Naturelink EMB 145

[Malagant]

Stickerlink lost their Middle East contract due the fact that they couldn`t produce the 145`s in the time frame that was agreed upon and they won`t be getting those acft at all..Question is, did they ever have that contract or was CB bulls&%*ing again..sorry to the pilots who are sitting around waiting on the empty promises at least they been getting paid since they did the sim training and those who been bonded on the 120 with the promise of gettin on the jets..!:{

[Romeo E.T.]

not to worry.........Link is desperately looking for ERJ drivers.......and these fellows come with a rating.........RF must be smiling tonight.

[Malloy]

No surprises that Stickerlink lost that contract.

If you know the inner-workings of NL the way I do, you realize that all that alleged deal was was typical CB hot air.

The company does not have the technical competence, flying expertise, or bank financing to acquire E145s.

The only good thing that came out of all this is that some of my mates got a type and a fat paycheck for sitting on their butts for a few months.

I hate to say this because I have many good friends there, but NLink is closer to filing for bankruptcy than getting a jet anytime soon.

For those who aren't in the know: the true results of CB + Jannie's Sao Tome expedition as well as all the looting and plundering Charlie Bravo has done to his own organization are about to become apparent. It is not looking good over there at Wonderboom for Stickerlink. There were some long faces last week seen around their headquarters. NL pilots - get your resumes ready! Well, at least CB is well experienced with the bankruptcy process, having been there twice already.

Malloy

[Romeo E.T.]

but NLink is closer to filing for bankruptcy than getting a jet anytime soon.


ouch ouch ouch

[Malloy]

This all would not be so funny if it was not so serious.

But, to be frank, just take a look at the lifestyle CB and some of the other upper-echelon management types at NL have been living and the extent of their skimming and kick backs becomes apparent.
You just do not have some of the things those guys have on what a rinky-dink charter operator produces.

The ironic thing is, the chunk of NL that CB sold back in the fall is what did him in. Then, their financial records came under more scrutiny and thats what is leading to this downfall.

Sorry to all those affected, but the next couple weeks at Wonderboom will be mighty interesting :-)

Malloy

[Malagant]

After Safair pulled their stakes and Imperial got out NL is on a downward spiral..they sold 120`s with promised contracts and those acft not all on contract..owners stuck with payments for acft that ain`t doiing anything..! :(

[cavortingcheetah]

:hmm:

Without knowing anything much about the workings of either the Saudi Arabian contract or the company's inner structure it does, nonetheless, seem strange that Nature Link, had it wanted to, was unable to raise the finance to acquire Emb 145s to replace the 120s it apparently already has in that part of the sandpit. One might perhaps reasonably have thought that the initial contract tender would have been financially based upon the provision of jet services, which might have been more in keeping with the mind set found in that part of the world, than on a turbo prop schedule.
In any event, had the contract been lucrative enough to be sustainable in the long term one would have thought that an accomodation could have been arrived at with either Brasilia or a leasing company to provide such aircraft.
Insofar as pilots are concerned, one can only feel a degree of sympathy for those involved with the company, having experienced at first hand an attitude from some company personnel which might, at the least, be described as strange and out of place in the overall context of an aviation environment.:ugh:

[Petrovsky]

As of now there are no Embraer 120 (never mind 145) wet lease operations in Saudi with NL aircraft, only a proposal.

[JMSP]

"But, to be frank, just take a look at the lifestyle CB and some of the other upper-echelon management types at NL have been living"


Malloy
Since when is driving a Hilux Bakkie such a high lifestyle.
Obviously you have not spent much time with other Aviation Companies Directors in our industry.
Even a low time pilot like myself drives better cars than this.

[cavortingcheetah]

:hmm:

Only a fool draws attention to his wealth by flaunting a life style so ostentatious as to solicit inquiry from others as to the methods by which he acquired such fortune and the book keeping which is legally required to substantiate such a manifestation of opulence.

That is only a rather general statement don't you understand? There are those of us around who drive SL 500s simply because we prefer to do so rather than helicopter it to the amusement parlour which we call work.

What is perhaps rather more interesting is that, if there are no NL Emb 120s in Saudi Arabia, then why is the company talking about three crews, asap, or is it six crews for three aircraft?
Something certainly seems a little peculiar but there we are, pilots should not concern themselves with such matters and should be confined to the cockpit until after tea time.:ouch:

[Malagant]

CB does indeed drive a Hilux bakkie..a COMPANY bakkie..so why would he drive his Merc to work..and old Jannie whas his Merc stashed away too..let`s all feel sorry for the poor poor management in their 19 voetsek Hilux cabbie`s..:{

[Malloy]

...and when Charlie Bravo has time off, he goes and relaxes at his lion hunting lodge. And he's got a fleet of cars at home in the garage. And when Charlie Bravo wants to go flying, he has a Falcon 50. Or if he wants to do General Aviation stuff, he just takes the plane he gave his snot-nosed kid for a trip around the pattern....

Starting to make sense?

Malloy

[JMSP]

Malagant and Malloy,

You guys tend to have some very personal problems with CB and JDK. Why dont you guys go see them face to face and sort your stuff out.
Probably dont have the balls do you.
Your facts are also way out guys, if you going to get personal atleast get your facts right.

[Malloy]

JMSP:

You obviously do not know Briers very well. He is one of the most arrogant, self-centered people I've ever met. He's also a financial sleazebag, can suck investors in, but specializes in blowing investor money on really questionable practices. He wouldn't have had the $$$ for NLink if his wife hadn't given him the start up funds. With Stickerlink, he's had a good run of things, but it is more "right place/right time" than any particular skill on behalf of him or the clowns who run NLink. Lets face it, who can't make money with a Caravan in Africa. The ironic thing is, as they've moved into bigger aircraft, with bigger acquisition and maintenance costs, that is where his pillaging and looting of NL becomes most apparent, as they just don't have the capital to fund the projects they talk about. Nor can they even get financing for an aircraft - those bankers who have full access to the NL balance sheet and contracts see full well how porous NL's bottom line is.

Having put in more than enough time at Wonderboom, I just feel sorry for the pilot corps. There are some good guys over there on all the fleets. I hope it works for them, but I've given my closest friends who are still there the heads up to start looking because once the axe falls, Solenta & the other companies are going to be inundated with resumes of 100+ NL pilots.

This E145 fall-through is only the tip of iceberg. Expect news of some major financial improprieties by him to emerge very soon. I give him a month more, two tops, as CEO. Enjoy that fancy office and CEO seat while you have it Chris!

Malloy

[Malagant]

FYI..my facts are from personal experience and have friends still working for stickerlink..and if you think we would not love to have a face off with CB and JdeK the biggest BS, you got it way wrong, .thing is CB likes to run to his laywers rather quick..but why bother..what goes around comes around..Fact..they don`t have 145`s, Fact..they do drive Hilux company trucks..Fact..they do own Mercs..Fact..they did lose the Middle East contract..thats four facts for you beside many more that I can list here! You are entitled your opinion but don`t tell other people that they don`t have the correct facts..and another fact is that their chief pilot has been looking at certain company that operates Lears out of FALA..:E

[warloc67]

Malloy & Malagant,

If you have an axe to grind do it in person, your accusations and "facts" borders on malicious:ugh:. This is a rumour network, you are becomming personal with known individuals.

Mods, in my considered opinion, this thread is getting out of hand.:=

[cavortingcheetah]

:hmm:

It is indeed becoming a little personal here and that's not a good thing.
However the company did launch a recruitment drive for Emb 120 pilots.
It apparently has trained or rated Emb 145 crews.
It said at recent interview sessions that it needed Emb 120 pilots to be based in Riyadh asap.
The excuses given at such interviews for not having the 145s operational were vague at best and certainly of economic dubiety.
So why did NL go to all that trouble and actually mess pilots around for a contract which it seems they have 'lost' . But then did the company ever have a memorandum of understanding, at the least, in the first place and, if so, why did they lose it?
Most interesting of all perhaps would be to know with whom NL were dealing in the sandy playpen and whether that operator/company is now looking for Emb 120 or Emb 145 pilots for a Saudi operation and is their pay structure is any better than NLs which, by international standards, was pretty poor?;)

[warloc67]

Cheetah,
Good questions, I believe the contract was signed, but at number 99 Saudi declared “open skies” which affected the Saudi operators route feasibility for 145’s, so to see if it can work they requested 120’s instead, meaning the 145’s are not quite out of the picture but they certainly are delayed. That’s aviation for you. :rolleyes:
As for the so called facts, posted by the two M’s. I know both individuals JdK sold his Merc about a year ago, CB never had a Merc that I know of, the closest was a Japanese copy made by Toyota. So, so much for that fact. :ouch:

[cavortingcheetah]

:hmm:

Ah well then, the whole thing sounds like a dead duck.
That presumably only leaves the matter of those E145 pilots who might have signed a training bond rather up in the air.
If one signs a bond for a type rating on the basis that gainful employment on that type will subsequently be provided and that employment is not forthcoming due entirely to the provider's problems, is that bond then still legally enforceable for repayment?
One would think that any adjudicating tribunal or whatever would bend over backwards to decide any such action in favour of the pilots who might have signed such a bond?
One factor that might however make any such claim for non repayment any such training bond would be, of course, if as a direct consequence of having obtained that type rating, the pilot in question was able to obtain gainful employment almost immediately with another operator of the same type, i.e. the 145?
But that is all rather idle speculation I suppose.
Incidentally, the car park at NL's FAWB base is conspicuous by its absence of shiny four wheel machines and instead, the plethora of ghastly old heaps standing about. It really is quite immaterial as to what anyone else might drive, what we on these forums should be rather more interested in is what we fly, the price, quality and availability of beer and the application of a similar consideration with regard to the hostesses.:confused:

[warloc67]

Couldn’t agree with you more, especially the beer and aircraft bit.:ok: As far as I know the crews trained on the 145 have been released from the training bond and the offer was made to move them into the 120 pool, with seniority nogal.:eek: Those who want leave are free to do so, considering the current shortage in the industry, that's not a bad deal, in my opinion.:D

[VortexGen300]

All well for the 145 jock's but what about the guys who were lured with the promise of the 145 but had to first start on the 120 - and now their does not even seem to be enough work for the 120's? (This is only my suspision from the reports here on this thread).

Just look around the Boom - and see them 120's stand around doing the odd test flight as the maintenance guys try to get their act together and not be breakerlink?

Stirred
VG300

[cavortingcheetah]

:hmm:

Having no idea what the 120 pilots shackles were, can only comment to the effect that if the 145 chaps have been released, that seems a fair deal and for some perhaps an advantageous situation in which to find themselves.
One should after all not forget in all this that the 145 is nothing but a baby jet, a 120 with different engines. It is not quite the same beast as a 737/800.
The intended significance of that line of comment is only to imply that a 145 type rating might, in South Africa at any rate, be of more use toward a break in to the executive jet employment pool than having a heavier machine on one's licence? Open to arguement on that one actually.:)

[VortexGen300]

Cheetah

Agreed about the fact that the 145 is only a smallish jet - but hey these guys can go straight to Link - if they want to work there - and will not be without a job for any amount of time - will they?

There are also several opportunities opening up all overt the show - I think someone else (maybe European) got the contract that Stickerlink or breakerlink wanted in the sand-pit judging by the postings on international flight deck crew vacancy sites for 145 crew in the middle east.

BTW have you guys recently tried to schedule any sort of training @ Flight Safety or any of those simulator centres anywhere? They are fully booked till way in the last 2 - 3 months of the year (or others just say when you enquire - "sorry if you are 6 or more we can try and get an instructor for you - else - sorry we can't help!")

VG300

[buck2rogers69]

The E145 is a good rating to have, but I think you still would need to have a few hours on type, well at least 500 for it to count should you not have jet time.

Great aerie to fly, a lot off power, great EFIS and really good systems, very similar to Airbus some of it. I think though that in todays market they would be able to find some work, AND i hope they do find it!!!

