First Job Dilemma - advice needed

[Kerosine]

Prepare for the sh*tstorm

I don't suppose you've seen the sticky on the Interviews, jobs & sponsorship forum (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=284418)

I have also heard instructing is a waste of time, and it's pretty easy and dead-end work

I personally was hoping for a starting salary of about £35,000 and a type rating and no bond
Brilliant :D

[MIKECR]

Yup, shxitstorm indeed! If you dont take it then your absolutely off your head. I would also suggest that you have absolutely no comprehention of the current job and are yet another example of mum and dad has paid for everything!

[BerksFlyer]

Take the first job regardless. Some are breaking their balls looking for jobs yet you are going to turn one down on the grounds of money despite the fact you have no debt to pay off!

I wouldn't make comments like that about instructing, it shows a complete lack of understanding about the job. Don't tell me you're one of those who came into this on a whim because mum and dad offered to pay?

[SD.]

Don't feed the trolls gentleman. Move along, nothing to see here!

Infact, Tabards. How about a new career change, I hear Jongleurs are looking for new acts.:D

[avrodamo]

This post is a wind up....right?????? It made me chuckle anyhow! :}:}You are in a very very fortunate position, and one which many others would beg to be in. When you start flying, wether it's instructing or the first paid pilot job you realise all too quickly that even that you have that nice new licence you know nothing really. Reason is you have no experience. You gain experience from doing the instructor thing, or taking that first turboprop job. It's an apprenticeship. You learn every day, and there is no CPL IR or ME rating that will teach you that. To be frank, you may think your worth alot more, but belive me your not, and neither were any of us when we first started flying professionally. You will be so far behind the aircraft when you first start you wont know wether your up or down. It all comes together with experience, and thats when you start being worth your money.
Take the job. Your crazy not to, and i reckon in 12 months you will see exactly what i mean.....might not be the best move though to say instructing is a dead end job. If you take the 18K job tell your sim instructor and line trainer that instructing is a dead end job. Im confident it will get you off to a soaraway success, and you will indeed have a unique 'bond' with them.;)
Best of luck with it!:ok:

[preduk]

Why not instruct while doing the job? (not at the start but during your career).

[matt_hooks]

Tabards, my advice would be don't take the job. Go do some instructing!

That will leave one more space for people who actually have a clue about the industry, and I'd love you to meet some of my instructors and tell them that they are in dead end jobs!

Oh, and as for earning more than 18k as a brand new, minimum hours instructor, you jest surely?

[OBK!]

tabards,

Ignore these lot. I wouldn't take the 18k job either, having no debts is great but still, that's not enough for any single guy starting out. Leave the turboprops to the desperate ones.

More to the point, I hear Virgin are currently recruiting frozen ATPL (that's what you've got) on the 747 (that's what they fly), only those with no debts or financial complications accepted though so you're straight in the minority bracket. I believe starting pay is 60k, 650hrs working hours a year with company car and profit share. Time to command less than 4 years aswell.

[airmuster]

I'm with you avrodamo this is got to be a wind up.

Tabards...... by now you should be at the door of your new employer if you have gotten the gist of what these posts have informed you to do. I hope that you do not let on to your instructor that you have been on Pprune as he may be able to add 2 & 2.

If I was your father, I would by now be suffering from severe embarrassment and probably thinking of how I could give you a fair kick up the arrrssse and get you to repay the money that your mother and I foolishly paid out with good intentions.:*

[r44flyer]

I wouldn't look a gift horse in the mouth and request more salary, they will hand the job to the next guy who will gladly take it off your hands for the salary offered, believe me.

There are a lot of folks who take instructor jobs as a stepping stone to build hours towards getting an airline job. They might be good instructors, but they also might be just staring out of the window at the shiny jets on the tarmac. This is one of the reasons FI pay is as low as it is, as schools take advantage of 'hour builders'. Career instructors, teaching CPL/IR etc, can expect a high salary in comparison.

