Job vacancy at Lancs Police ASU?

[just the driver]

Hi guys/girls, heard a rumour that one of the line pilots at Lancashire ASU has handed his notice in. Might be worth getting the c.v's ready if anyone is interested.

On a similar note - Is there anyone out there (suitably qualified), in the UK that hasn't already got a job ??

[chcoffshore]

Oh no! That would mean sharing a crew room with you LoL!:p

[SilsoeSid]

Is this the same rumour that there are also vacancies at West Mids. and Humberside?

I suspect there are a lot of CVs already ready!

[Darren999]

I would love to be able to send my CV in, but I only have a FAA ATPL.. :{:{:{.
Maybe one day...:ok:

[rotors59]

You can't keep anything secret these days;)

[chcoffshore]

I don't think there will be lots of CV's ready, maybe a bit of a struggle to fill or maybe not!:ooh:

[Bertie Thruster]

Depends whether your financial circumstances allow you the choice of working an 'interesting' public service type job for peanuts over the pressing need to squeeze maximium wonga out of your licence on the 'regular' big busses in the dark and wet!

[just the driver]

It's hardly peanuts, or are you hinting that police pilots are all monkeys:ooh:?

The financial package isn't as bad as it used to be, there is also discussion underway to significantly increase the pay deal for direct employment. In addition to this, the majority of us in this role have a decent(ish) military pension.

Besides, I'm scared of flying in the dark over the sea!!!!

[Whirlygig]

Compared with North Sea and corporate flying, it IS peanuts. Secondly, YOUR military pension should not be an excuse to offer low wages; not everyone has one of those.

Cheers

Whirls

[ShyTorque]

over the pressing need to squeeze maximium wonga out of your licence on the 'regular' big busses in the dark and wet!

Or the irregular small buses in the dark and wet? :)

[A.Agincourt]

Whirlygig: not everyone has one of those.

Chris, you state the obvious surely? :}

Best Wishes

Ace

[Sulley]

Well said Whirls :D

[Whirlygig]

Ace, who's Chris?

Cheers

Whirls

[A.Agincourt]

just the driver the majority of us in this role have a decent(ish) military pension.


Hmmm......interesting question springs forth, I wonder what percentage of police pilots are in fact ex military and out of that figure, how many actually do have a pension.

Do ex military crews prefer the role of the police because of similarities to a role performed in NI or is it the clear predictable regularity of shift patterns affording some kind of home life?

I know of one gentleman [term used in the loosest of senses] who moved into the police role specifically for the lifestyle and the pay was for him a secondary issue only.

Personally, I dislike dangling from a specified length of rope and relish my freedom as well as variety so feel unsuited for such a role. I'd be interested to hear opinions.

Best Wishes

Ace

[timex]

Ace, Unit I work for has 10 Pilots ALL ex Mil. Various backgrounds, mostly AAC. Job is very good, also interesting and the amount of time off is ideal with a sensible work pattern, you also know just what you are doing for the next 12 months. It probably won't suit everyone either for financial or personal reasons but, for the majority of the people I know they are fairly content.


Shaun

[A.Agincourt]

timex: - :) So many in one unit? I am surprised Is there a geographical reason for that? I can see the attraction in the circumstances you tell off and admit the 'certainty' factor of knowing what you are doing well in advance does have appeal. Must be like a military crew room there:}

Thanks for the info

Best Wishes

Ace

[Bertie Thruster]

....'peanuts' compared to the other industry sectors as Whirlygig has mentioned

..plus this little gem (about one of the main UK EMS employers) from the BALPA pension advisor that helps illustrate the poor state of the contracted onshore UK parapublic sector.........

‘The current pension scheme has one of the lowest employer contributions for such an arrangement, not only in the aviation world, but one of the lowest amongst all UK pension arrangements. If the employees do not augment the employer’s contributions with reasonable employee contributions, then there will be no meaningful pension at the retirement of the member, no matter what age they join the pension arrangement.’


(For example the '06 forecast for age 60, from the pension provider for my company pension, after 15 years with the company: £2700/year.)

[fkelly]

If memory serves this is the second departure from that unit in 6 months; is there something we should know? Directly employed police jobs are after all supposed to be pretty desirable.

[A.Agincourt]

It is the same old story isn't it? Time and time again and the solution is always the same, never changing. If the financial terms of the job are not liveable then leave and find an alternative but it seems that people assume that they have rights beyond reality.

The bottom line is simply, there are specific employment groups and each offers a type of flying, lifestyle and income. What you need to do is ask yourself what is important to you and make your decision. The holy grail is to get the job you really want and to have the remuneration as well but hey, life is just not like that and there is always a compromise.

I have spent over 30 years living my life the way I dictate and for the later half I have managed to achieve a half decent pay packet. Now I resort to determining what I want. Money or lifestyle and so far the two do not meet. Not for me anyway.

I choose lifestyle [actually you should read job characteristics] and though the pay is not bad at all it could be better compared to............what????? But I shall never be wealthy and that was ordained many years ago. I choose the pleasure of doing the job, the lifestyle, the good and the bad and do not whinge about pensions, pay or any other associated bol*****. The most important thing in my life is flight and every thing else is secondary. [I mean everything]

Fighting for something better is the natural way of things, it is human nature but at some point you just know that the reality is very different


Best Wishes

Ace

[AirWon]

For those of us (expats) who will probably never work back in dear old blighty, but have at least a passing interest in all things heli. over there, what does a position like this pay? What would the take home pay be on, let's say, a 50,000GBP salary?
Just curious.

[jayteeto]

Mr Agincourt, I see what you are saying but don't quite know why??? If you are telling us that if we don't like it then we can leave, then you have the problem. People ARE leaving, not quite in droves, but getting critical. Units in this part of the world (not us) are going off line REGULARLY because no pilot is available to cover the shift. Traditionally, direct employ has had much better pay and conditions..... However, no names, but one company has just given its pilots a SUBSTANTIAL pay increase, yesterday actually. This brings us (whoops) close to the direct employ salaries. That is enough to keep me from looking elsewhere for the time being. I too, LOVE flying, but I hate to be ripped off. We don't ask the earth, just to be fair and equal to our peers.

[Whirlygig]

Monthly take home pay on a salary of £50,000 per annum is just shy of £3,000. Depending on tax allowances and expenses allowances, it could be slightly more.

Cheers

Whirls

[A.Agincourt]

jayteeto: Mr Agincourt, I see what you are saying but don't quite know why??? If you are telling us that if we don't like it then we can leave, then you have the problem. People ARE leaving, not quite in droves, but getting critical. Units in this part of the world (not us) are going off line REGULARLY because no pilot is available to cover the shift.

I am aware that people are leaving, those who do not pay as well as some wish. Clearly the units that are suffering as a result of this have three options either arrange to pay more money, accept reduced capacity or arrange to take on pilots that would not otherwise be considered.

I too, LOVE flying, but I hate to be ripped off. We don't ask the earth, just to be fair and equal to our peers.

I do understand your position and have been in a very similar circumstance but I detect a little twinge of the politics of envy creeping in. I fail to see how you can determine that you are being 'ripped off'. From my perspective [note I state my perspective] what other people are getting paid is of no consequence to me.

If the employer pays crap wages then don't work for him. It really is that simple and as you indicate, the consequence is that that employer will not get the staff needed and either folds or ups the ante. So long as there are those who are prepared to accept the circumstance then there will be little motivation for rapid change.

A number of years ago I was getting paid 'peanuts' and I knew it - compared to my 'peers' but at the time I really enjoyed the job, the environment I was in and the overall lifestyle. The fact that someone elsewhere was getting more than me for the same job really didn't concern me. But I needed a change and as always I looked for the non money aspects. Quality of life both home and away are surely far more important.

:)

But I do hope things improve and suspect that that will not be in the short term.


Best Wishes

Ace

[jayteeto]

Politics of envy?? I still have my bills to pay, I wish I was as lucky as you where money doesn't matter :ok:
I actually agree with what you say about do it or leave. That is why I left the RAF, didn't like how it was going....... left.
Just for general information, say a unit has 4 pilots. One chief, 3 line. Each on a different contract with different wages, terms and conditions, significantly different. Would you think it unfair that the lowest paid might be a little peeved if he was on thousands less with less perks for doing the same job?? Multiply that by 6 or 7 units. I don't see that as politics of envy, just fairness. My company were one of the better ones (in my opinion), but still could have done better. The latest move is very welcome.
Things are improving, thanks to the people who stuck to their principles. I didn't contribute there, because, like you, quality of life is more important to me, however the company who works on the take it or leave it principle will eventually lose, big time.

