I don't like steep turns i feel funny - help.

[360 degree mason]

:yuk:

When my instructor does steep turns, it makes me feel like my head is going to explode and my vision goes slightly funny. I dont feel sick though Has anyone got any tips on how to deal with this?

By the way I have a medical, so I know im ok in that respect.

[Nashers]

hold your breath when doing them. normaly that helps keep the blood closer to your brain and eyes so you wont feel funny. he can be pulling that many G's in a training aircraft or it will prob break apart!

[Shunter]

One of the standard techniques during positive G aerobatics is to tense the stomach muscles. That goes a long way towards keeping everything where it's supposed to be!

When I started doing aerobatics I had a tough time of it, and found this made a huge difference.

[speedrestriction]

Tensing thigh and stomach muscles always did the trick for me.

[Mercenary Pilot]

Tell him to let you have a go at them instead. :p

[doctordoom]

I know this mite sound funny, but are you keeping your head level with the horizon if so you are causing the fluids in your ear to swish around. If you also have a cold it mite be causing it. Try just keep your head straight or tilt it slightly into the turn it mite help a bit. I think it happens to most people at first but you will get used to it. I dont think you need to do the whole Airforce breathing routine it should be no more than 2-3 Gs max :ok:

[spinnaker]

360 degree mason

Why is the instructor doing them, when you should. ?

Tense up the thigh and stomach muscles, and keep doing the turns until you like them. :ok:

[XL319]

Pick a spot on the horizon relative to the aircrafts nose and keep it there. Keep looking out on the horizon and dont turn your head as you turn. Remember to add pitch in order to keep the nose on the horizon. :ok:

P.S. I hated steep turns too, but with practice they ok

[Jumbo744]

hey there!

maybe your instructor is pulling too many g's for a beginning? what kind of aircraft is it? how do you feel when YOU do them? as other said, contract your abs and hold your breath. Also, don't think about the sensation, think about maintaining your altitude, keeping that 60° bank angle, airspeed, and you won't have time feeling funny.

Good luck :ok:

[Diamond_Dog]

Desk Job????

[Jumbo744]

Today 19:03 Diamond_Dog:

Desk Job????COMPLETELY FALSE. Some people are more sensitive than others, but they will build up a tolerance for g's, motion sickness, etc... and it will not be a problem anymore. I know some pilots with 5,000 hours flying airbus and boeing who admit that from time to time they get airsick.

[Mark1234]

Hmm. A proper steep turn = 60 degrees = 2G. No more. You do NOT need to be doing G straining at 2g. I'm not sure it's physiologically possible to be experiencing vision efects at that level. You also should be looking around for other traffic, so keeping the head still is not really an option..

I suspect it's a case of 'get used to it'. for my money you will - my first stall scared me, my first spin ditto..

If not Diamond dog might have a point.

[Rawrawhammer]

"I'm not sure it's physiologically possible"

sure is.I still get slight blackscreen/tunnel vision when doing 60deg turns.

[Jumbo744]

yes 60°, my bad...

What I mean is, when you are busy flying the plane, you don't have time to think about the sensations, you're just trying to do it right and checking eveything is OK, watching for traffic, listening to ATC, etc... but when you don't have control and the instructor is flying the plane, you might feel sick.

I felt sick when my instructor showed me spin for the first time, i really hated it, but I was determined to do it and recover properly. When It was my turn to do it on the next flight, I didn't feel anything as I was busy recovering, etc...

[nmcpilot]

Proper steep turn = 60 degrees but for PPL you only have to do 45 degrees same with CPL alot of instructors seem to not know about this, meh.

[Mark1234]

Possibly a matter of geographical (country/licensing authority) differences; I was required to demonstrate holding and reversing 60degree turns for whilst maintaining altitude.

Personally I'd be concerned if that was considered a big deal; but it might take some getting used to.

[mustflywillfly]

Message for the OP.

Stick with it. It will get better and considerably so when you are at the controls. I went through hell on my military elementary flying training where Aerobatics are part of the syllabus. When the instructor was flying I felt sick, tired, dizzy etc. After a few flights and getting myself some motion sickness wristbands (from Boots etc) I was much better and when I was poling the AC had very little problem (good job too as part of the syllabus was solo aerobatics - ahhh those were the days!!).

Don't let a silly thing like this ruin your enjoyment, ask the instructor to demonstrate a couple of max rate turns on the buffet. Do those for a while and concentrate on staying focussed, loooking at a point over the nose on the horizon. After a while a normal steep turn will feel like nothing!

Cheers :ok:

[Dop]

360 degree mason: Are you OK when you do the steep turn?
I've found that when my instructor demonstrates one I can feel a bit weird, but I'm perfectly OK when I have control!

[doctordoom]

It has to be more than 45 degrees to be considerd a steep turn :ok:

[360 degree mason]

wow thanks for all replies - couldnt reply sooner have just come back from cuba for 2 weeks.

it happens when my FI does the turn, especially without warning.:yuk:
i havent tried one myself yet.

My training a/c is a pa28 and its the 60 degree banked turns i have a problem with..

oh and i dont do a desk job.
ill try the motion sickness wristbands from boots too, sounds like a good idea.

i have tried keeping my head straight but i just end up paniking, im not scared of flying its just the sensation i hate.

[igarratt]

Know where your coming from !

My instructor is into acrobatics, he's pulled some kewl stuff with me, the first time he did a 60 degree turn with constant 2G my head well went out, 45 degree turns where not the most comfortable things.