You'd be crazy not to take the job you've been offered. If you turn it down it might be a long time before you get another offer. You are in possibly the most fortunate position you can be in in this career and you have no debt, so you are the exception to the rule in any cases I've ever heard of.

Take the job, build 1500hrs experience, then if you want you'll be in a much better position to move onto something bigger and better in the future with a starting salary of £40k+.

[WindSheer]

Did you actually do any research as to what the job is all about these days??

I reccommend you DONT take the job and keep chasing the money, to leave a bit of room for the guys that are busting their guts to get that first job....:ugh:

I don't think £35,000 is too much to ask for a starting salary, after all, over £50,000 was spent on my training. If you value yourself less, then employers will exploit you.

......and prepare to be exploited....!!

[shaun ryder]

If I were you, I would consider growing up a little. Take a step out of the cotton wool which you seem to be wrapped up in. Have a look at the real world and stop talking bollox.

Some people, who do they think they are eh? :rolleyes:

[gunit]

i reckon if you can hold out another week, BA will be knocking on your door! i'm sure they will offer you around £100000 as year.:ugh:

[boeingbus2002]

I would say take the job on one condition...
Ask them (sorry TELL them) that you are worth more and want the £35,000 minimum. On your way out of the office, please close the door behind you as the gusts of wind will blow the piles of CVs all over the place:D

On a serious note, you wont find a first job with super pay so easily. BTW which company is this and where did you do yr training?

[Hufty]

...wind up...:zzz:

[AvEnthusiast]

Hey Getns,

I was wondering if someone can get a real job (FO) with 200+ hrs? What are the job oppurtunities for CPL/IR & ME holders with 200 hrs?

Regards,
AvEnthusiast

[assymetricdrift]

6 weeks to get a job? And you have a view like that?

It makes me feel really bad about our situation. Most of the guys I know have been looking for months and still do not have any leads. I've been looking for 2 months, and haven't had anything.

Take the job, accept the salary and just get on with it.

It's your first job, as with every first job out there, don't expect anything other than these conditions. £35000 as a starting salary though, and deluded when you don't get it? Negotiate? Stop being such a gold digger and get on with flying. There are many people out there, including me, who would sacrifice variosu parts of their body for a job offer like that right now.

[Kerosine]

Agreed assymetricdrift.

Tabards you have to understand who is in control and who has the advantage. They (the airlines) are not here to do you a favour just because you've spent a load of cash on training. Supply of pilots outstrips demand when it comes to newly qualified fATPLs, that means they can pick and choose, and also means they won't negotiate. Take it or leave it.

The other thing to note is you will have your type rating paid for. They will start you on a lower salary.

Please take the time to read the thread I posted above, it really is sobering to see the desperation and despondency newly qualified pilots with no job offer. It may put your feet back on the ground.



edit: thread mentioned above http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=284418 (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=284418)

[ford cortina]

The guys either a troll or a a:mad::mad::mad:ole from a intergrated school and has started to believe the bull:eek::eek::eek:t he has been fed.
Listen sonny why don't you go and play on the motorway until you grow up!

[Wee Weasley Welshman]

I smell a troll BUT if its genuine then the obvious advice is to take the job immediately. As you gain time in the industry you will then become aware of how lucky you were to get a job offer on a jet after 6 weeks with 200hrs.

After 5 years you will have enough hours to apply to Virgin or whoever it is that takes your fancy and your bond will have expired and you'll still be very young.

WWW

[G-SPOTs Lost]

Lets not discuss whether its a wind up up not, lets by a process of elimination work out who the employer is.....

18k per year
Employs newbees
Operate Jet Aircraft
Is an "Airline"

Answers on a postcard please...............:confused:

[Right Touch]

Definately a wind up merchant ! most likely practicing his routine for the EDI fringe festival in august :)

[Kerosine]

Tabards, I'm struggling to understand why you thought there was any hostility in people's replies (:rolleyes:muchos sarcasm)...

The guys either a troll or a a:mad::mad::mad:ole from a intergrated school and has started to believe the bull:eek::eek::eek:t he has been fed.
Listen sonny why don't you go and play on the motorway until you grow up!


