like Tornado engines which the 747 could accommodate. It also means a better supply of fresh rations.

The re-supply ship is about every 6 to 8 weeks if it is not delayed. It then of course takes time to unload and distribute the cargo.

[Pontious]

Palletised Tornado engines wouldn't be too much trouble for a 767. What was a typical passenger load?

[C130 Techie]

Pontius

Average Pax load last year was around 150 and I don't suppose that it has changed much. I believe the max is 200 limited due to facilities at ASI. The DC10 certainly couldn't accommodate the Tornado Engine.

[Pontious]

Cheers 'Techie.

What are the approximate dimensions & weight of a crated & palletised RB199? Was the problem with the DC-10 the size of the cargo bay door?

With a 200 pax. requirement, the B763 can still lift 20 tonnes of freight & 56 tonnes of fuel.

Why isn't the Airbridge run more frequently, assuming it's still 1 rotation per week?

Cheers

Ponsh.
:ok:

[BEagle]

You see what I mean, C130 Techie?

Allegedly an officer. Clearly not a gentleman, given the degree of personal abuse to which he evidently feels obliged to stoop.

[C130 Techie]

Pontious

RB199 weighs about 2,200 Lbs not sure what the palletisation will add. Problem as you suggest was size of Cargo door on the DC10.

Schedule is 3 flights every 2 weeks.

Beagle

Yes. Reasoned argument without resorting to abuse seems to be too difficult for some.

It does hack me off when people claim that those not constantly in the sandpit are malingerers or war dodgers. We all have a job to do and the 1200 - 1400 guys and girls in the South Atlantic are just as important even if they are on a 'safer' tour. Everyone is entitled to a safe and reliable flight to get them in and out of any theatre.

[PPRuNe Pop]

This thread gentlemen, is taking a dive. It is in danger of getting out of hand. The invective must cease before it becomes necessary for a red card to be shown and someone sent for an early bath.

Please stick to the topic with no abuse.

[Seldomfitforpurpose]

BN,

Did you not spot PoP's CLUE :rolleyes:

[Dinger154]

I just heard that Trojan Air of Argentina have got the contract.

[farsouth]

According to Falkand Islands News Network -

"The new South Atlantic Airbridge contract has been awarded to Chapman Freeborn: the service will be operated by ‘flyglobespan’ using a B767 aircraft four times per fortnight with effect from Wednesday 1 October 2008. The airbridge is run under a two-year contract with two one-year options, expected to run until 2012. The airbridge will leave Brize Norton southbound on Wednesdays and Sundays, and it will leave Mount Pleasant northbound on Fridays and Tuesdays.


The aircraft will operate at timings very similar to those in operation with the current schedule. Details will be confirmed as soon as possible.



This service provides a higher frequency of flights than the previous arrangement, which offered three flights per fortnight, as well as an enhanced aeromedical and freight capability.


The aircraft is chartered to carry 184 passengers on each flight. Although designed to carry more passengers, the extra payload will be used solely for freight and the extra fuel required for a journey of this length.


Twenty-nine seats will be reserved on each service for the use of the Falkland Island Government. Twenty six seats will be reserved for the use of the Ascension Island Government. These allocations reflect the statements of requirement as each Overseas Territory set out for a fortnightly period, adjusted by the change in service from three to four times every two weeks. "

[Kengineer-130]

Not a fan of that decision to be honest, loved the 747, 4 engines over lots of water... Dc10- just nasty! Now down to two engines for a long flight over open water.. nice :}

In all seriousness though, I don't think you could beat the Jumbo for comfort and flexibility, RAF should buy a handful to solve most of our transport problems.

[Artic-Warrior]

BRANDNEW.
"Having spoken to a few SAR chums, it's amazing how many people secretly admit to enjoying their time in the Falklands. What will happen "down south" when military SAR goes "civvy" in a few years? Will Bristow's take over, or will we keep a small detatchment active? Do people think it will be dangerous to have no military SH / SAR / AT supporting this theatre; in addition, will the FJ supply chain suffer?"

Why say "Bristow take over", do you know something the rest of us does not????
Do your SAR chums know something?? come on please tell.

[cockyjester]

Nice to know that tax payer's money is coming back to a UK airline instead of going to a foreign carrier - would imagine the B767 is a lot more comfortable as well compared to the death cruiser?

[AYTCH]

See the link at BEagle's post #39 !! I think their will be tears if Globespan provide the same level of service to the Services that is described by most of those whom post on that link. :{:{:{

[dallas]

FlyGlobeSpan fined for flying faulty jet - Liverpool Echo.co.uk (http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/liverpool-news/breaking-news/2008/08/04/flyglobespan-fined-for-flying-faulty-jet-100252-21462122/)

It seems we're choosing the pick of the crop, once again.

[3rdgenalm]

Travelling by C130 is the best way of getting there considering you'll get to night stop Gran Canaria, Asi and Rio.

[Beermonkey]

With the crew on rates in a 5* and the pax on capped actuals in a youth hostel.....:hmm:

[Ayla]

The South Atlantic schedule although appearing straightforward has a lot of potential to be quite challenging. The Falklands itself has weather patterns that can change for the worse very quickly and are difficult to forcast. Mount Pleasant is prone to high crosswinds due to the runway direction and diversion airfields along the route are some distance away.

The MOD have decided to award this to an airline that once had it's ETOPS approval removed and has been fined for operating outside the MEL.

I don't suppose it was the cheapest bid!

[Kengineer-130]

UNfit for purpose, minimum initial cost ( we all know what cheap means :eek:)... Didn't Mr Branson offer a 747 FOC at some time?

[Seldomfitforpurpose]

"Travelling by C130 is the best way of getting there considering you'll get to night stop Gran Canaria, Asi and Rio."

So the chance to get a free ride to 3 great "nights out" and still some mealy mouthed chimp bleats

"With the crew on rates in a 5* and the pax on capped actuals in a youth hostel." absolute stroker :rolleyes:

[BEagle]

Meanwhile, clearly some folk have been up to no good in the South Atlantic:

LONDON (Reuters) - Eighteen sailors on a Royal Navy warship have failed a routine drugs test during deployment in the South Atlantic, the Ministry of Defence (MoD) said on Thursday.

It was the biggest such incident in the Navy's history

"The Royal Navy does not tolerate misuse of drugs by its personnel and internal action is under way against all 18 individuals," the MoD said in a statement.

One hopes that the 'internal action' appropriate to the use of Class A drugs involves the cat o' nine tails - or keel hauling, perhaps?

Elsewhere, other drug users have recently been caught:

"On Tuesday, the MoD confirmed that five soldiers from the King's Troop Royal Horse Artillery had been dismissed from the army after routine tests showed traces of class A drugs.

On Sunday, it emerged that eight members of the 2nd Battalion the Royal Regiment of Fusiliers tested positive for cocaine and cannabis in July."

Well done, the CDT teams!

[Chainkicker]

Looks like DTMA or whichever beancounter put this contract out has picked a right stunner this time :eek:

Glad i left when i did :rolleyes:

[Pontious]

Ayla

I'm sure the GSM crews are very experienced. I'm sure they have a vast wealth of expertise, professionalism & structured SOP's to draw on, and indeed, a number of them have visited ASI & MPA before in previous 'lives'.

I'm sure all the GSM crews have operated in vile, foul, unpredictable & demanding weather conditions all over this planet and will be well prepared for any met' phenomenon Mother Nature can throw at them including CAVOK... which is what you normally find in the UAE, apart from the Shamal & occasional summer fog, of course..

GSM has done a few MOD 'one offs' & proved themselves worthy of an invite to tender & won.

As for them being the 'cheapest', well if by saving a couple of hundred thousand pounds over the term of the contract, that money is re-directed to buy equipment badly needed by the boy's & girls in the other theatres, or compensation for the families of our fallen & wounded heros then that's money well spent, surely
:ok:

[Seldomfitforpurpose]

PN,

Nice politico post but Ayla's post mentioned

"The MOD have decided to award this to an airline that once had it's ETOPS approval removed and has been fined for operating outside the MEL."

Thoughts Sir?......................

[Pontious]

Sffp

By all means trawl the archives of the 'net but I think you'll find the two items to which Ayla & yourself refer happened under a previous regime & that the DFO & DirENG are no longer in the employ of GSM.

I may have to be corrected but I think the new team voluntarily suspended an ETOPs certification when an internal audit carried out when they took over revealed some paperwork conflictions. The ETOP's clearance was only applied for & subsequently granted after a thorough review & overhaul of the things that keep auditors happy. Which is such good fortune when your new DFO is a former RAF BigWig... & former BA auditor.
:ok:

[Ayla]

Pontious you posted;

I'm sure all the GSM crews have operated in vile, foul, unpredictable & demanding weather conditions all over this planet and will be well prepared for any met' phenomenon Mother Nature can throw at them including CAVOK... which is what you normally find in the UAE, apart from the Shamal & occasional summer fog, of course..

I flew the South Atlantic schedule for 6 years with the RAF, the Ascension to Falkland Island leg is fairly unique in the challenges it can present!

This is from Wilkipedia that SFFP posted earlier. Events happened not all that long ago!

It was announced on the 18th October 2007 that the CAA had suspended Flyglobespan's ETOPS (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ETOPS) certificate, the first time in 15 years a UK operator has lost ETOPS (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ETOPS) approval. This effectively meant Flyglobespan transatlantic flights were forced to adopt a flight path which never took the aircraft more than an hour away from the nearest airport, in case of engine problems. However, this only applied to Flyglobespan's own aircraft and leased-in aircraft could continue to follow ETOPS (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ETOPS) rules as these are operated by other airlines with their own ETOPS (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ETOPS) approval. [8] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Globespan#cite_note-7) Flyglobespans ETOPS rating was reinstated at a CAA hearing on 26th October 2007.
It was stated in the Irish Independent on the 15th of January 2008 that "Flyglobespan has voluntarily surrendered the safety certification that allows it to fly the shortest route to the US" that is Ireland West Airport Knock to Boston and JFK. A flyglobespan spokesman said " he was fully confident of having the licence restored. That it is a very minor thing really,we hope to have it all sorted out in a few months and definitely before May"
It was stated in the Sunday Times on the 25th of May 2008 that Flyglobespan "is to be prosecuted for endangering the safety of passengers after allowing a 757 jet to fly illegally to America with faulty instruments". The Sunday Times has established that the transatlantic flight is one of a number of alleged safety breaches being investigated by the Civil Aviation Authority (CAA).
The BBC reported on the 4th August 2008 that the airline had been fined £5000 for flying between Liverpool and New Yorks JFK airport in 2007 with faulty aircraft instruments due to a lightning strike which hit the aircraft on a previous flight. The aircraft had been authorised to fly with the faulty instruments by the airline.

Cheapest is not always the best value for money!

[BEagle]

If MoD had any nous at all, it would immediately contact the creditors acting for Zoom airlines and make then an offer they can't refuse for their sadly redundant fleet of 3 x Boeing 767-300ER (270 seats each) and 2 x Boeing 757-200 (202 seats each)... Mixed class seating as well - 'W' Class for 'fat wardodging holidaymakers' and 'Y' Class for 'kinetic war-fighters'.....:hmm:

Training suitable crews would be a doddle - a common Type Rating can be used on the 757 and 767.

