LAN Ecuador, a crapy place to fly!

[Flircat]

To all those interested in joining LAN Ecuador, please don't do so. This company, a subsidiary of LAN Chile is nothing but a joke, one typical of Latin American airlines and specially those in Ecuador. Salaries are 50-60% below the regional average for B767 and A320 pilots and the roster is done by a chimp!, otherwise there is no way to explain why pilots are exploited the way the are. Actually a chimp will have more sense doing a rational roster for the pilots than the idiots in Chile managing this issue via remote control.

Also, the Chief of Operations in Quito is the owner of the show, so for all those F.O. joining, don't expect an UPG anytime soon unless you join his "pretorian guard" of ass lickers. And that won't look nice with fellow pilots in the company. Actually there is absolutely no UPG policy and it dependes solely on the mood of the Ops Chief and his pupils.

Well I hope this helps. Otherwise just talk to anyone who flies for any of the LAN companies.

[varigflier]

Same situation here in Brazil. The place just sucks.

[richard III]

Dear flircat:
Looks from your post that you washed out on a recurrent or something, I've been with LAN CHILE for a long time for and besides the usual chit chat that's common in any airline and a salary that may be low for asian or middle eastern standards, LAN sets the standard for Latin America. Otherwise being the market so active, I don't see why people like you don't leave for greener pastures. Your english is quite good so why don't you try EK or QR. I sure don't see any threads against LAN of the kind I see against EK or QR. Not that I'm not interested myself going overseas, but if you badmouth your outfit, your own market value and that of your colleages decreases. Like it or not, what you get out of LAN, if not money, is top notch training, and believe you me, I've seen colleages of yours making a flying carreer that they never dreamed of, had it not been for LAN. What they do with that experience remains entirely their choice...there's a world out there.

[chileno 777]

Richard III,

Would you pls provide current minimums required for LAN (Chile)? Can you pls also inform the starting salary for a F/O? What is the career plan for F/O? Promotions to Capt. happens when? Is LAN a career friendly?

Thanks

[FlyingOW]

Richard III,

That's a bit harsh isn't it? He is obviuosly a little dissapointed with the way things turned out at XL and is venting some of his frustrations. Not to say that the things in his post are not true..........they could be and probably are. What is clear, is that T&Cs vary from company to company (LA, LP, XL, LX, etc) and those endured by our Ecuadorian colleagues are not upto industry standards, even for Latin America.

FlirCat,

R III does make some good points, LAN is giving you an opportunity to fly some decent equipment, get a decent rating, build some decent experience, etc. Whether you choose to use this to land a job overseas is your call, otherwise what options do you have in Ecuador? It doesnt look all that rosey from where I am standing.....so best to suck it up and keep logging the flight time till something better comes along or you fall in favour with the powers that be and get your command. Best of luck with what ever you choose.

Saludos,

OW

PS. Are you on the bus or the 767? We (LP) have already lost 4 to EK, 5 to QR , 1 to EY, 1 to KingFisher, 1 to Vueling, 1 to Singapore Airlines, 1 to LCBusre and about 14 or so to our local competition TACA over the last couple of years, totalling about 20 to 25% of the work force:eek:

[richard III]

Chileno:
Check your PM's
Rgds

[richard III]

FlyingOW:
Harsh? I thought It was pretty good advice, no doubt colleages at XL can do better... much better. On the other hand the only way they can inprove their T&C's is letting the market talk. And if you were a recruiter for QR, SIA or EK, would you look at us after reading that post?
Anyway....good to know that somebody is looking beyond the pond.
Happy Landings

[FlyingOW]

Richard III,

Well I thought the whole "you must have washed out of recurrent" thing sounded a little harsh, but hey maybe its just me. I happen to agree with you that coming on here and airing ones dirty laundry is not the best thing to do, especially if looking overseas for a job, which is why I told him to suck it up. But I doubt that recruiters will take one guys post seriously, especially since most of those who left before us have done a great job at their new outfits. Recruiters now hold potential candidates from LAN as good prospects thanks to them.

You are right lets hope market forces take effect and finally reach Latin America, no signs though as of yet.

Best of luck with the job hunting,

Saludos,

OW

[chileno 777]

Richard III,

Thank you very much for your PM. :ok:

Have sent you a PM.

[altiplano]

richard/chileno-
i'd also be interested in hearing the answer to chileno's q's.

also how the scheduling works. is it possible to bid blocks, live outside of santiago and just commute for your pairing?

are there passes for regional flights if you commute?

send pm please & thanks.

alti.

[Valdiviano]

Richard, can you share the info with me to........
Regards

[leondelfierro]

want that info too...:} if its possible

[chileno 777]

I do not mind to share the information with all the ppruners and think that Richard III will not mind either, so pls find below answer to mine/your queries:

-Lan will have you/us with CPL/IR (do not require ME)
-Minimums anywhere from 200 hrs. up. LAN has a good ab ibnitio program. -Salary starts somewhere around usd $2000, going up with experience.
-Type of aircraft you get depends on the experience.
-Upgrades to Captain can go from 3-4 years up to 8 years, also depending where you are. Looks that it goes faster in Cargo or LXP than LANChile.

By the other hand would appreciate if somebody can answer: What is the age limit to apply to LAN for a F/O starting possition? Is is possible to apply with 34 years old? (CPL/ME +-200 hrs).

Rgds,
Chileno777

[EagleA25]

OW, Richard...
I agree with both of you. LAN is what you make of it, and a LOT of our (LP) colleagues made VERY good on it. They quadrupled their income by switching to companies in the Middle East or Europe where LAN is well known for their high standards in the training department.
To FlirCAT I would like to mention, that, like it is in almost every part of the aviation industry, if you are new to the business, you have to "pay your dues". Badmouthing something you can't change, don't like or just simply hate will not only make you unhappy and disliked, but in the long run, unsafe.
Now, remembering the beginning, I have friends who started their careers about the same time as me, and they still fly around in carriers like American Eagle or Continental Express as FO's on EMB's or Turboprops, were as I have been flying Wide-Bodies for the last 5 Years. Things in S. America are the way they are, and it will take Generations to change a system that has established itself for Generations. The commercial flying community here is extremely small, and I would not be surprised if the total of all of our holding pilots would just about make up half of AA’s pilot pool.
It isn’t perfect, but being 48 years old as an FO in a major carrier like AA to gain access as FO (!!) on Wide bodies is not the right thing either.
I also highly agree with Richard on the following: the training aspect in this company is second to none in the Region. Especially at a time when other Airlines cut back on Training to safe money, LAN maintained a very good standard (Simulators, Ground School etc…) even in an environment that can be described as an explosive expansion. Additionally, LAN had to overcome political problems in the region, and fierce competition from Brazil.
Is everyone happy on how things go? Not at all, of course! I for my part expected more, too, but flying an airliner is nowadays nothing more than a way to a paycheck. It’s the same everywhere else! And just like Richard said, if the grass is greener on the other side, then… or is it now? :rolleyes: You need to know what you want... and that is sometimes not so easy...:bored:

By the way, LP is passively recruiting, and the minimums in Peru are citizenship and a CPL IFR for FO’s. If you have 4000 total, 2000 in Multi-Crew and Command experience you might be considered for the left seat. At the moment direct entry to the 767's left seat for full time employment is not possible, but the market is very volatile. Things here change on a day-to-day basis, and it would not make many of us wonder if things change rapidly. As soon as some of the new aircraft in the Middle East come to fly, the Emirates HAVE to recruit agressively, opening up spots for UPG's
Happy Landings…


PS Recommend a little light reading to Flircat called "The Secret" by Rhonda Byrne...:O

[skymale]

I have 1800 total time, 500 on BE1900D. SIC. Will LAn Chile hire me? Where is thier recruting office , do you have an email or number that i could use? Thanks

[skymale]

Dou you a an email or number that i can

Thanks