Dispatch/Ops Qualifications

[sup_n]

Hello! I'm new to this site and after reading a few posts I have discovered that there is actually proper qualifications you can get for Dispatchers and other ground handling posts like a GCAA & FAA licence! I never knew that!

Can someone please point me in the right direction regarding the training, courses available, course requirements, costs, time, etc.

Much appreciated

[plane_kerazy]

hey. yea there is a course you can do and obtain a qualiication in aviation studies its done by city and guilds an average of 1200-1900 quid to complete but i dont think that includes the exames... its a self study programme which is great because you can take as long or as little as you want to learn, there are two levels foundation and then advance which obviously goes into the foundation level in alot more depth.... ive been in aviaiton 7 years and never knew this course exsisted untill recently so im very much considering taking this course up myself it seems to be the only way to go as most airlines and handling agents wanting to employ airside workers regarding dispatch and operations require..... if you do manage to get on the course let me know what you think and if you get a more specific idea of price ect..ta v.much good luck!!!

[eagle24]

plane_kerazy !

what and where is this course you mention?

1 more thing: is it only a course or M.Sc. degree?

[HZ123]

You may try and join an airline / ground handling company or exec avaition to obtain some qualifications. For even with them many / most dispatch roles are filled internally I doubt that you could go into such a role without some hands on experience.

[blue monday]

The only 'proper' qualification worthwhile ios the FAA air dispatchers liscense, the C&G Qual is ok to have but gives you no liscense as such.

[blue monday]

IDR Just to clear something up from the start an American FAA dispatch licence has nothing to do with working on the ramp. They have Turn Round Coordinators for that. FAA dispatcher’s works in an office normally nowhere near any aircraft or pilots, but in airline operations (HQ). A licence is only required in the USA, Canada and some countries in the Gulf.
The Gulf States except the American FAA licence as well as their own GCAA licence… however no other Country`s accepts the GCAA licence.
The City and Gilds qualification is great if you want to work on the ramp in the UK but as no licence is required it’s your choice and might give you an advantage over other job applicants.
A lot of UK airline`s require 2 years aviation experience to work in their flight operations department. If you have that and an FAA licence then you are in a very good position to apply. easyJet send all of their operations staff to the USA to complete the licence so they have a company standard, but as far as I know they are the only airline in Europe that do.
Thats a good point as there is often confusion beteween the various job titles, titles. Eventually i want to go from flt ops to turn around co-ord but keep saying i want to be a dispatcher when meaning turn around co-ord.

[Paddywacker]

Im Ireland there is a course run by one of the colleges in Dublin. There could be something similar in the UK.
http://www.dit.ie/DIT/engineering/mechtransport/transport/evening_aero.html

Paddywacker

[Ayub Hussein]

Hi.
Just joined in today.
Read the topic as regards courses.
Pls advise if GCAA License is recognised worldwide and comparatively how do you rate the teaching facilities in Dubai for the jepps course with FAA license schools in USA.:D

[no sig]

Blue Monday and others...

If you are going to work under the US FAR system of dispatcher/pilot joint-responsibilty then you need to hold the FAA Aircraft Dispatchers License. It is a very good qualifcation, BUT, it is not the qualifcation appropriate to European operations that is based on ICAO Doc 7192 - AN/857 D3 Training Manual - Flight Operations Officers/Flight Dispatchers. Further, the FAA license obviously, focuses on US FAR regulations, US aviation weather services which are (with a few exceptions) unique to the contingent United States. That said, there is much subject matter that is common to both FAA and ICAO 7192. My view however, is that 7192 is the much more comprehensive syllabus and offer a deeper level of operations studies.

Those airlines who choose to send their people on the FAA license course, do so largely, as there is little other option and there is large dispatcher training industry available in the States which we lack.

So, if you are looking for an ops qualification for European operators under EU-OPS/EASA, then you must look for a course based on the ICAO 7192 D3, such as the Dublin Institute of Technology, and I believe Bristol Ground School are offering this course in the UK and AVTECH2000 who I believe, now have a 7192 based course.

I have reprinted here the UK CAA CAP 768 (April 2008) Guidance to Operators on the subject.

Responsibilities of Aircraft Crew and other Operating Staff

3.1 In this context the term 'operating staff', as distinct from the crew, means staff having specific duties, in relation to particular flights, which fall within the general preflight and in-flight responsibility of the aircraft commander. The operations manual should define, where appropriate, the duties and responsibilities of people employed as:

a) flight dispatchers/flight watch officers;
b) flight planning assistants who prepare navigation flight plans and flight briefs, compute fuel requirements, Regulated Take-Off Weights (RTOWs) and
Aerodrome Operating Minima (AOM);
c) rostering and scheduling staff;
d) traffic officers or 'loadmasters' responsible for calculating maximum payload and/or fuel uplifts or for supervising the loading of aircraft and completing load/trim sheets.

3.2 If an operator employs flight operations officers in conjunction with a method of operational control, training for these personnel should be based on relevant parts of ICAO Doc 7192 - AN/857 D3 Training Manual - Flight Operations Officers/Flight Dispatchers. This should not be taken as a requirement for licensed flight dispatchers nor for a flight-following system.

Guidance on the role of the flight operations officer/flight dispatcher is contained in ICAO Doc 8335 The Manual of Procedures for Operations Inspection, Certification and Continued Surveillance. Detailed guidance on
the authorisation, duties and responsibilities of a flight operations officer/flight
dispatcher is contained in ICAO Doc 9376 Preparation of an Operations Manual.

[dada]

in my experience, best qualification you can have is
1/ look good in a suit and wear cuflinks
2/ say yes to everything
3/ talk the talk
4/ lik a*se wherever you can
5/ turn your hand into a mouse
6/ keep saying thats what i'm talkin about

[blue monday]

Thanks for that info.

On a more light hearted note; The other advantage of the US course is getting paid to go the US for 6 weeks - although imagine its quite intensive so not much chance of site seeing.

[no sig]

blue monday

Of course you're right- a trip out to the States is alway a joy; and you're right, the FAA license requires quite alot of study- particularly the FAR's.

Despite my trying to steer everybody to the ICAO 7192, which I firmly beleive is the right course and is part of the EU-OPS (JAROPS1), I know well that having the FAA license has some cudos which most ops officers seek. The fact of the matter is that the technical content of the 7192 syllabus is superior to the FAA license, in my opinion; and it covers many more subjects.
That is not to say that the FAA license isn't a very good qualifcation- it is indeed- however, it's part of a system where the airlines then complement the basic license with an airline/type specific indoctrination and inital training requirements when new staff join an airline. We don't have a requirement for this training in Europe.

Anyway, I live in hope that EASA will mandate a requirement for an ops officer qualifcation based on ICAO 7192 D3 and that our focus turns away from a US qualification to a European based one. That's what our industry needs!

[waco]

.................you need TRUST............

[no sig]

Sorry waco, trust in what?

[waco]

........Aviation of course.........

[no sig]

Ah I see, yes you do.

[dada]

well i'd never ttrust him

[waco]

...........why ever not....................

When it came to W@nker word bingo. What a player !

[Lefthandseat]

Yes. U are right on the Doc7192.
I know in Singapore there is a training on Doc7192 & practical dispatching.incldin 7192Phase 2 syllabus. Mind U,we are not talking abt Jeppesen .
But I don;t know if they train for public as I heard they are approved instructors for Singapore Airlines and airlines running on JAR. Their primary business is actually starting up airlines & Flt Ops Department for Airlines.

My 2cents.

[johncun47]

This is my first time on the site. I am moving (for good) to the USA next year after 28 years in the RAF, most as an Air Loadmaster. I am thinking about working as a Flight Dispatcher, Traffic Officer or Ramp Co-ordinater, can anyone recomend a course in the states and give me an idea of costs, duration and locations? Obviously the aviation industry is a volotile one but what are employability positions generally and is there a good site to search for them? Any help will be greatly welcome!

[OCNL EMBD]

Hi John!
take a glance on it Aircraft dispatcher training airline flight dispatch trainers Sheffield school aeronautics (http://www.sheffield.com/) if you're longing to be a dispatcher.
I'm an FDO since 2003, and after 5 years my boss has decided to give me a chance to go to...I will join them in october,hopefully, and for 6 weeks I'll stay there for a FAA licence course.
Look on their site...there are a lot of threads(from many many guys who tryed it) regarding everything you have to do to reach the course. Fees,tutition,homes,books,endurance,programs ecc...
But be aware ..there are some other courses that you can try. This is not the only chance to try for...
Stay tuned:)
OCNL

[no sig]

johncun47

You may already know the difference; but for clarity- our European use of the term 'flight dispatcher' more often then not, refers to 'ramp dispacthers' or 'red cap's' as they were once know. The US 'Aircraft Dispacther' is a completely difference job with joint responsibility with the Captain for the pre-flight planning and flight following of a flight.

Good advice from OCNL EMBD as Sheffield does come recommended by all I have spoken to who have been there. You might also have a look at the IFALDA website which is an Aircraft Dispatchers organisation IFALDA Home Page (http://www.ifalda.org/).

An afterthought johncun47; you might wish to claim relevant expereince on the back of your RAF career, think about ensuring you have plenty of RAF papers with descriptions of your expereince. The dispatcher expereince requires are pasted below.

FAR Sec. 65.55 Knowledge requirements.

(a) A person who applies for an Aircraft Dispatcher certificate must pass a knowledge test on the following:

(1) Federal Aviation Regulations that relate to Airline Transport Pilot privileges, limitations, flight operations (ops);
(2) Meteorology, including knowledge of fronts, clouds, icing, & upper air data;
(3) General system of weather & NOTAM collection, dissemination, interpretation, & use;
(4) Interpretation & use of weather charts, maps, forecasts, sequence reports, abbreviations, & symbols;
(5) National Weather Service functions as they pertain to ops in the National Airspace System;
(6) Wind shear & microburst awareness, identification, & avoidance;
(7) Principles of air navigation under instrument meteorology conditions in the National Airspace System;
(8) Air Traffic Control procedures & pilot responsibilities as they relate to enroute ops, terminal area & radar ops, & instrument departure & approach procedures;
(9) Aircraft loading; weight & balance; use of charts, graphs, tables, formulas, & computations on aircraft performance;
(10) Aerodynamics relating to an aircraft's flight characteristics & performance in normal & abnormal flight regimes.
(11) Human Factors;
(12) Aeronautical Decision-making & judgment;
(13) Crew Resource Management, including crew communication & coordination;

(b) The applicant must present documentary evidence satisfactory to the Examiner of having passed an Aircraft Dispatcher knowledge test within the preceding 24 calendar month

Sec. 65.57 Experience requirements.

An applicant for an Aircraft Dispatcher certificate must present documentary evidence satisfactory to the Examiner that he has the experience prescribed in par (a) of this section or accomplished the training prescribed in par (b) of this section as follows:
(a) A total of at least 2 years experience in
the 3 years before the date of application, in any 1 of, or combination of:

(1) In military aircraft ops as a--
(i) Pilot;
(ii) Flight navigator;
(iii) Meteorologist.
(2) In aircraft ops conducted under Part 121 as--
(i) An assistant in dispatching air carrier aircraft, under the direct supervision of a certificated Dispatcher;
(ii) A pilot;
(iii) A flight engineer;
(iv) A meteorologist.
(3) In aircraft ops as--
(i) An Air Traffic Controller; or
(ii) A Flight Service Station Specialist.
(4) In aircraft ops, performing other duties that the Examiner finds provides equivalent experience. You might get credit here
(b) A statement of graduation issued or revalidated under 65.70 showing that he has successfully
completed an approved Aircraft Dispatcher course.

Sec. 65.59 Skill requirements.

An applicant for an Aircraft Dispatcher certificate must pass a practical test given by an Examiner, with respect to any 1 type of large aircraft used in air carrier ops. The practical test must be based on the Aircraft Dispatcher Practical Test Standards on items in App A of this part.

[waco]

..............I've got one of those............
Anybody want to give me a job so I can use it.

..............very cheap.........honest.......

[OCNL EMBD]

no sig
i'm fully agree with you concerned the accuracy of icao modules.
European fdo has another way of look at his job.
Italians thought that faa licence is the best thing on the aeronautical panorama...I don't think so... It helps us to adjust our curriculum only and to add on a bit of value on it, but that's all. some companies use to send their guys in USA to earn experience on their playground...and some other use to do on the job training, following skemes and skills, doing some tests
It's a long way to be the same. taking from 1 to 3 years to be released as dispatch officer "combat ready":rolleyes:.
Actually, Italian CAA (ENAC),requires that for any dispatcher fully released,
His companie gives him an internal licence based upon his personal sillabus collected during the basical training and for any type of aircraft he/she goes to dispatch(pre-planning phase, flightwatch,normal/non-normal ops.
WOULD IT BE POSSIBLE THAT IN THE FUTURE EASA WILL FULLY RECOGNIZE OUR JOB AND ITS IMPORTANCE?
john:
if you look into your big own experience into RAF...if i were you i'd rather be in a cargo company... i think that fedex guys and stuff like that, may can learn how to load a big canister :ok: there are so many companies that need experienced people.
by the way if you wanna be a dispatcher...let it flow in that way.
It is a good job anyway, even if stressfull somedays. It's a part of the game to be in an airline company

