Silverstone Brief 2008 & 2009

[plus expenses]

A warning to my fellow operators. I have just received details of the brief for Silverstone 2008 which contained the following:

'This briefing is mandatory for every pilot, without exception, who intends to fly in to Silverstone during the 2008 GP event. This is upon the assistance the Silverstone ATC, the CAA and Silverstone Circuits Ltd.'

I phoned to question this and it is accurate, they really mean that EVERY individual pilot who will be flying in will have to attend.

For our company this will mean not being able to take regular clients to work Monday morning, paying several freelance pilots a days wage and a lost duty day for us all. And all this on the 30th June.

Not clever.

Seems to me that this is poorly thought through and would suggest to other operators and freelance pilots that they contact Silverstone ATC and/or their FOI to put their case.

[misterbonkers]

surely a better approach would be to make it mandatory for low experience pilots I.e less than 1000hrs, all first timers, and AOC chief pilots/deputies for briefing other line pilots who have flown into silverstone before?

[THE EQUALISER]

Has the world gone mad!!!:ugh: Does the CAA really have the authority to ground all aircraft on the 30th June, as this is effectively what will happen if all pilots are summonds to Turweston?

[Brilliant Stuff]

When I did it in '97 and '98 they had relaxed it to cascade briefing by the individual who had been to the briefing. I guess they did not like the quality this achieved and therefore hardened their stance. I think if you have done it twice it should be safe to have briefing from the chief pilot about the changes.

[Flashover999]

Great!

1 days wages lost!
Expense of driving up there.

Why do we let them get away with it??

If we all said "B-----x" then they would have no money coming in that day (All those landing fees!!) and would rethink!

Arghhhhhhhhhh!

[manfromuncle]

I think they should make you sit a Silverstone groundschool exam before being allowed to fly. Of course, this exam would only be valid for three years. ho ho.

I am constantly suprised there is ANY helicopter flying in this country due regulation and cost.

[Bravo73]

I think they should make you sit a Silverstone groundschool exam before being allowed to fly. Of course, this exam would only be valid for three years.


That would make sense. Then, at least you'd know that some of the chumps had bothered to read the brief... :mad:


;)

[pitot212]

It has always been mandatory at the Silverstone brief, but some companies like Bristow were allowed to send a senior pilot who was then responsible in making sure all attending pilots were properly briefed. If this has been stopped then the briefing room at Silverstone will be too small and perhaps the Royal Albert Hall might just accommodate!!!!

[johned0]

Calm down peeps

pitot212 is correct, nothing has changed since I started going - not as long as some of you old boys I admit.

Maybe some of you regulars just haven't read the brief over the last few years to know that it is "mandatory" reading ;-).

There are ways and there are ways.

John

[Milky Milky]

I agree with misterbonkers
its same old, same old every year. There is never anything in the brief that could not be relayed by a co worker.
It is just coveryabackelitis from a non regulated body who answer to nobody and don't have to compete in a comercial enviroment to make any money. I believe this is the platform to say enough is enough. Lets show the bureaucrats at cash and aggro that this over regulation is unacceptable.
If you have flown in before they can't seriously insist you bin a day at work to drive to Northants to listen to two minutes of diffrences from last year. Everybody, bombard Fred Angry with your complaint and if nessasery lets get organised and boycott the brief. If push came to shove would they realisticaly stop a hundred plus experienced pilots carrying passengers willing to pay there £550 landing parking and taking off fees?

[Bravo73]

Everybody, bombard Fred Angry with your complaint and if nessasery lets get organised and boycott the brief.


Why should Fred care?

He's the CAA Chief Examiner. The Silverstone brief hardly falls under his jurisdiction.

[Hughes500]

I have just read the proposal with disbelief. I could understand the issue 5 or 6 years ago when one had to wait outside the tra for permission to enter and take up the hold with 20 other machines. Last flew in 3 years ago with an owner, no holds no waiting ,straight in with a 10.35 slot time. Now the amount of helis is down why such a big breifing for everyone, hardly needed.
It would be funny if no one attended, Silverstone needs to wise up , not only on this but its ridiculous landing fees ( 3 years ago twin squirrel £ 650 - makes Battersea seem quite cheap, talk about taking the michael )
Think this will be another nail in the coffin of punters flying in as prices will be going up !

[manfromuncle]

This briefing is mandatory for every pilot, without exception, who intends to fly in to Silverstone during the 2008 GP event. This is upon the insistence the Silverstone ATC, the CAA and Silverstone Circuits Ltd.Maybe we should all invoice them 'en-masse' for our time/expenses to attend the brief.

[Whirlygig]

Daft question from daft bint - how can they police it?

So Tarquin the pilot is due to be flying in to Silverstone but, he cannot make it so he briefs his no. 2 Torquil to do it. Torquil bowls up to the circuit, does everything by the book but Silverstone ATC say

SATC: What is your name?
Torquil: Torquil Proot.
SATC: Did you sign the school register when you came to the briefing?
Torquil: No, I didn't.
SATC: Well, you can't land here, go away.

Seriously, how would it work in practice?

Cheers

Whirls

[Bravo73]

Daft question from daft bint - how can they police it?


