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View Full Version : UK Airline to have disappeared....07/08


transwede
23rd Jun 2008, 15:57
Just a general discussion on UK airlines which have disappeared from our skies during the past 12 months, the why's, will we miss them or was the business just not up to scratch??

GB Airways - did BA make a mistake in selling franchise, certainly they had a good route network and a healthy reputation.

UKIA - route wise, potentially quite lucrative, management too dodgy?

Flyjet - IMHO there is room for a small independant charter carrier, however did their aircraft let them down, certainly in NCL flyjet was associated with delays, but rumours had it they did actually make a profit!

Silverjet - very recent, is the industry just not ready for this type of carrier?

Air Wales - were they in the past year?

Discussion open...................................;)

LGS6753
23rd Jun 2008, 16:28
I understand that GB airways was sold by Bland and not BA. They were a BA franchisee. As with Loganair, BA have decided against the franchise model (for now, at least).

Flyjet was actually purchased by Silverjet, and later SJ closed the charter (FJE) operation.

UKIA was never going to work - wrong management, wrong routes, business model fundamentally flawed.

Euromanx also failed.

revo
23rd Jun 2008, 17:53
Mytravel have disappeared as Thomas Cook have completely absorbed them.

flowy50
23rd Jun 2008, 17:54
air wales nearly 18 months now

rolibkk
23rd Jun 2008, 19:01
Who is going to be next?

- Jet2?
- FlyBe?
- Ryan?
- Manx2?
- Blue Islands?

easyJet Galley King
23rd Jun 2008, 19:07
Who is going to be next?

- Jet2?
- FlyBe?
- Ryan?
- Manx2?
- Blue Islands?

BMI Baby me thinks

RVF750
23rd Jun 2008, 19:32
With their breakeven fuel costs as high as they claim, I suspect Flybe are likely to be "last man standing" if the costs keep on rising. JET2 and BMI baby are the most likely candidate though.

EI-BUD
23rd Jun 2008, 19:42
Is Air Wales really gone, I mean it is not flying Scheduled services in its own right but it is doing work for other airlines?

I say an ATR 42 in full Air Wales at Edinburgh 2 weeks ago, it was taking off ahead of my flight.

EI-BUD

JulietNovemberPapa
23rd Jun 2008, 19:53
- Jet2?
- FlyBe?
- Ryan?
- Manx2?
- Blue Islands?


You put Ryanair in the same category as those others? Now I have read everything. :ok:

MeNelty
23rd Jun 2008, 20:06
The Air Wales ATR G-CDFF is still floating around. Aer Arann currently use it, as it has operated the BHD/ORK route a lot in the past week or so.

Loxley
23rd Jun 2008, 20:21
City Star Airlines are another one that went bust :(

Facelookbovvered
23rd Jun 2008, 20:21
Manx2
Blue Islands
Flybe

the above can all run their aircraft on the sniff of a tanker drivers glove and Flybe are 15% owned by BA so they ain't going anywhere.

bmibaby are owned by bmi who are part owned by luffty & SAS and short of just shutting up shop and walking away i don't see anything happening to baby anytime soon.

Jet2 publish their 2007 accounts in a couple of days so that will put to rest either the "there about to go under mongers" or the "Jet2 are making buckets loads of money cos they own the kit crew?"

At least with Jet2 you get a detailed breakdown of what they are doing because they are a PLC and are using shareholder funds (other people money if you like) where as with bmi its Sir Michael's cash in the main to do with as he see fit.

Let see what this week brings, hopefully this time next year all the player will still be in play and more importantly for most still employing lots of crews!! lol

harrogate
23rd Jun 2008, 20:33
Oasis, forget ye not.

JulietNovemberPapa
23rd Jun 2008, 20:43
Oasis, forget ye not.


Was a HKG airline.

tonker
23rd Jun 2008, 21:43
For the last time. Jet2 have hedged fuel until WINTER 09.

Why would the current increase in fuel affect them so much as to make them go under. Plus the lucrative mail contract, plus the 20 or so large shiny assets owned by the company which alone would sell for much more than the company is currently worth.

cyfarthfa
23rd Jun 2008, 21:51
Last Air Wales flight was April 2006. According to Jethros two aircraft are still around, G-CDFF (Cardiff) still active and G-SSEA (Swansea) engineless in Guernsey.

mathers_wales_uk
23rd Jun 2008, 22:06
Air Wales

Last Air Wales flight was April 2006. According to Jethros two aircraft are still around, G-CDFF (Cardiff) still active and G-SSEA (Swansea) engineless in Guernsey.


I am sure that the 2 a/c are either owned by Aurigny or Flightline.

G-SSEA has been engineless for a while now, i wonder when the engines will be replaced on the aircraft or are they using the aircraft as spares?

SinBin
23rd Jun 2008, 22:51
You're all forgetting BMed which was absorbed...sorry merged with bmi

Daza
23rd Jun 2008, 22:58
Fly Whoosh

Throat
24th Jun 2008, 06:27
re G-CDFF (IIRC)

Owned by Air Wales , Marketed by FlightLine and operated with Aurigny crews

xtypeman
24th Jun 2008, 07:59
Leased by RT operated on Aurigny AOC now marketed by ACMI24. CDFF in service as ad-hoc charter ACMI cover. Plans for SSEA have included a change to freighter config long term plans to be put back into service once RT has the money to put all the christmass tree items back!!!!!

cyfarthfa
24th Jun 2008, 08:34
Are the two aircraft still owned by Air Wales ? The Company still exists according to the Companies House web site.

