Doubt is Killing Me

[mustflywillfly]

Dear All,

HELP! Not a great way to start a thread but I am in need of some advice and need to "bounce" my thoughts off some aviation-minded people.

Please bare with me.....

I started to fly at 17 with an RAF Flying Scholarship, joined the RN at 21 as a pilot and spent 4 years in flying training, I wanted fixed wing, I ended up on rotary, hated it, wasn't very good at it and have since been flying a desk. I am now 32.

I have a PPL, I fly for fun, although I haven't flown since May 2007.
There is no DOUBT I enjoy flying and all things to do with aviation, seeing even a light fly over still gives me a buzz.

For the last 6 years I have been wondering if I should pack the Navy in and train to become a commercial pilot. I would be happy with instructing if it paid well enough. Well I made my mind up and am now leaving the RN on the 03 April to train for a CPL and the FI(R) rating. I have already started ATPL distance learning. This is with a view to instructing for a year then doing the IR an then looking for a RHS Turbo-Prop job.

My problem is that I am now worried (so much it is keeping me awake at night) and have major doubts if I am doing the right thing. I love aviation but will working in this environment in the Civil world not be what I am hoping for? I could spend the £22k that I have saved on an aeroplane or a share and stay in the RN, continuing to fly for fun. I earn £42k per annum and will be taking a 70% pay cut for quite a few years. In fact realistically it will take at least 5 years to get back to that level again. I do HATE the RN now and what it has become and getting up in the morning is very hard work. I might just be panicking as the clock is ticking down?

Would you stay or would you go? Would you invest that £22k into a business venture, leave the RN and then hope that the business is a success and that you can then afford to fly at your leisure and just for fun. Or would you exercise those demons and give it a go, nothing ventured, nothing gained etc.

There is also the complication that changing careers will make me totally dependant on my girlfriend for at least the next five years!

Sorry to sound so morose and sodding miserable.

Any thoughts would be greatly apreciated.

MFWF :ok:

[5150]

Check your PMs . . . :t

[boogie-nicey]

Bravo for taking this topic seriously. It appears that many people these days are easily seduced by their dream and I guess there's nothing wrong with that perse but it's usually at the expense of a well thought out plan. In the case of MustFlywillFly here's a chap who's taking the prcatical route and attemtping to plan for all eventualities and outcomes, well done sir. Though I can't necessarily offer an additional advice on the topic I believe with your common sense it should hopefully make the most rational decision in the end and perhaps one from which you could benefit.

Good luck :ok:

[G SXTY]

It's the squillion dollar question, and I'm afraid only you can answer it. For what it's worth, I also agonised over changing career for a long, long time. Not from the navy in my case, but from a very safe, sensible, well paid career in logistics. Unfortunately it was also extremely boring.

Once flying got under my skin (about two minutes into my trial lesson) I knew in my heart it was all I wanted to do. Getting my head to agree with my heart took a bit longer, and financing the whole thing took longer still. At the risk of stating the obvious, the main concern was the risk of not finding a job - even the best pilots can lose their medical or qualify just as the industry starts a downturn. In the end, however, I decided it was a risk worth taking. Worst case, I would have spent £45k on a licence I couldn't use for anything, but at least I had a career to fall back on. In other words, as long as I could still pay the bills, it was worth going for it.

I left my old job last summer, finished the IR and MCC in November, and am now officially an unemployed pilot (it raises a smile down at the job centre). ;) I only miss two things about my old life - the money and my colleagues. Regrets? You bet - I wish I'd done it ten years ago.

My advice? As long as you've got a workable plan 'B', follow your heart - your head will catch up in the end!

[fatobs]

I was an Observer in the RN for 16 years.

Weighed up the options and deceided to get my licenses and ended up with 3 job offers within 1 month of leaving the Navy, now flying with the company I always wanted from the base I always wanted so it was worthwhile.

Your background is similar to mine and so I think it would not be too great a risk, economic situation depending.

PM me if you want to know any more.

[mustflywillfly]

Chaps,

Thanks for the replies. Some re-assurance has been achieved!

As for going the FI route, it is purely based on finances. Namely that I will not be in a position to afford the IR until August 2009 and thought that if I make the jump now then at least I can build some experience over the year whilst earning just enough to contribute £300 a month to the living budget.

There are no guarantees with life and it can always throw up a few suprises. It takes big balls to make the jump and I think the priority now has to be setting up a very viable fallback plan. This seems more important particulalry at the moment with an economic downturn in the midst.

Thanks.

[Shlarm47]

It seems that there are alot of us who are in a similar situation. At 32 unfortunately I don't have my PPL (yet), however I got the flying bug whilst in the CCF flying chipmunks some 18 years ago.

So far I have failed on every hurdle.... Unfortunately I am mildly short sighted and as a result couldn't fly for the RAF/RN and as a result my career advisor suggested that I join the Army as their eyesight requirements were less stringent. So I worked hard, went to Uni, got an Army Bursary, complete Sandhurst and passed the AAC aptitude test. Only to fall at the medical, yes eyesight :ugh: Well, what would any failed wannabe do. I joined the Royal Artillery as an Air Defence officer, thinking if I can't fly the buggers I'll shoot them down!

After completing 3 years of a Short Service Commission I then applied for the BA sponsored scheme in June 2001. The scheme was closed after 9/11. I soldiered on and ended up leaving the Army in 2005.

After 3 years working for a bank I am now in a healthy position and about to qualify as a Chartered Surveyor, however, the dream is not at an end just yet. I aim to start my PPL next month, completing it within the year and then to distance learn my atpl theory and hr build before starting my ME/IR/CPL/MCC full time (in that order). My goal is to complete all of this within a 2 - 3 year timeframe.

There are so many things to take into account when changing career/leaving the Forces, and life always seems greener on the other side. Civvi Street and banking isn't all bad, it's the 3 - 4hr, round trip, daily commute at a cost of £6k per year that gets me down. Not forgeting that there's no guarantee of a seat and the tube.... I'd rather forget about the London Underground! As a result of the cost of travelling and pension payments my annual salary is less than it was when I left the Army as a Captain three years ago!

I believe it is sensible having a back up plan. There are loads of threads about qualified pilots paying for TR, and some lucky guys getting jobs extremely quickly without. My suggestion is not to put all your eggs in one basket, however if a flying career is your dream..... chase it. You only live once and if you don't give it your best shot you may live to regret it.

With the banker head on - starting out on a new business venture is equally as risky, and you will still need to draw a salary from the business. The banking / economic environment is currently uncertain and I probably wouldn't look to start something up at present (perhaps that's why I'm a banker). If I was in your position I would follow the dream and also get an instructor rating, at least in the event you don't get a RHS immediately you have a fall back option in the short term.

[Wee Weasley Welshman]

I'd say go for it. Staying In whilst loathing it is never an agreeable situation. Your timing might be a little off as the US recession leads us into a UK recession and the comfort of a secure job will be looked at longingly.

Good luck,

WWW

[chris-squire]

MFWF - I battled between my heart and head for 2 1/2 years before I finally decided to take the plunge. I would have to say that it was the most difficult decision I've ever faced and even now with only 6 1/2 weeks before I fly out to Canada to start my training with PPL etc I have some nagging doubts. I don't doubt that this is what I want to do 110% for a second but there are times I still think "christ am I being brave or bloody stupid!", there's a fine line between the 2 I think! :confused:

For me it doesn't quite seem real yet as I've wanted to do this for so so long and it hasn't sunk in that it's finally happening. 99% of me is absolutely over the moon and am like a 5 year old at x-mas with excitement about what's to come. But there's that little 1% that says "are you mad?!".

I don't think you would be normal if you didn't have some doubts and I think doubts keep us on our toes and whilst the decision is ultimately yours I would say GO FOR IT mate! You only live once and if it means that much to you then have a go at chasing it. If you fail, well you've got something to fall back on. If you succeed then you'll join the lucky few who get to fulfil their lifetime ambitions! :ok:

Good luck whatever happens fella. PM me if I can be of any help.

