How orofessional is this?

[Dushan]

I once saw a thread describing this video, but the link was wrong.
Here is the link:
JAT 727 (JU4521) cockpit - landing BEG RWY 12 (http://video.google.com/googleplayer.swf?docId=1488963970796657726)
Some observations:
PIC smoking, not strapped.
PF has no approach plates.
Door seems open, PAX standing in it.
Two people sitting behind crew. Does 727 have a FE?
Conversation, in Serbian, about a guy with chikens, on flight path, that would not lay eggs.
PIC "We left late, we are arriving early. What's that all about? 737 couldnt do that if it tried. Not even in theory."
Someone asking PF if he wants to land on the highway.
Someone explains that the highway toll booth is the marker used for turning to lineup with RWY.
Comments?

[mr. vicodan]

PIC probably has lap belt on.
Smoking...that's probably a European thing.
They're flying a visual approach, why have the plate tacked to the yoke. You review the important information before hand and fly a visual. Downwind, base, final...no big deal.
727 does need an FE.
I don't know who shot the video but perhaps it was the FO's, and he does have 4 stripes so he is a Captain, last flight.
Toll booth...a good cue on on the visual approach I'm guessing.
Telling jokes or whatever is just the usual banter in the cockpit. Perhaps it is non-pertinent chatter, but after you've flown awhile, you find yourself doing it.
They did run their checklists and acted professional in my opinion.

[priapism]

Very unorofessional indeed!

[FCS Explorer]

ah come on. wx is good, no traffic, the guys are having a good time and they are not really pushing any limits. a shoulder harness would safe his skull from impacting on the panel, but thats his problem. maybe they're not established at 1.000 of 500, but on the other hand they operate their way smoothly. it's maybe "non-standard" and i wouldn't do it like this, but i fail to see anything really unsafe.

[vapilot2004]

I just might have preferred to work with the guys in the video as opposed to some of the cowboys and girls closer to home.






Smoking at that point of the ride may be questionable, but did you know that many 727s came with ashtrays up front? :}

[RoyHudd]

Looked fine to me. Happy to fly with those guys. Nice approach, landing.

[warmkiter]

hi all

many airplanes have fallen of the sky because off bad CRM and that the guys didnt get along.

i always take rather an oldman smoking thank a captain whos an A§§HOWL.

There were 3 old guys flying a visual to a very familiar airport. looked like the flying part was pretty good. early establishment, checklists read timely and good basic flying. to all you chairflyers, get a life....

L

[Dream Land]

At least the captain was in the cockpit and his son wasn't flying. :}

[Farmer 1]

Could never be described as orofessional, though, could it?

[GeeJay]

:)

Nothing wrong here.

Nice visual approach (but a bit below glide on short) and smooth landing.

The guy taking the video is seating on the jumpseat behind the Capt.

Smoking in the cockpit?? When was that video taken??? Not all the companies are banning this and in many others, despite the ban, some are still smoking.... (Would you denounce a colleague or friend for this act which has absolutely nothing to see with safety??? (BTW I don't smoke))

Relax?? Do you need to appear stressed to look "orofessional"???

Happy landings

[npasque]

yes the 727 does have a FE. sitting ATPL flight planning on monday so if i dont know that much then im screwed :E

[iqit]

most non-pilots and some airline pilots have the wrong idea of what being a professional means.

relax!take it easy.

wearing a tie ,and raybans DOES NOT make you a professional.....

[Insane]

Looks and sounds like An African airline??:}

[Few Cloudy]

The British pilots of the ill fated mid air over eastern europe were talking about chickens too - beware!

[Dutchjock]

Even shiny new airbusses are still delivered with ashtrays up the front..:}

[BitMoreRightRudder]

Some interesting variations on what makes a professional, and some even more interesting variations in the spelling of the word professional!
Speaking of a shiny new airbus, my god how I would have loved to have flown the 727. I should have been born earlier. Those days are gone forever!:{ :(

[Huck]

Those days are gone forever!

Not quite. We still fly 110 of them:

http://static.flickr.com/92/246556849_df505ed28c.jpg

[strake]

One of the finest flights I had was couple of years back into Yakutsk from DME with Krasnair.
Door to flight deck open, flight crew mixing (not drinks before you ask) happily with pax, chatting about this and that. The age range of the flight crew (4) was from 25-62 and they appeared to operate in a familiar, friendly and professional manner. I had blagged my way on the flight deck and towards the end of the sector they realised a wx diversion was necessary. Everybody got their heads into charts/plates etc. I thought it probably best to get out of the way but the FE just looked up, shook his head and motioned for me to stay.
Impossible anywhere else, I know and I'm sure the naysayers will quote rules and regulations and what-if's...but I b****y enjoyed it and felt pleased to have had the privilege of sitting with a group of guys who loved what they did.

