Dragon Rapide (not!)

[Andy_RR]

I had an afternoon at Duxford today and my credit card developed a sudden and nearly incurable itch whilst walking past the Classic Wings cabin, so before I came to my senses, I was aboard the old dragon lady.

What a loverly old bus! In fact, I wish the seats in 747's were as comfortable. It felt way more modern that I would have given it credit for. OK, so it wasn't quick, despite the moniker, but with earplugs it would have been a very relaxed way of travelling in days of yore.

The Gipsy Sixes sounded like mechanical magic as they fired up. :ok:

Two questions though:

- how do you get a type rating in one? No dual controls to keep the insurance company happy.

- when doing my tailwheel instruction, I was taught to get the tail up ASAP, starting with full forward stick in order to avoid hopping down the runway on the takeoff roll. It seemed easy enough to do in a L-18, but not many pilots seem to do this. We managed to bounce several times before becoming airbourne. Is it dangerous to use this method on more powerful types?

A

[VFE]

I think yer'll find that type ratings are the preserve of aircraft above a certain weight/crew requirement. The Rapide does not fall into that category. Those applicable to fly it would probably need significant bi-plane time, multi-time, taildragger time and some experience of vintage aircraft. In other words it's not easy! Unless you've got money of course.....

I know someone who test flew one a few years back, and a family member who helped restore it - if no more enlightening answers are forthcoming by next week when I see him I shall ask for you.

VFE.

[G-KEST]

With some 250 hours on DH84 and DH89A types in the dim and distant past I may be able to shed some light on the queries.

Conversion to type was done once the individual had already obtained his multi-engine piston rating. He or she would have plenty of tail wheel experience along with a reasonable amount of time in vintage biplanes such as the Tiger Moth. Experience on the Leopard, Puss and Hornet Moths would have been beneficial since both the Dragon and the Rapide had similar braking systems.

With the "student" and the "instructor" as the sole occupants plus a good load of ballast on the rear seats to keep the CofG nicely inside the envelope the " instructor" would fly the aircraft to demonstrate a flight including general handling and stalling plus a bit of asymmetric flight, a demonstration of the asymmetric committal height along with the takeoff, a few touch and go's and a full stop landing. For this session the "student" would be in the front right hand passenger seat in order to listen and observe.

Following a comprehensive debrief the "instructor" would again take off and clear the area climbing, if possible, to above 3,000 feet. He would then trim out carefully and ease his way out of the only pilots seat into the cabin. The "student" would then be able to slide through into the vacant seat. With the "instructor" observing and making pertinant comments the "student" would carry out his own evaluation of the handling characteristics and performance under symmetric and asymmetric power settings. When both pilots were happy then a rejoin would be flown leading to a few touch and go's including missed approaches and simulated single engined circuits. Finally a few full stop landings would finish the detail.

Again a full and comprehensive debrief would consolidate the flight and settle any queries.

If both pilots were happy then the first solo on type would follow this, again followed by a good debrief.

The newly converted pilot would need a bit of close supervision until a reasonable number of hours had been achieved.

Later on a similar "dual"/"solo" session would be needed to cover cross wind techniques, hard runway operation and short field landings.

As the pilot gained experience then the load could be increased up to the MTOM where the reduction in performance is quite marked.

Cheers,

Trapper 69
:ok:

PS - In my own case having done my multi-engine rating on a Cirrus Minor powered Miles Gemini in some six hours my very next flight was as PI in a Rapide G-AKNN accompanied by eight parachutists. 15 minutes later I landed on my own. They knew it was my first landing on type and preferred to go for help on the ground should it be necessary...........!! Oh thee of little faith.

PPS - Getting the tail up too early in the Rapide or any tailwheel type can aggravate the swing due to all the pro-swing factors coming virtually together. If you wait until there is a bit of airflow over the fin and rudder the aircraft is much easier to control in yaw as the tail rises with forward elevator. Hope that makes it clear.

[Gipsy Queen]

Andy_RR,

Yes, the Gipsy Sixes did sound nice on start up. The Gipsy Queen sounded even better. But orchestrating four Sixes in a DH114 is really fun!

G-Kest,

I was waffling on about the Gemini a few days ago.

