BA Executive Club.

[jtipper1]

As a regular traveller I began flying between GVA-LHR each week form 2000- until 2204. This with a few trips to the US enabled me to recieve enough points to qualify for Gold card Status within the first year.
The benifit of be able to use the lounge facilities each week made the regular journey less of a hassle.
This I believe is what a "loyalty" scheme is all about. Within the same period I als o obtained A silver Swiss Air card, when on occasion i flew with them when the BA flight was full
I n 2004 I treturned to the Uk for 18mths and returned back to weelky trips in March 2205, this time from Zurich.
In the meantiome Ba had changed the tier pints and none of my flight seemed to qualify towards my Gold card renewal for the following year. I sent m,any emails to Ba with no response . eventualy got hold of someone, who said that the type of flights I was opurchasing dind meet the requiremnt!!!As i was buying them via the Ba websiter and paying the price they asked what was i meant to do !!!!
The result , is that I stopped flying BA and went to Swiss wo still gave more miles and of course Ikept my Travelclub card ( now called miles for more).
While i understand BA was trying to cut costs, I cannot imagine I am the only customer who has reacted this way.
Short sighted in my opinion.. I am now back to blue card mmber without any hope of going for an upgrade unless i fly club everywhere!!!

[self loader 54]

That really means we get our freedom of choice back! I am a lifetime member of the world's biggest and you have no idea how this limits me ..... no more upgrades, no more priority seating (they pretend.....), no more priority baggage (they pretend even more.....), no more miles earned (they reduced them like BA to next to nothing)..... but I still get my add-on extra kgs. The thing is that because of this and only this I still fly with them. Actually to be honest I don't know any airline worth flying with. They all seem to think that because it's become easier we should all make it like 'travelling on a bus. It is not a bus, it never will be and it's time these people started to think about the abusive treatment and the level of trash they are degrading the experience to.

Can anyone tell me why you get priority treatment if you are travelling with babies? Or small children? What? Are they frequent flyers that the airline goes to such wonderful extremes still and disregards us the exec flyer who is forced to now travell economy because that's the cheapskate company policy to save money? I can't fathom it. I think someone should point out to these airlines that passengers with babies/small children travels once in a blue moon and are not worth pursuing to the degree they are. Or is this the only passenger they want?

Frankly after 10 years relentless inter-continental travel I welcome and encourage the day I can work remotly out my home and then I can become one of these 'once in a blue moon' for-fun travellers and be treated decently! It seems that's the trick..... fly rarely and the airlines roll out the red carpet.... or hire a baby!

[k3lvc]

Don't believe the rules have changed - all that's happened is BA's lowest fares (i.e. non-flexible economy) don't qualify for tier points. Given that these are the default on BA.com then this is probably what you've been flying. Silver status is enough for me and a couple of Club sectors to the Middle East + taking advantage of their regular upgrade offers on short haul tends to get me the tiers points I need to maintain this within my travel budget and the company's expenses policy.

At the end of the day if you're paying LoCo prices for full service you can't expect all the trimmings.

[WHBM]

Most airlines (notably in the US) do indeed give mileage credit in vaying degrees for all types of ticket. BA is well known for having one of the most restrictive schemes around.

However one thing you can be certain of is that it is not short-sighted, but is very carefully calculated and reviewed by BA up to the board level. It is just what they have determined will give them what they want. Look at their nowadays respectable financial figures, compared to the US carriers who give away miles and upgrades like confetti to the extent that only a madman actually pays for first class in the US nowadays and the airline just loses more and more money, I think BA have actually got it right. For them if not for you.

[slim_slag]

BA 'enhanced' the executive club back in around 2003. so if you stopped flying them in 2004 you probably never noticed the 'improvements'. You should really be thanking them for letting you have a blue card :)

[slim_slag]

....compared to the US carriers who give away miles and upgrades like confetti.... and the airline just loses more and more money.Just taken a quick look at the financials of several US majors and they seem in good shape. Several weren't a few years ago, and they reorganised with much pain to employees certainly, but the loyalty programmes for their customers actually stayed much the same. Look at southwest with one of the best loyalty scheme in the business, and they are making money hand over fist and always have done.

[jtipper1]

While I agree that I may not of noticed that they had changed their pricing polocy, I was stil paying about the same amount as I had been before ( depending of how forward the booking ) and as I flying each week I never needed any added flexability.