[whoateallthepies]

Try this site to calculate income after tax.
http://www.pru.co.uk/home/calculator/income_tax/

[A.Agincourt]

If I were in the same unit doing the same job as another but getting less then I would feel a little peeved but that circumstance is pretty common in other work places/work areas where a person will be paid for qualification, experience etc. Though in this case that is probably not applicable. Yes indeed there will be those employers who will loose out big time, provided that they are unable to 'make do'. We shall see.:\


Best Wishes

[detgnome]

This weeks Flight has just landed on my desk (20-26 Nov) and I (like everyone else I suppose!) turned to the back to see what jobs are going. I see that there are 3 Police ASU jobs advertised, interestingly with quite a spread of salaries:

Lancashire: £37671 - £44855
Humberside: £45843 - £48705
W Mids: £45843 - £50013

giving a £12400 spread from top to bottom.

Given that jobs advertised in Flight only represent a proportion of jobs actually available (many filled by word of mouth), this would seem to back up what has been said on other threads regarding shortages of ASU pilots.

As an interested observer, I'll hand it over to those actually involved for comments..!

[Senior Pilot]

This weeks Flight has just landed on my desk (20-26 Nov) and I (like everyone else I suppose!) turned to the back to see what jobs are going.

Which reminds me of the old definition of security: starting to read Flight magazine from the front ;)

[Mr D's]

Just heard from a Premiair pilot that they've had a 10% payrise.

[Bertie Thruster]

Looks like Humberside have dropped their requirement from 3000 to 2000 hours!

..and I bet W.Mids would like to permanently replace the freelancer they are using (at a rumoured £900/shift!)

[FloaterNorthWest]

£900 a shift!!!!

Where do I sign?

FNW

[Dupsspud]

I've just asked a friend who is a pilot at West Mids and there definitely isn't a job going.

He also informed me that someone is already lined up for the role should a position ever become available.

[Bravo73]

Dupspud,

I think that your 'mate' is having you on. A couple of the West Mids pilots post on here so I'm sure that they will be along in a bit to confirm...

[rotors59]

FNW

On what you are on why are you bothered;)

Not sure about advertised jobs?............read the back pages of Flight!

If you want more information, why not call the units direct? Remember, this is a rumour site!!:ok:

[handysnaks]

and I bet W.Mids would like to permanently replace the freelancer they are using (at a rumoured £900/shift!)

???:confused:

[handysnaks]

deleted to avoid prolonging free advertising scam:p

[FloaterNorthWest]

rotors59,

£5 an hour + tips!!!

:}

[Bertie Thruster]

Thats the rumour, Handy!
...I even heard the name of the freelancer......

perhaps the unit name was passed on incorrectly.

....or indeed perhaps the whole thing is too far fetched? £900!!

[handysnaks]

Oooh, you tease, handy
B73 you have a PM

[handysnaks]

You know where we live!
As I write, the rumour has no basis in fact!!

[SilsoeSid]

Well, after all, I suppose this is a rumour network.

Dupsspud, if there definately isn't a job going as you have been told, why has the W.Mids gone to all that time effort and cost to advertise one?

Also, being a 'direct employer', I thought that the force had a duty to openly advertise any vacancies and therefore should a position become available all applicants would have to go through the same process and face the same interview board, comprising of HR, Ops, Independant and maybe even an Air Ops representative. The tale of having somebody lined up, in this day and age, should be on the Helicopter Urban Myths thread!

Having said that, have they paid extra to advertise at http://www.wherewomenwanttowork.com (not the full link due to advertising)

My contact at W.Mids says they don't need to use a floater as their system can cope. Besides why should they need one, they are still at full strength.
If they can afford that much, perhaps even I will apply for the post, £50K. :ok:

[Thomas coupling]

This latest vacancy will be interesting to monitor
The salary has actually gone backwards compared to ALL other police pilot adverts. Sub 40k to fill this post - what on earth are the HR dept thinking of here?
B**dy bean counters trying to manage ALL other depts leads to total disregard for market forces.
It will be very interesting to see if they get an improvement on the 2 applications submitted last time for a larger salary??????

