First Choice - drunk punter tries to leg it at FL350

[Taildragger67]

Passenger tries for exit - 35,000 ft in the air (http://www.smh.com.au/news/news/passenger-tries-for-exit--35000-ft-in-the-air/2008/07/18/1216163114199.html)


An allegedly drunken passenger has attempted to open an exit door of a Boeing 767 while the plane was 35,000 feet in the air.

The man was abusive to passengers and staff on the First Choice flight from Gatwick to Cuba before lunging at the door in an attempt to lift the handle.

The pilot had to make an emergency diversion to Bermuda airport where police boarded the plane and led the passenger away.

Police in Bermuda said the man had not been charged but was "under security watch" at a hotel and could face charges in the UK.

Dominic Carmen, one of the 257 passengers on board said the man appeared to have been drinking before the flight took off and the pilot had told passengers who were drinking duty free they had brought with them to stop before the incident occurred.

A spokesman for First Choice said the incident was still being investigated.

[b747 flightboy]

Guess he'll be their last choice of pax next time..:=

[Phil1980's]

All that fuel Wasted! Or was it going towards the carribean?

[HarryMann]

Drinking like this seems to be an epidemic now... either borderline or real alcoholics, or some quasi-mental condition IMHO.
Last night at the 02 Dome Leonard Cohen concert, we had trouble right next to us with a drunken Irishman being noisy and waving hands about... but more importantly, with 20,000 people in a tight seated concert-hall, why do they allow/envourage/serve alcohol and take-aways all through the concert - a constant and very annoying stream of twenty/thirty somethings push past and line the steep stairs the whole time... so many today either cannot hold their bladders or cannot sit for more than 25 minutes without yet another pint of Europiss lager or vodka paintstripper. Can't imagine what their waterworks will be like when they get to 50 or so.. but the 'wrinklies' as they're called, seem to enjoy a glass of wine or beer and sit through till the interval - maybe potty trained better?

Not a plane I know, but certainly Londoners seem to have completely lost it (and the Dome Management and Health & Safety Inspectors too, bowing to the take-aways and booze bars that litter the place).

Since now being termed a medical ailment, rather than an addiction, quasi-alcoholism seems to have become a badge to be proud of... displayed at every opportunity! :=

[411A]

Rhodos, circa, 1998.
Four broads enter the cabin and sit themselves toward the rear.
Much consternation from CC follows as these broads appear to have had a few too many, and the Captain (yours truly) is asked to intervene.
I do so.
I tell 'em...'either you behave yourselves, or you will be arrested by the security at the door.'
They decline.

They may still be in the pokey, as they were dragged kicking and screaming down the boarding stairs.

This Commander will put up with none of this nonsense...and the company backs me up...every time.
No exceptions.
None, nada, zip.

Treat passengers with respect...however, it is definitely a two way street.
Pax misbehave...color 'em gone...prior to departure.
Otherwise, we have on board the appropriate security measures, and they just might not be pleasant.

[MMENCLLBAMAN]

Flame me if you will, but I have a question!

Is it possible to open the door when the aircraft is pressurised and at such an altitude. We have all seen it in films but a CC friend of mine told me not the case.

[glad rag]

Depend on door design.
Very, very unlikely to open against press differential if it's an "internal" door being pushed against a'frame by cabin pressure. Unlike some large cargo doors.

[757_Driver]

Is it possible to open the door when the aircraft is pressurised and at such an altitude. We have all seen it in films but a CC friend of mine told me not the case.

Nope.
The door is not locked or anything, however at FL350 typical pressure differential between outside and inside is about 7 PSI.
say the typical aircraft door is about 3 ft wide by 7 feet tall - thats 21 sq ft or 3000 odd square inches.
with 7 lbs or air pressure leaning on each one of those 3000 squares, there is the best part of 21000 lbs 'leaning' on that door - call it 10 metric tonnes.
Its a 'plug' door , so to open it you need to move it inward against that weight - Kinda difficult to pry that open in flight!

[pattern_is_full]

make sure you book a football (Soccer in the US) team on every flight....

OKLAHOMA CITY (AP) -- An American Airlines flight from Boston to Los Angeles was diverted to Oklahoma City on Friday after a passenger stripped nude and later tried to open an emergency exit door before being subdued by members of a professional soccer team and others, the FBI said.
Members of the New England Revolution Major League Soccer team were among those who grabbed the passenger near an exit door, FBI spokesman Gary Johnson said. Tie wraps were placed on the man, whose name was not immediately released. He was taken into custody in Oklahoma City and placed under psychiatric evaluation, Johnson said.
American Flight 725, a Boeing 757, arrived in Oklahoma City at 1:35 p.m. CDT and was back in the air an hour later, said American Airlines spokesman Tim Smith. It landed without further incident at Los Angeles International Airport at 3:13 p.m. PDT.

[Load Toad]

What I don't understand in these cases is why people are not charged? Or at least arrested and confined to a police lock up or such pending investigation. If you are drunk, endangering the 'plane, passengers and crew, abusive, rude, aggressive, violent...what more do you need to do to get cuffed and put in a cell....?

[757_Driver]

yes it would be better to charge them - and in many countries they would be, however Its probably punishment enought that this guy is racking up huge hotel bills in bermuda and will probably have to come home on a boat! - AFAIK only BA fly back from bermuda, and are not likely to take him after this

[mrpinks]

If you are drunk blah blah blah
who sells them the alcohol in the first place? lets them on the plane, continues to sell them the alcohol, grow up accept some responsibility.