Swiss on the other hand, where the same price as BA, plus more miles and Tier points, So I switched to Swiss.

I imagine I wasnt alone.

[jtipper1]

Sorry, Why should thank them for letting me have a blue card?
As I have now moved back to the Geneva area, I have no choice at present other than use BA if I wish to fly to LHR anyway.
But Flying at least 50 times per year with one airline, surely should entitle one to some type preferential treatment over those who use the airline once a yearr to go on their holidays!

[PAXboy]

I don't wish to sound unsympathetic jtipper1 but you are thinking like a customer and BA are thinking like shareholders. Tier points were devised so that you do not get as much in the way of benefits as before. It works. Which means that other carriers will provide more but, bear in mind, that Swiss are having to work their way back up again after failure. BA are trying to prevent the failure.

[jtipper1]

No I do understand.. My main point is that there is no benifit to the "loyal" customer sticking with BA over another airline as far as i can see.
Before, when I travelled on business to the States, (club) I would always fly BA ,due to my gold card status ( yes know I would recieve points for those flights).

Yet now when making my long haul flights,I will look at all carriers, and make my choice, Virgin Upperclass etc. AA..

I understand that Airlines have to make a profit and as a lover of flying myself ( PPL of 17yrs), I just wonder if going forward this policy will result in a increase BA passengers numbers of the coming years.

I am quite sure that someone will have figs saying that BA figs have increased overall ,since the ease of booking via the web, and in some cases the cheaper flights
However Ii wonder if there a figs availble of how many of the older Executive club members now use other airlines as a result of the changes ?

[slim_slag]

The only point of being in the executive club is if you are silver and gold (or their special higher tiers). It costs a lot to reach these levels, and a lot to stay in them. So yes, they don't encourage loyalty any more unless you spend in the five figures £ per year with them.

Prior to the changes in 2003, it wasn't a bad program, nowhere near as good as the US carriers, but still not bad. But even back then they wouldn't treat you any better if you flew a lot with them but had no status. They don't really recognise (what the yanks call) 'Butt In Seat' miles. You could fly 100k miles with them in the cheap seats, and they would still check you into a middle seat, with somebody who never flies them in the window seat.

It's their choice, and nobody makes anybody buy their tickets.

[jtipper1]

I quite agree Slim-Slag,, but I guess I will be in the 5 figs region this year, but still wont qualify for for Silver /Gold as I am booking via the website I guess !!!!

Still I could always flyself. if Avgas wasn't so expensive !!!!!! and if my company would pay for it !!!

[groundhand]

Maybe BA could be more generous to regular travellers if they did not fill their busiess and first class seats with staff and their families.
Having paid many £'000s for a business class LH fare it really p**es me off when the person next to you is the mother/brother/sister of a ba employee who has paid jack sh*t for their ticket.

I've never really understood their policy on this nor how these 'benefits' do not get caught in the benefit -in-kind tax that we poor workers seem to get hammered by for anything small perk we receive.

My answer - only fly BA when there is absolutely no alternative which, thankfully is becoming pretty rare.

GH

[10secondsurvey]

I could not agree more with this poster. You can do a hell of a lot of flying and be recognised by BA as nothing. In my experience, it is getting harder all the time to keep status with BA, and I'm thinking it just ain't worth it anymore.

As regards another comment earlier, simply because a BA ticket does not earn Tier points, it is simply not the case that the fare will be low (loco). You can pay a pretty steep fare with BA, yet still be told it doesn't earn tier points, ever.

Now that much of the BA domestic network has gone, and their Club Europe becomes more of a name and less of a product, I've calculated that by switching much of my travel to VS, BMI/star aliance, I can probably get *Gold and VS gold. This combined with my priority pass (free from Amex) covers pretty much all eventualities, and gets me in the wonderful clubhouses every time too. Plus I'll probably earn a helluva lot more miles.

[Momo]

Life has been tough for those managing FF programs in all airlines. The reason is that the lowest economy fares have to match the low cost carriers like EasyJet and Ryanair. Before the majors changed their schemes, a person flying in Economy for 50 pounds/$/whatever got the same FF credits as someone paying literally 10 times as much. What BA, LH, Swiss and others have done is to reward people who give them the most money, not those who fly the most with them. Booking via the web has nothing to do with this. If you are flying a fare that does not earn tier points with BA (or does not earn full mileage with LH and others) you will find that another higher fare exists for the same cabin. Personally, I find this normal.

