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rotorman11
9th Mar 2008, 18:38
hi all

I am currently a Mil guy looking to leave the service in about 12 - 14 months. I have started the ATPL syllabus, hopefully completing in the autumn. I will be 30yrs old with about 700hrs total time. Approx 500 of that will be twin turbine, multi crew. I am hoping to leave into the offshore world.

Can anybody give guidance or comment upon the following:

1. I will have about 70hrs total instrument time (excluding simulator IF time), a green rating and also procedural (well TACAN) from the military but no civil rating. How open to sponsorship for an IR are employers given the current working climate?

2. I will be opening my fATPL on the mighty Lynx, not a machine used in the civilian sector, will companies sponsor type conversions?

3. Does anybody have any inside knowledge to be able to comment upon the employment situation in approx 14months?

Any advice will be appreciated!

regards

ShyTorque
9th Mar 2008, 18:48
Hi rotorman.

With regard to your questions,

1) and 2). Possibly, if you are very lucky but it's by no means common.

3). If I knew the answer to that one, I wouldn't be giving the answer away on PPRuNe, I'd be doing an astrologist's column in all the daily newspapers and making a fortune.

With that number of hours you will be directly competing against self-improver pilots who have had to pay for all their own training with a reasonable amount of civvy experience. Your advantage is that you have twin turbine and instrument time.

Good luck.

FloaterNorthWest
9th Mar 2008, 19:04
Rotorman11,

You won't be able to open your licence with the Lynx as it is not a type listed on the civil register.

If you went through the Shawbury system you would have flown the Squirrel so you could open it with that. You need to find a school with an AS350 and a TRE who can do your Licence Skills Test or if like me you know people you can do your skills test on a military Squirrel. But you need to convince someone to lend you one and then find a QHI who is also a TRE and can get permission from the CAA to do the test.

Best go to a school. The civvy Squirrels are slightly different than the military Squirrel as they don't have the throttle mounted on the collective, so you may need a little extra time to get used to it.

Good luck in the future and when you have 3000+hrs give me a call as we are looking for another corporate pilot.

FNW

jayteeto
9th Mar 2008, 20:23
What are the wages?? :)

chcoffshore
9th Mar 2008, 21:09
I think you might be opening a CPL, as you don't meet the requirements for ATPL ie hours and no IR. I take it your going to be x army? Learn as much as you can about procedural intrument flying and look into the company's who operate the North/Southern bases. Some will sponsor you some will not but as for a type rating you'll get one of those if they take you on board.....

FloaterNorthWest
9th Mar 2008, 21:31
jayteeto,

More than you are on but not enough for the hours worked and time away.:{

FNW

MINself
9th Mar 2008, 21:41
Just FYI, under the JAA/CAA system the type that the CPL is "opened" with does not have to be on civil register, just that it is a type flown by the mil and you have 500+hrs on type, amongst other things. It might be that it has changed recently but 5 years ago my CPL was issued with Lynx as the opening type after I showed the CAA my log book with the other bits and pieces.

If you have 500+hrs on a mil type which is also a multi-crew type and on the civil register, then submitted with the paperwork you could get a ATPL otherwise you will be issued with a CPL.

:ok: MS

Horror box
9th Mar 2008, 22:35
Just FYI, under the JAA/CAA system the type that the CPL is "opened" with does not have to be on civil register, just that it is a type flown by the mil and you have 500+hrs on type, amongst other things. It might be that it has changed recently but 5 years ago my CPL was issued with Lynx as the opening type after I showed the CAA my log book with the other bits and pieces.


absolutely right. Did the same thing myself a year ago.

Rotorman - I am afraid your hours wont mean very much in civvy st, as your total is less than most will do in a year in the offshore world. Dont be disheartened though, the experience is recognised to a degree, but you will be starting right at the bottom of the scale, and army flying is very different to offshore, so you will be starting over.
You will not get an ATPL, and there is no such thing as a fATPL. You will have a CPL until you do an IR, and get the required command hours, flight hours (1000), and do an LPC with you assessed as commander. Normally taken care of in the offshore companies by your command course.
Job prospects in 14 months - well again, very difficult to say. That is a very long time in this business, but it is fair to say, that if you are flexible about where you can work, and what you do, you will find something.
The IR is all important though, and best to get your medical done early. The initial CAA medical Class 1 is a quite a bit more stringent than your annual aircrew med.

good luck, and do your networking!

blithe
9th Mar 2008, 22:43
"I am afraid your hours wont mean very much in civvy st"

Yeah right. Then how come most of the decent police/EMS/VIP jobs go to ex-military people?

Having all that twin time is hardly "starting right at the bottom of the scale". Try having a logbook with over 1,700 piston only hours, and every operator wanting twin time and/or an IR, and then we'll talk about 'being at the bottom' in this industry.

Bravo73
9th Mar 2008, 23:01
Gawd, I could've sworn that that was manfromuncle moaning again... :rolleyes:

jayteeto
10th Mar 2008, 02:01
Be careful about 'multi pilot' time as well. Just because you fly with 2 crew does not automatically mean you are multi pilot!! I have 2500 hours RAF Puma, mostly flown with 2 up front. The Puma is capable of flying single pilot, so the CAA classed hours as single pilot, even when flown 2-up. The Lynx is the same, you only NEED a single pilot.

Horror box
10th Mar 2008, 10:39
"I am afraid your hours wont mean very much in civvy st"

Yeah right. Then how come most of the decent police/EMS/VIP jobs go to ex-military people?


You are right, but they will usually have considerably more than 700hrs. Even in military circles, that is still an inexperienced pilot.

ShyTorque
10th Mar 2008, 11:27
Yes, I believe it's 1500 hrs for a police pilot. Some units want double that.

FayeDeck
10th Mar 2008, 15:38
Regarding Multi Crew..... any multi pilot time will count if you are 1 of 2 pilots, even on a Gazelle. You need to get a letter written by your OC certifying thay you have x amount of Multi Pilot time and send it to the CAA when you get your Lic. You will get back a MCC, Multi Crew Certificate which will enable you to save wedge you would have had to spend on a CAA approved course.

Best of luck.

PlasticCabDriver
10th Mar 2008, 19:46
It has to be 2 pilots though. Navs, observers, flight engineers etc don't count. Neither does flight under instruction, as an instructor, Staneval trips etc etc. 500 hours of 2 pilot operating only.