Phones in Aircraft

[llondel]

A good one today (technically yesterday, but I haven't been to bed yet). Push back from the gate at SFO, rumbling down the taxiway to the runway end, I suddenly realised the guy in the seat in front of me was talking on his phone. Probably fortunately for him, the woman sitting across the aisle from him managed to get him to stop, I was on the verge of waving/signalling to the cabin crew to come and have words.

[fendant]

Italian or Chinese ?

Frank

[Platinum206]

Billybuds,

Source??

Thats a very sweeping generalised statement. Which I feel I must correct.

True, mobile phones pose a very little threat to modern airliners, however there have been many documented cases where phones have been attributed to navigational errors etc. These cases which I refer to, are out there, before you ask my source, I've read them, but am simply far too lazy to find right now!! :)

P206

[VS-LHRCSA]

Regardless of whether it is dangerous or not, it is still a blatant disregard for the airline's rules and going against a direct order given by the cabin crew during their safety demonstation.

[TightSlot]

billybuds - there's a lot of history in this forum on this subject: I think you need to read it before you post on this subject again.

Welcome to PPRuNe.

[MudCrab]

I have had many internal flights in the Russian Federation ,and they use their mobiles during taxi,takeoff,cruise,landing....and none of them show any concern at all..



:}

[ford cortina]

Could not agree more, cheeky bugger must think he is above the law.

On a side note a little bit off topic, Billybuds, You should be very careful in believing everything you are told.
I am not for one second having a go at your instructor or even your school, I am mearly stating that as a Professional you should question everything and always check with the relevent authority, be that Boeing, Airbus Manuals, JAA etc. A fellow pilot and I were disscusing this very subject over a coffee yesterday in Casablanca, it was regarding a Boeing procedure, but if you follow what Mr Boeing says, then you are fireproof.
Good luck with your studies

[Bus429]

EK and others will be offering the use of mobiles in flight. Simply put, the aircraft is equipped with mini cells that prevent the mobile from using its search mode and consequent higher output.
I deplore the use of mobiles. Flying is (was) the last refuge from these bloody things! I have one but it is switched off when driving, travelling in a train or flying.

[FHA]

Billybuds: your "Air law ground instructor" is obviously working on the basis it's never affected him or any of his crewroom buddies.
I know a lot of G.A. pilots use them in the cockpit but at least you've got control if there's a flight deck effect.

[chrisr150]

Flying is (was) the last refuge from these bloody things

Not quite, so was the London Underground, but look what they're bloody doing to that too! :* Mobiles, pah! Can't live with 'em, can't live without 'em, can't get away from the damn things either!

[llondel]

Quite apart from upsetting anything during critical flight phases (there are still mentions of EMC and Gordon Brown's motorcade on the BA 777 thread), GSM mobile phones don't work too well in flight because (a) you're likely to hear too many base stations and (b) there's a maximum speed limit of about 200mph, based on how fast the base station can tell you to adjust the timing of your packets so they arrive in the correct slot. Those airlines intending to use microcells on-board will avoid this issue because they'll be on very low power, the phones will also be on very low power and the base station will be stationary relative to the phone.

As for not interfering, it probably depends on where you are in the aircraft relative to the wiring and instruments - I expect the fuselage makes a good circular waveguide. We've probably all heard the characteristic noise on audio equipment when a nearby phone fires up. I could see that some stuff will be happily immune, there are items that, while tested for EMC, may still be susceptible to high levels of RF. There's a road past Fylingdales in Yorkshire, site of a US radar base, and it's not unknown for the field strength when things are operating along that road to exceed 50V/m, which is what road vehicles are tested to.

Anyway, regardless of whether it's safe or not, the direct instruction from the crew was to turn off such items and he ignored it.

[Cap'n Arrr]

I've seen mobile phones directly causing navigation aids to read incorrectly with my own eyes. There are also numerous cases of it interfering with the new FADEC systems in new light planes, which are not at all dissimilar to any of the equivalent systems in an airliner. I've seen the proof it has an effect, because I've seen the effect. And yes, it was exactly in time with the datdadat coming though the speakers.

Just turn the :mad: things off.

[Pax Vobiscum]

Absolutely agree, malc4d - if active mobiles pose a non-trivial threat, we should replace the pointless 'shoe scanners' at the gates with 'mobile scanners'. But now the airlines have discovered a way to make a extra few (hundred) quid a leg by installing on-board picocells*, they're going to be actively encouraging mobiles to be turned on in flight.

Funny old world, isn't it?

* Yes, the picocells will be configured to maintain all the mobiles at their lowest operating power levels, but (at the risk, nay certainty, of repeating myself) what happens when the system fails???