I find it totally acceptable that a person who flies 50 times a year, but spends a total of $10,000 (without airport taxes, etc.) gets less credit than a person who flies once on BA's obscenely expensive fares to the West coast and pays $12,000. The latter is the one BA wants to reward. It has a side benefit that they already have lounge access for their C fare. This has to be part of the cost/benefit equation for the airlines too.

Back to the original question, BA has revised the scheme somewhat since the change a few years back. It is once again easier to gain tiers flying from Switzerland to the UK if you are a Swiss resident. Silver is currently 400 points for Swiss residents. I might be mistaken, but I think it is 600 at the UK end?

Bottom line: pay more money, get more tier points.

Momo

[10secondsurvey]

MOMO

I think the point is however, that with many airlines you DO get recognition even when flying on the very lowest fares. As I said before, you can pay 400 pounds Sterling (about 800) USD and still get no tier points. BA is therefore markedly different.

It s very glib, and overly simplistic to try to make out that the reason BA behave like this is because they are charging budget airline fares. This just isn't so.

The only people paying 6000 pounds to west coast USA, are usually in F.

In a year you can spend a helluva lot of money with BA, and still get no tier points. This is the point the original poster alluded to. Such a scheme hardly rewards a frequent flyer.

For the record, it is 400 points for Silver with an address in continental Europe, and 600 for a UK address. So, even if you live in the UK, if you have a continental Europe holiday home (or company office) you are best to register the continental address for exec.club. Many do. makes it much easier to get silver and gold.

[Momo]

Here are the business, First and economy fares from LHR to SFO next week. For the entertainment value, I have also added the business fare from Geneva to SFO via LHR on BA, which is less than one third of the nonstop fare. (That's what I call abuse of a dominant position, in competition law terms. Unfortunately, airlines are exempted from EU competition law on this point.)

Business Class fare leaving next Monday, returning next Wed.

$13,347.80

10:50 am Depart London (LHR)
Arrive San Francisco (SFO) 1:40 pm Mon 1-Oct
Duration: 10hr 50mn British Airways 285
Nonstop flight

4:50 pm Depart San Francisco (SFO)
Arrive London (LHR) 11:00 am +1 day Wed 3-Oct
Duration: 10hr 10mn British Airways 284
Nonstop flight

Preview seat availability Choose this flight


First Class:

$16,725.80

10:50 am Depart London (LHR)
Arrive San Francisco (SFO) 1:40 pm Mon 1-Oct
Duration: 10hr 50mn British Airways 285
Nonstop flight

4:50 pm Depart San Francisco (SFO)
Arrive London (LHR) 11:00 am +1 day Wed 3-Oct
Duration: 10hr 10mn British Airways 284
Nonstop flight

Economy:
$2,629.00

10:50 am Depart London (LHR)
Arrive San Francisco (SFO) 1:40 pm Mon 1-Oct
Duration: 10hr 50mn British Airways 285
Nonstop flight

4:50 pm Depart San Francisco (SFO)
Arrive London (LHR) 11:00 am +1 day Wed 3-Oct
Duration: 10hr 10mn British Airways 284
Nonstop flight


And, most entertainingly, the business class fare via LHR, from Geneva:
$3,955.70

7:40 am Depart Geneva (GVA)
Arrive San Francisco (SFO) 1:40 pm Mon 1-Oct
Duration: 15hr 0mn British Airways 723 / 285
Connect in London (LHR)

6:50 pm Depart San Francisco (SFO)
Arrive Geneva (GVA) 5:55 pm +1 day Wed 3-Oct
Duration: 14hr 5mn British Airways 286 / 734
Connect in London (LHR)

Preview seat availability Choose this flight

[Momo]

And for the sake of completeness, the BA lowest economy fare from GVA to LHR, not including airport taxes, leaving 1st Nov, returning 7th Nov is CHF 115, which is about 45 pounds. The cheapest business fare on the same dates is 975 CHF, or about 380 pounds. I am not surprised that one gets you 40 tier points each way and the other probably gets none.