CS :)

[mustflywillfly]

Very touched by the thoughtful replies guys. I think the subject of this thread has obviously struck a chord with anyone who has gone down this route with their eyes open.

It sounds a bit pathetic but your feedback has actually made my day and I feel far more comfortable now then I did at 0800 this morning.

Cheers

MFWF:ok:

[chris-squire]

MFWF - No worries. I was in a very similar boat only a 6 months ago and know how hard it is. As long as you carefully plan your contingencies then you'll be fine. I sat my parents and girlfriend down before I sent my business plan off and made sure they knew exactly what the implications of my training would be for them. They were all very supportive and myself and whole family know what I will be doing and when. If your family are aware of whats to come and your contingencies are in place then definitely try and go for it mate! :ok:

[G SXTY]

Chris is right - it's perfectly normal to have doubts and think "what the hell am I doing?"

There are few things that test your commitment as much as commercial flying training, and I've certainly had a few moments when I wondered if it was all worth it. Just a few examples:

- During PPL training, having my QXC postponed 13 or 14 times due wx.
- Arriving in Florida to build hours and discovering that 24 hours earlier, the government had decided to shut down my flight school.
- Turning up at the 'plan B' school 4 days later to discover they had also been shut down.
- Discovering that the 'plan C' school's C150 had a blocked fuel line. At 4,000'. Over the Everglades. At night.:ooh:
- Banging my head on the desk trying to understand General Nav and gyroscopes.
- Partialing the CPL skills test and knowing that one minor cock-up had just cost me £1,000.

I'm sure other people will have worse stories - the point is that despite all of that, I never gave up. Maybe I'm just a bit daft.

You don't have to be brilliant at anything to succeed in this game, you just need average ability and an absolute stubborn, pig-headed determination to get there in the end. :ok:

[Hyph]

Hey MWFW

Instead of struggling with the "should I, shouldn't I" question, ask yourself this...


What is my goal?


Look at what you do every day - is it helping you to reach that goal? No? Then why are you doing it?

You have a great advantage over many wannabes - you have already proven that you have what it takes. If the RN were willing to bet on you, why shouldn't you have the same faith in yourself.

Of course it is prudent to think and plan before you do something, especially something life-changing.

However, if you are compulsively thinking and re-thinking through the same scenario you end up in analysis paralysis.

There isn't going to be a perfect time or economic situation. Weigh up the pros and cons, make a decision, go with it and concentrate your efforts on making it happen.

This has been a public service announcement. :)

[Adios]

These sort of doubts are fairly normal, but part of the key is in your post. You wrote, "I do HATE the RN now and what it has become and getting up in the morning is very hard work."

So the question then is what to do once you are out of the RN. I like the one answer that says better to regret something you've done than something you we're afraid to do.

On the question of starting a business, you should know that most new businesses fail due to under-capitalization. £22K probably places you squarely in that category for almost any business you might consider. It will make a serious dent in the cost of a Modular fATPL course or a CPL/FI endeavour.

Just keep in mind that you need 250 hours before you even start an FI course and you can finish a Modular fATPL in about 250 hours. Perhaps you should go that route then if an FO job can't be found, take the FI rating.

[Farrell]

MFWF...

The decision is yours, as you already know.
What worries me, is not your commitment to training or getting your dreams, it is the unknown entity that is your girlfriend.

Depending on the finances of someone else for five years is a very high-risk situation.

Before you set out you need to look at the worse case scenario.

If you break up with her, what will you do for a roof over your head etc.

"She loves me and would never do that." - don't count on it!

Depending on her for five years severely limits her options and while she may be the sunshine of your life, things can get very dicey if her career path accelerates prematurely.

If she gets the chance of a lifetime in another country or if she gets swept off her feet overnight by someone who lives in Dubai and decides to head off there - well mate, you'd be royally knackered.

Remember as well that with the ATPL studies and the flight training, you are going to be on your chin-strap most days - if she's used to seeing a lot of you then that will change.

At 32, you have already built a life for yourself and your decisions to do this have a much wider knock on effect than if you were 19.

I wish you the very best of luck. It is a great life if you can get it, but have a long hard look at the one you have and check if it is possibly worth losing.

Farrell