Jet2 - 3

[freightdoggy dog]

WAWKRK Have to agree, best curry in UK is in Bradford...AKBARS !!!

15p share price sems an absolute bargain to me from where Im sitting..but do I have the balls of Harry Rednapp to trade on the market ? course I do.

Rekon its Olearygobsh!te that has the problem...laying up 20 aircraft with 40 more to be delivered !!

[Facelookbovvered]

So did Silverjets share price a month ago, until they went tits up, this is however a different situation and might be worth a punt, but i wouldn't go more than about 10k worth, it could go down a deal further yet.

On the other hand Ryanair could have bought the whole shooting match based on market valueation for a fraction of the write down he took on AerLingus, and it would be a useful hole to put his 20-50 spare 737ng's in and flog off the owened 7373 to Africa, just think of all the Jet2 trucks painted up with the Ryan harp on with BYE BYE EDDIE STOBBART on the curtain side trailers.

Go help the poor motorist who slow down in front of them or the grass on roundabouts.................

[Chille Con Carnie]

fdd
How are you, long time no hear.

[Hussar 54]

Re the comments a couple of pages back that the public will need to realise that the days of cheap flights are over.....

Perhaps so....But it'll be a sorry day for some airlines when the public does, in fact, wake up to this fact and sees that some of the self-proclaimed low-fare airlines are really no better than the proverbial snake oil salesmen when it comes to actually delivering the promises.....

And would have to say that Jet2 are probably the worst offenders when it comes to misleading prices....

Just looked at booking a ticket MAN-NCE which was stated on Page 1 at £29.99.....By the end of Page 2, the price had risen to £57.49 because the the originally quoted price didn't include taxes - no, I don't want to hear the nonsense that it's not Jet2's money, because that one won't wash anymore....Ask BA, RYR or EZY if their opening price is with or without taxes....Taxes are taxes are taxes - it's a bit like someone advertisng and offering to sell petrol for 42 pence per litre and then telling you that there is an additional 71p taxes for each litre when you are half-way through filling the tank of your car because the Government says that you have to pay tax when you buy petrol.....Well, the government also says that you have to pay taxes when you buy an airticket, so why does Jet2 pretend you don't ?

On Page 3 the site defaults to ' One piece of Baggage ' - it needs yet another window to be opened up before a first-timer would know that there is an additional charge for each piece of baggage - but without actually quoting the cost applicable to the flight being booked even though the departure and destination have obviously been entered into the reservation system and so could be included in the ' running total ' shown at the top of the Page 3....And then there is a default to include a charge for Travel Insurance ( £4.82 if you're stupid enough ) and which, cunningly, requires three seperate ' clicks ' for the buyer to actually delete....At this stage, the quoted price on Page 3 remains at £57.49 although has actually now increased to ???

Page 4 invites you to select your seat - which varies between £3.99 and £12.50.....Humm...Haven't I just booked my seat on Page 1 for £ 29.99 or £ 57.49 depending on your interpretation of the actual cost of the ticket....

Page 5 the truth emerges - the ticket, the taxes ( which are now added into the price of the ticket but, of course, were not added into the price on Page 1 and are not itemised here on Page 5 ), the fuel supplement of £ 5.27 or approx. 20% of the base price of £ 29.99 (humm again - don't recall a mention of this on Page 1 ( the obvious place ) or Page 2 or Page 3 or Page 4 for that matter), the seat selection charge, and one piece of baggage, and hey presto - the price has risen from £29.99 to £73.74, or more than double the price quoted on Page 1...

But wait - we're not finished just yet.....

As I can't pay by cash or cheque with an on-line booking, I now have a choice to pay either by Debit Card ( £ 1.99 extra for a total cost of £75.73 ) or Credit Card ( £ 6.99 for a total cost of £ 80.73)....Oh, and if there is more than one passenger on the same booking, this charge increases per passenger even though there is a single payment transaction - do Amex, Visa, MasterCard charge Jet2 per transaction or per passenger ? Of course they charge per transaction, so why this extra charge from Jet 2 if it isn't just another plain, old-fashioned gouging of a yet a bit more money off me ??

Frankly, I won't bother - not because £ 81 is too much....But simply because they have lied to me from the beginning, so why should I even trust them to actually operate the flight on the date / time they said they would ? After all, Jet2 also cover their arses in the event that they don't / won't / can't provide the service they've just tried to take my money for, by requiring me to check that the flight is still operating both 72 hours and 24 hours prior to the quoted day and time for which thay have just tried to sell me a ticket, but this time have lost both a potential customer and my goodwill forever...

BA are AF are quoting me not a whole lot more for the same date / time and the price they quote ( yes, varies depending on the actual flight chosen but at least there's a choice ) it's the price I'll pay - not almost three times as much....

In fact, right now I'm feeling so pi**ed off I'll probably call the OFT in the UK tomorrow....

[A300BOY]

I have to agree with you we all want to know what the total cost of the flight is and have a breakdown of the items later, but having said that Jet 2 offer me a good range of destinations for leisure and business from my local airport on the hill so I think like you the price is still reasonable when you compare it with a car journey to the same destination.

[757 Speedbrakes]

In fact, right now I'm feeling so pi**ed off I'll probably call the OFT in the UK tomorrow....


Hope you got on ok!! It might persuade Jet2 that customers want a feeling they've got a bargin and the price should come down as you go to the second page so you feel like you've had a good deal.:ok:

You'll be pleased to hear Hussar that Jet2's staff travel is so crap and unfair (we have to pay higher costs, baggage and credit dard fees too now) that Im booked up with BA .................. says it all!! :confused:

[IB4138]

Booked an AGP-BLK return for mid July using their flexible on dates/cheap fare finder, earlier this week.

Return fare €79.98...........charges and taxes €90.86....Total €170.84.

....and that's hand baggage only. :hmm:

[A320fan]

Just looked at booking a ticket MAN-NCE which was stated on Page 1 at £29.99

It says FROM £29.99, that no way refers to you particular flight, it says that you CAN get a ticket from £29.99 not that you WILL get one for £29.99 on your chosen date.

Well, the government also says that you have to pay taxes when you buy an airticket, so why does Jet2 pretend you don't ?


When you select the flight times it clearly states in the box on the left "Running total all passengers" which breaks down as follws: Base Fare: £XXXX Taxes: £XXXX Running Total: £XXXX

Under the "Running Total" (a total that is continually changing to account for added items - Websters New Millenium Dictionary) it clearly states:

"Excludes variable payment card fee and fuel supplement which will be added later in the booking process"

Page 4 invites you to select your seat - which varies between £3.99 and £12.50.....Humm...Haven't I just booked my seat on Page 1 for £ 29.99 or £ 57.49 depending on your interpretation of the actual cost of the ticket....

You dont have to select your exact seats just press continue to check in as normal without s specific locaed seat.

Pure price comparison for the same dates in February 09:

LBA-ALC-LBA Jet2 £104.36 (fare, tax, crdit card charge, 1 hold bag)
DSA-ALC-DSA Ryanair £147.56 (fare, tax, credit card charge, 1 hold bag)
MAN-ALC-MAN Monarch £128.14 )fare, tax, credit card charge, 1 hold bag)

At the end of the day i would fly with Jet2, it is cheaper and LBA is more convenient for me, I am not a first timer for Jet2's website but from someone who has studied ecommerce and transactional websites for the last 3 years, they are ALL perfectly legal so calling the OFT will have no effect as they are perfectly suitable as despite what people say you ARE told the running total at various stages of the booking and you are given a full price breakdown before you input any of your card details. From someone with a professional qualification in ecommerce Jet2's website is far easier to use then Monarchs website, and is better composed and have a extremely effective use of multimedia.

I have no idea why someone would pay shed loads more to fly with BA/AF just because they had to click a few more tabs, buttons and option buttons is beyond me, and at the end of the day im sure your 'mouse will have just a bigger pounding' at the BA website.

At the end of the day why are people ranting on and on and on about Jet2's prices, you dont HAVE to book with Jet2, you CAN use a different airline so why bother WHINING??? As I have said before complain all you like about having to pay these "ridiculous" prices but 10 years ago... BLK, LBA, MME, MAN ... whatever airport you would not have been able to fly to the wealth of destinations that you can for affordable prices FROM YOUR LOCAL AIRPORT! Before you all jump down my throat £104 for a return flight to Spain is a god dam good fare!

Booked an AGP-BLK return for mid July using their flexible on dates/cheap fare finder, earlier this week.

Return fare €79.98...........charges and taxes €90.86....Total €170.84.

....and that's hand baggage only. :hmm:

- Mid July - Peak Season
- Jet2 have a monoploy at BLK so can charge what they like
- £141 for a return flight to Spain in peak summer time to obviously your preferred LOCAL airport ... complain all you like!!! :rolleyes:

[IB4138]

You keep missing the point A320fan. :ugh:

It is the lack of transparency with the total to be paid that people are complaining about.

With Jet2, there is the fuel surcharge, which should be part of the fare and visible on the first or second page. It should not be added later in the booking process. Yes, it maybe legal and you brag about your qualifications, as if we wanted to know. :rolleyes:

Perhaps Jet2 should spend some brass and have the website reconstructed, although then people may not be misled into choosing unnecessary chargeable add-ons, by the sequence in which they are presented.

After all, not every body has had the education that you boast of.

[Hussar 54]

A320...

Do you work for these tricksters, perhaps ? And why the praise that Jet2's website is better than Monarch ? I've never even tried Monarch's website, but if it really is more misleading, then to me that's just like saying Jet2's sh*t doesn't semll quite as badly as Monarch's....

And as for your study of website design and functionality, well done. It's perhaps people like yourself who design / prepare the sites knowing what can and cannot be done from a legal perspective....Perhaps a little bit like lawyers who make a fortune through their ability to have cases against obvious criminals dismissed on technical grounds....Nothing personal meant there, just giving my own cynical view of your defense of the legality of Jet2's website and their marketing style....

However....Quite simply, when I go shopping ( even in the UK at somewhere like Tesco or a clothes shop like M&S ) in almost every case the price displayed is the price I will be charged.

Either when choosing the products I have selected to buy, or when I get to the paydesk, I don't need to have someone from the retailer keep informing me what the price has now increased to because the original price displayed didn't include the VAT, the cost of a plastic bag to take the goods home in, etc..... In other words, either while I'm buying or at the paydesk, they don't start adding the VAT...They don't say that the price displayed was actually decided three weeks / months ago and since then the cost of rent / utilities / property taxes / etc have increased and the price today is actually 25% higher than displayed in store when I selected it....They don't start adding a ' purchasing fee ' for selecting the goods / size I want rather than randomly giving me ones that are available....They don't charge me for using one of their shopping trolleys....And they don't charge me another 20% of the original price if I choose to pay by Credit Card...

Please give me one single example ( other than supposed low-fare airlines, of course ) when you, personally, have had to pay almost 3 times more than the originally stated price when completing a purchase.....

In this case, you are asked to select a flight ( click on it as you say ) and the price of the flight quite clearly states ( alongside where you have to click ) £29.99....Not " From £ 29.99 " but £ 29.99...No ifs, no buts, no froms....You must know it would actually be illegal for these people to sell me an airticket without the appropriate taxes, as with any other VAT rated, duty rated, alcohol or cigarette tax rated - there you go, are cigarettes priced at £ 1.00 per packet when you see them displayed behind the counter but you have the pay £ 5 to complete the transaction because WH Smith are being used as unofficial tax collectors by the UK govenment ?

And no....I'm not whining ( as you put it ) about the fJet2 fare. It's about the same price as I have now paid with BA ( by the way, on the BA and AF websites, the first and last price you see is the price you'll pay for the flight selected ) and which is still considerably less than the same flights used to cost me almost 20 years ago....

In this case and too many other cases with airlines ( Brussels Airlines are just as bad if you try their website ) it's about the deceit and lies, and just because people are now able to fly to new destinations from their local airports, or major hubs for that matter, does that make it OK ?

As you say, I don't HAVE to book with Jet2...Never have before, didn't do this time, and probably never will in the future....

Now - anybody help with a number / contact at the OFT, please ?

[ILS32]

Whats the problem with the Jet2 website?
If you want the cheapest flight to your destination,you book 6 months early.You know how the LoCos operate,as the plane fills up your flight costs more.You know you will be paying the flight taxes so does it matter if its not on the first page.If its your first time booking a flight then I can understand the shock when you see the final cost of your flight.The second time you book a flight you will have a rough idea of the extras that will be added to your flight whether it be Jet2 ,Easyjet or Ryanair.

Is Jet2 website misleading.I don't think so.You see the extra cost of adding additional items ie extra leg room,insurance,a prebook meal etc.
There are lots of options but they are not all compulsary to purchase.
You buys what you want.