The 45 turns got much better after I had got used to them and when I started doing them I was fine.
I actually love doing 45's now so much more fun, though I have been told off for doing them on downwind to base eeek.

on the 60's it was just a matter of the more of them you do the calmer it will feel. In the first ones it felt like I was 90 degrees to the ground lol he also does some wing over maneuvers, but again after done a few they just ended us good fun.

When I was doing my PPL I learnt from my instructor teaching me but also watching what he does and how he handles the plane.

Question for anyone: do you ever get taught 60 turns and wing overs etc, if so is it cpl stuff ?

Ian

[mad_jock]

I suggest a change in instructors.

It is not big and cool to do steep turns without warning or briefing a student.

Every action on an instruction flight should have a benefit to the student and a "I have control" then throw the machine into a steep turn has no instruction benefit at all. In fact it is gash.

In a ppl I used to be hands on the controls for less than 30 mins in the whole of the ppl course. If there is no safety reason to be hands on the student should be flying. Even if you want to reposition the aircraft onto a heading there is still benefit in the student doing it. Apart from the fact that doing it by a steep turn knocks the student out of the learning groove you are also stealing thier flying time.

Also it gives the student the idea that it is pefectly acceptable to throw an aggressive turn without checking thier 6. Which 99% of the time you will get away with until one day you swing it right into the path of another aircraft.

[707Lover]

in which country did you bye your medical?Stop aviation stay away... you will have no IFR,and then imagine....,except if you're flying those modern aircraft like the most of the young "Top Guns" on this site are doing...
I give you and advise, Have a chat with the "old guys" who have the real experience,not this new generation that thinks that knows everything but...scarry.
I'm not one of these "old guys" only 40,but they teached me a lot...A lot of respect.
Wish you good luck,
707

[mad_jock]

What utter bollocks with "stay away from aviation"

Motion sickness/vertigo can happen to the best of us. And getting a sudden roll and G pulled when your not expecting possibly eyes down can throw most of us until we get used to it.

If they grounded every commercial pilot who wanted to spew after not being quick enough to get their heads down when the Examiner slews the sim there wouldn't be a problem with wannabies getting a job.

[THE WELSH WIZARD]

I Quite Agree With Mj, In My Opinion

Give Your Instructor A Slap And Tell Him/her Everyone Has To Learn Some Where, And Not Freighten Strudents Away.

Good Luck (if That Fails Find A New Instructor)

Ww :)

[a797]

Don't worry, it takes a bit of getting used to, if youre still have trouble with steep turns when youre doing your CPL maybe you can worry then!

[SD.]

CAA & FAA PPL steep turns are tested at 45 degrees angle of bank. Remind your FI this and politely ask him to demonstrate no more than 45 degrees AOB. If you allow the nose to drop which results in a loss of altitude and then try to recover with a load of pitch up, it can get a little uncomfortable. If you start losing altitude, ease off the angle of bank and then you'll need less back pressure. Thats' more comfortable than trying to yank it round the turn. Ensure the turn is balanced, keep those feet moving and keep the ball centered. A well executed steep turn should not feel like you're pulling 10g's in an F16.

Whilst the FI is demonstrating the steep turns (he should only need to demo them once or twice), look at the 'picture' of the position of the nose, relative to the horizon for both left and right turns. Glance in at the instruments and then look out. I would suggest at least 2/3 of your time you should be looking out. When your eyes are outside the cockpit, try not to look up at the outboard wing.

Steep turns are a part of your training and will continue to be all the way up to a type rating.

Unfortunately its going to have to be a case of learning to like them.

[mad_jock]

the person is not near doing steep turns in thier training.

They have a gash FI who thinks its cool to throw a steep turn in un-briefed without warning and the person gets mucked up.

What a ducking arse hole of a FI, name and shame and get these cowboys to stop teaching.

[chris-squire]

The first few times of Stall's, Steep Turns and Spin's do provide some new sensations :yuk:! Stick with it and take a bit more time to get used to it. If things really aren't getting better after many hours then have a chat with your GP or something. Maybe they can shed some light on it before speaking to the CAA AME's.

Good luck fella

Chris :ok:

[corsair]

Some of you seemed to have missed to point. His original description clearly indicates that a few g were pulled. Dimming vision and feeling the head was going to explode is quite familiar to anyone who ever did any aerobatics. That isn't exactly the correct method of demonstrating a steep turn.

I agree with MadJock. It's the Instructor making a shambles of it. However as Chris_Squire says you soon adapt. You can also use the techniques aerobatic pilots use. Tensing your muscles as if you are constipated works very well. But you really need to be ready for it. (and careful):ooh:

[chris-squire]

Corsair and MJ both make valid points. Your instructor could be overdoing it abit. Although I'm not going to criticize given that im only a PPL about to start ATPL's! :oh:

I know someone else that got queezy doing steep turns and they always found it beneficial to do some nice medium banked turns @ 30 deg then go to 45 deg and move onto the full 60 deg all in one flight. Not sure of the medical reasons why that helped but he said it just eased him into it.

It might help to try and keep yourself busy looking outside for traffic, maintaining the picture throughout the turn and quickly glancing at your instruments to confirm.....god, sorry I sound like a bloody instructor now...im really not but thats a long way of saying try to focus on the job in hand and it may help. Im no expert and I'm sure that's alot easier said than done.

Chris :ok:

[XL319]

Don't mean to be negative here! However if you are unable to steep turns then is aviation for you? It is a basic and does not pull many G.

As you progress there are lessons which would possibly pull more G...

In the UAS we regulary pulled 5/6 G.

Maybe it's a case of learning to tense muscles and i was always told to look over my head as we did aerobatics.