There is a lot of legacy's being delivered as well, so the chance of getting onto one is great!! Mango seem to like ERJ drivers, hired a whole lot just recently from link, ERJ gives you good EFIS and FMS experience, just not Autothrottle!!!

[Beeech19]

Did the NLK guys do base training on a ZS- aircraft ?
Or is the FSI sim course sufficient to have it included on your SA licence?

[Malagant]

You right..it`s just a rumour network so nobody needs to worry about facts..if you read most of whatever was about NL on PPrune in the last year or so you will find that most of it is negative, you seldom see that of Solenta or ET or the FEDS, but lets leave it at that before you run to the MODS cause you don`t like what you reading about someone wanting to give someone one of these:ouch:..hehe

As for the rating..if you didn`t check out in a ZS acft and taken the type rating forms to the CAA and its not on your licence you cant`t do much with it. There were no 145 instructors or 145 that was on SA register so the crew could not get signed out and none of them have it on their SA licence, they only have certificates from the training facility..! They will have to go back to sim to get current anyway as its nearly a year since they did their training..question is will they be sent back..NO..as I heard today that they are not getting 145s.. :suspect:

[JMSP]

Malagant and Malloy,

"if you think we would not love to have a face off with CB and JdeK the biggest BS, you got it way wrong"

I challenge you to say everything you have to say to CB and JDK's faces.
I will even set up the meeting for you.
We all know you dont have the guts, just another bigmouth that cant stand up for himself face to face.
Atleast I know that CB and JDK will have the guts to speak to your faces and not talk allot of crap behind your backs where you can hide behind your computers.

[dash431]

This is indeed a rumour network, and as such, much is left to speculation and the imagination. Many claim to have hard facts on certain companies. But, how would anyone that doesnt work for the company know whos telling the truth?

Despite all that is wrong with NRK, I cant see how CB's son has anything to do with this forum. How CB spends his (read HIS!) money, has nothing to do with those that work for him. Nor do the origins of the finances that were made available to him to start the company.

If Chris is spending/blowing company funds, that is a different matter. Malagant and malloy... Please prove to all of us that the blown funds were company funds, and not CB's personal funds... Otherwise belt up!

431:ooh:

[cavortingcheetah]

:hmm:

One has to agree with dash431 on this small matter. It is all very well for us to be quite rude about the company, its managment direction in general and its ethos which seems to have as a central plank the fact that pilots are replaceable. However in my opinion we should try to avoid attacks of the personal nature and especially those which, as dash431 so correctly says, have no bearing whatsoever on the company's dealings with its employees, present or prospective.
This has been a very entertaining thread and it would not do really to have it terminated because it had begun to border on the defamatory. The moderators after all must surely follow certain laid down guide lines and ours, on this forum, is historically particularly lenient. Furthermore, although I have no personal knowledge whatsoever of CB and JDK, were I either of them I would be reading the descent into personal lambastations with a certain satisfaction since attacks of that nature detract from what should surely be the central theme of this thread which might be to apprise pilots, engineeers and so on as to what we in the industry perceive as being the true nature of affairs at Nature Link.:):)

[Malagant]

Nobody cares where or how they spend it..! It was stated in an earlier post that they drive Hilux cabbies cause they doiing so badly, when in fact it is their company transport and they have other private transportation, but its not worth getting wild about..!

The main subject this thread was originally posted was about the 145s not goiing to arrive and the crew who gets affected by it..and that CB and DeK keeps on misleading the crew with empty promses..so why not continue with it in the original context..?:ugh:

As for JMSP or whatever wanting to set up a meeting..bru wake up, you don`t know my history or any of the other pilots that had a run in with them and what happened..and who backed down..but lets leave it at that..and if you think we little boys hiding behind our comps..GOOD for YOU..and thats the last you gonna hear from me on that suject..!:E Go read the Airlink thread and see how RF and the management at Link gets a beating..and then go whine there to the moderators..!

[FUG]

Taken from SENS, announcement made this morning

WITHDRAWAL OF CAUTIONARY ANNOUNCEMENT
Shareholders are referred to previous cautionary announcements issued on 6 and 13 November 2007 and 16 January 2008 in respect of the acquisition of a controlling interest in Naturelink Aviation (Pty) Limited.