I book 5-6 flights a year with Jet2 and have done since the day they first started their services from Leeds/Bradford.The website is more transparent know than when they first started.I fly next week to Amsterdam the return fare £9.98.As I progressed through the booking
procedure I saw the cost of the flight increasing as the taxes were added on plus the credit charge at the end,final cost £58.

Nothing was hidden I knew the cost of the flight before hitting the confirm button. Hussar 54 if you are prepared to pay more for your flight rather than use Jet2 because of the misconception that you have been lied to more fool you.

ILS32

[Hussar 54]

With the comments from Jet2 lovers above, this is becoming personal...

Maybe it's my English....I try to use big words, fancy words, latest buzz words, business terms, etc, but as English is not my first languauge perhaps I try a bit too hard....So simple English...

I have just looked at the Jet2 site again....

The price is not the issue - even the ' all-in ' price on most days is less than I used to pay 20 years ago, so no whining about that...And having actually been in the aviation industry for almost 30 years as pilot, then manager and now part-owner, I think I understand enough about booking early for cheap fares, etc, etc, etc, etc....And also about ' wow, come look at this price ' advertising tactics, etc, etc, etc, etc....And ' f*ck me look at the price of this and what are we going to do now ' sessions to drum up yet another idea to increase revenue....

So...

Can I or can I not travel on Jet2 from Manchester to Nice for the prices stated next to the the tick box on Jet2's web site as follows -

June 26 - £ 59.99
June 27 - £ 89.99
June 28 - £ 24.99

Irrespective of whether I have checked-in baggage, pre-book a seat, order a gin and tonic, etc, etc....

NO I CANNOT !!!!

The minimum prices, no baggage, no insurance, no pre-booked seat, etc, are

June 26 - the minimum price is £ 92.76 plus £5.99 booking fee
June 27 - the minimum price is £122.76 plus £ 5.99 booking fee
June 28 - the minimum price is £ 57.76 plus £ 5.99 booking fee.

As the price to be paid now includes a cannot be avoided, 100% obligatory, positively / definitely / has to be paid / fixed price tax, then why is this not included in the opening price.....And an unavoidable fuel surcharge that I cannot deselect from the additional costs so why is this not included in the opening price.... And a booking fee which I have to pay because Jet2 don't actually have sales offices in France ( do they have them in the UK ? ) that I can wander into and pay in cash, so why is this not included in the opening price ....

So....I'll ask again.....

Can I or can I not travel on Jet2 from Manchester to Nice for the prices which they have stated next to the the tick box on their website as follows -

June 26 - £ 59.99
June 27 - £ 89.99
June 28 - £ 24.99

I think you'll agree that the answer is no....

Isn't there something in UK or European law about false, misrepresentative and/or irresponsible advertising ?

Jesus C, at our operation we actually spend almost as much money on meeting regulatory requirements than we spend on fuel, so where are the regulators now ?

These people should be prosecuted for stating / offering unobtainable fares that cannot be purchased - fact !


So, who do I complain to,....

[A320fan]

Does anyone actually give a t*ss?

They must be doing something right as Jet2 is the website with the highest number of hits in Northern England.

[trebor]

Try looking at other websites for airlines - nearly all the same. I have just booked for a freind a special offer it stated 29.99 . When I did the low fares search I found the fare was 0.99 and when I finished 29.99. With no hold luggage or seat reservation.
On the front page it states FM = from

Other companies that advertise like airlines are Car hire companies- have you ever seen CAR HIRE FROM 10GBP a day. Oh but what a pitty not on the days I want them. Try hotels , theres lots more. As you are in the industry you should know this .

BA credit card fee 3.50GBP

Before you lay into one company look around. You are not reading everthing on the screen and are probably one of those that clicks the conditions box before even reading them . :ugh::ugh:

[fimbles]

Try EZY from LPL, there web prices include taxes on page 1:

26th & 27th - 2 flights per day from 59.99
28th - 3 to choose from 34.99

Its all about choice:ok:

[TSR2]

You are absolutely correct with your example. The £29.99 fare quoted in the low fare offers does include taxes. However, THIS IS NOT THE PRICE YOU WILL PAY. Further into the booking process you will find a non-optional FUEL SURCHARGE will be added.

[DispExt]

i think there is some confusion as to what hussar54 is actually annoyed about.

It is not that an airline states that prices start from £xxx and these fares cannot be found for a selected day...it is that for the flight/day i have selected, the price quoted (whether it be 99p or £199) is not achievable as taxes/fees are still to be added.

I'm sure the cheapest seats, quoted on the 'front page' so to speak, are available if you look hard enough, but when you give in and select a more expensive flight, what you are then quoted should be the achievable price (albeit without hold baggage/priority boarding etc).

and regardless of whether it is fuel surcharge, airport fees or taxes, they are all non optional, as hussar said, and should be in the first quoted price

[freightdoggy dog]

Chillie Con Carne...fine me old mucker...Italy is keeping me full of busy.

Do we care Hussar 54, as Fimbles states....its all about choice.

I've booked Pikeyair for a weekend away in Sardinia last night for £48.00 return including all taxes/bag/check-in etc in 3 weeks time. Sleazyjet would have cost me £210 quid for the same dates/times/arrival airport. My choice equals the money saved going on more Peronni's and fast women. I think we're all wise enough to know that the 99p Offers are a sprat to catch a mackerel.

I mean £48 can't even buy you a good night out in Southend anymore let alone a taxi home after a few bevvies? A bleedin parkin ticket is even £60 now...and don't get me started on the price of eggs.

So Horses for courses me old, it be a pretty boring world otherwise. Sweet or Savoury anyone ?

[inglebyboro]

I agree about airlien websites charging more for the flights, than on their main page.

This week I booked flights with Ryanair from DTVA to Dublin.

When you open up the website is says 2 million FREE seats.

When I went through the booking process (for 2 pax), with selecting online check in, hand luggage only, no priority boarding, and no insurance, and paying with a friends Visa Electron card the fare really did jump up.

Instead of being FREE, I ended up paying £0.04 (yes, 4 pence). TOTAL COST.

I was horrified at this increase:E:E

[A320fan]

Jeasus Christ!!!

The Jet2 homepage states: Amsterdam from £9.99 including taxes and charges*

* Payment card fees and fuel supplement may apply. Also individual bag charges (if you are travelling with checked/hold baggage)

SO IT CLEARLY STATES THAT A FUEL SUPPLEMENT & CREDIT CARD CHARGES MAY APPLY!!

Choose Leeds Bradford > Amsterdam on Tue 23rd September 2008. Select the 06.55 flight, £0.99 fare right? £9 taxes? = £9.99 fare advertised on the home page. CLEARLY stated by Jet2 that this fare does not include credit card fee and fuel supplement. Jet2 have no obligation what so ever to include the credit card fee and fuel supplement as it is IMPOSSIBLE to include this!!!! They are varying costs depending upon the situation so if they included these costs on the home page is would be a major issue as THAT would be false advertising.
Oooh lets advertise the fare starting at £15.92 yet it will actually cost £15.92 if you pay with a debit card or £20.92 if you pay with a credit card, or lets say the total cost is £20 including a £3 fuel supplement, when actually the fuel supplement VARIES! THEY CANNOT DO THAT!!! They DONT do that!!!

How many times!!! Jet2 have, and are currently not doing ANYTHING WRONG!!!

Believe me, as someone who has just spent 3 years studying transactional websites, Jet2 are perfectly within their rights. It's just people that are either not educated in reading the terms and conditions and have a chip on their shoulder about the said company that are complaining!

CAN WE MOVE ON NOW? LETS TALK ABOUT THOSE THINGS, ERRR WHAT THEY CALLED?, THEY HAVE WINGS AND ENGINES ......?


Mod edited to keep the screaming to a minimum.

[exrotarybooty]

It's a bit much comparing buying an airline ticket with shopping at Tesco and M&S as I must have missed that particular shelf; I also can't see where I can order the weekly food shop on the jet2 web-site! Horses for courses.

However, I have just bought a rail ticket, on-line, for a one way trip for my daughter from Bournemouth to Leeds. Eventually I found that the cheapest solution was to select a return ticket, instead of the required single, and then select the 'Try two single tickets instead' option. This gave me a return ticket I didn't need, but a saving of £33 on the single fare!

Anyone want a free train trip from Leeds to Bournemouth on the 19th July? (I'll add a few extras though just to keep everyone happy!) :ok:

ERB

[BigT2207]

Thank you for your kind message BYALPHAINDIA

[Hussar 54]

OK....Last one because life's too short and you and I will never agree.....

" Payment Card fees and fuel supplement may apply "

May ? May ? Are you sure ? Perhaps you can point me to just one, single flight or booking where there will be NO Payment Card fee or fuel supplement when I buy a ticket from Jet2....More accurately, should be "... WILL apply "

" Jet2 have no obligation whatsoever to include the credit card fee and fuel supplement as it is impossible to include this. They are varying costs...."

You know, I'm not on duty today and I'm sat here in a sh*tty part of Africa with not a whole lot to do, so I tried about about 70 different booking enquiries, combinations of departure / destination, dates, etc....Guess what ? The fees charged didn' t vary by 1p....Not too variable, then...And, you know what ? Either Jet2's management are pathetically, plain stupid if they are genuinely paying these credit card companies £5.99 on a £30 transaction, or they are just trying to gouge a bit more from their possible passengers...The avearge charge by credit card companies varies between 1.0% and 1.75% - not 25% as it would be on £ 30 ticket...

"...advertise the fare at £15.92 yet it will actually cost £15.92 if you pay with a debit card or £20.92 if you pay with a credit card...they cannot do that.."

Of course they can - I've got to pay with one or the other if it's a web booking, and as Jet2 ALWAYS charge £1.99 per passenger for payment with a debit card, why not include the £1.99 in the starting prices and say that there will be a charge of £4.00 for payment with a credit card....BA, LH, AF even AZ have computer systems that do that ! Oh no, hang on.....Because Jet2 actually charge per passenger on the booking, so they can't tell you before hand how much the charge for a payment by credit card will be until you've finished the booking and they know how many passengers.....So it isn't a debit/credit card fee at all, then, in the same sense as BA's £3.50 fee....it's effectively a booking fee applied to each passenger on the booking...Naughty, naughty....Trades Descriptions Act is the phrase that comes to mind....

And the Passenger Taxes ? Are these variable also ? I think not....so why not included at the start of the booking process - ie, the price shown and quoted for the flight you select, where you ' click' to start the booking process...Tell me that this add-on is not just Tax, but also includes airport charges and security charges, etc, then OK...But I'll counter with aren't these just normal business costs which should be added into the trip costs and, therefore, the ticket price ? Next we'll be having supplements for Airways charges depending on the routings, aircraft leasing cost supplements depending on which aircraft is used because some aircaft were obtained on more favourable leases than others, etc...The possibilities are endless, but please don't tell Jet2 and the others....

And the fuel supplement varies ? Of course it does, but are we to believe that Jet2 are so cashed strapped ( sorry, tightly managed to keep costs strictly under control ) that there is nobody in the organisation who can update prices in the reservation system when and as necessary ?

So summarising, what Jet2 do might be considered as good, sensible business tactics by some of the population, and as ethically immoral by the others...Legal - yes...Honest - no....Or maybe it's just that they have a web-based reservation system designed by a moron who didn't understand the booking process and supplied Jet2 with an inflexible, difficult to update, reservation system with a non-comprehensive set of price tables and files that can't be integrated at the front end ( the right jargon ? ), or one designed by a genius who really, really, did understand how to ' legally ' triple the originally quoted price....

I trust and hope that it was the former and that Jet2 sent him packing without paying his fees....Because if that isn't the case, then the conclusion is that Jet2 management DID deliberately set out to design a misleading, etc etc....

And...yes - I'm reasonably educated but don't go on about it, even to my family....know more about the business side of aviation than probably the vast majority of ppruners....have previously posted about similar issues at Ryanair ( now corrected through the legal pressure ) and Car Hire companies - check in my profile.... have no axe to grind against Jet2 ( in fact, I've never even seen a Jet2 aircraft. let alone flown / dealt with Jet2 )..... and I wish you luck in your chosen career - seems that there's a whole lot more future in designing web sites than there is in being an owner/driver these days...

[4567]

Just found this article released today about this subject. Jet2 are to be probed about charges added to the tickets!

http://www.sundaysun.co.uk/news/north-east-news/2008/06/15/jet2-face-probe-over-extra-costs-on-tickets-79310-21078093/

[Hussar 54]

I know I said last night that I would post no more about this, so apologies...And this is absolutely the last one until the the enforcement action starts against these shysters....

This morning, the website displays a price for the NCE - MAN leg on 28th June of £ 89.99 plus, plus, etc if booked as part of a MAN - NCE - MAN return...Same flight, same day it is quoting € 170.99 plus, plus, etc if booked as a one way ticket NCE - MAN....

A Euro > Stg exchange rate of 1.90 ????? Today's rate is 1.23 and has NEVER, EVER been higher than 1.52....All perfectly legal, of course, they can set and trade with any rate they wish...but these people are lower than a slug's bollocks....

Oh and if you are stupid enough to make the booking, you don't have the aggravation of needing three ' clicks ' to remove the Insurance add-on as the extremely intelligent reservation system doesn't offer the add-on - not too sure if this is because it is illegal in France, or maybe the insurers don't want to deal with compenstaion claims from outside the UK...

Great to hear the news about the investigation....Can't wait !

[IB4138]

Believe me, as someone who has just spent 3 years studying transactional websites, Jet2 are perfectly within their rights. It's just people that are either not educated in reading the terms and conditions and have a chip on their shoulder about the said company that are complaining!

Will you please stop bragging about your qualifications A320fan?:ugh: You have been asked before to desist, but continue.

If you are so confident of your opinion, you should apply for a job with the OFT, as obviously, they need an expert such as you, if the Sunday Sun is correct and they are investigating Jet2's website.

Let's wait and see what happens and who should be righteous. It may be you, who's education is found to be erroneous. :ooh:

[eastern wiseguy]

From the Sunday Sun


We discovered that Jet2 passengers have to pay a so-called "fuel supplement" which is not revealed on its advertised rate. It is only when customers buy their tickets online the extra cost is revealed.



I thought they had hedged loads of fuel.....so why is there a fuel surcharge ?

[ncleflights]

eastern - agree if they have hedged their fuel why the fuel surcharge someones not been overly honest at LS I am afraid. Makes you think what else are they not been honest about.

[TartinTon]

A320Fan is absolutely wrong in saying what Jet2 are doing is fine. The OFT has decreed that any unavoidable charge MUST be included in the price displayed at all times of the booking process whether that be in outdoor ads, press or website.

[trebor]

Well if one company is being investigated , why not do them all. Start with FR first where you even have to pay to check in .
How can people moan about air travel it is now cheaper than ever. There are alot of airlines so go somewhere else :ugh::ugh::ugh:
I have just booked my parents tickets with AB , at the end i had the credit card fee of 6eur each , but so what , 2 return tickets 100euro BARGAIN.
Retail and marketing has changed - get used to it. I saw an advert for a new car on the television from 14000 euro . Went to the showroom and to get the same car would have cost me 21000euro . Beacause you add on CD , MP3, ALLOYS , ABS , CLIMITIZATION , 6 GEARS so on so on .
If I find something and at the end it is in my price range I will buy it and enjoy it , not compare it to my neighbours.:mad::mad::\

HUSSAR54:yuk::yuk::yuk:

[ncleflights]

trebor - your missing the point totally. This is a fuel supplement issue and it is this issue alone that is to be investigated not the CC charge etc as you can choose an alternative MOP. The fuel supplement however should be advertised up front as its a charge you can not avoid paying.

Lets keep to the facts before you go of on a rant. FR would not need tobe investigated as they don't impose a fuel surcharge.

[trebor]

They do state Fuel supplement on the front page , maybe others just call it taxes and charges. If we were just talking about fuel supplements why such a debate.

[A320fan]

Right we're never going to agree on this and frankly, I cant be bothered to waste time going over and over this. At the end of the day i'm not going to stop booking with Jet2 because of a £3 fuel supplement ...

.. so as I said earlier maybe shall we talk about planes now?

[Justin Cyder-Belvoir]

Planes - two dimensional surfaces which are perfectly flat.

Or.....devices for removing shavings from pieces of wood.

Did you mean aircraft ???? ;)

[TSR2]

You are way off the mark with your £3 supplement.

Some current fuel surcharges per passenger for a return flight in June from Manchester:
Faro - £12.14
Malaga - £12.26
Alicante - £11.90
Palma - £11.80

[JulietNovemberPapa]

Start with FR first where you even have to pay to check in


And with WW on bookings after the 12th June:


All passengers travelling with bags need to check in at the airport and will be subject to an airport check in fee.

If you have selected to check in at the airport you will be charged £4 per passenger if you make an online reservation and £6 per passenger if you make a reservation through the call centre. If you have not paid the airport check in fee online or via the call centre and check in at the airport you will be charged £6 per passenger at the time of check in.


From: bmibaby website

[EGNMCharlie]

Jet2 have modified their website to include the fuel supplement in the original advertised price on the home page. So I'm guessing this is because of the complaints to the OFT. The only additional charges now are hold baggage and seat selection.

[Facelookbovvered]

Glad to see that they have acted quickly to put their house in order, i suspect it woud have taken MOL rather longer. I gather this years accounts are now out in July rather than June, then back to June in 2009?

I thought it interesting that despite MOL comments about Jet2 (and others) that he seems to have no wish to pick a fight with them from Ryanair bases in ALC & AGP in the way he has in the Midlands, i would like to see Jet2 go head to head with them on DUB, i think Jet2 would win that, there are far more fan's of Jet2 from Yorkshire that travel to DUB than there are Ryanair fans in DUB wishing to visit Leeds.

Jet2 are more than strong enough to give Jet2 a bloody nose on this route and with the fuel positions are probably in a better position than Ryanair to sustain it

[Mr @ Spotty M]

Jet 2 were mentioned months ago that they did not conform to the requirements on showing the cost on the first page and that was before the fuel surcharge problem.:=

[harrogate]

I thought it interesting that despite MOL comments about Jet2 (and others) that he seems to have no wish to pick a fight with them from Ryanair bases in ALC & AGP in the way he has in the Midlands, i would like to see Jet2 go head to head with them on DUB, i think Jet2 would win that, there are far more fan's of Jet2 from Yorkshire that travel to DUB than there are Ryanair fans in DUB wishing to visit Leeds.

I think that 99.99% of low cost airline punters aren't 'fans' of any low cost airline. They just don't give a sh*t. Ask anyone who's not involved or interested in the airline industry (i.e. most people). The typical lo-co demographic folks just plump for the lowest price they can find.

Yes, there are a few people who do give a sh*t, like if they've been 'burned' by a particular airline before and so would be reluctant to use them again, but most people just see the lo-co's as much of a muchness.

They're far more bothered about where they're going and how much it's costing them than they are about the colour of the plane they fly on or the personality of the MD.

It's all about price. A punter may well have once enjoyed his/her experience with a low cost airline, but when it comes to booking their next flight and that same airline is more expensive, then that allegiance often dissolves in the face of saving a few quid by flying with someone else.

[Facelookbovvered]

Fair comment!

I know of people who said they had a bad experience of flying with xxx airline that don't even fly from xxx airport!!!

That said it would be nice to put one over on pikeyairline lol

[TSR2]

I do not see any changes to the Jet2 website. It still states that the Fuel Supplement 'will be added later in the booking process'

[EGNMCharlie]

All the prices have gone up now to include the fuel suppment so basically Jersey used to be fm £29.99 plus the fuel supplement. Now its fm £34.99 including the fuel supplement, which if you select hand baggage only and no seat the actual fare is £29.99 plus the fuel supplement but now the only change is that the prices on the home page have the fuel supplement built into them now.

[TSR2]

Yes, you are correct. The (from) prices on the home page flight offers do indeed include the fuel surcharge. However, this only applies to the cheapest basic fare offered to the destination and if you travel on a date where the fare is higher (or you use the Find Your Flights facility), you still have to go 'later in the booking process' to find the actual fare.

[take-off]

Call me thick but, are people saying that the fuel supplement is included ?
Because if so , then why does it state at first page of booking, under fare,taxes and total ,

'Excludes variable payment card fee and fuel supplement which will be added later in the booking process '

Does that not mean the fuel supplement has to be added on????

So still not true fare is it? :ugh::ugh:

So a fare at £20.99 ends up at £48.49 inc tax plus £6.00 fuel supp = £54.49

maybe im either stupid or just tired after working all night, but cant see how can be including fuel if their charging you later on!!!

Dnt get me wrong not complaining about it being 54 quid, but why is it airlines cant give you an upfront price, fair enough if you want to add extra legroom and reserving a particular seat or food, insurance etc... not anti jet2 by anymeans but just very annoying:mad:

Just Read the small print at bottom of J2 homepage
Quote'* Payment card fees may apply. Also individual bag charges (if you are travelling with checked/hold baggage)' no mention of fuel supp to be added, still misleading.

Anyone saying that it cant be done , just have a look at easys website, they seem to manage it.

C'mon Jet2 you can do better than this:ok:
Rant over , have good day guys(and gals!):ok:

[Facelookbovvered]

With the share price touching an all time low yesterday (12.75p) down from over £1.00+ this time last year its got to be worth a punt. up slightly today (13.25) with oil prices starting to look like its peaked, it wouldn't take much to double your money, they wont go bust and a hostile take over would drive the price up, come on have a flutter

[TSR2]

No, you are not thick and YES it is confusing if not misleading.

The prices advertised on the home page as 'fm' are the lowest price to that destination and include the fuel supplement. The lowest fare is the only fare that includes the fuel supplement as that is the only advertised fare.

It is worth noting that the lowest price to that destination may only be available on one date in a month, so if you choose to travel on that date then you will pay the advertised price which includes the fuel surcharge for that outbound flight only. If however you choose a return flight or choose to travel outbound on a date where the Base Fare is higher, then the fuel surcharge will be added 'later in the booking process'.

I fully agree with you that there is no logical reason why the fuel surcharge should not be incorporated into the Base Fare for all flights like many other airlines do. Until they do so, Jet2 will lack credibility in my eyes.

[Shed-on-a-Pole]

Facelookbovvered,

Your 19:12 post urging readers to "come on have a flutter" on the shareprice of Dart Group (Jet2) is deeply irresponsible and could be construed as "ramping" (promoting a shareprice for personal gain) which is illegal. I am guessing that your posting is born out of genuine enthusiasm for Jet2 rather than for any malicious reason, but nevertheless you should not post a recommendation to trade shares in any named company again unless you are a licensed professional.

Your contention that oil prices are starting to look like they've peaked is questionable. A short term relief correction in the oil price is a strong possibility, but if you are suggesting that the long-term bull market in oil is over then I fear you are mistaken. Many in the oil industry feel that a continued long-term upward trend in the oil price is inevitable.

"They won't go bust." Really? How do you know? I genuinely hope you are correct, but my impression is that you are guessing and are not intimately acquainted with company accounts. Note that I am not making any judgment on Jet2's financials here, just pointing out that if you wish to claim that a company "won't go bust" you must offer verifiable supporting evidence. "A hostile takeover would drive the price up." Maybe so, but do you know of any current suitors? And how do you know that such a suitor would be willing to pay a sum exceeding the company's current market capitalisation? Is it good business to overpay for an acquisition?

You say that "it wouldn't take much to double your money". Oh yes it would! It would take a ONE HUNDRED PERCENT increase in the shareprice! Forget about historical valuations; they are exactly that - history. Nobody will pay you £1 for a 13p share. The only two prices which matter are today's price and what you project it may achieve in the future based on detailed and rational analysis (not hope or luck). Note that I speak generally here and not of Jet2 in particular. There is a stockmarket adage which states "never catch a falling knife". Cheap shares really can get cheaper and frequently do.

I am not making any judgment on the wisdom of purchasing shares in Dart Group or not. Firstly, it is not my place to do so. Secondly, I have not done the detailed research which is necessary to make such a judgment. What I can say is that commercial aviation is a very dangerous place to invest right now and those who choose to do so should have their eyes wide open. Personally, I enjoy flying with Jet2 and wish them well for the future - but the only investment I will be making in any airline at present will be in exchange for a ticket to travel (and I may well pay by credit card).

For those of you who do wish to invest in (any) shares, please do so on the back of careful research an use only funds which you can afford to lose entirely. Do not believe that a share which has fallen by 80% is destined to return to its former trading range; life is not like that. Finally, good luck to Facelookbovvered and all with their investments, but please do not urge or solicit others to invest similarly to yourself based on hope and sentiment alone. Some may be tempted to gamble money which they cannot afford to lose. There are no "sure things" in stock trading.

Cheers, SHED.

[Facelookbovvered]

I have been having flutters on shares for over 30 years and don't bet money i can't afford to say goodbye to. To be on honest in the early days i used to do lots of research but was wrong just as often as i was right!!

So now i just look at the fundementals of the business, in the early days of Jet2 i thought they were growing to quickly,opening to many bases and so on,things have changed and they have at LBA a captive markets that allows them to mark up the price because the options for most are a drive accross the 62 to Manchester.

Jet2 have a good spread business in transport and night mail, so i will have £5k worth in the next few days and i'll let you know how i go on, its just a flutter............

[harrogate]

SHED

I think most of us know that Facelookbovvered isn't the Chancellor of the Exchequer. He's just someone else with an opinion on a message forum about planes. He's hardly painting the tape.

Call off the serious fraud office. They've got better things to do.

H.

[Shed-on-a-Pole]

Apologies for this TEST POST but my reply to harrogate seems to have disappeared into the ether! I will try again if this posting succeeds ...

[Shed-on-a-Pole]

Well, my second reply to 'Harrogate' also failed to appear so I've now ditched the dire old PC at work and settled on the trusty AppleMac back home. Let's try again ...


Harrogate -

I must respectfully disagree with your post. FLB's message could not be treated merely as "an opinion on a message board about planes." The posting contained a direct recommendation to purchase shares in a specified listed company along with the suggestion that "it wouldn't take much to double your money." I'm afraid that such a claim should not pass unchallenged. Especially as it relates to stock in an airline company whose peers are feeling the stress of an extremely chill economic climate.

I am sure that many readers of this forum are financially literate, tolerant of high risk investments and sufficiently wealthy to recover from a loss. But if one person who is not so fortunate is tempted to "have a flutter" on a high risk speculation based on enthusiasm alone, then they may quickly find that the stockmarket can severely punish the unwary. It is an unforgiving place.

I do understand that your reference to the Serious Fraud Office is intended in jest. However, I would point out that I never advocated reporting anything to anyone. Indeed, I stated that I believed that FLB's posting was "born out of genuine enthusiasm for Jet2 rather than for any malicious reason." In my final paragraph I wished FLB good luck with his investment and happily repeat that now. My motive for posting is not to chide FLB but to challenge his assertion that a very high risk share investment represents a great opportunity for other readers here. And my suggestion to any individual that it is a seriously bad idea to post a recommendation to buy or sell specified shares on a message board is for their own protection as well as that of their readers. It does leave the poster vulnerable to legal challenge.

Personally, I hope that FLB's £5K investment does double because that would require fantastic trading conditions for Jet2 - something which I would be delighted to see. Unfortunately, I cannot be as optimistic as he.

Cheers to all. SHED.

[EGNMCharlie]

Facelookbovvered, good on you, I completely agree.

My parents made most of the money they have saved for my PPL on the stockmarket, they have followed the Dart Groups reports and accounts for the last few years and for my 18th invested me £500 in Dart Group. :ok:

Lets hope that it pays off. The stock brokers they use say that the Dart Group is forecasting a £9.5 million profit for the past 6 months, so this is 50% down on last year but its still a good profit.

Just a shame were away on the day the Dart Group results are out!

[CaptJ]

You are no doubt familiar with the ancedote about the American billionare investor who was asked how he could make a small fortune in the aviation industry.

"Start with a large fortune" was the reply

Best of luck to Jet2 but they are at risk, whatever the fundamentals may seem to be. Those fundamentals are not entirely transparent either.

In the present climate companies need more than good fundamentals and low valuation for a share price recovery. Sadly there is no-one in the market who is going to want to buy Jet2. All the other likely suspects have more planes than they know what to do with this winter. The opportunity that presents itself here is the chance to wipe out a competitor with spare capacity rather than going through the pain of integration.

good luck

[freightdoggy dog]

CaptJ,

Unless PM sells his 40% stake to MOL, it’s not going to happen.

As for using spare capacity to "wipe out a competitor",

I thought most airlines this winter including RYR were going to lay up aircraft, trim capacity, give crews unpaid leave and preserve their profit margin... not destroy it through chasing market share

[wawkrk]

I suppose this will stir up the usual Jet2 are crap brigade.

A Which? (Consumers Association) customer satisfaction survey of more than 30,000 members has placed Leeds Bradford Airport based low cost airline Jet2 ahead of its rivals, including easyJet and Ryanair. It came out top of the low cost airlines in the British Isles.

Jet2 boss Philip Meeson said ‘We're over the moon at being ranked ahead of the likes of British Airways and KLM, who can't get anywhere near to the low fares we offer, and are of course delighted to be ahead of every other low cost airline in the British Isles.'

‘It's particularly pleasing that we have been singled out for the high standard of service on our flights to Italy, Portugal and Spain. Millions of people travel from the UK to these countries on holiday every year and I'd say to anyone who hasn't flown with Jet2 that, with an endorsement like this and our extremely low fares, why not give us a try?’

[Stick Flying]

Facelookbovvered

Hope you didn't flutter your £5k. If you did it would only be worth £4717 at the close of trading today (and that could have been £4622 at one stage).

I certainly wouldn't be speculating on the Aviation market until well into next year at least. You could double your money, you could also halve your money without too much trouble at all.

[no sponsor]

Despite what the public might think, the city will know the results already, particularly the chummy analysts. The drastic fall of the share price I suspect implies that the results are not that good, certainly less than expectation.

[tonker]

Well lets just hope it's a profit.

I've got 9k's worth so its been a buttock clenching rollercoaster few months for me:}

[Facelookbovvered]

No money spent yet, probably trade mid next week, i might be off my medication, but i still think that we are near or at the peak on oil prices and the next move in US interest rates will be up, i also think that OPEC will want to show that it has some control over markets and will become more serious about pumping more and hopefully a new (black) president will bring some stability to the world stage, must get back to the real world now and BBrother

Have a great weekend you all lol

[BigT2207]

There are two new routes for our Belfast customers to choose from:
Jersey and Menorca

Other routes on sale for Summer 09 today are:


Barcelona
Ibiza
Murcia (Alicante)
Majorca
Pisa
Toulouse

[take-off]

ANy chance Jet2 will carry on the AGP from BLK this winter? Going by todays debarcle on the M6 even more reason not to travel to man/lpl :ugh:

[commit aviation]

If I were a betting man I'd say probably not but expect an early start next year - a bit like this summer!

[TSR2]

Spare a thought for the young lady killed and another very very seriously injured in the 'debacle' as you put it, on the M6 today. Delays seem so irrelevant under these circumstances.

[4567]

When will the W08 EDI routes be released anyone heard of any new routes to be launched?

[airhumberside]

EDI-Chambery/Prague are on sale for W08. Thats all there normally is

[Jet22]

Anyone know which A/C operates the NCL-RHO Flight?

I dont think it would be a 733 because it is nearly 4 hours in flight time.

[transwede]

Both Greek Jet2 routes ex NCL are operated by based 757 equipment. Correct me if I am wrong but strictly speaking they are actually charter flights, with Olympic & Libra Holidays and Thomas Cook taking seats on the service. However, Jet2 also sell a number of seats on each flight. Would be interesting to see how well the LS side of the selling is going. Low cost flight only to small Greek Islands from the regions is a fairly new thing, with only GB/EZY previously operating from LGW.

[Jet22]

Is that why when i go to see what a/c the seating comes up as rows 1-29 instead of 1-41 because the 30-41 are taken up by the chater companys.

As for the fares 852 for 3 Adults 1 Child 13/08 to 20/08 which is quite cheap compared to what charter companys are offering.

[freightdoggy dog]

Why not Jet22 ?

G-CELP did STN-RHO on Tuesday for the HEB cruise. Yep 4 hours and 5 minutes ...but in pure Business Class and full champagne service.

It's the only way to fly...if you av a few grand under yer bed :ok:

[Chille Con Carnie]

fdd
How,s life at the sharp end,
hope all is going well,regard,s to all

[AviationNE]

So Far it has been operated by a 733 Limited to about 125 pax i believe for the fuel. Apparently one of the charters has bought an extra 60 seats so it could be uprgrading to the 757 along with the Corfu. But the 757 currently goes to PMI so who knows.

[RobT100]

Both Greek Jet2 routes ex NCL are operated by based 757 equipment

I was in Rhodes on wednesday and can definately confirm it was a 733 that touched down at ~1600hrs local time.

[dochealth]

Not long back for hols. Flew charter DUB-VER-DUB on LS 757.

Just wanted to say congrats to Belfast based crew for a really good service both ways on a packed 757. We were dreading a Sat 17.30 departure on a/c that had been dodging around Europe since 6am and would be well delayed by teatime. But no, Jet 2 left on time. And great cabin crew- would put some full service crews to shame.

Same on return leg with another BFS crew. A/C arrived Verona on time. Delayed a bit because of Verona check-in staff who were so slow it was unbelievable, but flt great.

Obviously Jet 2 exposed to crazy fuel prices more than most because of ageing fleet of 737s and 757s, but from pax perspective they would be a big loss if they didnt survive..

So thanks to crews who operated DUB-VER - DUB on June 14th and 28th:ok:

[TSR2]

Wish some of it would rub off on the Manchester crews.

[Channex101]

NCL-CFU operated by 757
NCL-RHO operated by 737
NCL-MLA operated by 737 (when it starts)

RHO is capped at bout 140 out and 135 inbound, but even then if its a hot day in RHO its a big tight!
Not sure about the RHO being upgraded, if it is I think AG will be ferried up from LBA to operate it as this seems to be the charter aircraft, most charters from the likes of DUB have been on AB or AG, and the recent MON and TCX charters have been on AG, so there is one unit spare to operate the RHO if need be

[Jet22]

What is the seat pitch on the LS737??

I hope it beats FCA and TOM with 29-31 pitch(dont know how much legroom but it is tight).

[Mooncrest]

Channex 101,

AG is on C check at the moment so will be off line for a few weeks yet. We currently have three 757s at Leeds and they're all spoken for.

MC

[commit aviation]

....and when AG returns I believe AH is off for a C check in Aug and it will be followed by AI. :ok:

[757 Speedbrakes]

Then AB in Sept........................ for winglets!! :ok:

................ so I'm told :hmm:

[Channex101]

yeah your right, AG went off to EGHL on Thu after it operated the MJV out of NCL. Well no RHO will be gettin upgraded out of NCL then so thats put an end to that rumour.

Will winglets be benefitial on a 757 thats operates mainly to spain? just curious, i know it obviously isif your doing long sectors on a 757 such as LBA-EWR but how much fuel is it going to save doing LBA-PMI/ALC/AGP
I can imagine a bit would be saved on PFO/TFS/LPA/ACE and the lovely SSHs coming up

[OliWW]

How are Jet2's booking for New York doing as fuel prices go up, flight costs are going up and people are considering not to travel long distance?

[no sponsor]

Not selling well according to rumour. Think it is a bit early though - I'm sure they will pick up after sept.

[Channex101]

Im not suprised given the price!
BA is charging £299 in their world sale at the moment, id rather shuttle it to LHR and fly BA/VS/AA/UA or whoever else than sit on a crampt 757 where you still have to pay for all your drinks and snacks onboard!
Would much rather fly on a 747/767/777 or even a 757 that has less seats! The price is rather high and the dates are VERY limited

[wawkrk]

How many seats on NYC flights?
Her indoors and daughter going. Full monty upgrade just over 1600 pounds for the 2.
In my experience I dont really agree that wide bodies have more space, why?
Single isle x 2 I think.
Now if you are really rich, like a rock star,you get to fly in a really tiny jet.

[OliWW]

Would the B752 that they are putting winglets be used for the New York flights, as they will be used to there full potential then...

[757 Speedbrakes]

I belive that the routes they are looking at and the price of fuel that now the first five aircraft, AA - AE will all have the modded wing fitting.

The winglets are not just for the NYC charters, that wouldn't be very cost effective for just four flights. :ugh:

[4567]

Whats routes are they looking at?

[take-off]

Sorry for a rather late reply to tsr2 mentioning the young lady being killed on 'm6' , been away for over a week, i'd just like to say that i meant no disrespect to the person or persons that died or were injured, but despite that the m6 is nightmare to get down any day of the week, night or day it it getting beyond a laughing matter, thinking 11pm last night would be a good time to travel back from midlands got me on a a diversion taking in the m42/m54/m6 sat dinnertime was no better when coming back from wales...although on brighter note did see the Airbus A380 coming out of MAN heading toward lpl way...now wheres me anorak:ok:

Apologies for straying way from j2 thread. Have good day guys and gals!

[757 Speedbrakes]

Whats routes are they looking at?


Don't know!! :confused:

I imagine the CE or MD would be the only ones who really know so don't let anyone on here tell you otherwise.

The only reason I mentioned that is because the words came from the MD's mouth ;)

[4567]

Will Jet2 be getting 767's any time soon?

Heard a rumor they might be leased one from Flyglobespan for S09 but don't think that would be true and i think Flyglobespan are planning to use all 3 of there 767-300's for S09.

[TSR2]

I'm certainly no expert on this but the wisdom of spending so much cash on the 757 fleet must be questionable.

Most of the Jet2 B757 aircraft are 20-21 years old with 50-65 thousand hours on the clock. By the time the work is complete and with a 2.5 year payback, the aircraft will be 23-24 years old before any return on investment.

[757 Speedbrakes]

Your forgetting the extra range / payload factor. Just under 400km range or an extra 4.9 Tonnes. :ok:

It's one of those, belive it when it happens rumors but all the people who have told me it's happening are those who have been involved in the decesion making process, I'll say no more..................... :oh:

[MUFC_fan]

Does the addition of winglets decrease the length of runway needed aswell? If so this would help increase the range even further from the shorter runways it serves.

[Tango Route]

Is it true that there will be only one B733QC based at BFS this winter operating the Mail Flight and an occasional Chambery?

Apart from the LBA flight, are they operating any other routes ex-BFS this winter?

[BYALPHAINDIA]

Quote:
and when AG returns I believe AH is off for a C check in Aug and it will be followed by AI.

Reply:
Flew on LSAI last week, It sure looked as thou it had done a few miles.

No IFE & screens on it, Quite a few rusty wing bolts too.

[BYALPHAINDIA]

What's up with '257' to PMI??

Coaches to MAN and Indefinate delay.

Flew on 257 last tuesday, Glad we didn't go this week.

[flybar]

Indefinate Delay on LS186 inbound from Malaga causing plans to be changed.

[CentreFix25]

Putting 2 and 2 together, I think whatever operated NCL-CFU-NCL went tech in CFU, causing the problems. I'm happy to be corrected.

[LBA-MJV]

AA Tech @ Man
AJ Tech @ AGP
:ugh:

as of 19.00

[EGNMCharlie]

Poor AA! I saw her this morning at PMI while I was getting the TCX flight to Leeds.

So when these 75's are in for their checks are other aircraft going to be leased in or are the 73's working extra hard?

[lbalad]

I see it is now possible to book the limited series of flights to New York,on a seat only basis.

Checked the first departure on the low fare finder,came to £411 plus fuel surchage I presume.

Not that cheap,but it may attract some more punters that have friends and family to visit in the New York area,and don't need a hotel package trip.

[TSR2]

You have been able to book 'flight only' to EWR since early May. The price then for November departures was £622 inclusive of all taxes and surcharges.

Looks like they have reduced the price somewhat.

[TSR2]

The first departure to EWR is indeed £411.98 with the only additional charges being £7.99 each way for checked-in baggage and £16.05 Credit Card charge bringing the total to £444.01. There is no fuel surcharge now.

Interestingly, there is not one single reserved seat on the entire aircraft for the first departure.

[TSR2]

Same date price comparison.

LBA-EWR ....... £444

MAN-EWR ...... £335

[MUFC_fan]

Does the LS flight come with free inflight service like DL/CO from MAN?

[TSR2]

The basic fare includes one hot meal in each direction. Snacks and drinks can be purchased on board. Full service is included in the Jet2plus package at £99 Each Way per person.

[commit aviation]

EGNMCharlie
No need to sub in as there was a spare 757 once AJ came on line. Gave plenty of sub charter opportunities during the early part of the summer season.
Now however, things are a lot tighter so tech = stuffed particularly at the weekends!
737s are just as tight so the unfortunate damage to LC in PMI resulted in a European 737-200 coming to LBA to help out Friday & Saturday.

[lbalad]

What was the 'unfortunate damage' to an aircraft in Palma?.Missed that one.

[commit aviation]

A baggage belt tried to make the hold a little bit wider... :uhoh:

[baps]

They tried that with a tom 737 a week earlier. Didn't tell anyone though so wasn't noticed till it was back in the UK. Sounds like some of the baggage handlers in PMI should have gone to specsavers. Hope they've got there P45 spanish equivalent.

[757 Speedbrakes]

Was it one of Jet2's own ground handling staff???? :rolleyes:

[MUFC_fan]

Yes, they self handle in:

Murcia
Palma
Malaga
Tenerife

[757 Speedbrakes]

We don't self handle in TFS...... Ground Force staff are quite good there.

I was just wondering if it was Jet2 staff that day??

Knowing how much pressure those guys are under to get on-time push backs I'm not surprissed something like this would happen.

Although I've noticed that what we record as 'off blocks' and what they record can differ by up to 20 mins!!

[MUFC_fan]

According to your jobs website you do.:confused:

[trebor]

Maybe offblocks is recorded due to the fact it can take 20 mins to taxi to runway. Some airlines used to record doors closed as time of departure especially if the delay was 2hrs59:ugh:

[Channex101]

TFS has Jet2 groundstaff for customer service, however ramp handling is provided by groundforce so its 50/50

[757 Speedbrakes]

Sorry, thats what I meant. Customer service staff don't usually drive baggage loaders :hmm:.

Trebor - Good point but I think the target of 85% or higher on time departues is the more likely reason........

[682ft AMSL]

Dart Group results announced this morning show underlying pre-tax of £4m vs £14m last year. Shares up 30% in early trade.
682
Market News (http://www.londonstockexchange.com/LSECWS/IFSPages/MarketNewsPopup.aspx?id=1909132&source=RNS)

[take-off]

Dont know if its been mentioned or not been on for a few days, see Jet2 have changed booking website, still dont show the prices including taxes and charges which is so annoying.
Good to see a new route for next summer as well outs blk to mahon:ok: , maybe only a weekly but just kind of thing that should do well out of blk, hopefully few more weekly destinations will come our way in not to distant future:ok::ok::D

[EGNMCharlie]

Dart Group results announced this morning show underlying pre-tax of £4m vs £14m last year. Shares up 30% in early trade.

Pre tax profit of £11.8 milion according to London Stock Excange and Thomson Financial. Revenue grew by 23% to £429m.

Fuel is fully hedged until 31st March 2009, company says that with a more focused flying programme and fuel hedged they are well placed to improve financial performance in the current financial year.

[MUFC_fan]

Would LS really want to mess around with GSM?

They are in a very stable position whatever people have been saying.

Well done Jet2 and good luck in the future!

[757 Speedbrakes]

Interesting too, was the CAA report that more passengens were carried (over 4 million) from the North of England than any other airline! :D

[682ft AMSL]

EGNM - the underlying profit is not £11.8m. You have to take away the effect of changes in accounting treatment following IFRS adoption between the two years. Indeed read the full report and in their segmented analysis it reports operating profit of £0.3m from Aviaiton Services in 07/08 compared to £13m in 06/07 which means that the revenue effect of the capacity and passenger growth was more than offset by increased costs. In effect, they chased volume at MAN (and NCL) and it cost them; hence the more "focussed" flying programme now which has taken around 60 - 70,000 seats per month out of MAN compared to S07. The distribution arm makes £5-£6m profit and seems a pretty stable outfit from a P&L perspective and that does at least give the aviation side some breathing space in which to work. Against that background, if they can return the aviation side to a similar level of profitability, it looks undervalued as a business.

[Facelookbovvered]

Facelookbovvered,

Your 19:12 post urging readers to "come on have a flutter" on the shareprice of Dart Group (Jet2) is deeply irresponsible and could be construed as "ramping" (promoting a shareprice for personal gain) which is illegal. I am guessing that your posting is born out of genuine enthusiasm for Jet2 rather than for any malicious reason, but nevertheless you should not post a recommendation to trade shares in any named company again unless you are a licensed professional.


And that my son is how you make £5000.00 in to £10,000.00, but i wouldn't advise anyone do anything they can't afford to loose, that will help pay for the new motor (a good way to get rid of some dosh)

lol

[Shed-on-a-Pole]

Hi FLB,

Gloat away when you've doubled your money. But you haven't done it yet! [DTG 'ask' price was 13.5p at the time of our exchange]. I continue to wish you good luck on that score because I will be delighted to see Jet2 thrive, and I have no problem with you making money on your personal trading. However, my altercation with you concerned your inclination to make stock recommendations to other readers and you remain well advised to desist from doing that.

Cheers, SHED.

[Chille Con Carnie]

Was is not the Dart Group PLC in whole that made the profit & just not just Jet2.

[Facelookbovvered]

Thanks, i bought at 10.75, but have some dealing costs to cover, i reckon that Dart is worth around 36p, get rid of Jet2 and its worth double that and some, don't get me wrong i think its a great product, but there is only so long you can continue flying kit of this age and the return (negative) will not cover the money required to replace them, as for putting winglet on the 757's the term "pollish a turd" comes to mind, sure it might work for conny flying accross the pond eveyday, but thats not Jet2 model, sooner, but i expect later the board will come to their sense's and sell the avaiation bit, look how much more profitable the group would have been worth with out it!!

Gloat!! no i don't do that either, but flying aircraft on ego trips is not an investment plan, i am happy just to punt them where the boss wants, its not my money and it pays enough to keep the kids in private school

[Shed-on-a-Pole]

Congratulations, FLB. However, anyone who purchased on the date you urged them to "have a flutter" has yet to double their money. I still hope they do so.

SHED.

[Yeadon Dam]

Well done to Jet2/Dart for staying well afloat at a time when airlines/transportation are suffering badly elsewhere. Keep up the good work.

[LSJET]

Does Anyone Have anyideas of New routes for summer 09 from leeds

[TartinTon]

Interesting that after some fairly lacklustre results they now appear to have pulled all but one aircraft from MAN for their winter schedule. All AGP/ALC/NCE/FAO/VLC etc etc appear to have been pulled. The only things operating are some very thin schedules to Canaries. Anyone with any further clarification?:eek::eek::eek:

[MUFC_fan]

I very much doubt LS will only have one a/c flying from MAN this winter. The airport mayt have become a smaller base now but surely not that small!

[airhumberside]

Looks to be 2 aircraft according to their timetable, but with low utilisation on some days. As well as Canaries there is SSH, BUD, GVA and Chambery

[take-off]

At least thats more than blks got this winter, come jan theres only weekly tfs and geneva, even agp been pushed back to end of march rather than feb like this year.
:{:{:{

[757 Speedbrakes]

You can add NCL to that list as well. :(

Currently only 2 destinations for each fleet:

737 - CRK & MJV

757 - TFS & ACE

Plenty of rumors re charters but there will need to be a lot or winter 08 will be more boring than W07 :*

[Channex101]

Dont forget to add CMF to 737 fleet for winter. so thats a whopping 5 destinations in total... and i think you ment ORK lol

[0523 cov man]

:Dmay be going from cvt next year

[BigT2207]

Sardinia - New from Edinburgh!

Following on from the success of the Leeds - Sardinia (Olbia) route launched for Summer 08, flights are now on sale to Sardinia flying from Edinburgh for Summer 09!




from the Jet2 website

[Jamesair]

Hope there will be something new from NCL next summer...still no news on the NCL - Cork route beyond 29th March....any rumours?

[AviationNE]

Im Just grateful Ncl has it until march the way things are going!

[BYALPHAINDIA]

Quote
I very much doubt LS will only have one a/c flying from MAN this winter. The airport mayt have become a smaller base now but surely not that small!

Reply
Seems to be 3 75's presently based MAN, Can't see them basing only one 75??

Anything can change before October.

[GrahamK]

Jet2 apparently looking at LBA and MAN to Tel Aviv

[scamptonboy]

Jet2 have also announced Rhodes today, yet another bucket & spade destination from LBA.

Commences 27 May 2009, 1 x weekly on a Wednesday

[Prestonian]

I have been told that LS had to put up a plane load of passengers in the 4* Hotel Vulcano, Playa de las America, Tenerife last night (expensive!). Anyone know what the problem was?

[BYALPHAINDIA]

I agree, Running a scheduled airline is not what PM has experience in.

Think now the time has come where, The airline needs other people with a bit more low cost or scheduled experience to help run it.

As for 4* what's the need for it.

Any hotel or appartment would have been just as sufficient and a little cheaper.

[flybar]

In an emergency you have to put passengers where there is room irrespective of the star rating.Intrigued why a Four Star hotel would have so many spare rooms anyway at this time of year - Probably got them very cheap in the circumstances

[757 Speedbrakes]

It was the 4 star Arona Grand in Los Cristianos last summer when an aircraft went tech. (LSAC)

That made sense as us LS crews had been staying there in Winter 06 so they would of got a good deal.

Amazingly, some passengers were very pleased that they had been put up in a four star hotel and I even flew two of them back to Tenerife this summer and other crew members said they have also bumped into returning pax from the same delayed flight last year!!

What did O'Pikey say about loyalty and dogs?? :hmm:

FLB

Tommie Cook and Last Choice's 75's are not much younger either.

Technically, according to Boeing, the 75 was designed to last 40 years so their only half way though their useful lives....................... Boeing didn't say anything about the increased engineering costs though!! :oh:

[Jet2krazey]

Heard a rumour today that we are gonna be selling off the chinese 757s AG AH AI as they are worth today alot more than when we bought them! and we are buying some 737-800s as early as oct, as its easier to fill a 737-800 in the winter than a 757! anyone able to shed any light on this! :confused:

[RobT100]

RHO wil do a cracking business out of LBA, I guarantee it

[BYALPHAINDIA]

Not had AG AH AI that long, Thought they might run them for a couple of years yet??

