Hunter air and ground crew

[Tim McLelland]

Any former Hunter people out there with photos, anecdotes, or anything else connected with the aircraft? If so, please contact me as I'm putting together a new Hunter book - would be nice to include some input from the guys who worked with the aircraft rather than simply churning-out another potted history!

Anyone know where I might find any shots of Chivenor's twin-seat Hunters back in the 68-72 era when they were painted grey with dayglow patches? Pictures of these machines are particularly rare!

[GeeRam]

I remember seeing these posted on the Flypast forum a while back.....Chivenor 1972.
Although no grey/dayglo seen here I'm afraid.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v243/Consul/HunterLUcopy.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v243/Consul/HunterTOcopy.jpg

[Tim McLelland]

Indeed, just a little bit too late for the dayglow machines I guess, but impressive photos - that's the sort of sight that would encourage you to actually go to an air show!:)

[fantom]

This is a repeat but, here goes:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b236/minlgw/Sharjah1970.jpg

[BEagle]

So is this:

"The lovely Hunter ‘GT6’ was my favourite ever aeroplane. Take a standard Hunter F Mk 6, remove the heavy 4 x 30mm Aden gun pack and the draggy ‘Sabrina’ link collectors, add a TACAN so at least you know where you are, then paint the whole thing in go-faster high gloss ‘raspberry ripple’ polyurethane paint and there you have it.

During 1975, I’d finished my Gnat course and had been holding awaiting a pre-Tactical Weapons Unit Hunter course. When the course started, it was a few days’ groundschool, some simulator trips and then on to the Hunter T Mk 7, otherwise known as the ‘barge’. After the compact Gnat with its central warning system, Hobson motor pitch system and OR 946 instrumentation, the ‘barge’ was a real backward step - and it seemed as big as an airliner! But after passing the simulator check and the T7 dual rides, finally the day came on 9 Dec 75 to fly a real single seat fighter for the first time!

Get kitted up in goon suit and anti-‘g’ suit, then out to the aeroplane parked on ‘Hunter beach’ at Valley. Walk round, prod, poke, squint, then up the ladder and into the cockpit. ‘Fitz’, a CFS trapper visiting 4FTS keeps a fatherly eye on proceedings from the top of the ladder as I truss myself into a maze of webbing which would satisfy the most earnest bondage fetishist. Finally it’s time to lift the gangbar and turn on the batteries. First surprise - there’s no intercom sidetone. Because, of course, there’s no-one to talk to in a single-seater, stupid! Do the checks then wave finger at the groundcrew and Press the Button......

The Avpin starter works as advertised and the smell of burnt iso-propyl-nitrate fills the air. But all is well, gennies on , radio on, IFF on, power controls on. ‘Fitz’ smiles and disappears, the ladder is removed and it’s time to call for taxy. Next surprise, it’s so much easier to taxy than the T7 and before long I’m at the holding point.

Take-off clearance received, it's on to RW32 and off we go. Power up, quick stir of the controls then set top left and off we go. A brief ‘da-da-da’ from the bleed valves but initial acceleration seems much like it was in the T7. But then the extra oomph of the big Avon makes itself felt and there’s an almighty roar from somewhere behind as the IAS increases rapidly. Suddenly we’re airborne - Brakes on, gear up, flaps up, gear lights out, pressurisation master on.....then at 500ft start the right turn onto 140° to intercept the 100° radial. But we’re already passing 1000 ft and going like a train! Throttle to max continuous and adjust to 370 KIAS -except we’re already doing over 400! Pitch up, nail the speed, there’s the radial, turn left breathe out. ATC ask whether I’m ever going to change to Approach!

Oops, to Stud 2 then up the radial towards FL 200. At around 10 000 ft, remember to set 1013..... Finally catch up with the beast at FL 200 and check position. How can I be so far away from base already? Aim in a safe direction, think ‘OK - let’s see what she’ll do’ - set max continuous and M0.9something comes up amazingly quickly. Tweak the control column back and the altimeter goes bananas - as do ATC as I’m in the upper airspace without clearance! Then settle down to some aeros and max rate turns before aiming back at Valley for a QGH to PAR. That all goes OK, so I roll and then out go to initials for a visual run-in-and-break.

Overtake a couple of Gnats, call ‘initials’, then idle power, airbrake out....70-80° angle of bank and 23° flap on the break. Roll out, airbrake in, gear down - and the controls go all stiff as the hydraulic pump can’t cope with both things together. So a bit of power and all is well. Call ‘final’, 38° flap and pitch into the final turn. Then full flap, slow down to Vat plus 10 and another nice roller. Full power - lovely loud noise - another circuit and it’s time to land. Turn off, taxy in and shut down, grinning from ear to ear.

My logbook says ‘December 10 1975 Hunter F6 XF386 Self / Solo Ex RF4 0:50 First Pilot (Captain), 0:05 actual IF, QGH/PAR, 3 landings. But that hardly describes such an experience!

And what of XF386? She lived on for nearly 20 more years before being scrapped at Otterburn in 1996 after 40 years loyal service. A cruel death for such a lovely lady - I hope she’s up there in Hunter heaven......."

[ArthurR]

It will be nice to see a real book about the Hunter, Do not know which is my favourite to work on Hunter or Vulcan.. Any way take a look at these web sites you may find the pictures your looking for,

www.ekco-radar.co.uk (http://www.ekco-radar.co.uk)

www.abpic.co.uk (http://www.abpic.co.uk)

Worked on them at Valley (late 60's) and later at SOAF (late 70's)

[Chairborne 09.00hrs]

Seen at Valley in 1975:

http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q217/John_txic666/XF386Val98.75.jpg

[Exrigger]

This appears to have some pictures of the ones you mentioned:

www.classicjets.co.uk

Plus the favourite site for gen, might be some hidden away here:

Thunder & Lightning site has a Hunter section

And

http://www.fradu-hunters.co.uk/gallerycb.html

possibly:

http://pacific-hunter-aviation.com.au/oz/warped.html

These should help (I hope).

[dwhcomputers]

I believe it was late 1965 or early 1966 at RAF Kutching. At about 02:30hrs I was rudely awoke by the Duty Driver as I was required to help off load an Argosy from Changi. I was tasked to take the wooden boxes by fork lift direct to the Hunter Detachment .Job finished by 04:30 hrs and empty Argosy back off to Changi. Back into work 4 hrs later and asked Deano what the panic was. He explained that the previous day the Hunter on patrol had jettisoned his tanks and when the Sqd asked stores for another pair the bin card entry showed nil. No computers in those days. Come with me said I feeling smug and took Deano to the Stores Bulk Storage area behind Whirlwind Aircraft Servicing Flight. I pulled back the tarps and there lay 6 drop tanks in wooden crates where I had been told to put them six weeks or so earlier. Deano a Cpl Storeman aged in his late 40s obviously realised if the truth came out the proverbial would hit the fan. The following Sunday instead of having a lie in I found myself with Deano sorting out the bulk storage area and putting the tanks right at the back. He removed the outer case labels and then we stacked other boxes on top of them. I wonder what happened to them when the camp closed probably got buried in the Jungle like a lot of the other kit.

[Tim McLelland]

Exrigger, I can't see any shots of grey/dayglow T7's on the Classic Airframes site so if you spotted any, do let me know - I might just be looking in the wrong places! I don't bother looking at the Thunder & Lightning's site as I don't rate the ramblings of that particular plane spotter too highly!

Beagle, that's a nice story (can I use it?) - the 4FTS Hunters were fine-looking machines. I only ever managed to scrounge one passenger ride in a Hunter, courtesy of FRADU, but I have to say I was impressed by its performance considering the age of the airframe. I guess the side-by-side seating gives you a perception of speed you don't get when you're sat in a tandem cockpit, but I remember being distinctly surprised by the speed at which she rattled down Yeovilton's runway.

I'll keep looking for Chivenor stuff - considering that Chivenor was often regarded as the "home of the Hunter" there's surprisingly little photographic evidence of the days of the OCU. I'm also keeping a lookout for the many and varied RAE/MoD(PE) Hunters that appeared in all manner of guises!:)

[philrigger]

;)
Back in 1967 I was a member of 1417 Flight, RAF Khormaksar. The flight had a photo taken with all flight members perched in/on a FR Mk10 Hunter. Is there anybody out there with a copy of this photo? The CO was Sqn Ldr Barraclough. Other aircrew that I recall were; Horatio Farquhar-Smith, Derek Whitman, Dave Bagnall and Ken Simpson. I think there were 6 pilots in all but my memory is fading.




'We knew how to whinge but we kept it in the NAAFI bar.'

[haltonapp]

I was fortunate to do my time in Bahrain in 1968 on 8 Sqn, FGA9's and FR10's! I do remember having to change the anti-g valve when ever we did airfiring, the vibration fractured the bellows, not an easy job with the seat in on the line in the middle of summer!
Tim Thorne was a mear Flt Lt then! The SEngo was a pilot.
Happy days.

[Exrigger]

Tim if the ones here are the right color scheme they appear to be T8s, I'll keep looking for T7 as well:

http://www.classicjets.co.uk/gallery/galxj6151.html

http://www.hunterflyingclub.co.uk/hunterdt/n321.html

[devonianflyer]

I once saw a pic of 8 hunters flying over Lundy Isle in echelon, with the tail letters spelling out CHIVENOR! Can't exactly remember where, but I think it was in a pub on Lundy. Would make a nice edition for your book. Hope it hopes.
DF

[off centre]

I wonder why the disparaging remarks about a source offered up? Would seem to defeat the purpose of asking for assistance.

