View Full Version : S61 Radius of Action
Can any S61 drivers tell me what their radius of action is in still air, normal min landing fuel, a 10% reserve and assuming a 20 minute loiter on scene?
TVM
Geoffersincornwall
23rd Feb 2007, 19:23
With all the kit we had to carry I seem to remember that it was more like 150 miles - on a good day. We certainly couldn't meet the contract template - but then everyone new that - it was -as they say - the elephant in the room that nobody talked about. It had been there for many many years but I guess the politics of the situation got in the way of the truth
G
:uhoh:
Is it true you are working for CHC now?
Geoffersincornwall
23rd Feb 2007, 20:53
Nope! Not working for CHC at the present time
G
Geoffers is right about the elephant.
The Target figure for Politics is 250nm right?......BUT 210nm radius is as far as you can stretch it realistically (been there done that on several occassions) As you know you usually get back with just a little less than the target MLA you 'required' (SK61 =100lbs Total!) plus 10% of max fuel 520lbs. So doing the job and landing on with 620lbs doesn't usually happen. Outbound speed is reduced slightly at the over weight certified 21500lbs for the first hour. The onscene 20min loiter bit always takes longer and burns more than you would like and then hey presto the wind changes direction and speed, go figure!
But then again I'm sure the MOD often fall short on targets too (did when I was there). Point is irrelevant now the North will soon be sporting Nicks L's S92's and they will be able to do the long range jobs that the RAF Sea Kings can't quite get to. On the South coast the AW139 doesn't need the Radius of action required elsewhere. When SAR is 'privatised' the Sea King will be parked up somewhere with its cracked frames and we will be seeing some slightly 'newer' cabs on the block able to do a real long range target figure without striping all the kit out before take off. If you want Crab, you can be my co-pilot on some long range 'fishing trips'!
Geoffersincornwall
24th Feb 2007, 10:09
210nm - well in my day, although people did fly at 21,500 lb, I was one of those that insisted on sticking to the (then) certified MGOW of 20,500 lb. Didn't make many friends from the "George Medal or bust" brigade but I figure that as the component lives were based on that number then, somewhere down the line, there might be some young lad with a family who would be grateful that at least some members of my generation showed some respect for the machinery and didn't tear the arse out of it in vain search of glory. When you get to 3000 feet and find your Vne is 75kts because it shakes so much at 21,500lb then I'm glad nobody can pin that kind of crap on me.
If you take an hour or so's fuel off the 250nm target then you get 150nm - Quad - as they say - est demonstratum
G
:ugh:
The reason I asked is that the ARCCK use 190nm as a standard for all S61s but it appears that different operators have different ideas about this - where one will stretch it to 210nm, another won't go past 150nm - is this the elephant that Geoffers refers to?
The RAF cabs all have a quoted 240nm providing you get rid of enough role equipment to allow max fuel at 21,400 lbs aum but we all have the same aircraft fit, the same MLA and the same planning SOPs. When the ARCCK asked the various operators about RoA they didn't ask all the different S61 operators which is why I am asking the question.
NRDK - thanks for the offer, it might come to that since the SAR(H) manpower plot for the military looks ludicrous and unlikely to be self sustaining.
Sailor Vee
25th Feb 2007, 10:29
I've just worked our RoA for today based on your premise in the first post and it's 186 miles. This is based on the MAUW being the 'normal' certified 20500lb. (Perhaps if we all lost a bit of weight?)
If we could go to 21500, it would be 233 miles, ( and who would want to go to 3000' at that weight?)
Geoffersincornwall
25th Feb 2007, 13:02
Well certainly an extra 100 pounds of fuel would give you another 6 minutes or 12 miles but if I lost that weight (which, I agree I really should) then the A+ boys and the AW139 boys would be disappointed about the loss of my contribution to the C of G dilemma they would otherwise face. Anyway - driving a sim it becomes academic!
Maybe I was indulging in a little hyperbole but certainly an adverse wind will leave you struggling - try working it out with a thumping cross-wind both ways.
You will have to agree, though, 186 miles isn't 200!! They must have kicked some of the kit out or maybe they now have lightweight stuff that we didn't have back in 19 something or other.
Bet you guys are hoping to see some of the S92 action the chaps in Blighty will get ....... sometime........ sooon ...... I think.
England Croke in Dublin - Feel very humble after yesterday's thrashing - my regards to the boys and girls.
Ref the 3000 feet thing - It was a dark and stormy (IFR) night and the lads went off to search an area south of Waterford - MSA was ???????? check it out and you'll see what I mean.
G
:ok: