flyglobespan -Abandonment@jfk New York

[yakyakyakyak]

as one of the many passengers abandoned at jfk on the 2/3 july,and having spent several hundred pounds getting myself back to the uk!
is there anyone out there organizing a joint action or must i go it alone?


how did the alleged 500 odd people over 3/4 days get back to the uk?:confused:

[warkman]

Try here
http://www.airlinequality.com/Forum/flygspan.htm

and here
http://www.holidaytruths.co.uk/
Ross ferneihough the lawyer on that site is worth contacting

[geriatrix]

My goodness - those stories on the Airline Quality website are scary indeed. One airline to be wary of, I think. Anyone from Globespan feel like commenting?

[GSM SCOT]

Don't believe everything that is on airlinequality as they are "selective" about what posts they publish on the website.

Know of a few passengers who have written to them to comment on how good the service/crew where but they never appeared on the website.

There are problems with some of the longhaul flights, most are flying at over 90% capacity, if not full so these "comments" are only from a very small percentage of our passengers.

[manintheback]

GSM_Scot - I've written positive and negative to airlinequality and the only post not selected was a negative one about Heathrow.

You also state that 'there are problems with some of the longhaul flights' - which agrees with the overall negativity expressed?

[yakyakyakyak]

gsm scot;
try telling that to the 500 odd customers abandoned @ jfk last week:ouch:
you would be likely to have been linched:}
are they going to cough on the costs of repatronisation in excess of the refunded leg of the flight or will it have to go legal, public and messy?
yours
one of the abandoned:E

[Big Harvey]

GSM SCOT - I've had reviews good and bad published on that site about a variety of different airlines. One or two weren't published, and I wondered why. However, when I read the small-print, they're very strict about format, and they don't like you doing things like using an empty line to denote a new paragraph. That's one possible reason for non-publication of these reviews.

Are you suggesting that airlinequality could have something against FlyGlobespan?

[Mr Gammon Flaps]

Just found this:

http://www.rte.ie/news/2007/0712/globespan.html

Couldn't possibly be Globespans fault....it would have to be Swissport, or the engineers, or JFK, or the wrong leaves on the runway.......


GF

[CamelhAir]

Why so surprised? It's beyond the concept of modern management to accept responsibility for anything negative. Blame is the name of the game, as well it might be as refusal to accept responsibility is generally rewarded.
The idea that management are remunerated to take responsibility is alien to most. It used to be that that was their job. No longer. The buck used to stop at the top, now it is passed ever lower down the chain. This ability requires bull**** and political skills, not management skills. Thus explaining why the general level of genuine managerial talent is so abyssmally low.

[SingleLensReflex]

met a couple at Palma whose flight didn't show 2007_07_14.

almost booked same flight. soooo glad we didn't.

[CHIVILCOY]

GSM longhaul has been nothing short of a disaster so far this year with a lot of unhappy passengers who will not be back.The Boston route from GLA has been scaled down and abandoned for the winter so GSM will lose any RDF funding for not complying with the rules.:=
I have not heard a good word said about the longhaul product although their shorthaul European product continues to perform well - maybe they should stick to flying those routes.

[Hombre]

I do not take away the sorry experiences of long haul but must say I have flown with GSM since they started on AGP/Glasgow and AGP/EDI and never had a problem.

Hopefully lessons have been learned and they can stick at what they are good at - providing a well-run European service.

If they want to keep going over the big pond though they better sharpen up their act exponentially.

[malagajohn]

Like Hombre , i am a frequent user of GSM within Europe using the AGP - GLA service and occasionally the EDI one as well

Never had a delay :D:D

Obviously there transatlantic measure has suffered from bad planing and bad luck - should be interesting to see what they do next year

[cabot]

Im a regular user of GSM and have used their flights all over europe to places as diverse as Prague, Faro, Malaga ,Palma and even an international flight to Orlando for 2 weeks at a villa in 2006.I can honestly say i have never encountered any of the problems that seem to have beset other travellers. Staff have been professional in their dealings with both myself and my family and flights have generally been on time and sometimes early in their arrival on both outbound and return journeys.
Perhaps the airline has been stretching itself on the international scene lately which has caused problems when planes go tech.One thing which may have been a contributing factor on this has been to lease out 2 of its recently aquired 767 aircraft from Air NZ on to Air India. I flew in its first 767 GCDPT and was impressed by the level of service in its economy plus cabin. I wonder if an additional 767 due to arrive in September will help alleviate some pressure
Maybe i have been lucky....the problem is most people complain if they have poor service but few people will shout if they have the opposite.
...........and no i do NOT work for the airline

[IB4138]

History! :rolleyes:

...before the shambles!

cabot, you were very, very, lucky. European route have not suffered the same as the trans Atlantic ones, but they have had problems.