I can 'Vouch' for AI flew to PMI on it a few weeks back, It is looking very tired now, Also had no IFE, So I guess it might be moving on.

[tonker]

Why should he stick to trucking, when over the past 5 years he has run a profitable airline in one shape or another.

[Yeadon Dam]

Having flown on AG, AH, AI and AJ for that matter, I personally think they are spot on. If however they can trade them in/offset them for some newer 737/800's, then that sound good to me. No Cat III issues on 32 at LBA in Winter, less maintenance and fuel costs I would imagine, and increased load factors when filling a 186 seater instead of a 238 seater.

I must admit that it is rare I see a 757 come in with much more than about 190-200 punters on.

[Prestonian]

In an emergency you have to put passengers where there is room irrespective of the star rating.Intrigued why a Four Star hotel would have so many spare rooms anyway at this time of year - Probably got them very cheap in the circumstances

Despite it being peak UK holiday period, Tenerife is very quiet at the moment and the hotels, including very good ones like this are half empty. The reason....? In my opinion it is the lack of flight availability because the operatos, including Locos, have cut back far too much. Well over £300 return for flight only! Same applies to Alicante and the Costas at the moment. Jet2 are one of the culprits in being too defensive - they don't even fly to Tenerife from Blackpool for instance in the summer!

[Facelookbovvered]

Tenerife is a long way from LBA or Blackpool and the fuel cost alone must be over £50 a head one way, plus you'll only get one rotation out of the aircraft, on board sales will be less per mile than say flying to PMI or ALC so £300 returns not a bad deal in peak season.

[no sponsor]

Heard 2 NGs are coming in Nov. Not heard the rumour for 757 exiting stage left though. Wouldn't surprise me, however.

Bear in mind that the 2 NGs arriving soon did the rounds this time last year.

[4567]

As for GSM not being in the running for a merger with jet2 i would have thought the two would be better suited than Jet & bmibaby. They both offer full package holidays. Plus Flyglobespan own 3 763's and has 2 787's on order and jet2 have many 752's for them to operate a varied long haul programme though jet2 would have to catch up on GSM with having a full fleet of 737NG'S as globespan are disposing of there 2 733's. Plus they would gain the hotels and appartments that The globespan Group owns in France and spain. If you don't agreee then im sure Globespan can keep going at alone aswell as jet2.

If jet2 was to sell the chinese 752's im sure GSM would be interested in one becuase there wanting to expand UK - Toronto route.

[Mr @ Spotty M]

"Prestonian", TFS is classed as a winter destination, which is why you will find half empty hotels at this time of the year.
It is a case of why fly 4 hours plus for the sun if you can fly 2-3 hours for the sun around the med.
In the winter you have to fly 4 plus hours to be sure of warm/hot sunny weather.

[EGNMCharlie]

Yes, Tenerife is a winter destination but it is still busy in summer! We stayed at the Hotel Vulcano last summer and was roughly 80% full. It wont have cost Jet2 as much as you think to put them up in the hotel, as baring in mind Jet2Holidays will have pre bought hotel rooms and they evidently must have had a fair bit of availability in the Vulcano to put up pax there.

Talking of the fleet, it would make so much sense to get rid of a few 757's, lets face it the cabins are not the freshest. I can just see it now ... PM sells off 6 of the 757's and buys some used 737-800's from Ryanair. I would have thought that Jet2 could charge what the hell they like for a 757 as as far as i'm aware the likes of fedex, DHL etc are desperate for 757's? Gradually phase out the 757's, get a few more 737-800's and then get some ex EZY 737-700's in to get rid of the old -300's. One fleet type so lots of synergies with crew/MX etc..... maybe someone should wake me up from my dream now ...:ugh:

[4567]

Is there much of a long-haul expansion planned for Jet2 anymore?

There were so many rumors of jet2 getting 767's but nothing has ever appeared.
There was a rumor of Flyglobespan leasing jet2 one of there 767's but i guess that was just talk.

[commit aviation]

One problem with getting rid of the 733s. What about the QC's for the mail operation????? :eek:

Correct me if I'm wrong but there isn't (currently) a NG QC.
Maybe PM could speak to Mr Boeing and IAI and set up a conversion programme but it won't be cheap. Mind you, if Royal Mail want to continue the operation then they might be prepared to / have to pay for some of it in some way....

Thoughts anyone?

[AviationNE]

They could keep the qc aircraft and just replace the normal run of the mill 733 with 7377 that would allow them to keep the operation but have a majority uodated fleet. And in time im sure if it all goes to plan they could leave the QCs solely for charter work and freight should a big enough profit arise.

[trebor]

Yeadon dam . Alot of the routes have over 200 pax at the moment . So not very rare.
I would much prefer to fly jet2 and know I would be looked after in the event of a long delay rather than other locos that just cancel or reschedule and you look after yourself. I remember with ryan not being able to land at my destination and being dumped 400 miles away and left to find my own way. The train ticket and bus costs were more than the flight :ugh::ugh:

[BYALPHAINDIA]

Not a complete 'lover' of the 737-800, To me it doesn't seem exciting, Just a 737 with 'winglets' on.:zzz:

I'm sorry it doesn't 'jump' out at me.

I'm a 757 man thru & thru.;)

Long live the 75.:D

[Mr.Brown]

The airline made £300,000 profit last year. They own all their aircraft except one. And people seem to think they are gonna get NG's. They can't afford to buy new aircraft so they'd have to lease NG's. Add the cost of crew and engineering training etc etc and they'd be looking at a massive loss next year.

[kick the tires]

NO leasing costs and they only made £300K????

[AviationNE]

I was lead to believe they would be selling the 757's to fund the NGs so no leasing costs.

[Mr.Brown]

They would definetely be downsizing the fleet if they were to fund the NG's by the sale of the 757's.

[757 Speedbrakes]

If they were getting rid of all the 75's why the hell are they fitting winglets to G-LSAB in september!I hear the 3 ex China Airlines(AI, AG and AH) may be sold. This is becasue they are NOT fitted with Hydraulic Driven Generators and therfore cannot go ETOPs. They can't even go on the Tango 16 routes!Mr Brown, as a poor shareholder, I have a glossy copy of the company accounts this year. £3.9M profit before tax. Unfortunately out of a total revenue of just under £430M. However, with fuel hedged til March 09 with an option to increase to Sept and forecasts of smaller operating costs this year the company forecast isn't TOO bad compared with others.Hear endith the accountant spiel!

[Mr.Brown]

757 Speebbrakes,
Yes the company (Dart Group) made £3.9 million but the airline (Jet2)only contributed £300,000 (after tax I think) to that...
Any investment in new aircraft would put the whole group into a loss.

[Night_fr8]

Rumour

B.737-800's from Ryanair.
Out with the old in with the new Ryanair that is.

£300 K with that number of aircraft in the fleets, seems a poor profit.
Sell all the aircraft close down and put the money in the bank for a much better return on capital.

[Mr.Brown]

£300,000 was of course dismal but some airlines suffered loses. What would happen if Jet2 had lease fees to pay.
I think a few new Scania's would be a better investment for the group!

[BYALPHAINDIA]

Looking at that figure, I wouldn't be surprised if PM sold the Airline 'As a going concern'

BP is making 300,000 an hour!!

Think EZY or Baby would be interested in 'Channex'

[Jet2krazey]

Id be happy for TOM to buy us out! :)

[sparkshy]

I can't believe that.



how many tenerifians are gutted at not flying to blackpool for a fortnight??


must be at least a skateboard full.

[LSJET]

:ok: if its true i cnt wait to go on a jet2 737-800

they will most likley use them on the bucket and spade destinations like ALC AGP IBZ FAO PMI :D

and what destinations do you think they have got up there sleve for next summer - the rumour of tel aviv and i heard that they was planning turkey flights from manchester

[Johnny F@rt Pants]

I think the Turkey flights from MAN will be the same as this year, charters:D. Whether Jet2holidays takes some of the seats though is another matter.

[757 Speedbrakes]

The NG's will also have the legs to do the cannary flights with bigger payloads.............................

[4567]

See Flyglobespan are considering a move from MME to NCL think they would go into competition with jet2 for some flights should they do this?

Airline could quit Tees Valley for Newcastle - JournalLive (http://www.journallive.co.uk/north-east-news/todays-news/2008/08/19/airline-could-quit-tees-valley-for-newcastle-61634-21556273/)

[perky35]

What !?! As cabin crew for Jet2, we all wanted to have the TFS and ACE routes as they made the most money on the bar hence more commision for us. It was not unusual to take £3000 on a TFS flight from bar takings alone, flights are generally always full as well!

The aircraft also went somewhere in the morning before its TFS flight. in summer 07 it left LBA for TFS at 16:00 after the aircraft had been to Faro i believe.

The ACE flights that started for the winter 2007/08 left in the morning and was back in time to do an AMS rotation on the first of the season!

[LSJET]

NEW! For Summer 2009


Leeds To Larnaca 1x Weekly

Manchester To Sardinia 1x Weekly

Newcastle To Ibiza 2x Weekly

[harrogate]

£300k profit doesn't mean only £300k in the bank.

New aircraft aren't paid for entirely up-front.

Some of the business logic on this thread is mental.

[GoEDI]

EDI summer schedule now on sale, little change to this summer's except for Olbia. Can't imagine there's much more to come, if anything.

[leedsnorthern]

Great news about the new routes. It good to see that Jet2 are still adding routes despite the current economic climate. Wouldn't be surprised though if Easyjet now increase the duration / frequency of their Ibiza flight from Newcastle.

Also, looking at the timetable, it would appear that the Manchester to Olbia flight is on a W rotation, so is there a possibility of a new route to Sardinia from another of their bases?

[airhumberside]

Re Olbia, both LBA and EDI appear to be simple out and backs. I cant see BLK-Olbia. NCL or BFS to Olbia maybe but could it be a w pattern from Stansted, with the Stansted leg being a charter? Or some retirmings to come?

[LeedsN1]

Jet2 is soon to ounce a new route to Dubrovnik Croatia from Leeds Bradford Airport. Its already up on the Jet2 Destination map but no timetable or news of it yet.

[BigT2207]

• Dubrovnik (Croatia) – from £56.99 one way including taxes (departing 23 May 2009)
Saturdays Only

Strange the LBA website has the news first

[commit aviation]

....close: Sundays only and starts 3rd May 2009! :)

[OliWW]

There is quite a big delay on a B752 operating ALC-LBA tonight, according to AENA its not due to depart ALC until 0915 and was due to leave at 1340, thats 19hrs 35mins late...
Whats causing this one then?

[leedsnortherm]

The Alicante flight is now estimated at 1530 tomorrow - is this a 24 delay or is the flight being merged with tomorrow's? Also, the Belfast - Leeds has been diverted to Manchester so not a good day for Jet2

[commit aviation]

More summer 09 routes on sale today:
LBA-AVN / CDG / GVA / KRK / LRH / PRG & TLS

Just a few more to go by the looks of it.

[EC-ILS]

I flew ALC-DUB on the 22nd while the delayed ALC-LBA flight was on the ground, they just kept saying next info in 20, 50 mins etc, I can imagine it was very frustrating for the passengers. There was one of their 757s parked remoteley so I quess that was the one with the tech problem.

[EGBKFLYER]

I think the 757 was the one that had a large hydraulic leak.

[Bill Bo Baggins]

Yes that was the one with hydraulic leak I know someone who was on the flight and yes the etd kept being pushed back then they were told that they were waiting for a spares and in the end they were put up for the night in a decent hotel and flown back to Leeds the next day

Bill Bo

[jet2impress]

I believe the part was sourced, companies light aircraft was dispatched to collect the part, then were let down by the supplier. Due to that, the part had to be found from an alternative source. Just one of those things I am afraid. :rolleyes:

[BLKsheriff]

LONDON (Thomson Financial) - Dart Group Plc. said it is very encouraged by its current trading performance.
The Aviation and distribution company said the greater emphasis on leisure destinations within Jet2.com's flying programme has had a positive impact on both yield and load factor in its Aviation business.
It added revenues have been further boosted by strong late demand, which, combined with careful cost control and strong growth in charter flying, has resulted in an improved operating margin, which is expected to continue for the year as a whole. Trading in the Distribution business, Fowler Welch-Coolchain, has been in line with the company's expectations despite the poor summer weather impacting on distribution volumes from traditional summer foods, Dart said.

:ok::ok::ok:

[TartinTon]

So the trading statement says that the distribution business is trading as expected but gives no hint as to whether the airline is ahead of, at, or behind expectation. Just a lot of warm words. Hardly a positive statement, more a sop to the investors.

[Going loco]

So, Distribution = trading in-line.

Overall Group = "very encoraged by performance"
Reasons stated for encouragement
- aviation yeilds = UP
- aviation volume = UP
- aviation operating margin = UP

..and from that you are unable to deduce whether the aviation side of the business is doing better than expected????