[TheGorrilla]

"Some observations:
PIC smoking, not strapped.
PF has no approach plates.
Door seems open, PAX standing in it.
Two people sitting behind crew. Does 727 have a FE?
Conversation, in Serbian, about a guy with chikens, on flight path, that would not lay eggs.
PIC "We left late, we are arriving early. What's that all about? 737 couldnt do that if it tried. Not even in theory."
Someone asking PF if he wants to land on the highway.
Someone explains that the highway toll booth is the marker used for turning to lineup with RWY.
Comments?"

Wouldn't concern me. However, what would be of greater concern is being low on the profile and triggering a "Glideslope" gpws warning, which so far no one has commented on. Hitting the approach lights is a bigger sin than smoking a fag in my opinion! :}

[Farmer 1]

a bigger sin than smoking a fag in my opinion!

Funny place to keep a fag.

Sorry.

[click]

I'd find out what they are smoking and buy them a carton!:E At least we know that JAT has real pilots capable of doing a visual instead of FMS geeks who fornicate with the ops manual.:D

[Chimbu chuckles]

Nope...you are just watching a very experienced crew, who clearly fly together regularly and know what they are doing, enjoying their profession in a region that hasn't outlawed fun in some PC backlash against life.

I used to fly the same technology in a similar scenario...we used to smoke but admittedly not through a landing...perhaps there was a little more chit chat than would be considered proper but then they were flying a visual approach and I don't speak their language so am unsure how much was non operational.

The captain flying from the RHS was clearly concentrating on the flying and not partaking of most of the chit chat...the remaining crew members responded to commands for config changes and ran the checkists in a timely and professional manner. It was a joy to watch actually..lovely flying and a beautiful landing...727s don't land themselves unlike some more modern aircraft...727s and their ilk are mans aeroplanes.

I firmly believe having watched them that had the weather been bad they would have responded in an equally professional manner and the film would have had a completely different 'tone'.

I envy them their job...but not their pay probably. If I could earn what I do now flying a 767 doing what they are doing in their 727 I would be there in a fast minute.

As far as the ground prox...that was a glideslope warning and he was flying the Papi...from time to time I set that off too on a visual approach at my home port...but my airline, like his doesn't have ACARS flashing off a message to BS castle 1/4 of a second later. It could be as simple as a slightly steeper than nominal GS in order to clear a chimney or other obstacle that is not a consideration on a visual approach...which is exactly the case where I live.

[fireflybob]

I'd find out what they are smoking and buy them a carton! At least we know that JAT has real pilots capable of doing a visual instead of FMS geeks who fornicate with the ops manual.

Well said, click!

There is, as they say, more than one way of "skinning a cat". What's more important? Doing the "right thing" or doing "things right"? (You'll need to think about that one!). Despite the minor "transgressions" (and I don't approve of smoking, let alone on the flightdeck) this crew seem to be operating well as a team - how well would they deal with an emergency?

[Avman]

It brought back memories of many a jumpseat B727 ride I had when flying was still fun! Yes, the B727 operates with an F/E -but I don't know if the present FEDEX ones still do. As for the "Glidescope" warning, I've heard it (temporarily) more often than not when on a tight visual circuit. Had it gone on the whole way down that's something else, but in this instance it was short and sweet -which suggests it was well within acceptable parameters. A well excecuted visual approach by three pros. Just remember that some countries/airlines don't have to fear suicidal terrorists as much as others, and these still tend to practise a more open cockpit door policy.

[Grunf]

FYI:
Knowing some of the crew members (not all, mind you) and since I do understand them it is quite true that this is a well coordinated team flying for God knows how long (20 years at least, maybe even longer).

This is their home airport and they know all the visual cues. As for the chit-chat it is informal but it goes with the level of traffic (extremely low), good weather and familiarity with the terrain (ergo the chicken story).

As for mentioning of Africa - presumably this crew has flown there (and in Asia) for too long to be used to "visual only" approaches.

I would gladly be on that a/c or with that crew, whenever and wherever (and I probably was, many times).:D :D :D

At least 727 nas no hidden FMS related surprises.:E
Cheers

[JJflyer]

Also the Capt in the RGT seat does have APP plates... Have a look at his sliding window "Clipboard". Attached right there me thinks. Very orofessional though must agree :}

JJ

[Panman]

No one was smoking. One person with bad eyesight mistakes a pen for a cigarette and everyone else goes along with it. I though orofessional pilots were supposed to have good eyesight (whether corrected or not).

[DrKev]

(FWIW, captain is definitely holding a cigarette and the cigarette smoke is very hard to mistake for anything else).

[big.al]

Very unorofessional indeed!
"I love the smell of irony in the morning...."

[Stearperson]

Looks like a good approach and landing to me. Some of my best approaches and Ldgs have been while the Non Flying pilot was telling jokes and cracking me up.

Looks like they have an FE and two jumpseaters. Pretty standard situation in a 727. The closed door can be seen behind the guy standing.

The captain is smoking,either that or they are on fire.

The US Airmans Information Manual actually states it is acceptable to descend below the g/s after the middle marker when landing in vmc.