Happy plannings
OCNL

[no sig]

OCNL EMBD

EASA, at least at my last reading, have rejected any idea of a requirement for a FDO license along the lines of the FAA, but there are looking at alternatvies, such as requiring a 'qualification' for FOO/FDO to ICAO Doc 7192.

johncun47

Again OCNL comes up with a good idea re the cargo airlines, but even if you go back into loadmaster/loadcontrol type work- having the FAA dispatcher certificate under your belt is very good and might give you an advantage over others in the job search.

[CLR4theAPCH]

Hey folks,

I have read this thread, and much of what has been said is pretty accurate. I am a licenced FAA dispatcher and pilot here and I thought I would shead some light on the subject.

The school you mentioned is know as the oldest dispatch school in the US, they have a good reputation, but they have a high failure rate due to the intensity of the 6 week training period.. Over here, the airlines really dont care where one gets the license, all schools here are part 65 certified by the FAA and approved to teach the exact same material.. the method of teaching is the only difference.
In the end, once hired by an airline, they are REQUIRED by the FAA regs to put each new hire though their own training program pertaining to their own specific operations specifcations, commonly referred here to as (OPS SPECS) and to their aircraft types.

We do share operational control with the PIC and bear a hugh responsibility for the safety of the overall flight and we feel strongly that we contribute greatly to the avoidance of accidents and company profits through our flight planning and weather/ aircraft knowledge.

As for our jobs future here.. well the economy here is in the crapper.. the worse In have seen it in many years, layoffs are to happen this year, some airlines may not make it at all.. I have to tell you many of us here in the US are looking to convert and move to other countries to dispatch or other airline work.. we dont see our industry here recovering from this oil problem anytime soon.. Over here seniority is EVERYTHING, so we would have recall rights before any new hires, with that, I would hate to see anyone come over here from overseas expecting to find a dispatch job with all the senior people here on a waiting recall list, you will have a very long wait.. years possibly!
As for getting a job with UPS/FED EX or mainline airlines.. forget it.. vertually all of us here are/have been trying to do the same, these companies only hire highly experienced (8 to 12) years dispatchers and only with internal recommendations.. very tuff.. infact near impossible... they have hard no turnover as they are the best places to work.

I hate to paint a dismal picture on this matter, but I felt it was important to give you all the "real" facts in the US.. ALL the dispatch schools will tell you or paint a rosey picture.. but they have to now don't they.. otherwise they would not be able to keep their door open.. I teach dispatching as well, I have a classroom available, I can help you get the same license that any school can teach you.. But I NOT going to sit here in Florida and blow shunshine up your butts.. It's not a pretty picture here..

I'll be glad to help anyone with more questions.. Good luck in your quests..

[johncun47]

No Sig, That is all very useful, thank you for taking time to reply. I will have a look at Sheffield and the other websites you suggest now.

[amerioca]

Well said.:D I am currently as a area ops mgr in Asia for a US carrier (on contract). I would probably not have gotten the job without the license as the carrier flies under N reg and that way we have to comply with local CAA regulations of every single country, as well as with FAR's and ICAO regs.

I think it was mentioned already in this thread, that the US is one of the only countries in the world where the license is a legal requirement, while many other countries have similar trainings (Germany, England, Canada, Australia), which are based on recommendations (welcome to ICAO, half of the chapters are recommendations in order to cater airlines globally:ugh:).

It is getting harder and harder to penetrate the HR systems of mega carriers. Better chances are within the exploding business jet segment.

[silversaab]

many other countries have similar trainings (Germany, England, Canada, Australia)

Just for info - not Australia - some of the few airlines here who actually have dispatch are living in the dark ages. They pretty much do what they want, and is it not uncommon to find managers who have no idea of the significance of the role(s) the dispatcher plays. (By dispatcher, let me reiterate we are talking principally about flight planning.)

Australia is way behind in comparison to Europe and Canada, although there has been talk of creating and putting standards in place along the lines of the ICAO recommendations for some years now. Until all the holes line up and something dangerous or serious happens, nothing will happen, if you know what I mean. (Mind you, do you consider planning and dispatching a flight on months old TAFs and NOTAMs serious? It has happened. That's ignorance, negligence, poor training, poor staffing and lack of supervision for you.)

On another side of dispatch, I wonder, with the price of fuel nowadays, whether airlines might wake up and stop treating their dispatchers like cr@p and realise they can save huge $$$ if they properly select, train and renumerate their dispatchers, let alone staff their sections properly. I suspect there are some "managers", for want of a better word, who have no idea how much a good dispatcher can save them if given the time to flight plan properly.

Oops, I've gone off topic...

And on the subject of the FAA Dispatcher's license, I agree that generally it is the most recognised license globally and based on what I have heard about Sheffield, they seem like a good outfit.

If you like to crunch numbers and analyse weather and want a job where every day is different and you thrive on challenges, I'd go for it johncun47 especially since you are going to the USA where it is a profession that is held in some regard. :ok:

[Benjax]

Hi,
could you help me out in any institutions that conducts FAA courses, along with fees if you know.
Im working in AUH Airport as Load Controller. Cheers :)

[Lefthandseat]

hi
Nearest insti u can find is EAC.;Emirates Aviation College in Gharhoud,DXB.
Do a google or call them.
Good Luck!

[EIDFZ]

Hi Would anyone know if completing a course in Dispatch/turnround coordinator ie completing manual load sheet, supervising the turnround AAA ect, i know the AAA course is manditory but not sure about the rest. Would seem strange if not, if there were to be an incident and the load sheet was signed off by the dispatcher ( all be it the Captain would be signing it off after ) would there be any negligence ???

[Brutes]

I heard there is a training school opening in SA as well anyone got more news on it?

[johncun47]

Hello to you "no sig" thanks for taking the time to respond with all that info, it is very useful. I am continuing to look into getting the FAA recognised Flight Despatchers licence and will look at the various schools, i have also taken on board what others have said about high failure rates due to the intensity of the course. Therefore is there any pre- study course that can be undertaken prior to going to the school that you or indeed anyone else is aware of? This may include self study, previous exam papers etc etc.... What is your history and where/how did you get involved in despatch?

[AiRBuS_380]

hi there,

just been reading through this thread, well look for Gleims ATP prep test book 2008 for pratice and to study prior to class. the ATP book are used for all FAA dispatcher or ATP pilots test. dispatch test with FAA cover the some topic and is known as ADX.

this will prepare you for the FAA exam prior to your FAA oral and pratical exam. many schools conduct such programes, such as jeppesen, or IFOD...

cheers
great way to fly...

[dada]

grteat attribute theses days in uk aviation is arse liking

[theflyingsultan]

Hi guys,

This is my first post on this forum. Thanks for all the interesting replies so far. I did the first part of the Jeppesen FOM course (FOM 1) in Frankfurt, Germany last year. I didn't have the time nor money to do the full course then.

I currently work as a Dispatcher for a business jet operator and have gained a huge amount of experience and knowledge over the past year. I feel I am now ready to do the rest of the course to get my Dispatcher Licence and am looking at the options.

One option would be to go back to Frankfurt and join FOM 2. But I would prefer to go to the US and get an FAA licence. I am thinking of going to Jeppesen in Denver. Does this facility offer a high-quality course or would it be better to attend another facility somewhere else?

Also, what are the chances like to be accepted for the 2-week, abbreviated course? (the experience substitution programme) I received an email from Jeppesen in which they say that they will do an oral exam through the phone to test the level of knowledge. Anyone any experience with this?

Looking forward to your answers!

[caorider]

"A licence is only required in the USA, Canada and some countries in the Gulf" Wrong!
Many European countries have a State qualification (licence) for dispatchers... Germany, Switzerland, Scandinavian countries...exceptions are France, UK, Ireland and a few others
Many Far East, Latin America and South American have State licences for dispatchers.
ICAO Document 7192 is the only official syllabus for the Flight Operations Officer/
Aircraft Dispatcher.
Aircraft Dispatcher and Flight Operations Officer (FOO) refer to the same profession. The term FOO is used in most European countries.
For more information, go to the IFALDA web page at IFALDA.org, IFALDA.com or the EUFALDA web page.
Better still, why not join IFALDA or EUFALDA.
caorider