Completely uncalled for, lowers the tone of the discussion and only aids in escalating tension what is already a 'delicate' issue.

[Wee Weasley Welshman]

Flybe are recruiting and they do hire people fresh out of training so this sort of scenario is quite possible.

The lack of appreciation for what such an offer represents and the expectation of a 35k starting salary is what suggested trollish tendancies.

But then maybe not. I've seen so many people spend so much money based on so little research that I perhaps should stop being amazed..

WWW

[avrodamo]

Tabard....If you decide not to go for the jet job, at least go and try and negotiate just for the hell of it. It would be top quality entertainment! I will have a fiver on you won't even have a job offer any more. No one is being hostile as such. We just can't believe what your saying, in an industry that we know pretty well, and in particular what it's like when getting that first job!

[The Ginger Prince]

If you have a problem with the idea of negotiating the raise yourself Tabard - have Daddy send one of his minions along with you.

[Kerosine]

Childish, Ginger. Is that your alter-ego username for posting inappropriate comments?

[The Ginger Prince]

Quite right Kerosine (sic) I stand corrected.:ugh:

[fade to grey]

How funny !
tabards you are either a complete tw*t or a wind up, either way very funny !

[1013 with altsel]

you dont know what you have until its gone !!! spoilt little boy!

[Put1992]

I may be still in education, and might not have as wide a knowledge about these things, But you are in a situation, which i would really like to be in within the next few years.

235 hours and being offered a job, and a ME jet type rating?.......£18,000 a year?

Take it, as it's been said, many would kill for this situation!

What FTO did you do your training with?

[denlopviper]

Tabards must be worn

well if you dont want it, tell them to hire me :E...

[airmiles]

I have more hours than Tabards and I have been looking for over a year, and I have no sniff of a job yet. I do not understand pilots like Tabards. Gosh you should be grateful that someone with so little hours and experience is offered such a position!! Give it to me if you don't want it!! I will gladly take it off your hands.

With whom have you had such luck? I would like to apply.

[Hufty]

..as G-SPOTs Lost said, I can't think who the employer could possibly be, hence why I reckon it must be a wind up.

Go on Mr Tabards, reveal the truth...unless he didn't susbscribe to this thread and is blissfully unaware that people (including me!) are still posting. More likely he is logging on from time to time to see how many pages his bogus thread is running to... :D

[Put1992]

Yeah, wind up. Join date 2nd March 08, same day he posted, and 2 posts, each in this topic. Plus his situation seems a tad farfetched.

My question is, why would someone go to the effort of lying?:=

[JB007]

As these are anonymous forums the origins of the contributions may be opposite to what may be apparent. In fact the press may use it, or the unscrupulous, to elicit certain reactions.

I would suggest ignore him guys...Tabards, to quote Alan Partridge, ...get yourself a girlfriend...

[Put1992]

I would suggest ignore him guys...Tabards, to quote Alan Partridge,
...get yourself a girlfriend...
:ok:
Wise words

[Adios]

Let's rephrase the question:

Should I become an FI to build hours in the hopes of later getting the job I already trained for and join the ranks of alleged dead-enders who hate the job they're in and dream of an airline job?

or

Should I take the airline job I trained for and build hours in that job so I can go on to a better one a bit easier in a few years?

Did it ever occur to you that if you do the FI/hour building route, you might end up two tears from now with the exact same or worse type of job offer?

You'd better keep your identity and the airline's secret or a stampede of unemployed Pprune fATPL holders will crush you as they step over you in a rush to fill the vacancy you are unenthusiastic about.

[avrodamo]

Hello......Hello.....tabard....are you there?

[Flintstone]

Classic trolling. Post once, forty two responses.

Eight of ten for effort but lacks originality. See me afterwards.:D

[Wilton Shagpile]

...post number 44 now. Well done Sir! :D

[usedtofly]

C'mon dudes, this does make entertaining reading!

Mods, why not move it to Jet Blast?

Oops, gotta go now. I just need to finish off that letter to HQ demanding 50 grand more per year................................

UTF;)