[shack]

BEagle unless I am very wrong (always possible) it must be a very long fat 737-300ER that seats 270.:rolleyes:

[mary_hinge]

To quote Pontious
"I may have to be corrected but I think the new team voluntarily suspended an ETOPs certification when an internal audit carried out when they took over revealed some paperwork conflictions. The ETOP's clearance was only applied for & subsequently granted after a thorough review & overhaul of the things that keep auditors happy"

That is also my understanding.
Also when the new team came in, amongst other things they moved Engineering and other key functions to Manchester as they had problems in getting suitably qualified staff to work at EDI. These new key post holders were needed for the airline to re-gain ETOPs certification.
Also over the past few months the airline has gone through the fleet with a maintenance clean-up programme, clearing many ADDs

[BEagle]

Sorry, I meant 767-300ER!

Post amended!!

[shack]

BEagle don't apologise, I remember your mother waving to me!!!!!!!!

[Ayla]

Fairplay, it sounds like Globespan may well have gone through a re-invention process, perhaps a name change as well may have helped!

[Pontious]

Yes Ayla,

I respect that you flew the route for 6 years, as did quite a few of the GSM crews. May I suggest that you read my last couple of postings a little closer.

Quite a few of the training captains & management pilots within GSM already have considerable South Atlantic experience from previous military 'lives' flying Victor Tankers, VC-10's, RAF Fast Jets, & Civvies flying B747's from AAE & operating Big Twins over the Pacific (Ayla, there is'nt a lot of places you can go to when you're inbound to SCIP & it should close for some reason). 'Island Reserve' Fuel and/or a lengthy diversion. They know what to expect & what's expected of them.

As for the ETOP's suspension, I'VE ALREADY STATED about the CAA's suspension, the subsequent re-instatement & GSM's volutary surrender of it when an internal audit discovered discrepencies & conflictions (Wikipedia don't call it 'ETOPs Certification' the 2nd time they mention it) & the following re-certification. GSM surrended their own 180 mins ETOP's certification but the CAA said they would've been happy with a reduction to 138,120 or 90 mins. GSM declined & started from scratch on drafting a new ETOPs certification application which was approved by the CAA.

As for the court case, GSM were fined £5000, hardly the sum you would expect if they '...had knowingly broken rules & laws endangering aircraft & passenger safety'. If I recall correctly, BMI were fined a much bigger sum for something years ago.

WHAT YOU DON'T REALISE, Ayla, is that the ETOPs suspension AND the 'order' given to bring the 757 back across the Atlantic were results & policies of a PREVIOUS regime. The current DFO was pretty much appointed by the CAA when the previous one retired on the grounds of ill health. Suffice it to say, the 2 accountable managers who were responsible for the initial ETOPs cock up & the 757 incident LEFT THE COMPANY shortly after the latter & I should think the Judge presiding over the court case took advice from the CAA concerning inroads the new team had made over the 12 months since the incident to ensure it couldn't happen again when deciding over the level of fine to penalise GSM.

The new team have the confidence of the CAA & it's going to be a long, steep road to win back the reputation GSM enjoyed when it first engaged on Long Haul Op's, but they are slowly, step by step, making progress.


:ok:

[Ayla]

Pontious, thanks for describing the recent improvements at Globespan, I am sure you too would have had reservations about the old management team at Globespan running this schedule, please see my previous post.

[BEagle]

Just so long as that's all she did, shack!

I wondered why we used to walk up the hill to my Merryfield 'goofing spot' quite so often!!!

[Sideshow Bob]

So how long have you been working for GSM Pontious? :hmm:

[matkat]

Sffp

By all means trawl the archives of the 'net but I think you'll find the two items to which Ayla & yourself refer happened under a previous regime & that the DFO & DirENG are no longer in the employ of GSM.

I may have to be corrected but I think the new team voluntarily suspended an ETOPs certification when an internal audit carried out when they took over revealed some paperwork conflictions. The ETOP's clearance was only applied for & subsequently granted after a thorough review & overhaul of the things that keep auditors happy. Which is such good fortune when your new DFO is a former RAF BigWig... & former BA auditor.

Yes they were removed but had nothing whatsoever to do with the ETOPS suspension in fact the director of engineering actually got the approval reinstated the fact is the MEL was misinterpreted by both the Capt & the certifying engineer at LPL the second ETOPS suspension was indeed volunteered however it would have been again revoked because the annual CAA audit highlighted several deficiencies that caused concern it was NOT an internal audit, I know because I was present in the boardroom for the CAA audit findings. One thing I do agree with is the present DFO is a top bloke.

[Pontious]

Ayla

No worries, I was so close to walking out myself but things have changed here.

SideShowBob,

Just over 2 years, through fair weather & foul.

Matkat

My apologies, the rumour from 'round the campfire' was it surfaced during an internal audit but while the CAA were camped out at Collinton & looking over shoulders. And yes BMcC is one hell of a boss!!
:ok:

[mary_hinge]

Repairing ramp rash at ASI won't be as much fun as the current repairs in EDI

[BEagle]

A few passenger comments for August 2008:

28 August 2008 : by K E

Customer Rating : 1/5

We paid £1067 for 'so-called' premium economy for two of us, OAP's with not a lot of cash to spare, Manchester/Vancouver. The food was uneatable, we didn't get a chance to sample any drinks, as only the two soft drinks we were given throughout an 11 hour flight. The tv screens were miniscule and we couldn't watch them - but the entertainment of Mrs Doubtfire and an ancient episode of Only Fools and Horses was not unduly missed. Comfort was at a very low value and there were no pillows/blankets supplied for the overnight return. All in all it was a miserable experience, not helped by the Italian flight crew who were dour and unhappy. It does though, go to show that they are not improving and I wonder how they are allowed to keep operating, if you can use that word.

27 August 2008 : by G B

Customer Rating : 1/5

We flew back from Orlando. There had been a storm in Orlando and we anticipated this to alter our flight time. However when we arrived at the airport most flights were on time and this included ours which was due to depart at 6.30pm. The inbound flight from Glasgow had arrived on time and we checked in quite quickly. We were due to board at 6pm and it was at this point we were told there was a delay and we would be notified momentarily. All flights due to fly out of Sanford that day had departed except one to London and First Choice were accommodating their customers at a hotel. In about half an hour it was announced that we were delayed but the extent was not clear and no reason was given. About an hour later it was announced that the delay would be until 3am (11 hrs after check-in) and this was due to a fault with the plane. After further questions (there was no Flyglobespan rep, only a lady who worked for the airport) we were told it was because the Captain did not want to fly the plane because it had a faulty 'back thrust' and this would affect emergency landing. He also said that we needed to wait for more crew. The plane finally departed at 4.45am - over 9 hours after it should have departed. The airport was shut up and there was no security staff anywhere making it an unpleasant place to be. The plane was not fixed, the Captain simply decided to take the risk-so why not take the risk 10 hours earlier? The staff were lovely but when boarding the plane we were told to be patient with them as they had only had minimum rest. They weren't the only ones! I would never fly with Flyglobespan again.

27 August 2008 : by J G

Customer Rating : 3/5

Glasgow to Sanford return. Outbound on time, impressed with plane, loads of legroom and a foot rest. Premium economy meals better than expected with complimentary drinks, entertainment up to date. Return journey a very different story! Got to Sanford 3 hrs before as requested, flight supposedly on time, 18.30pm. Flyglobespan decided not to fly - excuse a "technical" problem with the plane and the crew had gone over their working time so we would be flying out at 4.15am, 10 hrs later. Pilot told us this through a recorded message and by the time we received it all the crew had done a runner and were tucked up in bed. We did receive $20 in food vouchers each to compensate but Sanford closes down at night and it was a long 10 hr wait plus the journey home. I suppose when you only pay £1100 for 4 adults return what do you expect.

23 August 2008 : by S D

Customer Rating : 2/5

We had a four hour delay each way on London to Vancouver with £4 vouchers each time. No reason for delays and on top of long transfer and journey now worth the cheaper air fare. Never again as happens all the time and not a one off.

22 August 2008 : by J W

Customer Rating : 2/5

Gatwick / Vancouver Business Class return August 2008. Having read the extensive negative comment and followed the CAA court case we found we were too late to cancel without penalty so I still wanted to enjoy the flight knowing full well that one cannot expect Virgin Upper Class. Globespan managed to remove any sense of business class other than to technically supply a faded old style cradle chair. Yes, we were 3 hours late both flights but in comparison to other reported delays we felt we were lucky. There are all the other oft heard niggles which could be re-iterated but I am more concerned about the aged, noisy 767’s that seem to suffer technical problems on such a regular basis. They must be costing Flyglobespan a fortune through their inefficiency and the inevitable knock-on costs such as timed out crew, hotel accommodation, etc. for the unfortunates. If these aircraft suffer so many technical problems they must not only show faults prior to take off but during a flight.

22 August 2008 : by M N

Customer Rating : 4/5

Manchester to Vancouver via Calgary. No complaints. Return flight (via Dublin) delayed 2 hours but informed at check in. Screw up with pre-booked meal selection on return, but they supplied a crew meal for me. I knew about stopovers but only because I asked someone in Canada to look into the same flights from there. Seems that if you book from outside the UK the 'stopovers' are made quite clear to potential customers. This (I speculate) is because the UK doesn't have the same consumer regulations as Canada, so it could be that providing this information is the law over there but not over here? My advice: Don't waste your money on 'premium economy', unless you really need to sit a few feet closer to business class and the economy class lav. Fly Globespan but business class only, it's affordable and worth every penny especially on long haul flights.

21 August 2008 : by L McC

Customer Rating : 1/5

Glasgow to Barcelona. We were informed a couple of weeks before this flight had changed to Glasgow- Edinburgh-Barcelona adding time onto our journey. The flight then left Glasgow on time, arrived in Edinburgh with no sign of a problem until they let all the passengers on, we then waited almost an hour before being told there was a "fault" with the plane! The part they needed was in Glasgow so it was being couriered over to Edinburgh. We were then taken off the flight, given a hastily written letter apologising and were left there for 3 hours. The flight from start to finish took 7 hours with little information being passed to us. Extremely disappointed with their service.

16 August 2008 : by S M

Customer Rating : 1/5

Myself, husband and children flew from Glasgow-Vancouver on 30th July. We were delayed over 19 hours on the way there. Initially we were told that there would be an update on half an hour. This came and went and only updates were supplied when people were demanding answers when the update was 'we have no further information at this time - a further update will be given in half an hour'...this also came and went. Eventually a £4 meal voucher was supplied to each person. Considering we had checked in 9 hours previously, this allocation was poor. We were then told to come back at 11pm to collect our luggage and we would then be allocated a room - we eventually were given a room at the Premier Inn 'just down the road'. After walking for almost a mile across busy roads with 3 children plus all our luggage we eventually checked in at 1am - told to be back at the airport next morning at 7am for departure at 9am - flight departed around 11.10am. I had to demand a minibus to take us back to the airport the next morning. Premier Inn were great and organised this even tho it wasn't their responsibility bringing in staff from their day off. Return flight was delayed 1hr 45mins. I hadn't read the reviews prior to booking with Globespan and was sceptical about flying with them after all the documented bad press. My scepticism was well justified and would much rather pay that little bit extra in future to fly with an efficient well run airline. I definitely won't be using them again.

