Irrate passengers

[EC-ILS]

Hello everybody, was just wondering about people expierences with irrate passengers.

I work in a baggage office handling some major airlines so I get quite alot of annoyed people everyday, Ive worked in baggage for 3 years but today came across the most irrate passenger Ive ever seen, he really let go roaring and shouting all over the place!

Luckily security and the police were on it very quickly and he was soon forced to calm down, Ive had angry ones before so its like water off a ducks back at this stage?

So any similar expierences?

[TightSlot]

Irrational ire irritates the irate









Sorry

[James 1077]

I've noticed that people have been getting more and more fed up when it comes to things going wrong; but then you can hardly blame them as flying isn't exactly a stress-free activity nowadays!

[EC-ILS]

But in this situation there was no queue at immigration and bags were on the belt within 10 mins of flight arriving! He was missing 1 bag, we werent sure where it was though and all he did was make a show of himself.

[Final 3 Greens]

You can never tell why people act like this.

Maybe he was travelling home to bury a close relative or just found out he had a terminal illness.

Or had gone without sleep for 36 hours.

[13Alpha]

I had a bag delayed recently and while it's not acceptable to lose the rag in the way you describe with someone who a) wasn't to blame and b) can quite possibly help put things right, I do understand why people get so angry -

- they've given their belongings into the care of the airline
- the airline have failed to deliver them back to the owner on time
- the airline (quite often) can't tell the owner immediately where their bag is, and given recent media coverage they will likely fear it's been lost altogether
- the airline baggage service probably treats the pax and their lost bag as a routine incident - which it is for them, but for the pax it's quite likely a major inconvenience (especially if they're a frequent business traveller).

So first and foremost the pax is probably looking for a big fat apology and some sympathy from the airline, and in my recent experience at least that was absent.

13Alpha

[James 1077]

Unfortunately a large number of companies and people seem to be under the impression that saying sorry is an admission of fault. It isn't.

All it takes occasionally is a sorry and people realise that you understand and have sympathy for them; then you can try and work out what has gone wrong and where.

The lack of an apology is one of the reasons I sometimes lose my rag with call centre operatives and end up hanging up before I say something I regret (before having to call them again and spend another 20 minutes in the queue due to my call being completely unimportant to them, which is another reason for getting a little irate!)

[kwachon]

Ground staff who cannot spell make me IRRATE

[skydriller]

I feel 13a and James have summed up why pax get irritated, bags were probably the last straw on a long trip. You also saidLuckily security and the police were on it very quickly and he was soon forced to calm down
This is a new trend at airports whereby even the slightest dis-agreement about anything from a pax results in some member of staff either threatening to call, or actually calling, security - even when pax arguements are justified. And in todays hyper "T-word" environment many pax I feel probably bottle up the things they would once have made an issue of and invariably this leads to maybe the wrong guy who happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time getting an earfull !!

I am sure there are many on here travelling frequently, who these days find themselves "counting to 10" or muttering under their breath when ordered to jump through the latest pointless hoop or personal inconvenience - I know I have!!

I used to enjoy travelling by airline, really I did!! - However not anymore...

Regards SD

[Saintsman]

EC-ILS. Not that I am implying that it is you, but unsympathetic staff quite often tip the balance.

You know the type. The ones that don't give a damn and let you know it, or the ones that talk down to you etc etc

[jetset lady]

There seems to be two types of irate passengers. There are ones that have been pushed and pushed until they snap and then you have the idiots who think they make themselves look big and clever by trying to intimidate crew.

I've recently had experiences with both. The first was during boarding of a deep night L/H. We were already nearly 2 hrs delayed and I was called down to deal with a gentleman that had been abusive to a crew member. On speaking to him, I discovered that he and his wife were travelling with 3 young children, one of whom was disabled. They had been pushed from pillar to post all night by the airport staff and were not pre boarded as would be expected. This left them trying to settle 3 very tired and tetchy children in their seats while everyone else pushed past them. Eventually, the man, understandably, snapped and my crew member was unfortunate enough to be in the firing line. After offering a bit of sympathy and understanding, I quietly explained that it was unacceptable to shout at the crew and he calmed down and apologised, even going as far as to seek out the initial crew member to apologise personally to her too. (I then got to spend the next 10 minutes trying to divert a ground service agent who had heard that there had been a slight fracas and was determined to "sort" the passenger out. She was most upset at my refusal to tell her which passenger was involved but it gave me great satisfaction to ruin her big moment!)

The second incident was typical of the other type of irate passenger. Those who are just desperate for something to find fault with. Whilst in the flight deck, I heard a commotion at the front door. On coming out, I saw a gentleman stalking up the aisle muttering. When I asked him if there was a problem, he started shouting again and it turned out that he was furious because we were on a remote stand and he'd had to get on a bus to get to the aircraft. He was told in no uncertain terms that he either shut up or get off as I wouldn't put up with it! He shut up.

