Australian Defence Force, is it worth it?

[jamesmcintyre23]

I completed flight screening in May 2006 and passed the flying component with flying colours but lacked in the leadership side of things, as a result i received a 'not yet 12'. It's nearly been two years since flight screening and im wondering whether its worth pursuing or not?

A stuff on recruitings behalf in regard to my dossier being sent to the wrong place and other stuff ups in regard to police clearance forms etc has not also helped.

Just wondering if there are any people out there with similar stories who can shed some light on military recruiting???

[oldpinger]

JM 23
First of all, military recruiting isn't. It's run by a civilian company working for the ADF. They quite frequently get it wrong and don't do the job justice:ugh: I think they put off more people than they recruit just by the stuff-ups....

Anyway- if you are still at all interested (guess you wouldn't be posting otherwise) don't take "the cat ate my homework" as an excuse, kick them up the backside and find out what's happening. You could also ring PSA and get them to help.

PM me for any further handy hints.

[Arm out the window]

You're the one who has to decide whether it's worth it or not - do you see yourself flying military aircraft or not?
As most people will tell you, the rewards can be, well, very rewarding, but there can also be a lot of frustrating aspects as well.
For me, looking back on a fairly long time in, the balance sheet is certainly in the positive; others may disagree. I'd do it again.

Regarding the admin stuff-ups, it's worth remembering that many parts of the defence 'machine' are just like any large organisation - things can and do go astray. One very helpful thing I started doing when this happened one time too often was to make sure I tracked important things I put into the system.
Basically, I had a little file and recorded simple stuff for each issue - date, time, who I spoke to, what they said, when they said to call them next, what they said they were going to do.
Then when I rang back and got someone else professing ignorance or contradicting the last person, I could hit them with the facts. Amazing how much action you can generate when they can't fob you off!

I stress not every dealing with the admin machine is the same - lots of good people around - it's just a way of preventing your file being marooned on someone's desk.

[Double Asymmetric]

James, don't take this too personally....

Going only on what you have said in your post (and if there is more to it than that may change things a bit), but I would question how strong - really strong - your motivation to be a military pilot is.

You said this occurred over two years ago and it would appear you've done nothing about it at all, save post a question on an internet forum?

Can you clarify how the paperwork getting sent around the traps did not help? Didn't you get knocked back in the first instance anyway?

I would have thought if you were absolutely single minded and determined to be a military pilot (and you need to be, to make it), then the misplacement of your file is a trifling matter that could be chased up with some vigorous phonecalls and polite badgering. Happy to be enlightened if you have done this?

For perspective, I know a number of RAAF pilots who were not successful in round one, some medical, some in the testing. But they dusted themselves off ASAP, found out the min turn around time for application and launched straight back in. Nothing was going to stop them, and suprise, suprise, they ended up flying military aircraft for a living. I know one pilot who got in on his third attempt in minimum time.

This is the sort of tenacity and initiative (the core element of leadership) that you have to display to make it in.

As I said mate, I'm not having a personal dig; and if there is more action you've taken then what you've shared you should let us know. As it appears you haven't done a lot to rectify the situation in the last two years. Happy to be corrected!!!

Anyway, best of luck with it all, I hope you achieve all that you set out to do.

[slow n low]

JM23

Double Asymmetric has some wise words indeed, I came back after a "not yet 12" almost 6 years later to be told by the board that I would have had a very strong chance of getting a shot if I HAD come back after 12 months... :bored:

The admin battle will not get any easier, :ugh: I suggest keeping a diary from day 1 if you make it. Photocopies of important documents (med docs ect) depending on security class of course will ease some of the pain later on.

My Sqn only has a handfull of aircrew so people are needed, keep the faith mate, work hard, its there for the taking.

[BentStick]

James,
You haven’t given us much to go on but I’d like to stress that pilot aptitude is but one element of the ADF Pilot Selection process (the three elements being; pilot aptitude, commissioning test scores and psych reports). I have seen many applicants come back from flight screening with good aptitude but who ultimately lose out in competition with other applicants due to lower test scores or psych/board reports (usually maturity). The end result is a ‘not yet N’. While I admit admin stuff ups could extend this process, it would not stop a suitable candidate being selected.
If you had no problems with pilot aptitude and you still want to fly in the ADF, address the deficiencies in the other two elements to make yourself more competitive. My advice would be to join the Reserves. It will certainly take the psych’s out of the equation if you can demonstrate effective performance in a military role.

Good luck.

[jamesmcintyre23]

Cheers for the advice!

I have done everything so far that they have advised me to do IE toastmasters and other leadership activities. I was advised not to join the reserves as there can be some complications when trying to get into the RAAF?!?

I am motivated to become a military pilot but im getting to the point now where i have devoted alot of time in trying to get in and i suppose im just getting a bit fed up with the whole situation.

I've always had good feed back from the phycs and also scored a stanine 9 score for the flying component.

Hopefully things work out for me..

[Trojan1981]

There are some complications coming from reserves because its a transfer. It may help with your leadership stuff though. I know someone will bite, but IMHO nearly all the good officers I ever worked with were non-commisioned first.
Think about getting a taste of the lifeslyle in the reserves first because its a BIG ROSO and trust me it can go very slowly if you are frustrated, bored or find you just don't want to be there.

[Esposs]

Hi everyone.

I would advise against joining the reserves with a view to becoming a Pilot. The process takes quite a while longer and it can be quite painful at times chasing things up.

I am a re-tread and guys from my FSP with similar scores got on course at least 12 months before I did.

[Neptunus Rex]

James,

Just ask yourself what Clive Caldwell would have done in your position. Check him out here:

http://www.awm.gov.au/people/18265.asp

Bon chance!

Neppie:ok:

[Trojan1981]

Fair enough Esspos.
I was a retread (permanent-not reserve) but after jumping through the hoops and getting to FSP (2 year process) decided I had had enough of defence and, staring down the barrell of a rather large ROSO, pulled the pin. Several others in the same boat did the same, one even removed himself from cse despite performing well.
Some people like it I suppose, but I think look before you leap.
There is a reason why you are held by them for so long, If it was all Hornets and happiness, there would be no need for a roso.

[Silent T]

Arm out the Window,

Good tips about keeping a record of conversation, but how long did it take to carve out the tablets back in your day???:)

[Arm out the window]

Oh very witty, yer only as old as the woman you feel, I always say!!