[strake]

It's been said before..it's all to do with the amount you money you spend. You can examine the tier levels and mile points to the greatest of detail but the truth is, you only become "interesting" to the airline if you spend £50k+ per annum.
At that level and above, booking reward flights (for whole families as well) becomes simpler because you have a special team to call. You get invited to nice little do's and, in the unlikely event you have a complaint about something...someone actually listens and deals with it.

[slim_slag]

It's been said before..it's all to do with the amount you money you spend.Definitely on BA, and I don't have a problem with that. But not all carriers work that way, which is also ok as choice is good for the consumer. For instance, if you fly 50k miles a year transatlantic in the cheap seats, you would be a fool not to fly on United.

The thing that makes the BA executive club flexible is the household account. The differentiating factor used to be flights on concorde but that has sadly disappeared. They had deals for LHR-JFK in Economy, JFK-LHR on concorde, as long as you took the first concorde of the day back. All for 95,000 miles. Absolute bargain.

[jtipper1]

Just to be exact The cost of flight from GVA_LHR Friday evening 2nd Nov,ruturning Sunday evening 4th Nov, (the times I actually fly),
are 306.5CHF, compared to the the 115 you mention for the Thursday.


However if I were to now to book for the 5th-7th of Oct.. that rises to 1.055.50 CHF... for best economy cheapest ticket.......not worth tier points.??..

Anyway ,I degress my original point was that I dont think the Ba executive IS a loyalty rewards programme
As has been previously mentioned, they are only interested in the Club traveller ( who get lounge access anyway) not the frequent traveller.

[MrSoft]

Contrary view here. I think BA have it about right. I must be lucky, I seem to live in a sweet spot on the scheme. My tier points are lousy, Blue with little hope of Silver, but my Miles are high.

With lots of miles in your account you can upgrade a class quite economically . . . . Club to the Middle East for £800 + 20k miles, that's a steal. I accept that on many routes these upgrades are non existent, again my good fortune.

The algorithms in the booking system are not coherent and throw up weird anomalies all over the place, but sometimes the passenger wins. Last time I bought a miles upgrade, it was cheaper upgrading both legs than upgrading one leg (explain that to me). Make sure you try every permutation.

I think BA rewards both approaches : high spenders get the Tier Points. Low spenders still get the miles (actual miles flown). Both have enough of a benefit to buy some loyalty.

Of course living in the sticks, loyalty is killed by the hell of transiting LHR. Purely because of that, flying direct with Etihad in coach is a better choice than Club with BA. That's what should worry BA. And to rub your nose in it, MAN-LHR connections NEVER seem to earn tier points.

[slim_slag]

I think BA rewards both approaches : high spenders get the Tier Points. Low spenders still get the miles (actual miles flown).No, low spenders get 25% of miles flown, but only if you are already a member. To enrol now in the executive club, you need to pay for a flight that gets you tier points. Somebody starting to fly BA now, and who flys 50k miles a year in the cheap seats, gets nothing.

[MrSoft]

Fair point slimslag. How hard is it to enrol though? I think you'd be very unlucky to avoid a qualifying flight in a year of regular trips. The BA Amex also enrols you.

If you're serious about the scheme, and you want the rewards, you've got to do what it takes to enrol. I don't believe BA make this task especially onerous.

[10secondsurvey]

With BA you require at least one fully flexible economy fare to join exec club. To retain silver you must take at least 4 'qualifying flights' per year as well as get 600 tier points.
A'qualifying flight' is decribed as fully flexible economy or higher.
I have in the past been offered a non flxible fare with BA from LHR to Scotland, at just over 400 quid. This would not be a 'qualifying flight'.


The point is that with other airlines e.g. BMI you can earn status and miles on virtually all flights. So if you travel anywhere in the world, but never in club/business/F or fully flex econ, you are much better off using a star alliance scheme/carrier.


If you make 52 BA economy (not fully flexible) flights in one year all over the world, not only will you never qualify to even JOIN BA exec.club, but you will also never get air miles either. That is the key difference between BA exec. club and ALMOST ALL other frequent flyer schemes.

[jtipper1]

I quite agree with 10secondsurvey... My point exactly..

[MrSoft]

Quote : if you travel mainly around Europe and the UK, but never in club/business, you are much better off using a star alliance scheme.

I agree.