We are all too aware of the lease of their own 767's to AI, which is the route cause of the problem.

[nivsy]

While i also have not had a delay of any significance between AGP and GLA with GSM we have short memories. During early part of this summer the 737 600 series especially on the EDI-AGP was subject to extreme delays and on some days consecutive days - I do recall in excess of 8 hours on occassion. Anyhow I also hope GSM get the long haul probs sorted and continue to grow.


Nivsy

[afterdark]

mmm should I, or not book GSM flights Glasgow to Sanford & return for 2008 ?

any GSM folks tell me the configuration/pitch/entertainment of the their 767's the only cabin picture around, is of whilst in NZ cols looked pretty dated, tatty coloured cloth numbers, will they refit their own eventually with some leather seats, I heard it was supposed to be done late last year.

[GSM SCOT]

We have been told that the 767's will undergo an interior refit when they are returned from India and be ready for the summer session.

Leather seats and will be in a two class configuration.

[Bear13583]

Attempted the gsm samford glasgow route last night when the left engine had a power surge and the pilot turned back after burning two hours of fuel. All to be expected in the circumstance. When we got back to sanford we were told it was now no longer globespans problem. This ment that the ground staff were left to deal with us. We were told that there were no atms in the departure lounge when there were, the food vouchers werent accepted everywhere as we had been told, no oe told us anything once the plan pulled up at the gate. The flight crew left very quickly and offered no further assistance although some of them did a good job on the plane reassuring nervous passengers etc. And to top it all because we were staying with family we were told that it was up to us to find out what was happening with regard to a replacement flights. We were just giving contact details to the rep as we had been told to when some officious cow came up and asked what we were doing and then treated us like scum because we wern't going to the hotel. Also i was assured at check in that the 757 was not going to refuel on the way to glasgow but have recently found that this was a lie. :mad::mad::mad::mad:

[Bear13583]

What flea market do globespan darken to get there engines? Thier 757 seems to have an engine problem list longer than their delays! was on the flight to gla last noght when a power surge grounded the plane just after take off :ugh:

[speedrestriction]

Grounded the plane just after take-off Strange turn of phrase:hmm:
sr

[Bear13583]

Yeah sorry bout that tho i imagine it's not going anywhere just yet:O

[Pontious]

Sorry to hear you had a rough time of it, Bear'. I'll try to clarify some of the muddiness in the waters:

If the Captain deemed it neccessary to return to SFB then you have to respect that this decision was only taken in the interest of safety & only a fool would continue with a flight if they were setting off across the Atlantic in a twin' on a dark winters night, after an engine surge.

Once you had returned to SFB, GSM appointed agents (in this instance Swissport) are contracted to look after the passengers, Swissport then invoice GSM for any neccessary hotel accommodation, transportation costs and beverages. Swissport would be responsible for checking the validity of any vouchers they issue.

The flight crew usually leave the scene once a decision has been made that a replacement will be utilised so that they themselves can begin their mandatory rest between duty periods.

If you were upset by the way you were treated by a member of the Swissport team then take their name and include it in your general complaint to GSM but DON'T blame GSM for acting in the interest of safety then treating you shabilly when it was a differant company contracted in to look after your welfare. I operate into SFB frequently and I believe the only passenger handling company there is Swissport.

Finally, when you were originally scheduled to depart for GLA, then the flight may well have been able to make it direct & non-stop, I have done so on numerous occassions, this depends upon the ammount of passengers on board (hence weight), the required ammount of fuel for the trip plus any mandatory extra for anticipated holding, re-routing & diversion plus crucially, the wind component for that particular track of the flight, if my memory serves me correctly, if you have more than a 30kt tailwind component for the entire trip and your aircraft's Zero-Fuel Weight is sufficiently low, you can usually make it without tech.stopping.
To say "...this changed so it was obviously a lie..." is factually inaccurate at best, or at worse libellous.

Any more queries, please PM me.
:ok:

[Bear13583]

As i said it was expected that he turned back after the fuel was burnt off but the denial of any resposibillity on the ground was appaling. Swissport ignored us completely or treated us like an unwanted inturuption and all information given regarding atms etc was missleading or contradictory. No contact information for globespan was given and no consideration was given by gsm or swissport to those stayng with reletives that had to be woken to collect us.

[Pontious]

Well, Bear', YOU CHOSE to stay with relatives. YOU COULD have stayed with the rest of the pax. in a GSM provided hotel (as is the norm') but as you stated , YOU CHOSE to stay with the relatives YOU woke up- YOU cannot blame GSM or Swissport for that! Try taking some responsibility for your own unneccessary actions.

No contact for GSM would be given because Swissport co-ordinate everything including pax accommodation and transportation right up to the moment of re-scheduled departure so any pax trying to contact GSM and subsequently acting on any differing GSM provided information could lead to confusion and a pax being left behind, as has happened before.

As for the ATM's, I've never had a problem with the ones on offer in the International departure lounge.

Was there anything else?
:ok:

[luvly jubbly]

B738 sent out to rescue the pax...................

[G-BPED]

Bear13583. FlyGlobespan are definitely a company to avoid.

Just a glance through the comments about them on this site

http://www.airlinequality.com/Forum/flygspan.htm

Will give you an insight into their "customer service" especially on Long Haul.

[Bear13583]

Ah pontius, were you the officious cow? First off the guy dealing with the contact inforation was explaining something but the bossy old tart told us to stop bothering him and go away. Also are you honestly saying that you would rather stay in a hotel than go back and stay with family? Wierd but what ever floats your boat I guess.

[Bear13583]

Also, the atm worked fine but the people running the lounge said there wasn't one there at all!

[Shiny side down]

Just to reiterate what pontious has written.

Flyglobespan use Swissport for the ground resources at Sanford.
It is their responsibility to ensure that passengers are cared for as per the company's instructions.

If you have any problems with what they have done, then the facts need to be forwarded on.
If any ground personnel treated you in any way inappropriately, details, and names need to be provided. Only with accurate information can these things be addressed.

Quite often, I have seen comments regarding customer service, which actually relate to our contractors, and not to flyglobespan.
I am saddened that instead of addressing the problems with the agent directly, it is written here instead.

[Final 3 Greens]

Shiny Side Down

You need to take onboard that your contractors are you in the eyes of the customer.

I have no axe to grind, never flown Globespan, have no plans to.

[TightSlot]

...pontius, were you the officious cow? First off the guy dealing with the contact inforation was explaining something but the bossy old tart told us...
Bear - you'll find that you get much more useful responses, both on PPRuNe and in your future correspondence with FG if you step back and try for some less emotive language.

Chill...

[radeng]

If the company employ agents, surely they take FULL responsibility for the agents performance? (or lack thereof)
So if the agents screw up, the company should recompense the PAX and claim from the non-performing agents

[nivsy]

Much depends I should imagine on the Terms and Conditions of Contract between the airline operator and the handling agents. Contracts and the price paid between various agents and operators will vary throughout the industry similar to many other businesses that have "contracts".

Swissport may have more liability for example with any other operator than what they have with FlyGlobespan. It depends on what has been negotiated and indeed could even possibly vary between airports served by the same airline with the same handling agent. Its all in the beauty of negotiation, value for money, risk assessment and liability.


Nivsy

[James 1077]

I'm sorry but as pax the agent = the airline. I don't care if the airline has outsourced their ground operations to someone else; if that company isn't performing then it is the airline that is at fault as that is who I have contracted with.

I am not going to put in a complaint against a ground handling company as I have no contract with them; I'll complain to / claim against the airline about their service and the airline can then pass that on to the ground handler.

[nivsy]

Judging by the newspapers (Daily Record) own forum pages which has a number of comments from pax actually on the flight wishing to put things in context now - including praise for Flyglobespans handling of the situation - at least in the air. Think this is the end of this particular incident debate??
Nivsy

http://forums.dailyrecord.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=919