757 Speedbrakes
24th Jun 2008, 10:28
Tonker

I'm affraid we're just wasting time on here! :ugh:

I mean, we only happen to be Pilots so how the hell would you and I know anything about the airline we fly for or the industry we work in!!!! :hmm:

Surely you must realise that on a website that is supposed to be for Professional Pilots it is far more factual and informative to let those who only get near an aeroplane when they pick up Airliner World or base their sole information on reading other crappy and mis-informed opinions on PPRUNE. :=

At least we get the thrill of hearing when others belive we will be losing our jobs at Jet2. Maybe there are a few that have the Champagne ready to flow every time an airline goes bust???? :confused:

tonker
24th Jun 2008, 11:38
Well the writing the writing is on the wall Speedbrake.

More 757's arriving, New York for Christmas, more charter work, weak routes chopped, freight until 2010-11, fuel hedged for another 18 months, less contractors, virtually nil leasing costs etc etc doom and gloom blah blah blah.

Rainboe
24th Jun 2008, 12:07
Hasn't there been this peculiar incredible increase in the last few years of these people who appear to have wet dreams about airlines collapsing? Very strange- it appears to bring about orgasmic reactions of joy (?) when a business folds and staff are losing their jobs and investors losing their money, with eager discussions of who will be next?

Does anybody have an explanation for this extraordinary phenomena? It appears to be related to the trend I noticed, particularly apparent following the Kenyan B737 crash, when people were desperately coming up with all sorts of possible scenarios which had to be put in print whilst the wreckage was still smoking so that the glory of possibly being the first to say the right reason would be theirs!

Pprune seems to be full these days of desperate 'I told you so!' wannabees. I wish they would all STFU! Is it fair these days, when the business environment is so hostile, to start publicly pointing the finger at different companies as 'the next to go'? Reading Airliner World once a month is not enough to make a proper judgement!

Would I be saying unjustifiably that most employees of UK companies are getting pretty fed up with these anonymous (and ignorant) idiots discussing whether their company can pull through? It's a hard environment to survive in now, and it's going to get harder. I don't like these anonymous idiots using this as a way of very peculiar personal self-gratification. Unless there is positive information, can it please stop?

TwinAisle
24th Jun 2008, 12:16
Rainboe

I could not agree with you more.

There has been a real trend on PPRUNE in recent years of people seeming to take incredible delight in airline failures. We've seen SilverJet being sent to the knacker's yard many times over its life, and do you know, I can TELL you - having been in that sort of position - that potential investors DO read this site, and DO take some notice of it when they are looking to place considerable sums of cash.

To anyone out there who has contributed to the "who's next to snuff it" trend - SHAME ON YOU.

I put this down to a very bad case of the green-eyed monster. The flying business is still the best place in the world to be (IMHO), and I can only assume that those who can't join it - or those who can't get beyond the very fringes - want to do damage to those who can.

Pack it in, people. You are damaging businesses, and the people they employ.

TA

Re-Heat
24th Jun 2008, 12:43
There are two camps

- Those whose interest in airline business is such that debate of the various business models is stimulating and academically interesting

- Those who have some spotterish attitude to airlines, with some peculiar loyalty to one or the other

I think those in the latter category are very few. While discussions in the former category appear offensive to those working hard in those companies, it would be counterproductive to curtail what is a valid debate on whether companies persue the correct strategy or not. Some employees are over-sensitive and some posters are (wierdly) apocalyptical.

In what way would limiting discussion of the full incompetence of UKIA have changed the situation in any way, for example?

TwinAisle
24th Jun 2008, 12:51
I think those in the latter category are legion in number. Just do a search on the threads which have a similar topic to this one.

The real question re UKIA is - did any of the prattlings on here actually help UKIA? If the answer is no, why do it? I go along - still - with Rainboe's assessment.

People don't have a right to discuss just anything - and just think, for a fraction of second, how it must feel to be an employee of one of the businesses being mutilated on here by the wannabees, and seeing the company that pays your mortgage, and pays for your kids being trashed. Nice. Not.

Probably worth remembering as well that if a business suffers material damage as a result of posting(s) on here (or indeed any other forum), not only the forum, but the author, can be found liable for loss. I've done this, so don't even bother arguing about the legal aspects.

Think about that.

TA

xtypeman
24th Jun 2008, 12:57
Both CDFF and SSEA ackording to G-INFO are still leased. CDFF is listed as being operated by Aurigny and SSEA still to Air Wales. Also please do not forget that Air Wales did not fail it did not go into liquidation or administration. The owner RT finally decided after losing XX millions to close the airline down. I believe that all of Air Wales debts have been paid off.

Long live the Dragon:ok:

plasticAF
24th Jun 2008, 19:16
Tonker

More 75's? Please:bored: us back room non pilot chaps are busy enough. Any more and we'll have to start working.

Speedbrakes

The great unwashed survive on doom and gloom. It's also the old one of "your successful so lets knock you down"
Blame the journo's. There's no news like bad news. Disasters sell papers! and the 24hour tv news can wring their hand, navel gaze and talk utter drivel

plastic

Evileyes
24th Jun 2008, 19:45
Having let this thread run a bit to see where it would go, it is obvious that the issues worth discussing in it are already being discussed, or have been discussed, in the appropriate airline threads. The other 'issues' within it are pointless speculation and fantasy which are helpful to none.

Cheers,
The AA&R mods