I suppose what I'm trying to say, in a very long winded way, is that I can understand why some people do lose it and every situation has to be approached differently. Air travel, in todays climate, probably ranks up there with some of the top stressful situations. However, one final word. Don't forget that those of us working in aviation, are also having to jump through those same hoops that you passengers are!

[bealine]

I can understand the initial outburst when things go wrong! What I can't understand is when people carry on the tirade unnecessarily.

The chappie who has ran halfway across the airport for a connecting flight only to see the doors at the gate firmly closed against him will naturally be upset, especially if an important meeting or job interview is at stake!

However, once the passenger has had the initial outburst, and starts to realise that there's nothing to be gained and that the staff in front of him/her are trying to make the best of a bad job, 95% will calm down and allow themselves to be guided along the route to Flight Connections for re-booking and re-ticketing! It is a very small minority who totally flip out and we end up either walking away and leaving them to "rage against the machine" in peace, or call security and/or the police if the tirade takes on a personal note.

Similarly, when someone's at the boarding gate asking about a Transfer Bag - honestly, what do they expect us to do if it's not been seen at the aircraft side? If it's missing, it's missing and most of the world's airports are far too big to locate a stray bag within the few minutes we're allocated to get the flight away!

Passenger Rage is in the increase, largely due to the promises made by airlines and the failure to deliver.

[MrSoft]

Spot on, JetsetLady. Regular travellers are philosophical 99% of the time when something goes wrong. Lost luggage especially, is just something that happens. The law of averages says it's my turn once or twice a year, so be it. I say this having just got in to DXB, waited 90 mins for luggage, 4 flights per belt simultaneously (!), whilst the rain dripped through the ceiling on us. All around me, huffing, puffing and effing; but after a while you just cope and go into your 'cocoon'.

I think the dangerous passenger profile is the (usually) male, (usually) middle class "king of the road" type, who probably flies once a year and has travelling companions to impress. I saw a truly frightening example of this species go berserk recently at MAN about a lost bag, f-in this, f-in that, and he even started ringing his relatives up "you will not f-in believe what these clowns have done".

Similarly, last year on the LHR-MAN shuttle, all of a 40 minute trip. CC bombed round with the drinks, and king of the road requested 4 gin and orange, to split between himself and his wife:confused:. He then had a tantrum when offered a mini carton of juice; "how am I supposed to open that then?" Poor BA girl had to do it for him. For these sort of pax everything is the last straw, "I want to see a supervisor" etc.

[Rwy in Sight]

F3G, I like your scenario that is often at the heart of a lot of issues. One can take something one day he is relaxed and snapped if it is the last of a series of bad one.

I think the issue has been put very correctly on an editorial of "Airline Business" back in March 1993. The moral of the story was that things go wrong but it is the way they are handled that makes a difference between a bad and an excellent experience.

Very often first line staff have very little authority to solve and issue and they may be tempted to show off they are important by refusing even to try to help a customer. (Metal helmet and kevlar jacket on). I am sure a very large percentage of rage incidence could be averted if the pax had the impression at least they are being really helped. And I believe given in general operations tend to go wrong there are model that can be used to forecast and provide the necessary resources at a fairly low cost to provide with pax issues.
Maybe top managers should spent time on front line when things go bad...

Rwy in Sight

[EC-ILS]

The only reason I brough this up was because of the way his outburst came.

I had not even opened my mouth to the ''guest'' before he blew off and it was the intensity of which he went off that made security come, I never called them!

[bealine]

...........and, of course, you get the ******s who won't accept that the airline has its own procedures for tracing missing bags, making complaints about the service and make unreasonable demands!

It is quite funny to all of us, but the people who NEVER lose their rag are the real "Ladies" and "Gentlemen" - the ones who used to fly Concorde and nowadays travel in the proper First Class and pay for their tickets without "mileage upgrades" - how vulgar! (not Business dressed up as "Business First" or some other dreary Americanism excuse for having got rid of "F" for economic reasons).

These people have nothing to prove - they are already big bosses of multi-nationals with no higher rung of the ladder to climb.

If the airline messes them around, they will very calmly and patiently return to the lounge, raise the pince nez or monocle, and very calmly start planning the way to get around the latest obstacle. When they approach the First Class lounge desk to ask the agent to help with something, it is with a very calm, polite, yet self-assured and authorative manner - the sort of approach that makes you want to bend over backwards to help!

This is what a good public school teaches - Eton, Harrow, Millfield etc teach far more than mere academic subject matter!

[SpamFritters]

:sad:
Not all of us people who sit in the back are baddies.
I always make an effort to be polite to all staff involved in getting me from A to B whether it is at check in, at the gate, on board or at the baggage collection.... what is the point in getting angry? It gets you no where at all!

I was lucky enough to be sitting in the back row of a 744 last July when coming back from Aus.. and got chatting to the stewardess who was sitting on that door...
Very nice lady and made the flight very pleasent.. especially interesting for me as I will hopefully be training as a pilot in the later part of the year.

That was also a great trip though... I went and 'charmed' the CC manager and was delighted when I was taken to the upper floor about 30 minutes before landing... and then shown into the cockpit whilst on the ground at Singapore... and had a really nice chat to the pilots.

Ok a bit off topic... but I think my point here is that if people are nice and charming every now and again instead of getting irate... they will get a lot more from the wonderful people who work at the airports and on the airliner.. who have to put up with abuse every day.
*give them a break*:)

[llanfairpg]

On the other side of the coin I have seen some very irrate ground staff and cabin crew.

Worst passenger was the one who stormed into the flight deck saying, how old is this aircraft, I want to know how old this aircraft is? I know there is a plate in here that says how old it is, where is it?

I wouldn't have minded but I was right in the middle of the Daily Telegraph crossword.

[SpamFritters]

yes to be fair I have too...

On a QF flight between Cairnes and Sydney (I think) the lady who was sitting in front of me put her big bag UNDER her seat... eg. I had no leg room! and I am a rather tall person...

So I politely asked her if she could move it so I could stretch my legs and she just said no..

I then asked the stewardess who was very helpful.... and told me it was my problem to sort out. :confused:

Is it just me... or is the space in the seat infront... the legs space?? Or is someone allowed to put their bags under their seat instead of infront??

[zed3]

Spam.....I believe the phrase used in the welcoming speech is " place your hand baggage in the locker above your head or under the seat in front of you ".

[10secondsurvey]

As a pax, when things go wrong, and staff don't care/won't help.

Don't get mad, get even. Stay calm, focus on facts, and then if the staff person has been impolite, non helpful or inattentive, send a written complaint to the airline concerned. At the very least it may help to ensure the said person doesn't get promoted.

Revenge is a dish best served cold. Just do not rise to the bait at the time, as airline staff hold all the cards whilst actually in the airport/aircraft, and you will lose.

As regards aggressive pax, I really think airlines need to think about it. If aggressive behaviour is increasing from pax, could it possibly, perhaps, just maybe be just a teensy weensy bit to do with the god-awful experience that airlines have turned flying into??

Or maybe they should just carry on blindly blaming their paying customers?

[Eboy]

First of all, you should never be treated with such disrespect. It is not your fault -- ultimately, it is a management issue.

Final 3 Greens makes an insightful comment that may be the cause, but still not acceptable.

I have a theory about matters such as this generally. What to you think? Here it is.

Apologies are all to common today. I'm sorry this. I'm sorry that. Scandal, abuse, crime, whatever, it is I'm sorry. I apologize. In the media, everywhere, the apology has lost its significance because it is used so much and often without sincerity. It is also one-way. So when they hear I'm sorry from you it does not sink it. Apologies are cheap. Goodness knows, we hear a lot of apologies when flying these days.

The solution is to make the apology two-way. Instead of saying "I apologize", say "Would you please accept my apology?' or "Please accept my apology." That gains some empathy from the complainant. It pulls them in. It is more sincere and somewhat disarming.

[SXB]

I hate to be the one to break this to some of the customer facing staff on this board but dealing with dissatisfied customers is a reality and requirement of your job. Some of the comments on this board underscores the generally poor levels of customer service which consumers in the UK enjoy today.

Somebody mentioned this being a management issue, which it is. In my experience many customer serving staff, especially airline staff, simply do not have the necessary skills for such a role. Clearly, their employers have failed to provide them with sufficient training. I've stood amazed in UK airports watching airline staff actually arguing with customers, when you see staff making such basic mistakes you do wonder if their management is actually aware of the shortcomings of the services they are providing.

Contrary to what some customer facing staff on this board may say, venting your anger at a service provider for screwing up your travel is perfectly acceptable as long as it doesn't overstep the bounds of civility. Personal insults, swearing, threatening behaviour are not acceptable but venting your anger certainly is.

[SpamFritters]

Zed3... thanks for the reply... as someone who travels a lot I am familiar with it but wasn't sure really if QF was different.... (although that would make no sense).
The other thing that annoys me is when people tuck their legs right back into my space.... especially if they manage to kick you nice and hard when your legs are stretched out and your asleep....:ugh:
Ah well... can't complain if I must always be a cheap skate in economy :p

Just a thought with customer service people...
If a staff member looks *interested* in my problem and actively trys to help me (even if they don't manage it) they certainly go down in my good books!
if they just sit there and do the little britain thing of "computer says noooo" then it just makes the person feel like they have encountered a brick wall... thus they kick off..... (as seen many times on Airline:E)

[iain8867]

SXB - Contrary to what some customer facing staff on this board may say, venting your anger at a service provider for screwing up your travel is perfectly acceptable as long as it doesn't overstep the bounds of civility. Personal insults, swearing, threatening behaviour are not acceptable but venting your anger certainly is.

What you say there is half the problem. If people vent their anger for a screwed up travel plans that is fine, if a bit annoying. The problem is that more and more these days it is becoming personal and threatening.

[John Hill]

I think the only time I have felt inclined to make an official complaint regarding cabin crew (in about 40 years as a frequent SLF) was when the lady seated next to me had a bad migraine and used the very handy water proof bag so I buzzed a CC to dispose of it. The git told me I could leave it under the seat (for 12 hours!:rolleyes:) or dispose of it in the toilet. I felt like pouring it into his pocket.:E

[James 1077]

On a QF flight between Cairnes and Sydney (I think) the lady who was sitting in front of me put her big bag UNDER her seat... eg. I had no leg room! and I am a rather tall person...

So I politely asked her if she could move it so I could stretch my legs and she just said no..
Isn't that when you take the bag out from under her seat and put it under yours? Lots of fun when it comes to her disembarking (especially if it continues like this until the back of the plane)!

Alternatively you could just stick it in the overhead lockers when she isn't looking!

[qwertyplop]

Sit there muttering to yourself and making clucking noises.

You'll never have another problem on board again.

[onboard]

Well, here's a little story to keep you amused:

We were boarding a 747 to god knows where, and I was in my galley trying to sort things out with a catering agent, when a female passenger stormed into the galley and initiated (on a scale of one to ten she went full ten) a conversation by screaming at me in italian. That day sadly not being one of my best, and with my fuse already at it´s shortest, I screamed right back at her to tone down. That stopped her dead in her tracks, she stormed out of the galley only to be replaced by her husband who screamed at me to not scream at his wife, to which I responded (still quite loud) that if he was used to being screamed at by his wife, fine, but I was not.
At that moment my purser happened to come by, took in the situation, grabbed me by the neck , hauled me to the other side and told me to go to the next galley and find something else to do for a while, which I did.
As it turned out the couple were angry about not sitting next to each other on a long haul flight. It also turned out, that the lady had mistaken the gate number for her seat number (happens all the time, just like pax pulling out the ash tray beside the rest room door overlooking the handle ON the door) and that they were in fact sitting exactly where they wanted, next to each other.
So, as I was sitting at my door after takeoff waiting for the fasten Seatbelts Signs to go dark, I was quite embarrased with myself at having handled the situation in such an extremely unprofessional manner and decided that before doing anything else, I´d go apologise to the couple.
When I got to their seats I did just that, and they told me that they were also embarrased with themselves and had already decided to apologise to me.
They then spent a good portion of the flight in my galley chatting with me and all of us laughing quite a bit about what had happened.
The lesson I took away from that is that you can get bad reactions for no reason on both sides. And it´s helped me stay calm in a lot of later situations that inevitably came my way.

[llanfairpg]

The lesson I took away from that is that you can get bad reactions for no reason on both sides. And it´s helped me stay calm in a lot of later situations that inevitably came my way.Excellent stuff.

Dealing with people is an art that few are born with and that includes me.

I am afraid I am one on the flight deck that will come out and say good bye to the passengers. We did a charter for a well known Scottish football club and we had to do a split duty, we were tech on stand outbound so we arrived about 3 hours late and had to extend the split duty by 3 hours, so we arrived at the aircraft outbound 3 hours late. Unfortunately no one had communicated this to the passengers and we had to have a police escort through the terminal building.

The cabin crew who all knew I always came out to say goodbye were taking bets on how badly injured I would be on return to Glasgow!

Sure enough I got a right slagging and as expected one rather large bald headed guy put his face virtually into mine and said "Your a xxxxing liar pal".

I still couldnt resist saying, "thank you and good bye" though!

[west lakes]

Those customers significantly affected will receive a personal letter of apology followed by details of compensation. This will be an automatic payment as a genuine offer of good will and paid directly into customers’ accounts or by cheque. There is no need to contact our call centre


Food for thought, from a water company website following a major incident affecting 20,000 customers.
This is in addition to the provision of water bowsers & bottled water (including delivery to known vunerable customers)
Yes they have to do it, but the compensation rules are such that customers would normally have to claim it.

[TheWestCoast]

My theory is that it is the less experienced traveler that will give you the most problems. Though not an airline or hotel employee, I deal with pax who have just got off commercial planes and anything involving delayed luggage or missed connections will drive the uninitiated crazy. The more experienced the pax, the greater the understanding of what went wrong, how to accept that this happened and how the problem will eventually be fixed (in the case of luggage).

By the way, my hat goes off to anyone who works in the US Air baggage office at LAS, you deal with more insanity than I can imagine.