Shareholders are advised that negotiations have been terminated as a result of failing to reach agreement with the Naturelink minority shareholders and that caution is no longer required when dealing in the securities of 1time.
24 April 2008
Johannesburg

[foxtrot_pilot]

MALAGANT,

What a lame a$$ response. :zzz: Dissapointing to say the least. And you were trying so hard!

I think we were all hoping that you would divulge some details on your confrontation with CB as JDK! But all you left us with, was to guess "who backed down" in the end. I can only assume by your last post that it was you. Shame. But on the other hand, a good flighter knows when he's been beaten..... What do you drive.....mmmmmm????

MALLOY:

A Honest question: Are you angry because you didnt really make anything of yourself in life? Or can your negativity be traced back to a childhood trauma?:{ Oh wait? Are you lashing out at CB's boy because your kids arent up to scratch? :oh:

Lemme know!

[malloyUsuck]

Malloy & Malagant,

I TOTALLY agree with foxtrot pilot :D, and I sure that you probably work for Nlink as a contract pilot some years back and that your probably one of those USELESS pilots that always caused sh*t! You were discipline on your actions and now you are throwing a tantrum like a 3yr old kid! Both of You Grow Up!!!

Pilots that live in glass houses shouldn’t through stones!! It’s so easy for you to bad mouth Nlink but I’m sure if they knew your true identity they could also spread some “factual info” on you useless a$$ over this rumour network!!!

[Charl Pieterse]

I also worked at Naturelink for about 2 years, and it was during that time that Tsunami struck in Indonesia, FACT: Naturelink was the first civilian aid response company to arrive ready to help. I were included in the team that landed on that god forsaken place, with dead people as far as your eyes could see, misplaces families, injured, hungry, confused people. We (Naturelink) were flying medical supplies and food from daybreak until the sun sets. I can truthfully say that the Chris Briers that I got to know worked side by side with the rest of us, helping needy people.

Since then I have left the company to go fly choppers somewhere closer to home, but whenever another crisis struck, Naturelink don’t even have to ask, I’ll work with Chris any day again.

By thinking positive, positive things will come your way.

Charl

[flyingaway]

Charl,

Perhaps the drama of the Tsunami situation affected your memory as well as your command of English? Naturelink was the first civilan entity to arrive in Indonesia but landed initially in Medan before relocating to Sabang, off the coast of Banda Aceh, at which time where there were few bodies left lying around and certainly not 'as far as the eye could see'.

Naturelink, working through AirServ flew MSF doctors and nurses, and other staff of numerous NGOs, not food or medical equipment, except for those flown by the Hueys brought in a few weeks later by Air Serv from the USA. You imply by stating that you left to fly to fly choppers elsewhere that you were flying helicopters there. Unless you are one of those using a pseudonym you certainly weren't there early enough to be one of the chopper pilots who saw bodies lying around.

Your account of Chris's commitment, whether relevant to this thread or not, is however, accurate and his organisational skills and seemingly inexhaustible energy certainly pushed many past what they thought were their limits. Irrespective of the fact that NL made a lot of money from that mission, there was no doubting Chris's leadership and motivation to make a positive difference to the situation.

Those who want to bitch and moan or ridicule when a company's plans don't come together should set up their own company and try it for themselves, risking every cent of their own money on the endeavour and then see if they still have anything to say. It ain't easy to run a business, certainly a lot more difficult than standing back and criticising from the sidelines. If it's correct that the pilots involved got paid and are still getting paid, then what's the problem? Nobody held a gun to their heads to sign up. Aviation is a risky game and pilots are replaceable, just like any other employee, albeit to a decreasing extent in the current market.

