Incidents on OR TAMBO

[alpha-b]

Hey ppruner.i was at OR TAMBO this afternoon by the domestic View and saw a Van stuck on 03L which compeled a Comair 737 to go around and disrupted the whole traffic flow planes ready to take-off had to backtrack and take-off on 03R with fire truck all over the runway.Can anyone shed on some ligths on the matter with me?

[REAL ORCA]

Burst a tyre on landing:ooh:

[beckers]

We were the ones that had to do the go-around. The van (ZS-OPE) had a flat tyre in front of us. We were then sent on an 11nm downwind for 03 only to be told the runway changed to 21 - so it was off to the other side of Gauteng for another approach.

There were at least 6 aircraft already at the holding point ready to get airborne and they had to reposition to RWY 21L for take off.

I think it must have been great fun for the controllers..

[alpha-b]

Wow that must have been great fun for the pilots and atc,especially those drivers who went around procedures they practice mainly on the sim and atc's during their prof check.I can imagine a little Van creating a whole chaos.What was the cause of the tyre burst?

[beckers]

Don't think it burst - just flat. Probably got punctured on departure from the bush strip. Lots of hand flying yesterday - great fun just 1 ton of fuel later.....

[Maurice Chavez]

So when are the going to learn? These GA airplanes should move to Lanseria or where ever, but out of FAJS. Now disrupting departing and arriving traffic due to a tire failure. These GA airplanes are a pain in the butt. If they depart off 03L, it takes a good 5 minutes before ATC can let the next aircraft depart, as they are low and slow. Smuts isn’t the place for these pisscats, I say out with them!!! :mad:

[QBY]

"Smuts isn’t the place for these pisscats" [/quote]

Now was that necessary?:hmm:

[allovertheplace]

Popcorn anyone???? This is gonna be gooood!!!!!!:}:}:}:}

[I.R.PIRATE]

Chavez - in all your infinite wisdom, what would have been the difference if it had been a heavy that closed the runway?

Prob would have taken much longer to clear too.

You forgot where you came from perhaps?

[Maurice Chavez]

Yes it is necessary. FAJS is a place without room for these airplanes. These GA aircraft are to slow on departures and are therefore blocking up traffic out of FAJS. Take them to other GA airports where they won't bother other traffic. :mad: And haven't forgotten where I came from, I never flew GA airplanes except C172 for the initial license.

[I.R.PIRATE]

Whats the big rush anyway, what with the menzies/equity debunkle, crappy service at airports, luggage probs and the lot, no one is ever on time anyway, so a slower aircraft departing is surely not that much of an issue.

I often get pissed off having to approach behind the heavies at Smuts when I am flying a turboprop, because whereas I can offer 220kts to 1.5 nm, I have to fit in behind you 140 kt approachers and make my passengers late. Inconsiderate non GA drivers.:ugh:

Im just yanking your chain, but I do believe there is room for everyone. I feel that weak controlling is the problem in most cases.

[Goffel]

IRP....Cannot believe you are losing your touch there lad...getting soft in your old age....used to enjoy your quick comments.

Now you are agreeing with people....nay china....you must be ill.:E

Goffel.

[Dude1]

I fly " pisscats " out of JHB for one of the GA companies based at the Airport and while I will admit at times it is not always ideal , we do try and be as little trouble as possible ( like keeping our speed up all the way to touch down , I almost always do a flapless and keep up my approach speed all the way to touch down ) I haven't heard any complaints so far and 5 min delay is streeching the truth a bit don'tyou think ( we almost always get an early left or right turn out to make way for traffic behind us ) Maurice ....we can't allbe members of the sky police

[CJ750]

M C

do you actually know what you are talking about.

You have never forgotten where you came from.......a 172.......WOW

I see you are an expert at General Aviation at FAJS. What general aviation aircraft have you flown in and out of FAJS. What GA aircraft have you flown.........................................

You say all GA aircraft must go to Fala and get out of the way so they don't disrupt traffic. What about the airbus that disrupted ALL traffic at FACT last year or is that ok because it is an airline. What about the airlines that are operating out of FALA, should they be thrown out of FALA because they disrupt the trainers in the circuit and take up most of the apron parking too.

I too feel that all aircraft can use the airspace but possibly weak controlling is also a factor. I fly a high performance GA aircraft into and out of FAJS and find that even with slots preference is given to AIRLINES with regards to routings and levels because "they are faster than us". The truth is we can fly higher and even faster than they can but they are given preference.

I suggest that most GA aircraft fly faster than your one and only brain cell and suggest that you find out more information about the subject before shooting your mouth off and changing feet.

[Maurice Chavez]

CJ750,

First of all the key is to read, not just posting something without reading properly, like you just demonstrated. IRP asked if I had forgotten where I came from, to which I replied that I never flew GA aircraft except the 172 for the initial license, incase you must know I drive heavy and medium jets and have done that since the day I got my CPL.

I don’t care about your “high performance GA aircraft”, again you didn’t read. As you might have seen, I complained about the delays we get after a small turboprop departs. I agree mostly with IRP, it is poor controlling. So if you CJ750, drive a Lear or a GLF then that’s fine, no problem with that as you will out perform most airplanes. Please don’t complain that we get preference, as you might know we are “scheduled airlines” therefore will always get preferential over any non scheduled or GA flight.

Dude1, what is the rated tire speed for the “Van”? Just curious to find out, as you point out most of you guys “keep the speed up". I’ve personally seen most of you guys flying about 10feet of the deck to touch down on “E” intersection so you don’t have to taxi that far.

[flyguysa]

I just have to give my 5 cents worth in this debate... I stand corrected (haven't flown a Van for about 7 years, great airplane none the less), the tyres are rated to 180kts. I think the operators have got a great concept going with flying out of ORTIA to the Lowveld, it save foreign travellers a lot of time and money transferring to smaller GA airports, giving them a better, SAFER experience and it leaves a little extra of their travel money over to spend in our country, which, at the end of the day benefits us whether we fly heavies or C172's...

I fly turboprops out of ORTIA for a scheduled airline, we also get shoved around the airspace to accomadate the jets that wish they could fly 250 KIAS to 6.5 NM and still be in the slot at 500ft to touchdown.

My point is there IS enough space for all of us and here and there we ALL have to compromise, we all have a job to do so let's help eachother out. Do you want our airspace to become like our roads??? I don't....

[sslut]

Sounds like MC can redefine the term ego-trip :cool: Ah well - takes all kinds to make the world go bump

[Shrike200]

Chill MC - and why aren't you (by logical extension) complaining about Link's J41's and SAX's Dash-8's? You're more likely to be held up by them than by the 1900's/Van's etc of the GA types at FAJS. US airports fit all types in - the problem is in the sky, not the piece of tarmac. And anybody can blow a tyre. Appropriate routings and procedures could solve the traffic flow problems that exist: ergo, the problem doesn't lie with the aircraft. Don't make this an us and them thing. We're all just users of the facilities.

[bosbok]

"I drive heavy and medium jets and have done that since the day I got my CPL."

Ah yes, it all makes sense now. I for one had no idea that we were clearly dealing with one of God's gifts to aviation. What a legend... had no reason to fly those pathetic "pisscats" with a fresh CPL like the rest of us idiots. No reason to spend years trying to get onto the big aeries. No siree bob, straight to the heavies for this natural top gun.

I agree, there is no place for GA aeries at FAJS.... but only because there is a very large EGO taking up all the space! :yuk:

[dash431]

M C

How on earth did you manage to get onto a Heavy (or ANY for that matter!) jet with only 200 hours???

Must be a few pilots out there with 200 hours that would love to know!

431

[four engine jock]

From 300 hour to a Heavy jet Happens in the real world.
I know a few guys that went from a C172 with 320 hours and went staight to B707 and within two years was flying DC10 all befor ethe age of 25.
So for all of you out there. It can happen and does.

The only thing that I see in SA is that Airlines dont want to give a chance to the young guys.
Me, I would rather hire a young Pilot with 500 hour than an old one with 20,000 hours.
But that just me.

As for the Pisscats,they also deserve the Airspace.
Its not an Airspace problem ,its a ATC problem.

[Shrike200]

An ATC management problem, not a problem with individual ATC's, they struggle with the same problem daily....so I believe at least.

[VoxPopuli]

Surely a cross-runway would be handy in a fast vs slow battle. Jets of main runway and lowveld traffic from cross. Oh wait, sorry that was 10 years ago. Progress?

On a sidenote, 5min between fast behind slow (40kts +) on the same direction turn is not ATC management or individual, it's ICAO.

[I.R.PIRATE]

So turn the slow traffic out to the left off 03. ATNS is wagging the dog these days, and needs to be tamed.

Have you ever experienced that certain female in George who speaks so fast it sounds like she is controlling the whole week of Oshkosh in one session, until you check the TCAS and see there are only 4 aircraft in the TMA.

If ever there was chaos, she creates it.

I have heard that george was extremely busy - well now I know why - this lady over-controls the airspace to death and beyond. I have never heard so much controller induced stress in my life.

couldnt even get a word in edgewise to chirp her - and that with a grand total of 4 aircraft in the TMA.

Now I fully understand why FAGG cant handle more than 5 aircraft at a time. She just doesnt give any of them a fighting chance.

I agree, keep it down to 2 aircraft per shift with her onboard, as she can speak enough to keep both aircraft and herself very very busy.