[Mr.Brown]

Do your believe everything you read? If so then there was of course weapons of mass detruction in Iraq, there is going to be no recession and Jet2 are doing great!


Overall Group = "very encoraged by performance"
Reasons stated for encouragement
- aviation yeilds = UP
- aviation volume = UP
- aviation operating margin = UP


Of course Yeilds, volume and operating margins are up (on last year) They have more aircraft and more routes than last year... But its still the summer season. What happens this winter, MAN for example has, I think, 6 routes, 1 of which is 1 flight a week. Que tumble weed at BLK, and NCL is fairly quiet...
This winter is going to take a fair chunk out of all the hard work this summer.

You can say Margins are up etc etc but what about future margins? With the winter ahead its going to be quiet but next summer is looking ok. Next year I think we might all look ahead to a restructure if the economy doesn't improve...

[TartinTon]

Yes, they do say that operating margins are up......but compared to what?
It's like saying that your bookings are massively up 500% when you've now got 6 booked when you previously had 1. With no frame of reference it's just meaningless drivel. Still, you can always put your money where your mouth is if you're that encouraged?

Nah, thought not...

[Going loco]

I don't believe everything I read on here! I am more inclined to believe formal statements to the LSE from a listed company considering that anything other than truth is not looked too favourably on by Inspector Knacker. Fraud, I think they call it.
So whilst the fine detail of how to interpret company trading statements may be beyond the mere mortals on here, I'll take my steer from how the aviation analysts in the city have reacted to the statement. As at 11:00, Dart Group up 22%, 6th biggest riser on the FTSE all share.
So, tell us again. What have you spotted in the statement that has been missed en masse by professional share traders?

[TartinTon]

The same things that were missed by the "professionals" when the former CEO of Silverjet was saying much the same thing......

Their share price went up then, too.

They then went down when the profit-taking started and the real story started to emerge.

[AIRWAY1UK]

Ok tartinton, so your saying Jet2 is going to fail?

[ciampino]

Not a great lover of Jet2 then Tartinton?

[TartinTon]

"Ok tartinton, so your saying Jet2 is going to fail?"

I'd say there was a better than even chance, yes.

"Not a great lover of Jet2 then Tartinton?"

Not really. I find their pricing misleading at best. The fact that
you don't actually find out what you're paying until stage 6 of the booking process could be said to be illegal under current legislation when the full price
is supposed to be shown on the first screen. I find that particularly annoying and misleading when most other carriers have managed to amend their systems (Ryanair being the notable exception).

I think if Ryan or Easy were to step into LBA in a serious way then they would be gone in months or maybe even weeks.

Just my point of view...

[4567]

Think Globespan and Jet2 will soon start to consider a merger of the companies?

[757 Speedbrakes]

TT

May we assume that as you are posting on PPRUNE that you are, in fact a pilot or hold some resonable position in the aviation industry............

I spoke to the Chief Executive for some time last week, who seemed nothing if not jovial about the current performance and forecasts.

If he's at the top of a company that he owns 51% of that is about to go bust, he certainly masks his fears very well.

[Mr.Brown]

If he's at the top of a company that he owns 51% of that is about to go bust, he certainly masks his fears very well.


Like he's going to admit any problems to a mere employee. Shareholders would run for the hills and it would definetly go bust then. Of course he's going to bejovial about the current performance and forecasts. To you anyway. You'll be the last to know from him.

[EGNMCharlie]

Right i'm just a humble PPL student and Dart Group investor here but Mr. Brown and TartinTon are you suggesting that The Dart Group has 'made up' their financial performance? That they are lieing? That they are decieving employees, shareholders etc?

I dont want to sound like a d!ck but The London Stock Exchange, RNS, The Dart Group, Philip Meeson, Andrew Merirck, and yes employees like 757 Speedbrakes WILL know more about The Dart Group/Jet2 than you! Reputable companies i.e Thomson Financial will NOT publish articles/statements/facts that are not true!

[retrosgone]

Always hard to know what is going on behind the scenes in any company. All I can say, as a "mere employee" and airframe driver, is that on all the routes I have flown this year the load factors have been noticeably better than over the past 3 or 4 years.

Jet 2 do not have more aircraft than last year (as stated previously on this thread). In fact, there are 3 fewer than last summer, when you take into account the very expensive wet leases we had during the period of rapid expansion. A good number of underperforming routes have been ditched, and a lot more charters have been evident in my rosters.

Fuel costs are a major concern for everyone, though at least jet2 are hedged well ahead, and therefore can work out costs, charges and fares with some degree of confidence. At the moment, despite increased fares etc, the public still appear to be treating their holidays as a high priority. If that changes, then we are all in trouble - and that includes the high cost base majors (who are capable of sustaining heavy losses in the medium term, but not indefinitely).

To summarise, there is certainly no air of impending doom about the place. It could even be argued that jet2, possibly as much through luck as through judgement, is better positioned than many in these uncertain times.

[Mr.Brown]

I dont want to sound like a d!ck but The London Stock Exchange, RNS, The Dart Group, Philip Meeson, Andrew Merirck, and yes employees like 757 Speedbrakes WILL know more about The Dart Group/Jet2 than you! Reputable companies i.e Thomson Financial will NOT publish articles/statements/facts that are not true!

First of all the statement released is not a lie, it just based on previous years performance's.
As an employee I know a little about Jet2.

All I can say, as a "mere employee" and airframe driver, is that on all the routes I have flown this year the load factors have been noticeably better than over the past 3 or 4 years
Yes they are having agoo year SO FAR!!!!!!!


Jet 2 do not have more aircraft than last year (as stated previously on this thread). In fact, there are 3 fewer than last summer, when you take into account the very expensive wet leases we had during the period of rapid expansion. A good number of underperforming routes have been ditched, and a lot more charters have been evident in my rosters.

These are reasons why the statement released is true.
How ever AJ has joined us on a long term lease with the added Mainteneance cost and crewing costs, so Jet2 have more aircraft in the long term.

Lets just see what the future brings for Jet2 then. I'm not a total doom and Gloomer. I think the end of summer 09 will reveal alot

[freightdoggy dog]

Mr Brown re:

"Que tumble weed at BLK, and NCL is fairly quiet...
This winter is going to take a fair chunk out of all the hard work this summer."

Every airline is out to minimise loss this winter,B.A,RYR,EZY,Flybe etc, so why are suggesting that Jet2.com should not batten down the hatches on all the hard work this summer( i.e profits ) and keep it in the bank ? Are they doing anything that the others aren't ?

You don't have the full day to day financial picture..none of us do...but I do know this.... the Jet2.com charter a/c down in Stan and Teds is working its nuts off during WO8 ,as are a lot of the other bases a/c. So yes, I can actually believe that margins/yields are up from the charter work and that costs are being contained on the lo-co.

So thanks for the "we're all doomed " Mr Brown, But I guess I will just have to keep turning up, like I have for the past 19 years !!!!!

PS I like the Mad Micks Madness, but hasn't he sold his soul/shares out to the race horses !

[Facelookbovvered]

Jet2 put the brakes on its growth last winter and given the dismal profit for 07/08 it was just in time! it claims to be well hedged and this (Summer) if that what you can call it will have given a late boost to booking with a better yield.

By pulling much of its short haul city stuff (MAN-EDI) it can focus on what it does best, the med and the medium haul stuff on the 757 can be profitable. So long as PM isn't allowed by his (poorer) shareholder to go off across the pond then the rest seems ok (trucks, mail & charter) this winter will be tough for all and next summer wont be as easy as this one.

I am not a doom monger but if you think its bad now (the economy) wait until next spring, oil will probably be back below $100pb due to the collapse in demand, but with so many unemployed and probably higher interest rates than now a holiday will be lower down the list, much of this years robustness in pax numbers for all LoCo comes from people have booked early in the year when people thought it couldn't get much worse.

I don't think things are as good at Globespam although the collapse of Zoom might help. The increase in fuel costs will be hurting big style, i think without the MOD Falklands contract and Air India they would be dead already. The management must be a set of clowns up there, mixed fleets one aircraft bases, all the additional costs of hotac & positioning non revenue sectors do they learn nothing from the likes of Easy/Ryanair/bmibaby...........Globespam will burn a lot of cash this winter

[4567]

Facelookbovard

Globespan if you don't mind!

Do you see us calling you Jet3!

Flyglobespan's hedged against fuel for this summer and winter 08/09.

As for the fleet comment the two 733's they own are bye bye! Febuary 09 becuase of there poor state and there gas guzzling nature whilst the rest of the 737's are all NG'S most fitted with winglets bar 3 because of the 733's Globespan are leaving there 1 a/c base MME.

So what GSM lease off there 3 large long-haul a/c in the winter becuase the loads are just not there so prefer to use there 752 to SFB in winter which is more economical and have the 763's out there making the cash.

Im sure if Jet2 even had 767's they would do the same.

GSM can't be that desperate for the air india contract far as we are aware they turned air india down to renew it!

Then there the Globespan group whichs own hotels etc in Europe

[Facelookbovvered]

Sorry for the typoo (why do they put these keys next to each other/)

Ha fuel hedging!! the great get out of jail card, trouble is sooner or later the positions run out, its a bit like having a fixed mortgage, then one morning your back to the standard variable rate, unless you've sorted the business out by then your in s**t creek.

The fact remains that there is only a very small business to be made out of flying long haul from Scotland, yes some charter and some schedule, but mainly American's who can interlink with their own net works, off course many Scot's will vote to fly with Scotlands airline, well at least once until something goes wrong, but for the business traveller (and THATS WHERE THE MONEY IS MADE) then its the shuttle to LHR every time or AMS or CDG, sure your luggage might come a few days later, but at least you wont need to keep unpacking in Hamilton or where ever.

Thanks for reminding me that Globespam have hotels in Europe, i'll add them to my list to avoid along with anything starting with REX!!


Facelookbovvered......

[robo283]

It's not just the price of oil but also the exchange rate. At present you get $1.82 to the pound so a barrel of oil at $100 costs £54. Slip to $1.50 to the pound and the same barrel costs £67. It's highly unlikely that anyone has hedged in sterling (unless the fuel industry has changed its ways) so I would think that all airlines are vulnerable. What we need is high inflation and high interest rates to boost the exchange rate, along with low inflation and low interest rates to stimulate consumer demand. I'm off to lie down in a dark room till my brain stops hurting....:eek:

[chickenstrips]

Facelookbovvered

What’s your insight in to the operations of GSM? Go on, I’m intrigued!

There are more similarities than differences between Jet 2 and GSM. We both operate the same Boeing mixed fleets, fly short to medium haul sectors aimed at the holiday market, both position empty a/c, hotac crew, have our fair share of tech issues and probably pay, near-as-damn it, the same cost/ltr for gas!

What’s your point??

The holiday charter market from Scotland has been very big for many years – it’s the one thing most Scot’s will spend their last pennies on! Globespan, before we were an airline, along with Barrhead Travel and others have been filling planes all year round and will continue to do so!

Business Travel, over the next few years will become less and less. More and more companies are not willing to pay the high costs for last minute tickets with the like of Easy/BA/BMI anymore and if the country does go in to recession, it will stop. As for the shuttle to LHR, you are joking? Have you seen how many flights Big Airways have dropped for the next 12 months? Video conferencing will become the norm, desk-top video calls will become more evident and your two weeks on the beach with your PDA will be even more needed!

I’ll put my neck out and say that I do agree with you. The long haul market from Scotland is limited, that doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist. Delta/Conti/Emirates all operate long haul flights to the Middle East and America from Scotland. Zoom and GSM did/do operate to Canada and I believe these flights will commence again with another operator.

I for one feel a merger with Jet 2/GSM would be a good move. Same types, same market with different destinations from different bases and more importantly both have Cargo ops approvals!

[Facelookbovvered]

The likes of EK offer the world via their hub and that make it another ball game, i know you aren't suggesting that Globespam (dam it thoose keys again) aren't competing with EK or BA for that matter, but unless your an international legacy airline eg BA,AFKLM,AA,DELTA,UA,EK,CA then it wont work because you'll never get the people up front spending £ks and all of the above have got more money invested in business lounges than Globespam(dam thoose keys) have in engineering.

I'ts really that simple. There is more money (by a huge margin) inside the M25 than there ever will be outside it, i don't see Jet2 and Globespam as the same, one is a travel company trying to be an airline the other is an airline trying to be a travel company, both would IMHO have made more money for less risk if they stuck to what they do best!!??, remember its not (all) their money at risk, they have shareholders funds to consider, Sir Mick & Sir Richard do not have to concern themselfs with thousand of small(and sadly all to often misguided employee, remember Silverjet!!) shareholders to consider

[4567]

Facelookbovard

Don't forget PM used the hedging excuse against Ryanairs MO aswell so it won't be long before Flyglobespan and Jet2 are in the same boat with the mortgage payments (as you put it) soon to be put up!