16 August 2008 : by M W

Customer Rating : 5/5

Glasgow to Orlando and back. Checking in at Glasgow very quick and we were told they expected a delay of 1 hour 50 minutes but after 1 hour 55 minutes we were on the runway. Our prebooked seats were available to us and the food was typical airline. Service with a smile was the nature of the day. Seats comfortable and acceptable leg room and width. Returning we had booked business class. We had a separate checkin and again our prebooked seats were available. Food as one would expect much nicer and served on plates. Not up to BMI business class food but we didn't expect that. The girls tried really hard to be professional but did seem young and a little nervous. I have to say I enjoyed the flights more than when we flew Virgin to San Francisco a few years ago. We would pay again for Business class. It was worth the extra money so long as it is appreciated that it is far cheaper than major airlines business class and you get what you pay for.

15 August 2008 : by T L

Customer Rating : 1/5

Glasgow-Vancouver (via Calgary). An 18-hour delay. Upon arrival at the airport there was already a four-hour delay which dragged on until 9 PM, when we were finally told we would not be flying that day. The lucky ones went home, while those not from Glasgow were accommodated (well past midnight, with a 6am wake-up call) at various hotels. The flight finally left (two hours later than the promised 9am, thanks to the use of that day's Florida-bound plane, making all those passengers delayed until at least 16:00 from their 9:30 flight (if they got out that day at all on our plane)! Globespan seems to do this a lot - grab another plane that does not have a technical problem and pass the delay down the line. My return flight two weeks later was also delayed (only two hours this time). The only positive thing I can say is that the service and food were reasonably good. While I have had only minor delays with Globespan's service to Tenerife, I would never fly with this airline transatlantic, and I do wonder how good the maintenance is when there are so many delays due to technical problems.

14 August 2008 : by S F

Customer Rating : 4/5

Glasgow - Sanford. The outgoing flight was delayed by two hours, but these things happen, and staff kept us informed and were and apologetic. The seats were comfortable, and food good for airline food. Cabin crew friendly and very accomodating. The return flight departed slightly early. Again, clean plane, comfortable seats, good food, friendly crew. My only real complaint is the inflight entertainment - seat-back screens would improve matters.

13 August 2008 : by J K

Customer Rating : 1/5

Edinburgh - or should I say Glasgow-Las Palmas. On outward journey arrived at Edinburgh at 1.00pm (our flight was to take off at 4.00pm) to be told we were being taken by bus to Glasgow airport as our plane had a "technical fault" and would not be leaving until 10.00pm that night. Bad enough you would think on way out but you still had a holiday to look forward to. But arriving at Las Palmas airport at 7.00pm for flight supposedly leaving at 10.00pm on return we thought we would ask at check in (just to be sure) what time we would be boarding. We were told 9.30pm. Not bad,we thought!!! So got through departure lounge at 8.30pm, quickly did our duty free shopping and grabbed a quick bite to eat. At 9.00pm we happened to look at board and to our horror found out that the flight had been delayed until 3.30am. No flyglobespan reps in sight and no-one to explain to us what was going on. At 10.00 got an announcement to ask all passengers to report to information desk to receive vouchers for a measly £4.00. What good were they to us as we had already ate? Still no explanation as to what was happening so there was nothing else to do but grab a line of seats each and try and grab some shut eye (to no avail as announcements every 2 mins to alert passengers of other flights leaving on time!). When we finally boarded the plane the only explanation we got was the same old story "there had been a technical fault with our plane and had to bring one over from GLASGOW". So in other words the exact same cock and bull we heard two weeks previously. The planes themselves are very dated and basic (no entertainment at all). Needless to say that will be the last time I will ever fly with Flyglobespan and would never recommend them to anyone.

11 August 2008 : by R F

Customer Rating : 3/5

Outward flight to Vancouver via Calgary was trouble free. Flight on time and had the seats we booked. Unfortunately the return flight was totally different. Meant to depart Vancouver at 8.15pm on Tuesday 5th August. On arrival at the airport the flight was already showing a delay until 10pm - no reason given. The aircraft arrived about 9.15pm, when everyone was assembled in the forward departure lounge when we were told there was a technical problem - one of the tyres had burst and they couldn't get a replacement one and even if they did the flight crew would be over their working hours. The flight was cancelled. We were accommodated in the Best Western hotel and eventually left at 12 noon on Wednesday and arrived back in Glasgow at 6.30 am on Thursday. We were kept informed and the technical problem could have happened to any airline.

7 August 2008 : by P G

Customer Rating : 1/5

Glasgow - Calgary 23rd July - drove wife and daughter from Aberdeen to Glasgow to be told on arrival that there was a four hour delay on the flight - eventually took off four hours late - no explanation from staff - captain advised only late incoming flight on previous sector. Globespan must have know this well in advance as the previous sectors were Gatwick / Calgary / Vancouver / Calgary / Glasgow - on checking the departures / arrivals boards at these airports the flight was always late - so Globespan knew at least 24 hours in advance that flight was late - no chance of making up the time. I could have lived with this, but I am now sitting in Aberdeen (6th August) waiting to drive to Glasgow to pick up my wife and daughter - only to find that the flight has been cancelled (rather that delayed) - subtle difference. No Information provided by Globespan to my wife (in Calgary) or myself in Aberdeen - only after I phoned Globespan in Edinburgh (when they eventually opened at 9am) did I find that there was an indefinite delay which was likely to be 15 / 16 hours. My wife is now in a hotel in Calgary awaiting a flight. I am sitting in Aberdeen wondering when I should drive to Glasgow to pick her up. Will I ever be advised by Globespan what is really happening? Glasgow airport departure boards eventually updated - after my complaint - to show arrival time of 06:45 on 7th August (16 Hours late) - I am not holding my breath that this will end up the limit to the delay. No one in Globespan seems to want to explain what is really going on. Passengers travelling with my wife on the same flight all seem to have their own horror stories about Globespan. Do not Fly with Globespan - worse than useless

5 August 2008 : by M R

Customer Rating : 1/5

Edinburgh - Barcelona. We booked Globespan despite a horrendous experience suffered by my sister last year, principally as the flight times suited us and they flew direct to Barcelona. We have three young children. On arriving at Edinburgh we were casually told of a 1 hr 45 minute delay which turned quickly into 3 hours. I count ourselves lucky compared to some poor souls. What irritated me the most was the complete disinterest of the staff and crew. There was of course no explanation given and you are faced with dealing with the fallout - ie screaming kids, midnight arrival, no service etc etc. I will never fly them again and will make it my mission to disuade anyone who is thinking of trying them - it simply is not worth it. When you add in the antiquated state of some of their aircraft it's a joke that they are still in business.

3 August 2008 : by S M

Customer Rating : 1/5

UK-Spain flights. I am a frequent flyer between UK & Spain and can categorically say Flyglobespan are the worst airline I have ever booked and flown with. They advertise attractive flight times (midday, early afternoon) and within a month or so the flight times change to late evening. A friend has just been advised via email that his Wednesday-Wednesday flights have been changed to Monday- Monday! They have on several occasions combined Alicante & Malaga flights to fill them without informing the customers who then have to endure over 5 hours on the plane instead of 2hrs 45mins. The change of flight times bugs me though, it is plain, simple, fraud! If they advertised evening flights arriving around midnight no one would book with them. I now use Easyjet even if it means 2 x flights via London because at least they are reliable and the flight times don't change.

1 August 2008 : by P S

Customer Rating : 1/5

Nice-Edinburgh, 28 July, 20.10. Well it turned out to be 29 July, a total delay of 9 hours with no open facilities at the airport and forced to stay in the terminal awake until 5am. Information was inaccurate when it existed and no proper explanation given as to why a little fog at Edinburgh earlier causes such a scenario- other airlines coped much better! They have a small fleet and absolutely no customer care when this happens. I'll go Easyjet next time, all is forgiven.Worst experience in 35 years of flying, but all too typical judging from other comments from young and old alike.

MoD should really pull its finger out and grab the redundant Zoom Airlines fleet!!

[mary_hinge]

Beagle, fully agree on your thoughts on grabbing the B757 / B767 aircraft if available at the right price, the problem being though that with the myriad of debts on this fleet it would be some months away, not taking into account all the other stuff such as the AOC ( The CAA stuff, not the bloke that used to shut down life on camp for 14 days a year)

Can’t argue with the postings either from the punters who have flown Gob Span, but we should remember that 10 people will report a negative Vs 1 person reporting a positive. Good news is no news!

As others have said, Globe have had problems, these have been identified and are being addressed. The fact is that these flights will be operated with “G” registered aircraft, built by Boeing and will be maintained in the UK.

It could have been a T154 operated by Sloberdown Disyebitch Airways, maintained at ****noseestan, but with a nice drink on the way, or in 3 years perhaps Mangle Agrospace will have released an L1011

[snowgoose]

First class outfit....let the proof be in the pudding???

[matkat]

Pontious no probs BMc was not my boss(I was in engineering) but still a top bloke.

[brakedwell]

Fore-warned is fore-armed! FlyGlobespan Reviews and FlyGlobespan Passenger Opinions about FlyGlobespan product and FlyGlobespan service standards (http://www.airlinequality.com/Forum/flygspan.htm)

[mary_hinge]

brakedwell said:
Fore-warned is fore-armed! FlyGlobespan Reviews and FlyGlobespan Passenger Opinions about FlyGlobespan product and FlyGlobespan service standards (http://www.airlinequality.com/Forum/flygspan.htm)

Have you read any of this thread, or perhaps just a couple of posts up?http://static.pprune.org/images/smilies/puppy_dog_eyes.gif

Any one else seen the film "Ground Hog day"?

[brakedwell]

Have you read any of this thread, or perhaps just a couple of posts up?

Any one else seen the film "Ground Hog day"?

Be a balanced Hinge and also read the positives :{:{:{

[BEagle]

The quotes I used were only those from August 2008 - during which time the 'improved' Flyglobespan has been operating.....

Normally you'll find more negatives than positives on such websites, but the group I've used have not been 'selected' for any purpose - just the names have been dis-identified.

[taxydual]

You have to bear in mind, of course, that the vast majority of the Airbridge pax aren't 'paying customers'. I'm afraid it will be a 'take it' or 'take it or else' situation. I don't suppose that 'the troops' feedback will matter a damn to the beancounters.

Oh, I wonder if they have leather seats on the 'frames? :):):)

[farsouth]

Much comment about the leather seats that were in the Omni Air DC 10, as if they were the height of (unneccessary) luxury - in fact they were hard as a board, very slippery, and extremely uncomfortable

[BEagle]

I wonder whether Flyglobespan will learn how to fly the SID on RW08 at Brize?

Perhaps they'll manage rather better than the Omni Air DC-10 managed at 1620Z this afternoon.....

[brakedwell]

I wonder whether Flyglobespan will learn how to fly the SID on RW08 at Brize?

Perhaps they'll manage rather better than the Omni Air DC-10 managed at 1620Z this afternoon.....

They should be able to hack it in a B767. Call up the SID from the FMC and engage the autopilot at 100 ft.

[Pontious]

BEagle

You may notice the recurring theme in the complaints about GSM is delay,delay & delay.

I don't know when you flew for an airline but THIS years unrealistic schedule was draughted, published & planned LAST year under said previous regime with...

Block times, for the main, less than the flight times.

Flt Plans drawn up for M.80 cruise speeds yet requested to operate at M.78 to conserve fuel.

Planned on 180min ETOPs Cert',yet, operated on Non-ETOPs routings (averaging 30-40 mins increased flight time EACH WAY on the Trans Atlantic routes).

Demanding 45 minute turnarounds which is possible on a 737 op'ing short haul but realistic on a 767(?)

Tankering fuel to just below MLM(?)... into a relatively high altitude airfield(?)...in a Canadian Prarie summer(?) Never heard of 'The Brake Cooling Schedule' in the back of B767 QRH then, eh?

Does that sound at all achievable?(I'm hearing Bruce Forsyth sniggering "Good Game! Good game!)

They (Commercial Planning) never consulted Flight Op's about ANYTHING. And don't even get me started on the crass lack of sched'd downtime for maintenance or breaks in the programme to allow for 'Picking up the Programme'.

The expected schedule for ANY LoCost operator is predicated on a 'minimum ground-time' programme to maximise utilisation. Unfortunately, the 'planners' in 'commercial' NEVER asked for ANY input from 'Flight Ops' management when constructing the Summer08 programme.

The Summer09 programme looks somewhere near totally achievable, but, "... the best laid plans of mice & men go...." ALL programmes suffer unforseen eventualities. A well researched & thoroughly planned schedule can recover quickly & a return to 'Ops Normal' practically achieved.
:ok:

[MarkD]

If the RAF was in the market for used 763ERs that nice Mr Walsh might have a few, depending on what the Waterworld strategy of the week is. Given the sector lengths to HM's possessions in the South Atlantic I imagine sticking on a few of Aviation Partners Boeing's new 763 bendy bits might be a good call too.

[BEagle]

Meanwhile, an interesting article from Mike Smith in today's Sunday Times:

From: The Sunday Times
August 31, 2008

Leasing RAF planes wastes nearly £500m

by Michael Smith

The government squandered almost £500m by leasing RAF transport aircraft that it could have bought outright for less money.

The Ministry of Defence wanted to buy the four Boeing C17 Globemasters for £520m but was told by Gordon Brown, then the chancellor, to lease them because it would be cheaper.

New figures show the MoD paid a total of £769m to lease the aircraft and then had to buy them anyway for an additional £220m. The final payment was made last month, putting the total price over eight years at £989m.

The MoD’s financial problems are now so great that the prime minister has still not signed off on its spending plans for this financial year.

The giant C17 transporters, flown by 99 Squadron based at RAF Brize Norton in Oxfordshire, can carry three Warrior armoured vehicles or a dozen Land Rovers. The MoD has since bought two more for £130m each, putting the total for the RAF’s six-aircraft fleet up to £1.25 billion.

Gerald Howarth, the Conservative defence spokesman, said the lease deal had been “an absolute shocking waste of public money when our troops are going without the equipment they need”.

The MoD said the decision to lease the aircraft was taken to meet a short-term need. Buying the leased aircraft to cope with operations in Iraq and Afghanistan was subsequently seen as “the best value-for-money option”.

[unclenelli]

Can't go back to Excel - they've gone bust

BBC NEWS | Business | Holiday firm XL in administration (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7611639.stm)

[Hairbus]

Correction. XL are bust not Air Atlanta.:=

[euringineer]

XL was bought by XL MANAGEMENT from AAI. The SA contract in 2006 was bid and won by XL but subbed to AAI. On the 2007 tender bid, XL lost out to Air Partner(British Broker) who subbed to OMNI(US Airline). Despite protests to the DfT about illegal carriers flying British Routes(YES the SA is also an official British scheduled service), OMNI were allowed to continue for sometime on the route. Mistakenly the MOD thought that it was a pure charter and then open to any carrier from anywhere in the world. AAI were allowed to sub fly as they are part of the EU Economic Agreement. What was illegal was there use of non-EU Flight Deck crew from their mainline, the cabin crew came from XL. The B747 is the best a/c for the route as it can take 2 loads and lots of freight. If there is a delay there is no furher waiting or catch up. In my exp. most pax had a triple or middle quad as a bed. If XL Management had any nous they would have leased a further B747 for Travel City Direct and used them to takeover the SA and other Trooping. Alas they were too busy worrying about West Ham and why no other British Charter airline would partner them

[cockyjester]

I hear from some one just back from MPN that the GSM flights have started and everything is going well, not the usual delays encountered with the Death Cruiser :}

Is this the case or are the locals being patriotic to a UK carrier?

[Pontious]

I brought the monday morning service into here (ASI) & the pax were very complimentary. In the Senior NCO's & Officer's Mess's last night people were approaching us & making favourable rumblings. It was the same story in the NAAFI.

The increased frequency of the service generated a lot of praise, as did the standard of service provided by the crews but it was the flight times seem to draw most comment. I.e. Night flight BZZ-ASI, day flight ASI-MPN, day flight MPN-ASI, night flight ASI-BZZ.

It must be said the crews said the pax were some of the most pleasant they've carried.
:ok:

[Nantucket Sleighride]

Pontious, since you're enjoying the delights of ASI I guess you haven't heard the rumour about your original 767 that was supposed to op the route requiring some serious work to sort out the corrosion they found.

[Pontious]

Nantucket Sleighride,
It isn't rumour, it's fact. I positioned the said aircraft from LTN-MAN for more work on the corrosion.

Now was that a general attempt at a bonafide 'Scoop' or a general 'pop' at GSM? I ask because the mod's keep an eye on this thread in particular & stopped the last one because certain people were just posting slanderous gossip.

By the way, the 'corrosion' isn't as bad as on the one waiting to go in the hangar after ours had left.
:ok:

[Brain Potter]

it was the flight times seem to draw most comment. I.e. Night flight BZZ-ASI, day flight ASI-MPN, day flight MPN-ASI, night flight ASI-BZZ.

That was always the way 216 Sqn flew the route. Were the more recent contractors doing it differently?

[Pontious]

Hi Brain,
I never saw the schedule that OMNI (the previous charterers) flew. All I know is that whereas their service was 3 services every 2 weeks, ours are 2 services every week, leaving Brize every Sunday & Wednesday nights & leaving MPN every Tuesday & Friday mornings. As I posted earlier, one of the airfield fire section commented favourably on our schedule.
:ok:

[brit bus driver]

As alluded to by Mr Potter....wheel, re-invent, go!

Mind you, Castle was never much kop as sun screen...:\

[TorqueOfTheDevil]

Flights seem to be going well, though the southern leg takes about an hour longer than it used to (is this to do with the ETOPS certification?) and spends noticeably longer at Ascension. To ensure the 0800 arrival at Brize, the flight leaves MPA about 0830 instead of the previous 1030 or so.

For the record, all the recent charter operators of the South Atlantic route - BMI, Air Luxor, Air Atlanta, Omni Air - used the same timings (leave Brize about midnight, arrive Brize about 0800); the only significant change with Globespan has been the increase in service frequency.

[Nantucket Sleighride]

Now was that a general attempt at a bonafide 'Scoop' or a general 'pop' at GSM? I ask because the mod's keep an eye on this thread in particular & stopped the last one because certain people were just posting slanderous gossip

Pontious, you've confirmed what I heard, why would that be deleted?
Now if I'd have asked how long it would be before you supply a compliant aircraft for the contract, I'd have understood your preciousness:hmm:

[Brain Potter]

So, an already painfully long trip is now scheduled for an extra 2 hours and in a much smaller aircraft to boot. Ouch!

Those who do a 4-month stint once in a career might not mind, but folks who have to go there every year or so might be less enthusiastic, although the greater frequency might suit some.

[Pontious]

Thanks for that, Torque. I've just seen the guy from the Fire Section & asked him to expand on his comments & he meant the increased number of rotations.

Nantucket'

I sincerely apologise. I thought this was the 'FlyGlobepan-8' thread. The corrosion issue has been thrashed to death on that thread & 'FlyGlobespan-7' before it, as it was discovered some time before GSM started the contract. 'FlyGlobespan-7' was pulled by the mods because some posters were getting out of hand. Once again I apologise for the tone of my response to your post as I was 'flitting' between forums & thought I was still on the 'FlyGlobespan-8' thread on 'Airports, Routes & Airports.
:ok:

[Kengineer-130]

What aircraft is operating the route now? I had the Dis-pleasure of going to Asi on the A330 :mad:, and a year later all the way to the falklands on the 747, which IMHO is the perfect tool for the job :ok:

[Fosters]

This mornings flight apparently left approx 4 hours late due to tech delay, admittedly there was a 2 hour delay already factored in to ensure some AOG freight made the flight.

Fosters

[tspark]

How do you crew this Pontius? What are the leg times?

[tspark]

Just to bring this back to the top again!

Do they have a slip crew waiting at asi or do u just carry extra pilots with a rest as asi?

[Pontious]

Each crew operates BZZ-ASI-MPN-ASI-BZZ on a 12-day-away pattern. At any one time in ASI they'll be 2 crews. each waiting to op' their respective sectors either downbound from the UK heading south or upbound from the Falklands heading north.

Sorry Tspark
I didn't see your post. They are as follows:

BZZ-ASI 9:00
ASI-MPN 8:35
MPN-ASI 7:45
ASI-BZZ 8:45.

I've operated the service & picked up a southbound delayed service ex-BZZ of 4 hours for connecting essential freight & accompanying staff then 'unshed'ed maintenance'. It arrived into ASI 3:30 late, departed ASI 3:00 late & arrived 2:45 late against headwinds 50kts stronger than forecast for over half of the flight. The aircraft stays in MPN with the crew & they spend between 12 & 18 hours in MPN depending on how early or late they pitch up in MPN from ASI.

Also picked up a BZZ bound flight delayed ex-MPN due to an I/B restriction at BZZ. They tend to delay departure ex-MPN so any transit pax. don't have to spend too long in 'the cage' at ASI. Departure was delayed ex-MPN an hour or so late, arrived BZZ shortly after 0800 as per restriction.

It's a comfortable, practical schedule that isn't rushed yet has sufficient 'fat' to overcome any delays. It works well.
:ok:

[spaniels ears]

Returned from MPA last week on the 767. Credit where it's due, the staff were extremely friendly and the turn round time in Asi was considerably shorter than ever experienced before - approx 75 mins. Arrived in Brize about an hour and a half early on Saturday morning.

[tspark]

Thanks for taking the time to reply Pontius, know you're busy! Sounds like an amazing route to operate ! Challenging to say the least with those winds!

Here the nite life in ASI is good tho !!!

Have you or any of the crew taken any photos of the journey? That would be worth posting !

[Bear 555]

Well, first time I travelled South it was BA/RAF TriStar from BZZ to Dakar the on to ASI, prior to changing to C-130's . . .

ASI to Stanley was between 12 and 13 hrs, with a couple of refuellings. Thats LOTS of boredom with just a little excitement!

(Apologies for the quality but worth it for the memory !!)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v655/brianmouat/C-130tanker.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v655/brianmouat/C-130Cockpit.jpg

[Pontious]

One of the Cabin Crew Seniors posted some on his Facebook page but I can't link it on to here. It is a cracking trip. I'm away on wednesday night for my second one. I can't wait.
:ok:

[tspark]

Sounds amazing !

If you can persuade them to let u use the pix, or take some yourself !

Enjoy the trip ! Penguins beware !

[Grey'npointy]

Just got back a few days ago from MPA and, it must be said, the Globespan team does a far finer job than Omni could ever hope to achieve. The aircraft is fine, the staff very friendly, helpful and none of the hosties are either over 60 or have beards - unlike their predecessors.

I understand from some of the crew that the contract is signed for 4 years and that there's an aircraft now undergoing mods to be specifically employed on the route. Some of the mods include a full set of seat-back TVs & a more modern IFE system than has ben seen before on this run.

Thanks to Globespan for a good job.

GnP

[tspark]

Meant to ask you Pontius (I'm just helluva nosey by nature) whats your accomodation like at ASI and MPN?

[TorqueOfTheDevil]

Just heard a story that about 6 weeks back, the TAF produced by the MPA Met Office showed strong crosswinds and severe turbulence on a day when Omni Air were due in from the UK. Apparently the Omni crew contacted some met colleagues in the USA for a 'second opinion'; as requested, the USA-produced TAF made no reference to the bad weather, and the flight duly departed!

[Pontious]

Basic but comfortable but the craic is mighty!
:ok:

[H5N1]

Isn't it just! ;)

And thanks to the Globespan crew fab flight much improved on the Omni and XL experiences of the past.

[albertoli]

If it is Globespan that are doing the FI flights then you can expect hefty delays!!!! Their OTP is pants. You will arrive at Brize to find that it will be a 737-800 instad of a 767, that is what they did from GLA on their flights to America from Scotland.

[Pontious]

Albertoli

Oh really...?
:ok:

[tspark]

Dont take the bait Pontius ! So are u speaking to us wi fi from ASI then?

[Pontious]

Oh yes! Live, Large & Unleashed! Coming to you all the way from TriStar Village!
:ok:

[Logistics Loader]

737 UK-FI...

christ almighty....

they can only just get to Lanzorote in 1 piece....!!!!!!

MPA was built in the wrong place !!

from those in the know, it should have been 15miles further than where it is now... a known fact the winds were not "as fierce" or were actually more favourable for crosswinds...

T* limit 23deg IIRC ??

[brit bus driver]

T* limit 23deg IIRC ??

23 degrees??

Do you mean 23 kts? If so, no; it was (is?) 30 knots across, not taking gusts into account. Standby for top of descent met special.....

But it's not the wind strength, it's the rotor streaming from the mountains to the north that'll get you. Best you bone up on Windshear Go Around before winter starts to bite doon sooth.

:ok:

[Logistics Loader]

BBD,

for some reason when i did my Tristar Despatcher course 23 deg across the nose stuck in my mind. i stand corrected if it's 30 deg...

however, the grey cells may be losing storage ability...

safe landings

[TorqueOfTheDevil]

Did the flight get there unscathed?


Yes, though I hear that the approach and landing was not the smoothest...

[BandiB]

I think the 738 comment is a little extreme. We all know that wouldnt make it to ASI or MPN. Strange comments though, you talk of hefty delays and in the sentence after say a 738 was at GLA to operate the U.S routes. A hefty delay would have been turning up to GLA to find no aircraft at all, so at least they recover the program with something. :confused:

[albertoli]

turning up and finding no aircraft at all would be a cancellation!

[brit bus driver]

So speaks a man (or woman, Loretta) who has obviously never ventured forth into said 'amazing part of the world'!!

I bet you'll be bidding for LCY-JFK as you appear to be some sort of masochist!!!;)

[cockyjester]

"turning up and finding no aircraft at all would be a cancellation!"

Not strictly true Albert'. Turning up and finding no aircraft then waiting for a replacement would be a delay?

Happens all the time in the commercial world

[brit bus driver]

AMS

Indeed it was, and was meant firmly tongue in cheek - apologies if it came across in a manner other than that intended. It is a wonderful place, in a perverse sort of way! Definitely worth seeing, but not for too long and certainly not too frequently!

:ok:

[BEagle]

Wind, rain, goose ****, peat smoke, corrugated iron houses, Landrovers, wind, rain, more goose ****, Bennies who look like Charles Bronson, wool prices on the radio, darts on the radio, rain......

And did I mention the wind?

But worth a visit between now and about March. Beware of the wind from about 340-030 - it can be 340V030 05G55 with windsocks pointing in opposite directions at opposite ends of the runway - and don't believe any non-Falkland based met forecasts for the place.

Upland Goose and/or the Malvinas hotel are worth a visit. As most certainly is the museum in Stanley.

Watching penguins can be fun....but not all day!

And as for the mystery of why 216 took off to the west and then turned left when flying to ASI...:\ (everyone else phoned the TOC to check range status). Or always used the high speed exit at ASI the wrong way round....:rolleyes:

[Pontious]

BEagle

I took off last week from the westerly runway and turned left due to:

a) The high ground to the North West that causes the rotors.
b) ATC cleared us to "...take off with a left turn out..." after we had checked the status of the ranges.

Upon arrival at ASI, I too used the RET 'the wrong way around' (your words) because:

a) I didn't want to burn the brakes out.
b) The marshaller's truck is always positioned on the RET pointing towards the ramp (the opposite direction to us on the runway).As were are expected to follow the "Follow Me" truck I positioned the aircraft behind the truck.

Why the 'mystery'?
:ok:

[BEagle]

Well, having operated from ASI and MPA on many occasions on the VC10 since 1985, we always landed in the right place at ASI and used the high-speed as it was designed after the 1982 war.

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a341/nw969/ASI.jpg

It's only those who touch down long (beyond the bump) :p who miss the high-speed and then have to come to a near halt to take the 90 left off the runway. The follow-me has got so used to certain people doing this that they tend to lurk in the entrance to the high-speed - the last time I was there in 2002 I told ATC that we'd be using the high-speed and to make sure that the follow-me wasn't blocking it....

But maybe it's become SOP to use the high speed the wrong way round now?

As for MPA, well, I'd have thought that you twin jet would have better performance then the TriShaw and would be able to turn right onto north - even in an old VC10K2 we could manage that.

Anyway, enjoy the experience - your operation seems to be getting some very positive feedback..:ok:

[Pontious]

On the contrary, BEagle, we elect to use the 90 degree turn off because the 'Follow Me' is usually parked on 'B'. After successfully catching the 'hump' & maximising efficient braking we prefer to follow the 'Follow Me'.... instead of 'jumping on the brakes' & risking running into the damn thing.

I don't know what weights you land at in the VC-10 however I think the B763 wields a little more inertia but I do know that as a private company we PAY for our spares, such as brakes, ... instead of letting the tax payer foot the bill, so we maximise their utility & efficiency.

It's a pity your photo doesn't show the downslope on '13'. There is no rule that states we must use the RET that way, in fact Wideawake Tower gives us the option of exiting at 'B' or 'C' & there is no advantage to using the RET either way, it comes down to the brakes & our optimum setting is 'Autobrake 2'.

As for the departure from MPN, we just follow the SID & do as ATC advise us. As for enjoying the experience, it's fun, however I anticipate the Falklands' winter conditions are to be respected. But the 30-40 kt crosswinds we encountered so far have 'blown away the cobwebs' & I like it but it isn't anymore demanding as night NPA's into the Greek Islands or from frozen runways in the Arctic Circle or into summer 'showers' in the Caribbean.

And yes, we must be doing something right- we've just been asked to take on the BZZ-EID 3x weekly run.

Happy Days!!
:ok:

[BEagle]

The follow-me is only there out of habit - you can always ask for it to get out of the way!

I still can't accept that braking almost to walking pace in order to take the 90 left will require less effort than braking as necessary to take the high-speed.

It was designed for that purpose.

And you're welcome to flying drunken oiks in and out of Asbestos, Argos and Domestos in the middle of the night - if the slobs I've seen being delivered to BHX are anything to go by, you and especially your flight attendants have my every sympathies!

[Nantucket Sleighride]

we've just been asked to take on the BZZ-EID 3x weekly run

well let's hope your Commercial Dept got their maths right on the payload this time :=

[farsouth]

Beagle - The Upland Goose hotel has now closed, being turned back into houses (which it was originally was).
The other hotel is the MalvinA House Hotel, not the Malvinas, named after Malvina James, daughter of a Sheep farmer there in the 1880s, Malvina being an old scottish name, and nothing to do with the Argentinian name for the islands.
Contrary to popular opinion, rainfall in the Falklands is generally lower than most of the UK

But it is definitely windy.......................................

[Pontious]

BEagle

You have to make a 90 turn whichever tactic you use but mine works just fine & I'll continue to use it but I heartedly agree about the calibre of the pax- MOD pax are gems compared to 'The Great Unwashed'. Just out of interest, are the '10's brakes steel or carbon?

Nantucket

I wasn't aware they'd got it wrong. Care to elaborate?
:ok:

[Brain Potter]

'Fraid I agree with the opposition on this one BEagle.

Taking a high speed at 30-40 kts groundspeed and then re-applying brakes to slow down for a 90 right is hardly more sensible than using gentler, longer application of brakes with reversers and exiting further down the runway. I would hazard a guess that the B767 crew use Autobrake 3 for the longer roll instead of selecting Autobrake 4 to make first exit. Moreover, the number of brake applications would be less with the "wrong-way round" technique, having significant effect on the life of carbon brakes, unlike the old steel brakes on the VC10.

[tspark]

So is this where you've been staying Pontius ?

Ascension Island Accommodation - Ascension Island Obsidian Group (http://www.obsidian.co.ac/index.html)

[BEagle]

Interesting to note the centroid of the tyre marks on the aerodrome photo I posted....

[Pontious]

I'm afraid not,Tspark.
:ok:

[Pontious]

BEagle

I think your photo may be a little dated. There's a pair of 'blisters' either side of the runway about halfway between the 90 degree left turn & the end of the runway nowadays.

I agree with one of the other posters, why such 'sceptesism' or 'criticism' of other peoples operations? Me thinks that averaging around 4.1 postings EVERY day of EVERY week of EVERY month for the last 9 1/2 years thou doth need a healthier hobby or simply to get out more.
:ok:

[BEagle]

Photo came from Google Earth, so I cannot vouch for its age.

I note from elsewhere (the discussion on the Ryanair incident at Ciampino) that the retardation effect of reverse thrust on high ratio bypass engines is less than that on coal-burning old Conways. In fact significant braking was rarely needed on most landings using full reverse on the VC10.

The explanations for using the high-speed in the reverse sense are of interest; nevertheless I find them surprising.

The personal abuse from Pontious I find irrelevant and unwarranted. And before you query the time of this post, I'm not in the UK at present.

Interesting to note how empty BHX was yesterday, although the load factor in the mainstream airline flight I was on was pretty good. So I guess that the credit crunch is starting to hit the chav-trav sector - and the military contracts must be a godsend to the likes of FlyGlobespan.

[Wycombe]

....indeed so, and I read elsewhere that they will soon be flying some others well-trodden routes ex-BZZ?

[Logistics Loader]

Seem to recall a VC10, reversing under own steam in secret Harrier base in Germany...
The pushback tug went Pete Tong !! So Vicky Capt elected to "reverse" himself out from VASF..
Awesome !!
Herc crew impressed too !!

[lurkio]

A great experience operating this route in the 747. At ASI we were told to take the 90 and come back around. We also couldn't use more than idle reverse on 1 and 4 because then they had to sweep the cinders off the runway afterwards.
Great people in both places, very hospitable. Funny to hear on the local radio in MPA the pax lists for the islander services the next day.
EID was a good experience as well until we royally annoyed the heck out of the US commander by completely smegging up his airfield twice in a week.
Everyone should have a go at these ops, interesting places, great people and it really brought it home to me that the forces guys and girls were not just 10 second soundbites on the news but living that way 24/7. Respect.

[Pontious]

Oh Perleeeese, BEagle!
No 'personal attack' was intended. But you have to admit, I wasn't the only poster to notice a certain 'tinge' of vociferous challenge, bordering stunned disbelief, to other peoples operations if they differ from your own. But credit where credit is due, an average of over 4 postings/day is some achievement.
:ok:

[dilly]

I was enjoying the delights of the airbridge earlier this week. At Ascension we saw an E-3D - anyone have any idea what it was doing so far south?

You hardly ever hear of them flying in the UK at the mo, so it was quite a suprise to see one in the middle of the Atlantic!

[Logistics Loader]

That far south...

Obvious....!!!

all birds fly south in the winter... damn sight warmer in ASI than Waddo !! lol..

8hrs route flying is far better than 8hrs on racecourse circuits...!!!

and i have seen an E3D around BZZ-LYE in recent weeks....

if i tell you the rest, i have to kill you !! lol...

[taxydual]

We had a 707 with a revolving roofrack racetracking over North Yorkshire earlier in the week. The previous day we had 2 KC10's in echelon starboard overfly. Nice to see.

Since Leeming went 'blunt', it's been very quiet around here.

Somehow, the 'sound of freedom' emanating from a Grob Tutor doesn't quite hit the mark.

Ah well, back to the liquidised food and the zimmer frame.

[HarrysHawk]

Just had a pal tell me that his mate, who works for Globespan, has been told that the company is just about all out of cash and may go under.

Hope this doesn't leave dudes down south in the lurch - probably a silly question but, does the MoD have a contingency for this sort of thing?

HH

[aw ditor]

Not according to "Airlines Airports and Routes'" See Scotsman' article dated 20th Nov.

[luvly jubbly]

We're still here Harry:mad:

[KeyPilot]

Thread has gone quiet for a while..

No news is good news? How are Globespan doing now?

[trex450]

still operating to the Falklands and they have recently taken swine flu down there

[TorqueOfTheDevil]

they have recently taken swine flu down there


Bugger! Swine flu and Falklands flu, could be a heady mix...

[Gainesy]

Cases of Swine Flu? No probs, they'll drink anything down there.


PS Whats Falklands Flu? Boredom?:confused:

[jammydonut]

About time to go back to scheduled to BA then down to El Comodoro by Aerolenas and link to Stanley.....maybe you won't need the White Card anymore !

[brit bus driver]

Once again, I see that Globespan is potentially in the poo:

BBC News - Airline says finance talks go on (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/edinburgh_and_east/8411643.stm)

Question: What plans do DTMA/DJC - or whoever it falls to these days - have in place to support the various airbridges currently operated by Globespan, in the event that they do indeed go under?

[Chidken Sangwich]

DTMA will revert back to the Operator / Broker that is the holder of the contract and they must provide an alternate solution to cover the flights at their own personal cost.

However on the FI Airbridge RAF L1011's have been rushed back onto the route when the Civil provider has been 'unavailable' in the past.

[Rigger1]

What's Falklands Flu?

Go down there and you'll find out about 2 1/2 weeks after you arrive. They even had me booked off sick when before I got there, and they were right ... to the day!

[Fosters]

Confirmed on BBC that Globespan have gone into administration.

Charter Co-ord at Andover is going to be very busy !

Fosters

[BEagle]

From the Flyglobespan web site;

Bruce Cartwright, Graham Frost and Ian Oakley-Smith at PricewaterhouseCoopers (PwC) have been appointed as joint administrators to Scottish travel firm, The Globespan Group plc and Alba Ground Handling Ltd (‘the Group’) on 16 December 2009. It is likely that other Group companies including the airline which operated as Flyglobespan will be placed into administration on 17 December 2009.

The companies entered into Administration having suffered liquidity issues.

Unfortunately, the Joint Administrators have been unable to continue trading the companies and therefore all flights operated by The Globespan Group plc or Globespan Airlines Ltd have been cancelled and the aircraft grounded.

A great pity; by all accounts Flyglobespan ran a very good operation to the Islas Malvinas.

But this just goes to highlight what a total and utter nonsense it is to use such charter airlines for scheduled military personnel moves - except, perhaps, to augment military AT during TTW.

I sincerely hope this doesn't bugger up too many peoples' Christmas - except for those who came up with such a daft scheme in the first place.

[nivsy]

Just as a point, Flyglobespan were not a charter operation from civilian airports and offered scheduled as well as seasonal (scheduled) flights on a low cost basis.

Shame they have gone under, but thats the current climate for you and probably operated as you indicated a good reliable service (unlike TriStars?) up to their demise.

[trex450]

What a shame, they have operated as reliable a service as anyone for the MOD instead of the crap 1011's. When you serve abroad, especially somewhere like the Falklands (not malvinas) a reliable airbridge is essential to morale, hopefully those there will not have to put up with long delays for too long.

[14greens]

so should we expext to see the Air atlanta jets back on the pan at Brize soon then??

[BackfromIraq]

Found out about this when I reported for my flight at 2015: they've got a job finding capacity after what BA's suicidal cabin staff voted for.

Thank charity for free internet while we wait...

[nivsy]

In the immediate short term probably find Air Italy B767 operating the airbridge.

[Pete268]

According to BBC News today:

BBC News - Flyglobespan collapse strands thousands of passengers (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/8417543.stm)

''It is understood Flyglobespan also has a contract with the Ministry of Defence (MoD) to transport troops to and from destinations such as the Falklands.
But the MoD said families in the Falklands would not be affected by the collapse as it has organised another airline to bring them back home for Christmas''.

Pete

[pigsinspace]

Operation Deny Christmas for 216?

[Lyneham Lad]

But the MoD said families in the Falklands would not be affected by the collapse as it has organised another airline to bring them back home for Christmas.

It may be that I misheard (not unusual) but the 3 o'clock news on Classic FM mentioned that the route had been given to Air Italy (http://www.airitaly.eu/site/index.php)(?).

Standing by to be corrected!

[trex450]

FlyGlobeSpan were only subcontracted to the MOD, they are saying that flights will continue with minimum disruption. I believe that the Italians are going to do the job in their place.

[Captain Lampshade]

Can anybody pm a contact number for the charter co-ordinator in Andover?

[Hairbus]

Bring back Air Atlanta 747 classics:ok:

[STN Ramp Rat]

Operation Deny Christmas for 216?

I believe the flight arrived early in BZZ today. not bad considering the notice that everyone had of the GSM bankrupcy.

[Dan Winterland]

Quote: ''It is understood Flyglobespan also has a contract with the Ministry of Defence (MoD) to transport troops to and from destinations such as the Falklands. But the MoD said families in the Falklands would not be affected by the collapse as it has organised another airline to bring them back home for Christmas''.

http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb73/dbchippy/1022657.jpg

[brit bus driver]

It'll still look modern against most of the tat at Brize!!

[Finger Poking]

Does anyone know who is doing the Airbridge this week?

I heard it was Al Italia (?) Last week after the sudden demise of Flyglobespan.

Who is in the Frame to be getting the contract semi-perm ?

Bring on Dickie Branson !!! Now that would be nice.

[BEagle]

Virgin Atlantic had the contract in 1984 - the 747 was a relatively unusual sight at Brize at the time. A temporary expedient until the 'new' TriStar service began.

Back then, aerodrome driving regulations were far less nanny-state; unfortunately that resulted in various rubberneckers driving around the ASP gawping at Virgin's jet. So the Stn Cdr of the day (none too popular) banned the commonsense rules of the day and started a rot which got progressively worse with time....:mad:

[[email protected]]

As ever the communication from the MoD is deafening in it's silence - we have to ring up BZN on Christmas Eve to find out if we are going on Boxing Day or the 27th and we had to pester them to get that information:ugh:

[Gainesy]

Are you manning the Griffens Crab? Whatever, have a good a Christmas as possible.:ok:

[Idle Reverse]

I don't suppose that AAI will bring back one of their 747s for the Airbridge as they seem pretty busy right now working with Saudi Arabian airlines in Jeddah . . . . . but they were extremely popular when they were doing the MoD flights. The spare capacity meant that the mail never failed to get down there to the troops.

But if the planners are reading this then give AAI a call :ok:

[trex450]

AAI already in the frame for New Year's eve I heard

[wx girl]

Air Tahiti Nui until early Jan then Titon until May.

[Lima Juliet]

BRING IT ON!!!

http://www.eletta.com.au/images/our_worK/New/largeimgs/Air-Tahiti-Portrait.jpg

There'll be plenty of volunteers for the QRA plot then!

[Chainkicker]

Flying to paradise?? 3 times a week??

Cant say ive heard MPN called that before :ok:

[Idle Reverse]

Hi there wx girl, do you mean Titan rather than Titon ?

[[email protected]]

It is a Portugese outfit called HiFly at the moment using A340 - decent enough hosties and first class and business sections although the audio/visual facilities were a bit patchy. They are flying the route until New Years day definitely but don't know if it will be them on permanent contract - unlikely I suspect.

[Bigt]

Titan have just aquired a 767

[Timmyflyer]

bmi could be back in the frame for a spell...as they have a couple of A330's doing nothing for a while.
They did it about 5-6yrs ago for 3mnths...so watch this space.

A Happy new year to all readers...

[K.Whyjelly]

bmi could be back in the frame

You could be correct Timmy.................just had an e-mail from the company requesting pilots to register their interest. Provisionally running mid Jan to the end of Feb

[Kengineer-130]

Why the RAF does not just buy a few 747's I don't know, great reliability, massive capacity, lots of operators so easy procurement of spares.... get rid of quite a few problems into non-combat areas, and even possibly modifications to make it self-defense capable? Sure the americans have one for some important bloke that has bangy bits on it? :ugh::ugh::ugh: But as usual we are farming jobs out to anyone and everyone with little thought of the potential implications.

Saying that, for my MPA tour I flew on the 747 AAI , the -200 and -300, both very nice to fly on with good crew :ok:, that would be my choice of contractor in the current situation, a company with experience of the route and military ops.

[Kilonovember52]

Posted at 03:15 on 06 January, 2010 UTC
French Polynesia’s flag carrier has signed a deal with the British army to fly soldiers from England to the Falkland Islands in the South Atlantic.
The head of Air Tahiti Nui, Christian Vernaudon, says one of its Airbus planes with its crew has been leased to fly the military personnel this month.
He has told local radio in Tahiti that this type of activity is possible because the airline has five Airbus planes at its disposal.
Mr Vernaudon says contracts of this type have already been signed worth almost 10 million US dollars.
News Content © Radio New Zealand International
PO Box 123, Wellington, New Zealand

[brit bus driver]

Right, here's a novel idea.....

Air Tahiti using A330s I assume?

RAF to start operating A330s circa 2014 (I know, call me an optimist....)

Can anyone see the synergy yet.....

I recall the Ozzies had a similar deal with QF prior to the A330 tankers coming into service. Surely it would not be beyond the whit of man to arrange some form of secondment to Air Tahiti (on the MPA route only!)?

Obviously the bloody obvious solution of purchasing/leasing a couple of A330s to be operated by RAF crews was far too tricky. I mean, there should be a multitude of multi drivers kicking around with the demise of the kipper fleet?

[ewaste]

Could be A340-300's, seems like a good option considering the long over water flight legs and the very changeable weather in the South Atlantic.


Air Tahiti confirms MOD contract for Falklands’ airbridge — MercoPress (http://en.mercopress.com/2010/01/06/air-tahiti-confirms-mod-contract-for-falklands-airbridge)

[cosmiccomet]

Guys, I would like to know if there was an airbridge using C-130 between Ascencion and the Bristish Task Force during the war in 1982.

In an Argentinian Forum we are wondering how come they fly so long from Ascencion (?) and back.
At that moment they were using air refuling in the C-130s???

[d192049d]

Had the pleasure of making the trip from Stanley to Acension in a C130 to pick up the VC10....which then went via Dakar to Brize. September 10th 1982.....remember it well...didnt care a jot that we sat on webbed seats for however many hours it was given that I spent the last 6 months in a tent...just glad to be going home to Mom.

Always remember that blast of warm air when the ramp lowered at Acension...oh joy!

[dionysius]

Long old day yesterday for the punters going down south as the Air Tahiti A330 had diverted into BHX earlier in the week and BZZ was still closed yesterday so pax/bags/wpns/mail had to be moved by road to BHX.

Unfortunately the airport security officials would not let the baggage vehicles go direct to the a/c so all the bags/mail/wpns had to be lined up outside the terminal and the pax had to claim their bags and take them to check-in.:confused:

[zedder]

Did they need the weapons to get through Solihull safely?;)

[Data-Lynx]

Air Tahiti is to do tomorrow and Wednesday with UK flagged Titan (http://www.titan-airways.co.uk/)to fly the 17th January. I wonder who is next?

[[email protected]]

Apparently there was a big pile of baggage and weapons, all of which had to be reclaimed by the owners who then had less than 90 mins to get checked in, pass through security and get to the gate as the crews duty time was rapidly expiring.

After the normal 17 hour journey to MPA, they were struck by lightning on finals and then had to endure a further 90 mins on the aircraft on dispersal because the movers decided to prioritise the unloading of the LAN Chile flight which landed 20 mins AFTER the airbridge - utter genius movers well done!!!

However it departed at 0400 local on its way to ASI so some happy faces in the end.

[anyoftheabove]

Does anyone know what is happening with tonights flight, absolutely no info available from Brize

[Nomorefreetime]

Enough movers in MPN to handle 1 aircraft at a time (in this crazy world of SOP's). Movers do work under other peoples instructions sometimes.

LanChillie on a 60min stop over and at its scheduled time.
Airbridge on a 20 Hour? stopover and outside its arrival time.

Its not hard to work out the priority.

[formertonkaplum]

Well, I would blame the movers.... There to work for the RAF not the dodgy random Civi's. Make them sit and wait.

Movers; they do like self importance.

For instance.... Including the Chillie flight, they have 3.... a total of 3..... flights a week to look after. If your flying BA / Easyjet or any UK carrier you can check in up to an hour before your flight and hand your bags in at the same time.

MPA = Bags in and check in the day before you fly, rendering you with no kit until you get out of MPA.

I know some high horse 'Flying Stacker' will retort with some 'self importance'; because you always do to try and justify yourselves.......



P.S. Coming back V.Soon...... Anyone know who I'll be flying down with in Feb to MPA ?

[Bigfoot]

Can anyone advise, who has the falklands airbridge contract? I appreciate Air tahiti has it at present. Has titan secured the long term contract?

[trex450]

I understand that Titan have the contract from next weekend but have been brought in a flight early due to the backlog. Maybe a snow plough at Brize would be a thought!

[Fosters]

Understand a BMI (British Midland) A330 is positioning in tonight. Operating tonights flight ?

Fosters

[Lomon]

"
After the normal 17 hour journey to MPA, they were struck by lightning on finals and then had to endure a further 90 mins on the aircraft on dispersal because the movers decided to prioritise the unloading of the LAN Chaile flight which landed 20 mins AFTER the airbridge - utter genius movers well done!!!"

Not defending the movers, but which makes more sense, let 50 or so civvies from south america mingle in the terminal with the 200+ military pax that arrived on the A340 from the UK, or keep the 200 passengers in the frame on the ASP and get the chile pax off the station, then let the Air Tahiti passengers off, with their 50kgs of luggage which would take more time.

I can see the logic behind the way it was done, but can understand the frustrations of the military personnel who were further delayed.

The Lan Chile flight arrives at the same time every week, how easy would it have been for UK MAMS to have avoided the issue in the first place by scheduling the UK departure time so that the airbridge wouldn't conflict with the one scheduled international civvie flight per week?

[Fosters]

UK MAMs (Now known as 1AMW) don't schedule flights. I believe some folk in Andover are responsible for that.

Even if they had rev itined it to say two hours later there is no guarantee that sods law would not have come into play and the LAN got delayed by two hours as well !

Fosters

[November4]

Yep all the movers fault - nothing to do with Ops who actually accept the flight, nothing to do with Group who would have been advised that there was a flow clash...?

Enough facilities to handle 1 flight at a time so if one lands first then that get handled first. Plus as Nomorefreetime said, one was a QTR and one was on a 20 hours stop over...

But then "it is our terminal and we should get priority"

they do like self importance

[Gainesy]

Just out of interest what is the LAN aircraft and where is it from/to (sounds Cornish does that boy)?

[trex450]

An A319 usually to and from Punta Arenas but its day starts in Santiago early and ends around midnight. With the movers on this one, they got the priorities right for all apart from for those paying for their flights on the airbridge.

[Gainesy]

Thank you Trex.:)

[cornish-stormrider]

Gainsey, I can get you your passport. Be prepared for manly drinking and consumption of pasties.
Tis a properjob Tis, jus whut we'em lookin fer. Ansom

[November4]

airpolice - are you implying that with the flight being delayed that there will be a flow clash with this one and the LAN flight again?

If so then what a brilliant idea that has been - accepted that the flight has been delayed for whatever reason but then to resched to make a flow clash...?

Yep - Movers fault again

[brit bus driver]

When advised of a 'flow clash', the only prudent action is to keep calm and carry on as planned. No other bugger's going to be on time, so you have now removed all chance of a flow clash later in the day when the other mate's delayed too!:ok:

Oh, and Gp have nowt to do with it....'tis all DTMA's bailiwick (haven't used that word since my last point brief some years ago). Anyhow, surely you can just ACARS to find out the conflicting traffic's ETA...:hmm:

[TorqueOfTheDevil]

Tomorrow's (should I say Thursday's) airbridge will need to be delayed quite a lot more than 6 hours to clash with the LAN Chile flight...

[30AB-JK]

I have a nice 744-412 White Tail doing nothing that’s begging for an ACMI Job :ok: – It just needs a stamp here and there, a Full Crew and the Owner’s to realise It’s worth rather than languishing here in the Plaines Centrales :rolleyes: :ugh:

[CONSTELLATION1]

Hear this morning that Air Seychelles are about to sign agreement with MOD to take over from Air Tahiti Nui at end Feb 2010.

[[email protected]]

Re the cockup at MPA - the movers defence was that the outbound LANChile pax were already in the terminal and there wasn't enough room in there for the incoming airbridge pax - that sounds fair but since after 90 mins of extra fu**about the airbridge pax were disembarked straight into the terminal anyway but just kept in the carousel area it doesn't seem so sound a decision.

As for missing slot times - we are talking MPA to Chile not eurocontrol for LHR to Paris - not really much conflicting traffic out here.

And the sympathetic answer of let those who are late keep late ignores the fact that the delay had nothing to do with the poor pax - would delaying the LAN Chile flight really have caused much of a problem? I don't think so.

[Nomorefreetime]

Last time I was down south. The Lan flight had to adhere to strict CAA rules, regarding Pax control blah blah blah. The MOD Charter enjoyed relaxed MOD regulations. When Aircraft are on the ground especially Civies ,certain areas of the terminal are controlled by FI Customs and what they say tends to be obeyed.
While you whinge about a 90 min delay, spare a thought for all those involved with running the Herrick Airbridge and the poor pax hanging around at both ends for sometimes days
Again the Mover's are to blame...why? Who else is there.

[Idle Reverse]

Well I guess it looks as if the airbridge contract(s) is virtually sorted then ? Shame it's not the Air Atlanta boys and girls with their 747. Whatever other jet they put on they won't be able to give the spare capacity that the old 74 always had. And speaking of spare capacity, I hear that AAI do have a couple of airframes ( and crews ) available right now. Give the long term contract to them I say. :ok:

[Dual ground]

As for missing slot times - we are talking MPA to Chile not eurocontrol for LHR to Paris - not really much conflicting traffic out here.Maybe their arrival slot was the issue, as opposed to the departure?

[Data-Lynx]

Further to Constellation1 last week, a weekend report (http://www.sartma.com/art_7286.html)notes that the last cycle for Air Tahiti Nui will start with this Wednesday's departure from BZN. The Sunday 24 Jan 10 departure and subsequent flights until 30 Sep 10 have been contracted to the brokers for Air Seychelles (http://www.airseychelles.co.uk/flightinfo/cie.html) which may offer one of their five Extended Range 767-300s.

[pwwuk]

IF the civi contractor has a few more 'comfortable' seats towards the front .. who gets to 'relax' en-route ?

[Lomon]

"Who gets the comfy seats up front"

Well, although they were assigned to mil personnel on the last airbridge, the Air Tahiti crew threw their teddies out of the cot as they 'needed' them, so everyone got bumped back a row.

The inflight entertainment on the first leg consisted of a low budget French film with English subtitles, with the audio piped through the PA so you had no choice but to hear it even if all you wanted was to sleep.

[formertonkaplum]

Who now is doing the routine run ?

[Laarbruch72]

Air Seychelles for now, possibly until September. Another company has lodged a complaint (something involving whether it's been tendered fairly) but the Seychelles crew are confident that it's a done deal until late in the year.

[Jimlad1]

Just emerged from the latest run - planes are very tired and very uncomfortable seating too. Not hugely impressed at needing to check bags in 24 hours early for no good reason - particularly when mil pax on previous flight didnt have to do so. Everyone down there is embarrassed at the need for 24 hour check in, so why is it still going on?

Glad I'm not flying to MPA regularly as the planes are old, cold and very tired inside.

[Nomorefreetime]

I first went down South in 2000 on a Mil flight. Check in for return was 24 hours before. Before you blame the Movers, this is a HQ directive.
There are plenty of good reasons behind this. ZFW, pax turning up late as they have been busy welcoming their replacements the night before, at the end of the day, whats 24 hours. You've just completed the safest 4/6 months you will get nowadays. There will be an aircraft with a better servicabilty rate to get you home. Lots of spare seats for your hand baggage.
Try to experience the whole herrick run to one of the outstations, then moan about 24 hours....

[Data-Lynx]

Nomorefree. I think it is a bit more complicated. Sitting on the MPA pan in the Air Seychelles 767-300-ER for flight RR3211 (Tuesday 9 Feb 10), the pilot apologised to the self loading luggage, including CBF, that engine start was delayed because someone had mislaid the flight plan. The one other civilian movement that morning had been a BAS Dash 8, probably heading to McMurdo Station, but this should not have offered grounds for confusion as it had just departed. We eventually lifted at 1045 local which means baggage had been in the system for just under 27 hours before take-off.

We used the time profitably, discussing the various recent battlefield tours and visits and it soon became clear that you could compare and contrast
the Bodie Creek Suspension Bridge (http://web.bethere.co.uk/BodieCreekBridge/BCB_02seen.html), just south of Goose Green, with the Airbridge. Both were recognised on the island as the most southerly examples of their type, they had seen better days in enabling people and kit to move between distant points and had both become anachronisms. Indifference, neglect and an unwillingness to protect investment dogged each enterprise and both had been condemned.

In contrast however, while the bridge was unsafe and another road had bypassed it around Bodie Creek, the airbridge is completely safe and enjoys a new contractor who is trying hard to establish itself. It has a Seychelles crew to live in ASI warmth and cover the southern route while a Brit crew covers the colder northern route. May I also commend the 1st Officer who landed v smoothly at BZZ; this lass was seriously better than the bloke landing at ASI.

For HQBFSAI, it is the organisation that is condemned - by its passengers - and especially after the latest fiasco. They stated that free seating was being imposed. At ASI, this meant that after "1st on" selections such as the Albert crew, the old and the children had taken their seats, 150 weary but fit military staff almost ran across the pan to both sets of steps to get better seats than they had on the first leg. The less mobile, including one delightful mature couple who had indulged to see family in MPA and did not want special treatment, found that their seats had been filled and in fact they could not even sit together. Two passengers who had dared to settle in the 'pearl service' front seats were turfed out by the hierachy and left wandering up and down the aisles trying to find somewhere to sit. One stewardess searched all the overhead containers to stow a daysack and had to wedge it behind a 'pearl' seat. It was left to the TA, as teachers and policemen etc who are used to providing the public with a service, to swap seats and get the old couple together.

This is systemic failure that should not be laid just at the movers door. ASI's DAMO for instance was working her butt off to sort out the mess. In MPA, casual decision making across the years has become lore, not fact. I have had CAA regs quoted at me to explain why you have to appear with luggage and hand baggage 24 hours+ before flight. Nothing is done with hand baggage and it isn't weighed for the obvious reason that it is taken away again. The ticket machine is not coded to reflect the seating in the aircraft so it is merely a numbering device. This is simple configuration and rather disappointing as many of the previous carriers have used 767s. Volume is controlled by the number of seats in the departure 'lounge' when there is more space in the arrivals section as well. MPA could not possibly do both together so collapsible seats perhaps? We have taken on a more reliable carrier who is being paid to fly an aircraft at less than maximum capacity, especially in these cash-strapped times. My colleagues in the CAA have poured scorn on these amateur attempts at flight management and point the finger at the budget holder - who happens to be an Air Marshall. Time for change!

For Swampy. I hope it was not your wife's parents who were inconvenienced at ASI; no one deserves that for their family and they may be too embarassed to complain. I suspect you may have already had the OK from your new Navy Boss to shake the system as you intend. Best of Luck.

[brit bus driver]

this lass was seriously better than the bloke landing at ASI

Have you ever tried landing at ASI? In an airliner?

Thought not.

[Nomorefreetime]

Data-Lynx

You have hit the nail on the head....BFSAI has been run in the past (maybe still is) as an Officers / Civ Servants club.
My 2nd tour 2006 (I have done 4 sandy ones as well) was in the little window where you come to get your flights home booked. I wasn't too involved in the politics of the 'who gets what seat', believe me It used to change upto shut out due to the people above getting a rant on as to who had the best seat. I had calls during the night from Civ Serv's who's wives were given the wrong seat out of Brize, demanding that I changed them. Another time they gave all the seats to all the OFR's / Equiv and had a few spare seats for WO's, only to get the call from WO Smith stating he was senior to WO Jones and wanted it changed.
I have had 2 great tours down south and meet a lot of great people from all 3 services. The politics that go with that place are unbelievable, I'm glad someone else has noted where the faults are.

[Jimlad1]

Just to back up Datas superb points, I was on the same flight as him (no idea who he/she is though) and would support all his points.

It was a bloody farce listening to the reason for our late departure being the loss of a flight plan, and the updates about how it had been lost then found. Particularly so when a lot of fairly senior staff were on the plan (including CBFSAI) - what sort of image does this present of the RAF to a senior tri-service audience?

The landing at ASI - I'm not a pilot, but it was probably the roughest landing I've ever seen, in and out of an Operational theatre - if there's a reason for it, it would be great if the pros here could explain why in laymans terms?

As for the seating - there was a clear tannoy at MPA saying "you'll keep your seats at ASI" - at ASI it was every person for themselves - total chaos and a lot of hacked off, very tired people dealing with the failure of communication at some point in the chain.

This isn't a grip at individuals, but corporately it shows the RAF in a less than professional way, and that was unfortunate and easily avoidable.

[Nomorefreetime]

Ref landing at ASI

I'm no pilot, but anyone who lands an aircraft on the up slope of hill, unable to see the end of the runway gets my applause everytime.

[BEagle]

Assuming you consider the VC10 to be 'an airliner', I've landed them several times at ASI and it isn't difficult. In fact it's really dead easy as the wind is always predictable and the cloudbase is usually benign. Day or night.

But I've also suffered controlled crashes, followed by very firm braking to take the wrong exit of the high-speed turn off at the hands of DeathStar drivers. On one occasion I was perched in the jump seat and all seemed to be going fine until the AP was disengaged, then it was all audio alarms and frantic arm wrestling, followed by an almighty thump. "Almost impossible to predict where you're going to touch down in one of these", was the comment.....:hmm:

One hopes that CBSFAI will 'ask' his blue-suit chums why such an utter goat is at large on the Malvinas shuttle these days....:suspect:

[Arty Fufkin]

Beagle,

Don't criticise what you don't understand. Of course it's easier in a light aircraft................ such as a VC10.

[Farfrompuken]

BEags,

The TriMotor is NOT an easy a/c to land smoothly 100% of the time. The undercarriage config doesn't help, which I think is different on the VC10.

As arty says, don't comment on what you don't know. It makes you look stupid.

[taxydual]

To be fair to Beags, he was only repeating the comments of the Tri* drivers.

[brit bus driver]

going fine until the AP was disengaged, then it was all audio alarms and frantic arm wrestling,

To be honest BEags old chum, you really do show yourself up to be an ar$e at times. The "audio alarms" would be the A/P disconnect warning. The "frantic arm wrestling" would doubtlessly be a couple or 3 inputs of trim on the thumbwheel to counter the designed in nose up trim (<1500R or do I forget - I'm sure someone will remind me). Oh yes, and you've been up since 0730 the previous morning - so just the 24 hrs - the sun's right where you don't want it to be, off a VOR approach to an appreciable upslope that you certainly don't want to land on the wrong side of. And you still weigh more than the max AUW of a VC10. Yes, I've smacked it in at ASI - and many other places beside - but then I guess we can't all be as perfect as you.

[BEagle]

I'm intrigued that the TriShaw should be such a handful to land... Others have said it takes practice, but the general opinion seems contrary to that - although back when I often travelled in a TriStar on holiday, landings were never of the ASI bone-jarring type. Perhaps the charter holiday people flew a different variant?

Thanks for the insults, your rude so-and-sos. Quite unnecessary.

In an epic article in 'Coastal Clues', George Morris once described the activity of a TriShaw crew in the descent as 'rather like a Buddhist prayer meeting - lots of chanting and gongs'...:\

Anyway, I hope that the Malvinas shuttle is soon sorted out.

[BEagle]

Thanks for the explanation!

George's comment came in the early days of 'CRM' and against a background of Nimrod flying. All the 'call-outs', height alerters and other audio were new to him - hence the amusing simile.

Nothing against the TriShaw or its crews. In fact I once went into bat for one crew at MPA - 'inexpert' observers had said that a TriStar had flown an unstable approach onto the easterly ("I thought it was going to crash....:rolleyes:") and some Wg Cdr wanted to hold an enquiry....:hmm: Wading through the tape transcripts etc, apart from getting low on the GS after rather a rushed feed in, nothing seemed particularly unusual - and we all know how tricky the wind was at MPA, so a twitch on late final was hardly surprising. Anyway, I persuaded the fellow that there wasn't anything to investigate - apart, perhaps from the less than perfect radar feed in (which was surprising as MPA ATC was normally excellent). So he got back into his box and that was the end of it.

[Arty Fufkin]

Speaking personaly Beagle,
It was just a bit of banter:), no offence intended.

Personaly, I'd rather have a firmer than usual touchdown (big jets should always be landed in a no-nonsense manner) before the ASI hump, than be desperately searching for the tarmac on the downslope after the hump. Arse twitching like a rabbit's nose springs to mind!:uhoh:

PS, Brit Bus Driver, all sounds horribly familiar!! Just to be a technical pedant, the nose up trim is wound on below 1500' in Autoland only, hence not at ASI. I'll get my coat.