[Load Toad]

If you can't be responsible for your own actions you have two excuses - being a child or being mentally retarded. Stop blaming the availability of something for lack of personal responsibility.

[Mark in CA]

Maybe it's a matter of no harm, no foul. If someone just gets blitzed and makes a fool of him or herself, then the mere inconvenience and expense of being taken off the plane is enough. But if they injure someone, truly endanger the flight or cause other damage, then they get charged. Who knows?

[NZScion]

If you are drunk blah blah blah
who sells them the alcohol in the first place? lets them on the plane, continues to sell them the alcohol, grow up accept some responsibility.

It's great that you can point the finger at cabin crew so easily! Unfortunately in the real world it is often alcohol brought on to the aircraft purchased duty free in the terminal outside of the view of airline staff, then consumed clandestinely in flight, compounded by the effects of altitude.

[Load Toad]

If someone just gets blitzed and makes a fool of him or herself, then the mere inconvenience and expense of being taken off the plane is enough.

Do you think it's free to just land the 'plane at an airport? What about the 'inconvenience' to everyone else on the flight, staff, passengers, people trying to make connections, meeting family, doing business where they land....

If you are drunk blah blah blah who sells them the alcohol in the first place?

They could have easily had enough prior to take off or before they even checked in (never mind carrying on in th' 'plane) - it's how they handle any alcohol and what respect they show to others irrespective of what they've drunk that is the issue.

[Rainboe]

pattern, I think the thin air of cabins can make some people temporarily doolally. We had a lady in her 60s calmly go to the washroom of a 737, and walk out stark naked in a confused state. In some of these cases, if the situation is contained, I can't understand why there is a need to divert. The person could be wrapped, or told to go back and get dressed 'as it's a bit cold', and one of the crew could be assigned to attend closely to the person. Yet I have seen airrage incidents where the passenger is cuffed and contained, and a diversion still takes place. I don't see it justified.

[aviatordom]

Lol, i saw a Daily Mail News article on this story....

It said the a/c was at FL500 and they had a photo of a 757!!!!!!!!!

[VAFFPAX]

Aircraft doors are precisely engineered the way they are for this exact reason. If any of the mechanics should fail, the air pressure differential holds it together.

But I do know that a South African airline had one of its passengers open an emergency exit because 'he was hot'. Of course, the flight was cancelled and the passenger escorted away.

S.

[harry the cod]

aviatordom

That must have been the one with the retrofitted winglets then. Improves the performance apparently! ;)

Harry

[Load Toad]

BBC NEWS | UK | Women try to open door mid-flight (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/7527058.stm)

Only when the criminals who get drunk and endanger and abuse other passengers and crew pay the full price for their deeds will this issue start to be addressed. The full price being paying the full cost of the diversion and all associated costs and some time alone to dwell upon their actions.

[Mr Quite Happy]

I’m slightly confused, which is of course a big step forwards from my normal state…

Lets say I’m on the emergency exit row… The door over the wing. The diagram pretty specifically shows me that if I pull the cover off, pull the lever down I can then pull the door towards me and then chuck it out the ‘window’.
How is that emergency door held in place by air pressure at 35,000 ft? Because the pressure is on the inside pushing out. But whats to stop me doing this, as, say we climb to 200ft with the runway still below?

Also, my ex girlfriend (nightmare) was on a Guatamala to UK flight, in the early 80’s, I assume BA has her dad was FCO and the front left door opened, she showed me the newspaper clipping so on this occasion she was not in a fantasy land lying her little brain out so how could that happen (given the air pressure). I believe it was a 747.

I thought, stupidly, that the “cabin doors to cross check” (or similar?) was about checking the arming of the door’s locks?

Lastly, I’ll just state it hear and now.. Any of you freaks planning on opening a door whilst I am on the flight will get the famous “Mr Quite Happy choke hold” so fast it’ll make your head spin followed by the Mr Quite Happy “method of incapacitation vs knee caps” whilst you sleep. Nobody will be walking you off my plane once we’ve diverted.

[Spotthedog]

So why then, if the doors can't physically be opened in flight due to the pressure differential, does the plane have to make a precautionary diversion/landing if someone tries such a thing .. as seems to be the implication from the original report?

Is it to avoid mass hysteria developing because most other passengers don't realise the doors can't be opened at altitude having seen too many technically inaccurate air disaster/thriller movies?

Maybe the two things - pax attempts to open the door at 35k' and the captain's decision to divert - are not linked at all.

[Globaliser]

Probably just a case of "the sooner that idiot punter is off the aircraft, the better".

[Spotthedog]

Yer but no but, I take your point but passengers have been known to do far worse things than simply try to open an impossible-to-open door without the crew feeling the need to take a really really expensive step (both in cost and airline reputation) such as a diversion. I guess there are some first time fliers who may be disorientated and not realise what they are doing when they try to open an external door not meaning to cause a threat. Would a plane divert under these cricumstances?

What actually happens if someone at 35k' tries to shift the door handle to the open position and they are not detected for a moment or two?? Just curious really.

Surely there must be more to it than just wanting to get an idiot off the plane which would be welcome I'm sure. Suspect we dont have the full facts about his behaviour.

[Globaliser]

Surely there must be more to it than just wanting to get an idiot off the plane which would be welcome I'm sure. Suspect we dont have the full facts about his behaviour.He was drunk, he was abusive, he was continuing to drink after a warning, then he tries to open a door.

The women in the BBC story were also drunk, abusive and needed to be restrained until after landing.

I mean, just how much more do you need before you decide that these passengers are a menace that need to be offloaded after diverting?