[Rotating Star]

The salary for the post advertised 5 months or so ago was the same as the upper figure mentioned in the current ad. Anyone responding to this ad would be well within their rights to expect the upper figure automatically, bearing in mind the fact that demand appears to be outstripping supply. Also with Premiair having given their pilots somewhere in the region of a 10% pay rise, Lancashire must be offering their pilots one of the worst salary packages in the market.
Odd considering they are allegedly the best constabulary in the country.:eek:

[Bertie Thruster]

As a comparison:

A starter with "XXXX", currently on 41.5K, will shortly be on 45+K. Their floaters also get an allowance of approx 4K plus a car allowance to make up for not having company transport.

The "YYYY" deal is 16% spread over 3 years - 8%, 4% and 4%. A starter with "YYYY", currently on 41662, will be on 45K next year and 48672 in 2010. Anyone joining with a "xx 123" rating or an IR automatically starts on the Year 3 rate - currently 42921, going up next year to 46330 and 50143 in 2010. That doesn't include the bonus (assuming the company makes a profit over 6%), the LoL insurance, Death in Service benefit and 6% company contribution to the pension.

The more industry wide transparency over on-shore pilots pay (that the Mods will allow) the better!!

[Senior Pilot]

The more industry wide transparency over on-shore pilots pay (that the Mods will allow) the better!!

I see no problem with that: it doesn't transgress any restrictions that I know of :ok:

[aquila105]

"In addition to this, the majority of us in this role have a decent(ish) military pension"

That is as relevant as saying "in addition to my wage, I get 100$ a month from my dear granny"!!

[ShyTorque]

I agree, the providing companies and the police authorities have benefitted from experienced ex-military employees for a long time; the minimum acceptable experience requirement bears this out.

I've said this before, but now there are fewer experienced pilots around, either the money must go up or the goal posts get widened, or a combination of both occurs.

I walked away from police aviation after I was expected to take a cut in terms and conditions on contract change. To expect an employee to accept a low salary in relation to the industry norm just because he is "expected" to have a pension from previous emplyment, is absurd. I can't think of any other industry where this occurs.

[Bearintheair]

The recent recruitment at our unit produced only one applicant out of nine that might have had a military pension and we have only one pilot out of four whos salary is subbed this way.

[chcoffshore]

3 Police jobs in Flight international!!!! Of varying pay scales I see……… And what is this about your pensions? Stop taking that into consideration; you earned it for queen and country. You still have to pay the bills so don’t sell yourselves short demand a wage that suits the post. £37K is laughable! £50K is more realistic, at least. :}

[just the driver]

Just to set the record straight guys - The HR department seem to have made an error somewhere. The last ad for this post was starting pay of £45k. The UEO is currently involved in negotiations with the powers that be to address the line pilot salary issue, the likely outcome being a significant rise.:O

The subject of military pensions doesn't come into the equation for salary. Just an observation that those lucky enough to be in receipt of a pension have the luxury of a higher income without having to move to Aberdeen!

I started this thread a couple of weeks ago to try and rustle up some interest prior to the ad going out in flight. Unfortunately HR got their hands on things and messed it up:ooh:. Rumour is they advertised the post on their weekly orders before going public - just incase there were any suitably qualified candidates walking the beat who might be interested.:hmm:

[chcoffshore]

But its very nice up here in Aberdeen!!!!!

[Helinut]

Sounds like the HR department has just wasted a substantial amount of money on advertsiing then.............. :ugh:

[Bertie Thruster]

Talking of wasting (taxpayers) money.....
I thought the previously reported rumour of £900 a shift to freelancers to fill in for unfilled posts on low salary directly employing police units was possibly a bit far fetched......

......It seems the truth is actually nearer £1100 a shift, paid by those same directly employing constabularies to the Companies that can provide floaters, to fill in for those vacant shifts. (unfilled presumably because those directly employing constabularies won't offer a decent wage to attract replacement pilots!)

Surely it must be cheaper for the taxpayer for those constabularies to pay a decent wage in the first place and not run light on staff!!

[ShyTorque]

Bertie, perhaps you and I should polish up the old Hi-tech boots again.... I could do with an extra bob or two before Christmas.

[Bertie Thruster]

Shy.. you know that would mean no unPC jokes!

My present "pax" also asked me to put the "remember the essentials" FS poster up on the wall. (the lady tennis player one, sans kecks, that the bobbies said had to go. )

You can also say "webbing"!

[Whirlygig]

Just_for_you_Bertram! (http://uk.geocities.com/david_jgregory/tennis_player_scratching_her_arse_athena_poster.jpg)

Oh_alright_then! (http://img.metro.co.uk/i/pix/2007/07/TennisGirl_450x675.jpg)

I don't do PC either! As long as it works both ways!

Cheers

Whirls

[ShyTorque]

Ah, yes - had the rose tinted specs on for a while there.... Mind you, I do miss the big breakfast on Sundays.

And the kennel maid.... ;)

[Fortyodd2]

Shytorque,

...............she's still there! :E

[ShyTorque]

Nice to know some things haven't changed. Woof woof! ;)

[Letsby Avenue]

Apparently that tennis player is a bit of a chap underneath.. So to speak:}

Don't suppose anyone has the poster showing the young lady who has caught her nice red dress in some barbed wire anywhere:)

[Bertie Thruster]

tuning into the rumour channels reveals.........

Well known offshore company might be advertising for 4 pilots/month over a 12 month period. (and offering very flexible "lifestyle" rostering as an incentive to recruiting!) (fairly soon,apparently)

Union push to get Government funding for experienced onshore VFR captains to get them IR's and into offshore cabs as FO's. (longshot rumour ,this one)

I've a funny feeling that both the directly employing police forces and the contractor companies might have to up the pay ante!

[rotors59]

It appears that Just the Driver was correct in his previous post. Lancs ASU have re-advertised in this weeks Flight (paper version only) and also in heli-jobs. Clearly there has been a review of salaries (45 - 50K which is a significant increase on the previous offering) :D and don't forget there are benefits working for a public body. There should be an advert on the Lancs Constabulary site to download the application pack (but it doesn't appear to be there yet!):confused:
For those still looking for a Police job it now may be the time to get that appilcation in. I'm sure the unit could answer any questions that folks might have :ok:

[Northskycop]

And anyone applying would also best subscribe to horse and hound in preperation for the interviews

[helimutt]

Union push to get Government funding for experienced onshore VFR captains to get them IR's and into offshore cabs as FO's. (longshot rumour ,this one)



..and monkeys might fly out of my butt!!!:)

Wonder if any Police employers would be interested in paying for 40 night hours for me so that I can apply?
Maybe the government will give me a grant?:E

[Dupsspud]

Yes I am suitably qualified, still looking to get my foot on the police ladder. Applied for Lancs just before Christmas, someone else leaving there?

[Need money]

Bertie Thruster : Could you expand on this please..... unfortunately still some way off for me - but interesting all the same :

"Well known offshore company might be advertising for 4 pilots/month over a 12 month period. (and offering very flexible "lifestyle" rostering as an incentive to recruiting!) (fairly soon,apparently)"..

Many thanks. :ok:

[Olde Devonian]

Dupsspud, no this is the same vacancy advertised pre Christmas. It seems that powers that be have come to their senses and given the pilots an extra wedge to keep them happy. This is as a result of a review that started when a previous pilot left back in May 2007. :suspect:
OD.

[helimutt]

Need Money, seems Bristows might be employing up to 4 pilots a month for next 12 months at least, for various Uk locations. Heard this from a number of folks over last couple of weeks. Also, the fact CHC lost an Aberdeen ConocoPhilips contract recently, maybe Bristows won it?

[Need money]

Thanks Helimutt :)

Wish I was further on in my flying learning curve. !

[rotors59]

It appears that the Line Pilot job at Lancs ASU is now on the Lancashire Constabulary website....at last. Look under Jobs and Police Staff. Includes application pack as well. http://www.lancashire.police.uk :)