In the case of jet3 (damm 2,3 next to each other) there are shareholders to cosider but at GSM theres no shareholders just one man Tom Dalrymyple who has ultimate control over the airline owning 100% last year he made a 13million loss and he didn't show one bit of worry because the airline is already back on track to profit.

Though the long-haul market from Scotland is limited it works for GSM there loads for each flight are around 90-100% full to SFB and same from the UK to Canada. Now they have a bigger share of the market in certain UK airports because of the collapse of ZOOM.

I think the strategy as you put it a Travel company trying to become an airline works the better way around than an airline trying to become an travel company. Offering all sorts at every destination you fly to from hotels, Car hire, nile cruises to accomodation only and transfers which all adds as extra revenue ontop of all the a/c lease's, Global holidays/Flyglobespan and MOD contracts.

Plus the globespan colours just look so much better! :)

[Jet2krazey]

"Globespan colours look so much better"! in your dreams hun! you cant get better than Jet2 colours! one of the best around and will be for years too come! i can see GSM going tits up b4 LS, there is just no competition! ;)

[Mr.Brown]

Every airline is out to minimise loss this winter,B.A,RYR,EZY,Flybe etc, so why are suggesting that Jet2.com should not batten down the hatches on all the hard work this summer( i.e profits ) and keep it in the bank ? Are they doing anything that the others aren't ?



Have alook at the BLK, Man and NCL flying programme for the winter, are those bases going to make money?
Manchester for example, quiet a few staff and not too much flying on the cards as yet, and maybe not that much planned as I've heard that some of the engineers can take unpaid leave for the winter.
What about BFS and EDI, not excatly busy for the winter..
They won't be able to keep the profit in the bank, because like alot of other airlines they will have to spend it over the winter, and even some of the previous years profits too.
So,freightdoggy dog, your welcome for the "we're all doomed". How long can an airline that owns all its own aircraft keep them on the ground for? At least if they were leased they could go back to their owners, they are now forced into trying to lease aircraft 20yrs+ old, so they could be competing with the likes of Flightline and European this winter.
Maybe freightdoggy dog, its time to get yourself down to kennel to find a new arse to sniff, because having your nose in the same one for 19years can't be good for you. I've heard it can make you BLIND.

[LEEDS APPROACH]

mr brown,

perhaps it's time you got yourself down to the job centre to look for a new employer. It is not good to work for a company that you clearly dislike. It sounds as if you are willing the company to fail, which is very sad, as the vast majority of posters on these forums are willing airlines to survive. Times are vey difficult for all airlines at the moment and it is to be expected that flying is reduced over the winter months. Despite this Jet2 are adding yet more new destinations for this winter and next summer and you as an employee like me as a customer should be chuffed to bits.

I recommend a new job completely away from the aviation industry, such as train driver. This will help put a smile back on your face as you sound quite an unhappy person. I say this with all sincerity.

I'd like to add that I wish Jet2 all the best and thank them for their continued expansion in very trying times. :ok:

Leeds App.

[EI-BUD]

Mr Brown

A bit of a simplistic view on a couple of these matters....

They won't be able to keep the profit in the bank


'Profit' does not simply go into the bank, companies who make profits may have no money in the bank. Profit may lead to a better balance in the bank but many firms who are massively profitable may be cash poor, a profit is a increase in wealth. So my point is that profit is not necessarily liquid hence may not be available to finance losses in difficult times.



if they were leased they could go back to their owners


Aircraft leases are not as simple as hey we will send them back to the lessors, there usually is an agreed lease period, and usually any return of an aircraft before the expiry date of the lease would mean a penalty often quite heavy ones.

[stansdead]

Robo283,

Actually, we at Virgin Atlantic hedge both fuel and currencies.

So, you are quite wrong.

[EGNMCharlie]

Don't forget that the Aircraft at EDI, NCL, BFS do the Royal Mail night time contacts ... so in reality they may have quite a lot of slack during the day but at night they are shuttling up and down the country! I wouldnt mind betting that a Jet2 737 at say NCL will do more rotations in 24 hours than say a Monarch A320!

Maybe Mr Brown forgot that the Jet2 birds make money during the night aswell as the day!

Jet2 also have an extensive charter operation! Charter flights this week:

DUB-VRN-DUB
MAN-AYT-MAN
LGW-KGS-LGW
LGW-FUE-LGW
MAN-DLM-MAN
MAN-REU-MAN
STN-FAO-STN
MAN-MLA-MAN
STN-PMI-STN
STN-MAH-STN
STN-LDE-STN
LBA-VRN-LBA
STN-VAR-STN
STN-SKG-STN
EDI-VLC-LTN
STN-FAO-STN

Remeber Jet2 sell no seats on these flights at all, the charter operations grows during the winter. So actualy, Jet2's aircraft sit on the ground a lot less than you may think!

[757 Speedbrakes]

EGNM Charlie:

I belive you said you have a PPL and I assume you live near Leeds????

Perhaps you would like to become a commercial pilot one day??

I propose you have Mr Brown's job and Jet2 can gain one more enthusiastic employer and get rid of one who, well............. isn't! :ok:

I mean, I've been known to winge as much, if not more ;), than the rest about some stupid and non-sensicle decisions made by Jet2 but I'm affraid Mr Brown is entering the relms un-professionalism at a rather worring time for a lot of us aircraft drivers. Opinions justified or not, it's not nice to be hear your employer is going bust any moment, even if we know it to be malious b***ocks.

I should stop coming on this website after earlies.....rant over!!

[EGNMCharlie]

EGNM Charlie:

I belive you said you have a PPL and I assume you live near Leeds????

Perhaps you would like to become a commercial pilot one day??

I propose you have Mr Brown's job and Jet2 can gain one more enthusiastic employer and get rid of one who, well............. isn't! http://static.pprune.org/images/smilies/thumbs.gif

Spot on! Nothing I would like more to be taking a channex 757 down to PMI ... hopefully it may be reality soon (well maybe not as some tits keep harping on how Jet2 will be bust soon .... :rolleyes:)

Mr. Brown, you are clearly unhappy at Jet2 so why not go somewhere else instead of talking a load of rubbish about them! Its not like you are obliged to work for Jet2... so if you dont like it why not pi$$ off and stop portraying Jet2 in such a bad light!!

[Facelookbovvered]

Robo

I am no expert when it comes hedging (well i can just about trim a box hedge) a friend of mine is very much into it, not fuel but cover position for stock & shares, as i understand it you can't buy a future position for free, you pay a margin whether you call or not and it needs to be money comitted either provided by you or bank (See article in todays Sunday time re XL airways) the one big things most airlines have is positive cash flows which reduces the funding cost, much as a mortgage offset or one account, but you can't use forward funds to trade whilst insolvent.

Get the hedging wrong or not covered and the result are not nice as Gold Mouth MOL has found, get the currency wrong and it cab get very ugly, the problem with have in the UK at the minute is the pound has weakend against both the Euro & $ most LoCo have little exposure to the $ oil aside but a fare bit to the Euro, it does of course mean visiting the UK is much cheaper, if you can think of a good reason to come here that is and i can't think of one, unless your a duck

[harrogate]

Are people still harping on about Jet2 going bust?

I think you're all gonna be very surprised shortly.

[wawkrk]

So the specualtion begins.....
Assuming not going bust.
They announce huge number of surprise destinations.
They become part of Easeyjet
They become part of Ryanair.
They do all the flights for Thomo group or other.
They have new finance and order 30 new aircraft.
Some tie up with a front line operator.
Did I miss something Harrogate?

[harrogate]

My advice to everyone is to shut up with the inept speculation and wait a few weeks.

But they won't.

So carry on...

[wawkrk]

Thought this was a rumours network not a news channel.
There would'nt be many postings if facts only were published.

[EGNMCharlie]

My advice to everyone is to shut up with the inept speculation and wait a few weeks.

But they won't.

So carry on...

They are going to sponsor me all the way to fATPL? :}

[harrogate]

Informed speculation is one thing. Spotters going rabid about fantasy business models is another.

[wawkrk]

Harrogate,I am not a spotter nor a disgruntled rabid aviation worker like you.
Part of the fun on this site is speculation.

[harrogate]

I wasn't talking directly to you. Less of the self-obsession.

I'm not a disgruntled aviation worker either. On the contrary. I'm very happy and self-employed.

Thanks.

[EGNMCharlie]

My advice to everyone is to shut up with the inept speculation and wait a few weeks.

But they won't.

So carry on...

My bit of speculation is as follows ....

Dalaman to be announced from Leeds Bradford and Manchester, once weekly on a Monday.

[Mr.Brown]

I'm affraid Mr Brown is entering the relms un-professionalism at a rather worring time for a lot of us aircraft drivers. Opinions justified or not, it's not nice to be hear your employer is going bust any moment, even if we know it to be malious b***ocks.

For the record I've never said Jet2 are "going bust", I have only suggested that there are going to be very trying times ahead. ie eating into previuos years profits....
Mine is only one opinion, however I refuse to look at the future of Jet2 through rose coloured glasses. Times ahead are going to be difficult for most airlines, and I'm sure Jet2 are doing everything they can to maintain their position in the industry, but I won't bury my head in the sand. The industry as a whole is suffering and jet2 being a part of that will find it difficult.
Are they big enough to survive? Thats only a question everybody!
I for one, believe they might have to restructure if it continues ( which I have stated before) and it MIGHT mean some jobs going etc. I don't realy know what is going to happen, and not many of us can know but if someone wants to convince me otherwise, by all means do.

Mr. Brown, you are clearly unhappy at Jet2 so why not go somewhere else instead of talking a load of rubbish about them! Its not like you are obliged to work for Jet2... so if you dont like it why not pi$$ off and stop portraying Jet2 in such a bad light!!

I am happy at Jet2, just because I've said things that aren't all good and brill and fab about the company doesn't make me unhappy working there. Like I said I won't bury my head in the sand.
Anyway who's hiring in this climate?

[Jet22]

Do LS operate a Charter flight to Dalaman during the summer season. Just look at MAN arrivals it says LS2002 (2022 or something), Dalaman expected 00:00.

If So which A/C will be deployed on the route, 733 or 752.

[no sponsor]

757 - the 737 doesn't have big enough fuel tanks, and in any case I'd be bored out of my tiny mind if I had to fly that far in the cockpit of a 73.

[flybar]

Do LS operate a Charter flight to Dalaman during the summer season. Just look at MAN arrivals it says LS2002 (2022 or something), Dalaman expected 00:00.

Charter flight to Antalya LS2022 out and LS2023 return. Appears to be a one off. No charter flight to Antalya listed on Manchester website for a Wednesday during Summer period although there are flights listed to Dalaman?.

[bobleeds]

QUOTE]757 - the 737 doesn't have big enough fuel tanks, and in any case I'd be bored out of my tiny mind if I had to fly that far in the cockpit of a 73.
[/QUOTE]

Just what extras does the 757 cockpit offer over a 733 to help prevent pilot boredom?

[757 Speedbrakes]

..........a lot more room for cabin crew!! :ok: :hmm:

[EGBKFLYER]

By my reckoning, the 737 should be able to make Dalaman. LJ goes to Tenerife in the winter and that's further (according to Google Earth).

PS I think it's more fun when the cabin crew have to squeeze into the cockpit.

[leedsnorthern]

On sale now for next summer is Newcastle to Split - Croatia, once a week on Saturdays. Also on sale now is Leeds - Almeria, Tuesdays and Saturdays as this year. Also noticed the Leeds - Sardinia flight has been retimed so it can operate the Sardinia - Manchester route on a W rotation.

Does anyone know how well the Leeds to Madrid route is doing? Is it likely to return next summer as, along with Valencia, isn't on sale yet.

[EGNMCharlie]

Strange they accounce two different Croation routes, NCL-Split and LBA-Dubrovnik. What does Split have that Dubrovnik doesnt? Surely (if) they sell seats by Jet2Holidays it would make sense to use the same destination within Croatia ... or maybe there is more to come! :ok:

[aeulad]

Main page of Jet2.com advertising LBA/MAN-Dalaman available soon! Would assume this is a scheduled flight. Apologies if this has already been reported.

Regards

Mike

[Deaf Tortoise]

Yes I noticed the sudden share price rise too. It hasn't risen above the price I paid yet, but then I am planning on holding for the long-term.
There is quite a bit of froth on the financial message-boards hyping them at the moment.
I have been looking for any news of substance out there, but haven't found any yet.
At least it is better than the usual gloom and doom.

[qwertyuiop]

Sign of an imminent take over ??

[757 Speedbrakes]

Sign of an imminent take over ??


Oh God, here we go again!! :rolleyes:

At least I'm way back in profit :ok:

...................................for the minute.