Only a guess but:

A Silverstone callsign is only allocated if there is a corresponding signature on the 'I've attended the briefing' sheet.

IIRC, Special Branch/Silverstone need passenger manifests for each flight (including the pilot's name.) These names could then be cross checked against the 'I've attended the briefing' sheet.

[Whirlygig]

So if a pilot was ill on the day, a replacement pilot can't be used? Everyone had make sure they're up to date with their jabs and take lots of Vitamin C and zinc then! :}

Cheers

Whirls

[manfromuncle]

Special Branch/Silverstone need passenger manifests for each flight

Special branch? I thought that was just for flights to/from foreign countries?

[Whirlygig]

Foreign countries? I thought it was just Northern Ireland!!! :}

Cheers

Whirls

[pitot212]

For Silverstone terrorism is a major concern hence the need for SB. Whirls with regards to your comment earlier you are not that far from the truth.Bravo73 is right and on your initial call to Silverstone pilots must confirm all the details of the aircraft. Like the bouncer at the door says.. if your name is not on the list then you ain’t coming in!

[nigelh]

luckily my pilot has changed his name by deed poll to the same as mine so either of us can fly in :ok: We will be in and out a lot each day doing some charter and maybe some lease work as well ....( whatever the difference is ..)
I think the time has come for the campaign against aviation to get a lesson in reality !! First thing to be done is to get all aoc operators to withold all payments and operate legally without the certificate ...that may just make them take notice and realise that they are killing the goose....:ugh:

[manfromuncle]

How many pilots are going to have to attend this? Must be hundreds? Sounds like they need a massive venue.

Why cant they just post it on-line? make a video of the lecture and stick it on youtube? Save us all a day in lost wages and petrol money.

[misbourne]

The brief is great but only if its your first time. Things dont change much for old timers and like most of these events briefings once you have got up at 5 am driven 150 miles only to hear "things are the same as last year" by the time you have driven 150 miles home you wish you hadnt of bothered

[Helinut]

Tis absurd but that is aviation in the UK, I am afraid..........

The only helicopter they like is one with its rotor blades removed

[plus expenses]

It is my understanding that this has been proposed because of the poor flying standards at Silverstone 2007. As I was cut up twice by the same company (who were later hauled into ATC for a chat) I have some symapthy, but I am not convinced that this is the way forward.

A more practical solution to me would run along the lines of:

1. All Chief Pilots/ Senior Pilot to attend
2. All pilots who haven't flown in before to attend
3. All pilots of Non UK registered aircraft have to attend
4. Pilots who haven't attended the brief have to sign for receiving a brief (including details of who briefed by). This is returned to Silverstone ATC (as per Cheltenham)
5. Any pilot who misbehaves on the day is held until all other helis have left and invited for a chat with Feds on Monday with their Chief Pilot.

[heli_ben]

What are the restrictions for Silverstone on race weekend?

Can PPL(H)'s go in?

Thanks,

HB

[Bravo73]

What are the restrictions for Silverstone on race weekend?

Lots and lots. For starters, you will have to attend the obligatory brief.


Can PPL(H)'s go in?

Yep. But IIRC, on race day (ie Sunday) you have to be on the ground quite early. Something like 8am. The practice days are a bit more relaxed.


HTH

[plus expenses]

As the person who originally started the thread, it is only fair to say that I have had it confirmed that the CAA are not insisting that every pilot attend a pilots brief.

This requirement has come from Silverstone itself and the CAA were wrongly/unfairly included in the original email.

[FloaterNorthWest]

Plus Expenses,

Agree with most of your list apart from number 3. Think it should be all non-UK pilots and not all pilots of non-UK Aircraft that should attend.

There are a lot of very experienced Silverstone pilots fly N and M reg aircraft.

FNW

[scooter boy]

"What are the restrictions for Silverstone on race weekend?

Can PPL(H)'s go in?"

Sure you can Pilot Ben.
Provided you are happy to vicariously give the diminutive, gorgeous-wifed, mop headed and already adequately wealthy Mr Bernie Eccles-cakes approx £500.
This massive amount does not even include entry to the grand prix!!!!!

I choose not to pay these extortionate rates!

Turweston is my HLS of choice for IIRC £10 or so. No mandatory briefing although there is an AIS that you can self brief with on the internet.
Take a folding bike or moped and make the trip to Silverstone at your leisure saving the (equally outrageous) £80pp 4x4 x-c transfer from Turweston to Silverstone and you will miss the traffic and get to the race a wealthier, healthier man.

If you take the Mrs she will undoubtedly admire your frugality, enjoy the exercise and be happy to spend the £490 saving on shoes etc... thus working further in your favour and against the dark forces of daylight robbery that pervade Formula 1.

PM me for more info on budget grand prix.

SB

[JimBall]

Only in the UK......... can you fly across the world's busiest international airport at 500ft "crossing behind the landing Singapore 747", "holding at the taxiway", "are you visual with the taxiing BA 747 ?"

Only in the UK........we don't trust you to land at a dedicated heliport, operated for over 20 years, where you will have no conflicts with FW in the middle of an old airfield in the middle of nowhere. Even if you've flown into this event 100 times in the past, you must forego a day's wages and attend a briefing onsite.

Somebody please see some sense. A Flash Player briefing browser, a downloaded docs pack and then a random-generated individual password which will release your slot number only after you've read and acknowledged every document.

It is that simple. And it's safer because despite the "signing on" requirement, there is still no proof that the signer has paid any attention.

Wake up SilverSTONE AGE!

[Bladecrack]

Hello all,


Where do I register to attend the brief?

BC

[notar]

Do I need a briefing to fly into the briefing:rolleyes:

[Brilliant Stuff]

No.

I flew into Silverstone when it was celebrating 35 years of the Mini. I was briefed on the phone plus some paperwork in the post.

[albatross]

I would like to see the changes if the Siverstone folks were to organize the Oshkosh fly in this year.:E

http://www.airventure.org/2008/flying/index.html

:ok:

[CRAZYBROADSWORD]

it does seem a bit daft as last year the only problem I saw and I had 7 trips in and out was some realy bad flying in the hold by one EC120 which was up and down from 1200 to 2200 on each lap, and I dont think a brief will stop that.

I think it should be a must for peeps who have not been in before and for one person from each outfit intending to go.

oh and could people stop calling north point half a mile before they get there cheers xx

[EESDL]

......will now mean that pilots will call 1 mile before they get there.....
off to fill tank up for the journey south for briefing.....
if they say "Not much different from last year" or words to that affect I will make out an invoice then and there for my time, trouble and expense.....

[ShyTorque]

Briefed myself this year.

Avoid all problems. Don't go. Thank you.

[500e]

Well that link seems to cover most eventualities albatross, perhaps we should get them to organise the GP as well, how many aircraft & helio movements do they have over the show?

[EESDL]

............and that ladies and gentlemen was Mandatory............

[Bladecrack]

Where do you go if you are flying into the south area to park up and you arent watching the race?

[120torque]

there are usually seats and snacks in the terminal area. also if wx permits then sit on the bank at Club and watch the race. Last year there was a mad Italian bloke trying to get rid of loads of wine between abbey and bridge. Suggest the other seat if you participate !!! Theres a big screen near Bridge aswell.

[ShyTorque]

I suggest you take some heavy duty earplugs, a packed lunch, and all the Sunday newspapers. Otherwise you might get so bored you might even feel the need to read the flight manual. If you're lucky, you might need your sunglasses too. If not, an umbrella.

Glad I'm not having to attend - I'm doing another, regular run instead. Enjoy! :ok:

[sycamore]

Well,no-one seems to want to spill the beans over the `briefing`.Was it all worth it,anything new,or is everybody still stunned ?

[EESDL]

earplugs then search out empty winnebago full of Hospitality Girls that you've pre-arranged to meet there........not sure what the earplugs are for.....could alays tell said PR girls that they're Cheesey Puffs!

[Flingingwings]

EESDL,

Or that they've got 'Cheesey Puffs' in which case you'd almost certainly need the ear plugs :E

[Qualityman]

EESDL,

You mean the PR girls still talk to you? Do you still wear the Hawaiian shirt?
:}

QM

[jemax]

Scroll forward to Sunday, this should make things interesting!

BBC - Weather Centre - Coast and Sea - Atlantic Pressure Charts (http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/coast/pressure/#no_url)

[DMW2007]

Hi all

Some questions re Silverstone and flying into the F1 in 2009:

Can PPL's and owners self flying still go in?? Previous posts on this thread seem to indicate they can but is this still the case?
How much??
When is the 2009 briefing that seems a mandatory pre-requisite?

I have checked the Silverstone website and seen the contact name but would like some info prior to speaking to them.

All info gratefully received.

[Bladecrack]

DMW2007,

Drop Bob D. an email or give him a call and he will answer all your questions! He responed promptly to my emails, and was very helpful and friendly when I spoke to him last year. Cost depends on which day you go in, slot times, heli type, handling required or not etc. I flew in for the first time on race day last year, with no holding and no problems, the master plan seemed to work well!

ATC were very good and even let me shoot a practice approach on the Saturday, and the radio procedures worked fine. We parked up in the Southern heliport on race day and managed to get fuel after a short delay because the bowser ran dry! The briefing was a bit over hyped on here, but I can understand why you need to attend if you have not flown into Silverstone before.

Good luck.

[Satcop]

This year there are two briefings, the usual one at Silverstone and an additional one at Redhill which will follow the Epsom/Ascot Briefing in May.

The idea being to make it easier for pilots/operators to attend.

[DMW2007]

Hi again

Thanks for the advice. I've e-mailed Bob Downs at Silverstone and will post any info he gives me if I think it will be useful to others.

[101BOY]

Anyone have any updates on briefing dates?

[DMW2007]

The main Silverstone briefing is on Monday 15th June 2009 starting at 11:00 local at Silverstone. The alternative is at Redhill on Wednesday May 27th 2009 at 13:00. As Bladecrack said in a previous post if you contact Bob Downs from the Silverstone website he is very helpful and will send you all the info you need.

[101BOY]

Cheers:ok: