Not quite the standard IR question.

[tu154]

I'm looking for some opinions to help in making a decision. My ATPL exams are going to 'expire' in May. I have 500 hours or thereabouts and am instructing quite happily at the minute with the probability of some commerical work coming into the mix. I am quite happy to continue to do this for a year or two. So in terms of timing for the IR, it's not great as I don't really see me being in contention for an IR type job until 1000 hours or so, and even then it will take a bit more commercial and turbine time.

However the thought of going through the 7 exams again is not appealing, so there is a case to be made for going ahead and doing the course, and going back to normal duties until the 'magic' numbers are reached.

In this case, what would be required to keep the IR current? Will I then be burdened with some expensive flying every year? Or am I better just waiting until I'm ready for a change and then going ahead? Or...could I park the IR flying at that point and get current again without too much trouble?
(The IR fund has been salted away and ready for use).

I'd appreciate any comments or advice.
(P.S. I have done a search, I have a good idea of my preferred training provider, just wondering whether to go now, or later and what the issues might be…)
Thanks,
TU154.

[finalchecksplease]

Not certain about all the IR training providers but some are booked up past May next year so better make sure you get booked in sooner than later if you decide to go ahead with the IR.

Greetings,

Finalchecksplease

[Flingingwings]

Given the N Sea shortages, with a new IR they'd talk to you, and if your face fits probably rip your arm off :p

With 500 hrs and an IR N. Sea as a P2 would be your best (and possibly only) option if you want to use the IR.

Have you spoken to any of the Big 3 to get a definitive answer as to whether your low hours would be a problem in the current recruitment climate?
Other things to think about.......

Most IR providers are booked some months ahead. You may not be able to get a course before your exams expire :uhoh:

Also worth searching for a recent thread by Helimutt about ATPL upgrade, as following Amendment 6 (as far as I understand it) if you only take the 7 IR exams you can only hold a CPL/IR (ie no multi crew command opportunities). In order to now get an ATPL you'll have to resit the full 13 ATPL subjects (unless the CAA exempt you say VFR comms in lieu of your experience to date).
That said I await a possible flaming from the amendment 6 experts :uhoh:

In so far as costs in keeping the IR valid - an annual IR LPC in a twin (as per LASORs). But consider that if you don't fly procedural IR regularly, passing the aforementioned IR LPC without any practice will be a very very tall order :eek: and so the costs will be higher :uhoh:
Another option is that if you allow the IR to lapse you have 7 years (I believe, albeit check LASORs for the definite answer) to revalidate it before you have to sit those lovely exams again.

Rgds,
FW

[hihover]

TU

If I were you, I'd get the IR now. You have the funds, you have the theory exams and you have some experience. You are very well placed.

Get the IR and you may not need the magic numbers, it all depends on demand that day and who is available with the qualifications, and that could be you.

Good luck, whichever you choose.

tam

[Bertie Thruster]

CHC hours requirement now down to 300 according to their website!

[SmokinHole]

I'd get the IR asap..

But you will be lucky to get a course in time. Try Tiger helicopters.

Like FlingWings said, if you get the IR now, you can then let it lapse and still have 7 years before you need to take the exams again. I'm not sure if it's 7 years from the issue of the IR or 7 years from when it lapses, but it's still a shed-load of time.

If N.Sea opportunities don't float your way now, you can sit on the re-validation until they do.

My 2 cents.

[Flingingwings]

Smokin,
It's 7 years from the expiry.

TU,
FWIW I'd suggest sticking with the established IR schools (Bond, Bristows, PAS/SAS, Helicopter Services) (with apologies if I've forgotten any others) if you decide to fund one. They have fine tuned their training and have proven results,not to mention offshore contacts, that newer companies expanding into this area of training don't. (In no way a dig or negative comment about the new guys on the block, but for the money involved I wouldn't want to be their guinea pig). One of the 4 I've listed does a lot of initial IR training for CHC -providing a well deserved 'Helicopter Service' IMHO :cool:

Stop worrying about the TT and commercial experience/ turbine hours.
On shore commercial Ops in singles is completely different to offshore flying (so I'm told by Helimutt :E), P2 in a twin anywhere is also a different kettle of fish to a bit of Jetranger time.

You'll need a lot more experience to get an onshore twin job as a P2 (and a whole lot more to get P1), and at your current stage an IR would be of far more interest to the big 3 than another couple of hundred hours in a Robbo or JetRanger.

I FI'd for a while, before funding an IR and it was, and still is, the best move I ever made :ok:
Good luck

[tu154]

Thanks for the replies, all interesting and lots of food for thought.
Tending to think that doing the IR course would be the way to go at this stage, if I could get a slot.
I think I would enjoy something like the North sea for at least a while. It does interest me. Also after the IR I feel it's important to be in a 'structured' environment, which this would be. Assuming the 'face fitted'.
TU.

[P1V1T1]

Im a 200hr IR North Sea P2 and there's way more than just me

[paco]

Rumour Control - they are changing the way sim IR instructors are qualified, in that from Jan they will need medicals and other sh*te - I would get something done asap as this will affect all schools.

I'm sure one of them will have the full details

Phil

[Torquetalk]

Good job they are tightening up on medicals for sim instruction. What a risk area overlooked!

"I may be having a coronary; you have control. Think you can bring us back in?" :rolleyes:

[jemax]

It is suggested that if your face fits you may get lucky,

but tu154, I know your face and I suggest that is this ,and not the IR skills which may prove to be your buggest obstacle ;-)

PS FAA IR about £10k all up flights flying, visa accomodation, plus about £3k to get FAA CPL in the UK. But then of course you need to convert it.

Greetings from Arizona

[tu154]

Thanks mate. :}
So what's involved in converting, and what are the waiting lists with those providers? I would presume it is the same companies involved?

[tarkers]

I hear on the grapevine that a new IR school is being setup at Severn Aviation at Gloucestershire Airport. Might be worth a call.

[Sliding Doors]

Tarkers,

1st post promoting a new school. Is this a three guesses where you work type question :hmm::hmm:

What TU needs with low hours is a course supported by a good solid base of instructor experience, on a sim and machines that the instructors are familiar with.

Enough low hours guys provide the 'training' for the new instructor and/or start up business venture. On a course thats hard work and very expensive, they are not the choices of a wise wannabe IR holder :ugh::ugh:

[manfromuncle]

I wonder just how long it will be before HAI/Bristows start offering JAA IR training and that will be the end of UK IR schools?

[Kangia]

Hi TU 154,

I might be wrong on this but as far as I know as long as you are enrolled in a recognised course your IR's are still being held. This might give you a little more breathing space concidering the waiting list for courses at the moment. So sign up in April and just wait for the course to come up if you're not sure.

My advise would be to apply to the North Sea operators for a job and tell them you are enrolled in a course but are waiting for a start date. With your hours you should have no preblem getting a job.

[Bravo73]

I wonder just how long it will be before HAI/Bristows start offering JAA IR training and that will be the end of UK IR schools?

A long time. Bristow already conduct their IR training from Norwich.

[heli-mad]

Hi there,

If you are thinking about it... better do it asap. There is a big need for IR pilot (as i hear) in the NS at the moment. Rumour has it( and remember it is a rumours network) that CHC Norway needs 70-80 pilots in the next two years if you fancy a chancge in senery. The IR wont get you a job but it would give you an interview for sure.........then as mentioned before it is a case of "do you fit in the picture" thing...:cool:

Total hours is not a problem, i personaly know 3 guys that got jobs last year with 250, 330, and 350 hours total....

Good luck

H-M:ok:

[Need money]

Lets hope I can get qualified in the next 2 years or less !! ;)

[paco]

"I wonder just how long it will be before HAI/Bristows start offering JAA IR training and that will be the end of UK IR schools?"

Don't think that will happen. A lot depends on whether enough examiners are available - it's bad enough right now.

Phil

[tu154]

Again thanks for all the comments. Decision has been made to proceed. Looks like I have a slot with my preferred provider and the timing fits quite nicely.