Sharp-ish end of legal proceedings perhaps?

[bvcu]

Has anyone got any pictures of the ETPS hunters with the nose probes fitted ? We used to fit them to both T7's and both F6's for about 2 weeks of the course for specific exercises , they had yaw vanes fitted if i rember correctly. Have never seen any photos of them fitted.

[virgo]

Northbrook College (Shoreham airport) has got an ex-Chivenor Hunter being used as an instructional airframe. It's fully complete and will be available for viewing (and getting into !!) at the RAFA Air Day 15/16 September.

bccu..............Try putting this thread on History and Nostalgia, you might get more responses.

[Tim McLelland]

Devonian, I think the photo you refer to is one of Chivenor's Hawks? I recall that they did such a photo shoot with 151 Squadron. Having said that, I know from many reports that the Chivenor shows always included a very significant Hunter presence, and yet there doesn't seem to be much photographic evidence of the events - 'tis a shame - there must be snapshots hiding away in attics all around the country!:)

Thanks for all the feedback and pointers - keep 'em coming if anyone thinks of anything more!

[Like This - Do That]

Tim have you tried contacting Neil Mercer? He's bound to have hundreds of piccies of FRADU GA.11s etc.

I've never met the bloke, just bought his books, so I don't have contact details.

[kemblejet01]

Got a dozen Hunter airframes at Kemble - 4 of them flyers.

www.deltajets.com

[BEagle]

Tim, yes, feel free to use that.

Do contact DeltaJets and also some of the old Hunter sqn assocs - gold mine of information there!

[Mightycrewseven]

Sqn Ldr (Ret'd) Chris Bain, who has just published his memoirs, include some Hunter stories:
http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/I/51AvtRcICaL._AA240_.jpg
His synopsis reads:
This is a semi-autobiographical account of a fighter pilot in the RAF from 1962 to 1994. He was both a Hunter and Harrier pilot, rose to Squadron Leader level, and commanded fighter and strategic recce units. He was CO of the Desert Rescue Team, flew Dakotas on desert supply running, and saw active fighter service receiving bullet holes in his aircraft during the Aden Radfan campaign. He flew Cold War covert recce missions, commanded the Harrier unit in Belize, spent the Gulf War working with the US Defence Intelligence Agency, and became a nuclear weapons specialist. The book includes inside accounts of army support missions on the Yemen border, flying cold war recce missions in Europe, early day conversion to Harriers without any training aids, and long range ultra-high-level, covert photo intelligence gathering sorties, including helping police and customs with airborne photography, most notably for the 2nd Moors Murder Inquiry. It also includes political, geographical and economic background of all the places in which he served, and comments on political and military decisions made at those times.

:hmm:
Before I waste my money, anyone read this book and fancy giving us a review? :rolleyes:
M7sends

[G085H1TE]

Tim,
I've had this shot of Chivenor in my (small but perfectly formed) collection for a while. Judging by the kit on the ground (Hunter F.1s, Vampire FB.5s and T.11s) I guess it was taken around 1955?
It's not the best of scans I'm afraid - will see if I can do a better job of it now I've got a new, less grumpy, scanner.
My father's also got a few shots from his time with the other Hunter OCU (233 at Pembrey) in 1956-57 if they're of any interest to you?
http://www.hawkerhunter.com/misc/Chivenor-sm.jpg

[Tim McLelland]

That's a gem of a photograph - a real nostaligia trip! Somehow I guess Chivenor's flight line doesn't look quite so interesting these days... presume it's full of Army trucks? I saw that the approach lights on their wooden trestles over the estuary have gone too - tragic - Chivenor's had more comebacks than Frank Sinatra but I guess it's gone for good now:{

[BEagle]

Yes, a real gem of a photo. That's the RAF I wanted to join!! Lots of stations and lots of jets.

But SHOCK, HORROR!! Not only are those chaps wearing hats on the flight line, but not one of them is wearing a yellow road-digger's jacket!!!

The sun always did shine in the Summer in those days. Having been on the first of the Hawk courses back in 1980, I don't think I could face the pain of seeing what the RM have done to 'Heaven in Devon' - probably the finest station in the RAF in the eraly 80s.

May the fleas of a thousand camels forever infest the armpits and crotch of the utter tosser who handed it over to the Marines............:mad:

[rivethead]

:cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool:
Hey Tim i have in my hand at this very moment a book titled "RAF Chivenor"
by David Watkins, it is in the series of Britian in old photographs and this book has quit a lot of old pictures of the mighty CHIV with its Hunters and lots of othe aircraft.
There is even a picture of 36 Hunters flying in the formation of 229, of which i was lucky enough to see way back then.
I first came accross Chiv as a very youg LAC when i got posted there straight off my Mechs course at good old St Athan back in February of 1971,
working on the Hunter line with Mk 6 & 10s, what memories.
I went back there and finished my time on the Hawks in 1985.
I go back there now and again just across the esturary at Fremington camp and have a few times gone back onto the camp, and what a lot of changes.
Talking to someof the locals it was a bad day when all the CRABS moved out and the BOOTIES moved in.:{:{:{:{:{:{

[Double Zero]

Please call if you wish at [email protected] - PM playing up at the moment.

- have a couple of shots of T8M XL602 when she was a Sea Harrier FRS1 Blue Fox testbed for us - an uncle was a fitter dedicated solely to that aircraft, and I must say I've not heard a good comment from him or my father re. working on the Hunter - great to fly, a total b----rd in original form to work on or use in combat !

[Algy]

Now that's how to write English. (http://www.flightglobal.com/PDFArchive/View/1955/1955%20-%200237.html)

[Tim McLelland]

Imagine - aerospace articles written by competent journalists. The mind boggles!:hmm:

Oh and speaking of T8M's I hope the one at Exeter gets back into the air eventually. That should be worth a second glance!

[jindabyne]

From the loft ----

O'head Chivenor, FL370, 6/68, RTB from Wattisham (Queens B'Day Flypast Detachment)
http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c192/jindabyne/img014.jpg

Most men who flew in it
http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c192/jindabyne/img013.jpg

Chivenor Open Day, 8/68
http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c192/jindabyne/img012.jpg

[Tim McLelland]

Even more obscure! - the lead Hunter appears to be wearing the fairly short-lived natural metal finish with dayglow patches. I assume the F6's have white spines?

Useful photo this - it also clears-up the confusion as to the size of the upper wing roundels on the Chivenor Meteors - these seem to vary in size on various Meteors, depending on what unit they belonged to!

[Raven30]

Tim,
You are correct, it was 151 Sqn Hawks over Lundy with the tail letters spelling out the name. 1982 I think - I still have a copy somewhere.

[Two's in]

Saw a couple of Hunters going in to NAS Jacksonville, FL, just the other week, not sure who they belonged to but still a fantastic looking aircraft.

[country calls]

As a fresh faced 16 yr old Flight Line Mechanic I was loaned to Hunter Line at Valley, supposedly to stop me from learning bad habits before the start of my Hawk FLM course in 79. Guess where I learnt all my bad habits?????

Such gems as the quickest way to get from point a to b with a polypin (barrel) of Avpin, was to lay it on its side and propel it along the flight line with deft kicks.........

I still have the trademark scar on the top of my head from the mainwheel centering spike in the wheel well. If you forgot to duck your head as you ran the fuel hose in, you ended up spilling claret everywhere from the gash in your head exactly where the soft spot in a babys skull is. It's hard work, dialling the clockwork fuel distributor setting with blood in your eyes!

Best memory though, was running a field telephone from the linehut to the beach and toasting nicely in the sun between see offs.

[cliver029]

I've still got a scar on my back from backing into a very "warm" Hunter pitot head whilst doing a hot turn round at Tengah during "Confrontation"

[Mike Read]

It is pleasing to see the photos of the Chivenor flight line at various times. I wonder if anyone out there remembers the day following the Royal Observer Corps day - 12 Oct 64 - when the visiting aircraft dispersed. They all had a training connection and it seemed a good idea to have a mixed formation flyby. So, with a Spitfire leading, (Phil Holde- Rushworth) a vic of a pointed nose Canberra and a Vampire T11 and a J.P. followed by a vic of Meteor F8 (me) with a Hunter F6 and a Gnat. As we flew by sombody said "why don't we go to Rissy" so we did ! Can't remember if the photo in my logbook was taken at Chiv or Rissy.

Or the New Years Eve Party on 31 Dec 64 when a rumour started about 1 Sqn (229 OCU that is - not the baloonists) planning a squadron flypast to welcome the new year. 2 Sqn boss, Buck Ryan, had a quiet word with our engineer and organised a 1st Jan 65 0900 take off, headaches notwithstanding. I have a photo of the Squadron - four boxes of Mk 6's with a box of Meteors and the Hunter spare tucked in behind. Needless to say, having been pipped at the post 1 Sqn gave in. Happy days. A great OC Flying, Mike Hobson, who permitted such things. No doubt such shennanigins would now need approval by CAS who would say "NO".