[cavortingcheetah]

:hmm:

In the never so humble opinion of this writer, that letter from flyingaway constitutes a most excellent posting. It may be that the writer has appeared to do battle for the reputation of CB, of whom, as stated before, one has neither personal knowledge nor opinion. The factual knowledge demonstrated in the post seems unassailable in its authenticity and one must conclude that rather more than casual interest prompted the writer to enter the fray. Be that as it may and it is, in any event, a point of some irrelevance; one really does have to deplore the personal attacks on individuals that have appeared in previous posts. The descriptive saga of Mr Brier's heroic efforts are certainly and seemingly more in keeping with one who drives a bakkie than one who swans around in a Mercedes Benz or a Falcon 50. But in any event, even were the man to make a habit of doing either, what does it signify? Why, nothing more than that the man dislikes the renal assassinatory discomfort of the pickup truck perhaps?
No indeed, this thread started its life off as a discussion about Nature Link, the Emb 145s and a certain Middle Eastern contract and that is really where it should have remained. Its is fair comment to ask, as flyingaway does, what the beef might be if the pilots in question are still being paid. If they are, then it would seem that they have little cause for complaint. But then again, this thread has not been liberally littered with letters from Nature Link pilots complaining about the way they have been treated. Indeed, if anything, the reverse has been the case.
So let us continue, if we must, to speculate upon the success or otherwise of the company's adventures in Sinbad land, althought the purists would have that to be what is today Iraq, or Mesapotamia in the days of yore, rather than Saudi Arabia.
If the ethos if the company is that pilots are replaceable then one supposes, upon reflection, that at least it makes no secret of that fact. It is probably true to say that for every aviator today, with the exception of this writer whose extra-aviatory talents constitute uniqueness in the field of aviation, there is an understudy waiting to demonstrate his talent in the skies. The only potential downside, were such a company philosophy to be sanctioned from the highest level, is that loyalty cannot necessarily be demanded from cannon fodder. It can, from time to time, be rather trying when underlings, of a childish and imature nature, at the lower levels of any company's employment structure attempt to emulate the attitude that they perceive is sanctioned by the senior management. But it should be born in mind that, though arrogant by nature, pilots are most certainly superior beings, dedicated and in some cases even trained, to transport the rabble of the world safely through the atmosphere by dint of using superior skills which are far beyond the comprehension of the puny imaginations of the lower orders of humanity.
But, and mark the words, so long as the thin blue line, respendent with gold bars of rank, is paid on time and is forewarned of the attitudes of its leaders, there can be little cause for real complaint.:)

[cavortingcheetah]

:hmm:

Komm, jou dors les, die klakkie het gelui!:8




(Which roughly translates, just in case the Great Powers have no knowledge of primitive African dialects as...'Come quench your thirst, the bell has gone.'
Which is very restrained under the circumstances?
Quite how the Afrikaans sub speak transitioned from klakkies to bakkies is another story which General Motors would probably not appreciate especially since the Caprice Classic is sadly no longer available in ZA, with our without flaming tyres.:ooh:

[I.R.PIRATE]

Proof that Pprune ruminations carry weight. Latest says N-link has opened a forensic investigation into finding the identities of malagnant and malloy...

Run forest run...die boere kom vir julle....

[VortexGen300]

Seems to me there were a Hijacker or two somewhere?

Good luck to all!

VG300

[cavortingcheetah]

:hmm:

One wonders in an entirely innocent sort of way, naturally, whether they are going to us a crystal ball to track the miscreants down. And, having found them, whether their punishment might not be to wash, thoroughly and with great grovellings, the company Ferrari with sweet and perfumed unguents.;)

[Malagant]

Die boere kom vi julle..haha..do I look like I give a continental about NL using forensic investigation to track down someone that says his say..and stands by it..what a load of crock..anyway..you seem so bent on it to try and snipe at me and Malloy, so in effect you doiing the same..and it doesn`t matter what we say fact remains that nobody has seen the 145s..and not likeky to?:{ Cavortingcheetah, be careful what you say about the Ferrari..haha..! :ooh:

[Q4NVS]

nobody has seen the 145s..and not likeky to?

Well someone seems to believe that the 145's will still arrive. Their (NL) advertisements are still in the May issues of most local Aviation Magazines.

Green-Tail 145 and all...:O

[controll pannel]

NO NO NO NO.
Just heard thad NL is sitting in the same boat as Nationwide, Could this be number 2 closing down:confused:

[VortexGen300]

I just hope it is not true?

Good luck guys & girls.

VG300