I wouldn't argue with your take-off procedure in the Rapide but as a rule of thumb (whatever that may be, and I'm sure it's dangerous!), I preferred to get the tail up early, other things being equal. Not in the case of the Rapide however. De Havilland tails characteristically tended to be on the small side and, in the case of two engines, this was a particular disadvantage compared with the more usual pre-war practice of having twin tails a la Gemini. Not much in the way of corkscrew effect but the gyroscopic precession with torque reaction from two props turning in the same direction did militate against getting the tail up too soon. I never did positively establish whether moving the throttle and stick forward together shortened the take-off run.

On the other hand, the Beechcraft 18, even with the tailwheel locked, had a propensity to ground loop if you didn't pay attention and I preferred to get onto two wheels ASAP when starting the roll. Ditto for the DC3, not because of handling difficulties but having set the DI when lining up, that's all you could see in front of you until the tail rose. Of course, these had contra-rotating props which makes a big difference. And having to pay for the tailwheel shear-pin replacement when you forget the check downwind makes a difference to your pay packet too!

The Rapide was fun and you really were King of the Castle stuck up there in the front all by yourself with that wonderful view outside and quirky panel layout inside which was quite hard work in IMC. I remember it as a pretty vice-less aircraft but you did have to watch wing tip stall. More powerful flaps would have been nice . . .

Best.

[Andy_RR]

Thanks guys for your insights and memories.

Yes, I didn't think about the lack of propwash over the tail on this twin type.

I doubt I'll ever get the means or the inclination to do a twin rating, leave aside a sign-off on a Rapide, but it sure was a wonderful to experience olde worlde air travel.

A

[Scion]

Andy,
don't loose faith. You never know what might happen. I grew up in Belfast besotted with Airfix kits more years ago than I would like to remember but some 4 years ago i was able to buy a DH 89a Rapide here in Australia and went through the process of endorsement. I had some tailwhell time in a Klemm l25 and a British Klemm Eagle but eventually you have to solo. Preferably at dawn when there is no one about to see any disasters. Unless however you are of slim build, young and flexable a changeover at 3000 ft is a bit difficult. My mentor just got out as he said there was but little he could do from the front seat but at least he could call an ambulance from airside.
My rapide is VH-UTV if you want to have a look at it on Airliners or Warbirdsnz.

[Andy_RR]

Scion, That's a beautiful bird! I guess it's like flying anything. Eventually you have to do it by yourself. I still remember my first solo in VH-RWF, and then again in G-BBYB for my tailwheel conversion. I guess learning to fly things is just a succession of these memorable events.

I love these old aircraft. Flying is still a personal adventure for me, but back in those days, it was an adventure for the whole of mankind!

I will keep the faith, S As you say, you never know what will happen. My dream, which will hopefully start turning reality near the end of this year is to build and fly an RV-8. Well, earlier, I wouldn't have credited being taken for my first flight in one with a Mr Johanson. A gentleman with a true adventurous spirit. I believe he is somewhere over the Pacific in an RV as I type this.

Regards, A

[Gary Halliday]

That all seems a bit of a faff Mr KEST. The way you did it seems adequate to me.

As for contra rotating props and having a sheer pin to replace as a result of an omitted downwind check.....

Gypsy Queen..... that would be on the DC-3's on Zog I guess? Though I can't speak for the Beech 18's.

Gazza.

[Gipsy Queen]

"As for contra rotating props and having a sheer pin to replace as a result of an omitted downwind check.....

Gypsy Queen..... that would be on the DC-3's on Zog I guess? Though I can't speak for the Beech 18's."

You've got me here, Gazza.

"Zog 1"?

I've wracked what's left of my feeble intellect but can't think what this might mean. Best I can do is a King of Albania. I am intrigued to know what this might be.

Curiously, the B18 was the opposite. Last of the downwind checks was "Tail wheel lock handle - LOCKED". It remained locked until just before you turned off the runway and you had to get the speed right off before making the turn - the machine could be twitchy on the ground and it would chase its tail with very little encouragement. In fact, the tail wheel was locked for engine start/run-up, take-off, landing and parked. I imagine the assembly had a shear pin but I can't remember from this distance in time.

Although I may have no recollection of the pin, I do remember that between "Altimeter SET - QFE" and "Fuel selector valve handles - FRONT tanks, crossfeed valve handle - OFF" was the curious instruction "Crew and passengers - ALERTED". I never knew quite how to deal with that one. :confused: