How to use the scanner

[7of9]

I have bought a Scanner for listening in to aircraft.
It’s a Yupiteru MVT-7100 Multiband Receiver.

Idiots guide from anyone please Help???

What reception mode do I need to be in to receive aircraft please?
On receiver I have the choice: WFM ( Wide FM), FM (NarrowFM), AM, LSB, USB?

For example if I wanted to listen to Doncaster Tower on; 128.7750. Or Doncaster Approach on; 126.2250. How do I set my scanner to receive & listen to the guys talking?
By the way, I live 7 miles from the airport & about 5 miles from where they start their approach.
Any help will be grateful, PM me if you don’t want to share this over the forum please. Thanx in advance for your help.

Trev.
:ugh: :ugh: :ugh: :ugh:

[eyeofthebeholder]

Hi 7/9

I do not have a that particular scanner, but it is very easy to listen into aircraft and ATSU's (eg ATC).

All communications are on AM. Basically you need to select the frequency you are interested in and make sure AM is selected. You will find that comms back and forth between the ATSU and a/c are on the same frequency.

Some scanners are able to listen to more than one frequency at the same time, so you many be able to tune into both - but you will have to consult the manual.

As radio transmissions only work in straight lines and are distorted by buildings etc, you may not be able to receive the Tower from were you are - even though you are only 7 miles away - just a warning!

Hope this 'elps

Adam

[eyeofthebeholder]

Hi Guys,

I have just been on holiday :cool: and flew with Thomson in a Boeing 767.

As I have a radio scanner, I thought it would be a good idea to take in onboard and attempt to track the comms en-route to the destination airport.

Tuned into Gatwick Ground and identified our Flight number etc., I sat ready to go. The standard flight information safety video came on and I noticed one of the things you cannot use on board at anytime during the flight is a radio.

I am not a radio expert, but I thought a radio receiver received the signal, demodulated it and sent it to the speaker. I assume the demodulator causes some kind of field which can disrupt a/c systems which is protected on the cockpit radios? or it is something else?:confused:

Is this the same for all airlines?

Cheers

Ad.

[Gulf4uk]

HI

I Really dont believe what ive just Read from you on one email
you ask for info on how to use a scanner mode Etc then your
actually saying "YOU Took and used a SCANNER "on a flight
ok on the ground but how did you get it on board ? if you are
a spotter didnt you Realise or know THIS IS A NO NO ?

:mad: :=
TONY

[eyeofthebeholder]

Hi,

I think the previous post you are refering to was in reply to another user on the forum who was asking about how to use his scanner. I don't really regard myself as a spotter - although I have a great interest in potentially learning to fly - eg the reason why I purchased the scanner in the first place to get clued up on comms.

I haven't actually had the scanner for that long, and no - I didn't realise this was a big No, No onboard aircraft - otherwise I wouldn't have used it.

Anyway - as soon as I saw the information about it I put it away - and hence the reason why I have asked the question on the forum on why it is not allowed. It is for security reasons or it is actually to do with disruption to the a/c's systems??

I have seen other people within airport lounges using scanners with no issue and obviously they are used by the pilots. I'm sure if security saw it as a problem while going through the security they would have picked by up on it anyway - this is at a time of high security remember!

Anyone know on why its not actually allowed would be grateful.

Regards

Adam.

[apaddyinuk]

OMG....Surely you know that its not acceptable to use scanning and transmitting equipment on a plane??? Very risky and inconsiderate thing you did there I must say! I bet at the same stroke you turned off your mobile phone with you also switched on your scanner! :ugh:

[eyeofthebeholder]

apaddyinuk,

I now know it is not possible to use radios on aircraft, but my question is why?? :ugh:

Obviously mobile phones are not allowed as they are transmitters (as well as receivers). A scanner is only receiving equipment - eg tests for a carrier wave on each frequency it scanners, for example - although I knew the initial frequency I wanted anyway.

What is wrong with radio recieving equipment?? :confused: :confused:

Adam.

[eyeofthebeholder]

So....I take it from the lack of replies (apart from the non-quantifiable ranters), no-one actually knows why we shouldn't take radio RECEIVERS on board aircraft - even pilots themselves??? :ugh: :ugh:

Bizarre!

Ad.

[cessna l plate]

I must admit this does seem a reasonable question, as the scanner is only a receiving device, so can't really see any technical reason, although I do stand to be corrected.

That said, there are very obvious safety reasons. What if after take off your pilot declares an emergency for whatever reason. You will obviously be privvy to his talks with ATC and may react in a hysterical way, alerting other passengers who might also freak out, and before you know it the whole plane is in a panic. Whereas what would normally happen is a quick message from the pilot that there has been a problem and you are returning to X, followed by a normal landing and a normal disembark, or at worst a quick trip down a chute, that you learned about 3 mins before landing. Harldy enough time to get into a lather about it really.

I can understanf the desire to listen, and I could imagine that it could actually be quite interesting to a non pilot, but although there might be other more serious reasons, this one alone is good enough for me to say NO!

[eyeofthebeholder]

Good point. I had thought of this reason and it seems the only reasonable one to be honest (as I have just watched Horizon on BBC2 :) )

Although, on the flight I was on it stated 'radios' and gave a picture of an old '80s style radio, indicating that even normal music radio were banned - hence the reason why I asked if there were any electronic interference issues.

I suppose tho it is easier to ban all of them from a flight attendants point of view??

Thanks for the sensible reply! :ok:

Ad.

[Wodrick]

With a very few exceptions all Radio receivers are also, to a lesser extent, transmitters, the local oscillator, a fundamental part of a simple radio, will also radiate, to a greater or lesser extent depending on design, internal screening, and perhaps expence. I have seen quite expensive products that disgust the Radio Engineer in me ! Incidently this goes for anything with an oscillator in it, so computer clocks etc also qualify. That's why you don't use them.

[macroman]

Slightly off topic but I do recall flying from EGGW one day a few years back and a guy on the aircraft insisted on using his mobile phone while the aircraft was in flight. He must have been on it for ten minutes. I have to admit that my eyes were popping to put it mildly but nobody else paid any attention to him, cabin crew included.

[Astral_Flyer]

With a very few exceptions all Radio receivers are also, to a lesser extent, transmitters, the local oscillator, a fundamental part of a simple radio, will also radiate, to a greater or lesser extent depending on design, internal screening, and perhaps expence. I have seen quite expensive products that disgust the Radio Engineer in me ! Incidently this goes for anything with an oscillator in it, so computer clocks etc also qualify. That's why you don't use them.
That is all correct. Most scanners are not exactly the best designed bits of kit around. The main oscillator hasn't got much in the way of isolation to the aerial on the unit and it radiates through it. Usually about 10.7 MHZ or 21 Mhz away from the received signal, depending upon the design. Add to this yet another oscillator to convert the frequency down before demodulating.

The way that the oscillators produce the frequencies normally involve some sort of frequency synthesiser. That again involves another oscillator, usually in the form of a crystal oscillator.

So really a scanner can (and does) produce a heck of a lot of radio energy at all sorts of frequencies, some of which will be "in band" to a lot of the aircraft's equipment.

Hope that helps,

Astral (engineer & licenced Radio Amateur)

[skiddyiom]

Astral, good explainantion.

Isn't it something to do with harmonics? The reciever transmitting several harmonics to a receding degree. It's light years since I did any radio theory (radio's had valves then :8 ) so I may be totally wrong. But this would also explain why mobile phones aren't permitted, as the harmonics generated may coincide with the frequencies used by equipment on the aircraft.

skiddy

[Astral_Flyer]

Astral, good explainantion.
Isn't it something to do with harmonics? The reciever transmitting several harmonics to a receding degree. It's light years since I did any radio theory (radio's had valves then :8 ) so I may be totally wrong. But this would also explain why mobile phones aren't permitted, as the harmonics generated may coincide with the frequencies used by equipment on the aircraft.
skiddy
Thanks - I do try :)

My explaination was somewhat an over simplification of what I would normally write. Most scanners and VHF / UHF equipment convert the incoming signal down in frequency at least twice. Scanners normally are double conversion superhet units. The sad part is that the filters on the front end of scanners (that would attenuate any signals getting out of the scanner) is very wide and virtually useless at stopping things getting out.

The oscillators apart from having the main fundemental frequency offset by whatever the first IF frequency is. They also produce odd or even harmonics upwards from the main frequency. So if you were say listening on 120 Mhz and the first IF was 10.7 Mhz the first oscillator would be working at 109.3 or 130.7 Mhz. Plus of course harmonics at multiples of it.

The same applies for any system generating clocks for computers, mobile phones, games consules etc. Manufacturers producing equipment for the professional market take great care to ensure that the radiation from whatever they are making is within strict limits and are checked with great care that they do not radiate anything where it could cause problems.

The reason I mention the above. Is that anything fitted into an aircraft has to pass strict tests and a long procedure to be approved. Which explains to some extent the high costs and the slowness to bring in new technology into aviation. Personally I wouldn't have it any other way. It pays my mortgage! :)

Astral

[eyeofthebeholder]

Thanks for the replies - very useful - so it is also to do with the hardware within the radio itself!

A kind-of related question on radios:

I take it that you do not need to show a licence when buying a transceiver from a pilot shop or on the web? - I've never tried.
Have anyone heard of any ATC transmissions being intrupted by someone using a transciever on the ground near airports - either on purpose or through ignorance.

I know from reading the Trevor Thom's Radiotelephony book that ATC can move to an alternative frequency - but that obviously depends on informing the aircraft of that frequency. What would happen in this case? - worst case scenario using light signals

Ad.

[MyData]

As already pointed out - radio *receivers* are also transmitters which is how the tuning is done...

Think about it another way - the TV detector vans, how do they know you have a TV? They pick up the signal being transmitted by your receiver. Similarly in WWII it wasn't so hard for Nazi patrols to locate and uncover illegal radio receivers from resistance forces.


On this point, I have a watch with an analogue face. Hidden in the face is a solar panel - so I don't need batteries. Additionally the watch receives signals from the clock broadcasts in the UK and Europe. So, I'm wearing a permanently switched on - albeit low power - radio receiver. Would this not be allowed on board? I can't switch it off or remove the batteries as there aren't any (well, apart from the internal rechargable which isn't accessible). I'll probably wear another watch when flying...

[eyeofthebeholder]

MyData - Just like to say that I came across your website at the beginning of the year. Fantastic! Your diary is of the inspirations that has driven me along to start flying - unfortunately as with most people it is money issues that is stopping me!:bored:

I am reading the Trevor Thom books as we speak to get clued up before I possibly make the jump in next year :)!

Cheers

Ad.

[MyData]

Eye

Thanks for that. A nice comment. FYI I'm now learning to fly helicopters (great fun but quite a challenge) and also doing an IMC rating. Lots to keep me busy. Stick at it - do it as quickly or slowly as you can afford, it is worth it!

To keep the thread on track - I wasn't asked for any licence when buying kit previously. I was going to go for an iCom transceiver but went for just a receiver in the end. If I'm going to do more IMC flying I might rethink that and get one of the VOR equiped iComs for backup... for personal flying that is, not on commercial flights :hmm:

[Skipness One Echo]

How is it possible to get all the complex electronic equipment to work in say Air Force One or a Nimrod yet a Nokia is danger of making the wings fall off?:)

Always seems to me like using a mobile in a petrol station, no compelling evidence it's dangerous by in the UK we BAN things these days.
For the record I tried my scanner on a BA flight from Glasgow to Gatwick ages ago and the reception wasn't too great and I gave up afetr 5 minutes or so.

Bottom line, any "UNUSUAL" behaviour on a flight these days gives people the willies so please don't.

[Kirk Biddlecombe]

My ICOM R5 came through today. Can anyone help me with what the Squelch actually does. The options are OPEN, AUTO, and 1-9.
All I've understood from the manual is that one end of the 'scale' results in a tighter output; could anyone clarify this somewhat?

Thanks,

Kirk

[allyn]

My ICOM R5 came through today. Can anyone help me with what the Squelch actually does. The options are OPEN, AUTO, and 1-9.
All I've understood from the manual is that one end of the 'scale' results in a tighter output; could anyone clarify this somewhat?

Thanks,

Kirk

The squelch control suppresses the static that you would otherwise hear on an unused channel. The squelch should be adjusted to the point that the static just disappears. At this point, any transmissions that occur will break the squelch and allow you to hear them.

You can think of it as a fancy automatic volume control...

[Dan Winterland]

And if you turn it up all the way, you may not hear anything. If you haven't heard any transmissions for a while - check the squelch.

[Kirk Biddlecombe]

I see. Doesn't quite make complete sense yet, but it probably will when I test it out again bearing what has been said here in mind.

Thanks

[HEATHROW DIRECTOR]

<<Doesn't quite make complete sense yet>>

Well it's not Rocket Science Kirk.. and surely you switched the thing on the instant you got it?

As has been explained, the squelch (or "muting" as it's sometimes known) reduces the hissing noise you hear when the squelch is wide open. As you close it down the noise will suddenly disappear but signals will "break" the squelch and you'll hear them. To hear very weak signals you sometimes need to open the squelch, ie so the receiver is making a hissing noise. On the other hand, if you turn the knob all the way in the opposite direction so the squelch is closed you may not hear anything except extremely strong signals.

[the dean]

kirk...

now you have the explanation from allyn and heathrow director...and so...when you turn on the radio...turn up the volume...then the squelch till it make that horrible hissing noise..then turn it down a little to where it becomes silent and bobs your uncle....

now you can turn up the volume further if you wish..

sort this out before you start transmitting and causing havoc on he airwaves. it only takes a minute.

you should do this every time you fly especially if someone other than you uses the aircraft.especially in training or club aircraft . i never cease to be amazed at the settings i find radios in...makes me wonder how people can fly and concentrate while listening to such a racket..:eek: .

as heathrow says ...its not rocket science. but if you're still in doubt ask an instructor to show you...:ok:

[HEATHROW DIRECTOR]

Not too sure what the dean is getting at. The ICOM R5 is a simple scanning receiver and not a transceiver. On a transceiver, having the squelch open should cause no problems other than noise in the pilot's ears! When he transmits the receiver will be automatically muted anyway so no "havoc" should be caused. However, it's certainly good practice to be thoroughly familiar with radio gear before you start using it.

[Kirk Biddlecombe]

Thanks HD and TD.
Am getting the hang of it now, cheers.

Kirk

[dave4444]

Hi everyone
New to plane spotting
58 years old
Near new doncaster airport that is the reason i got a scanner
Would be glad of information regarding abbreviations of frequencies and airports

[brantontyke]

Hi,
The main frequencies you need are the following :
460.150 Ops
128.775 Tower
126.225 Approach

These frequencies apply to DSA
For a more comprehensive guide, you would probably be best buying a comprehensive guide to Aircraft Frequencies, this can be bought at Maplins, or alternatively a trip to the Aviation shops at East Mids, Manchester or LBA would give you the info you require.In addition to the above frequencies you might like to add the various routing frequencies such as London Control, Manchester,Shanwick Oceanic,LBA. Also add this one :130.600 which is the Servisair frequency commomly used at all Airports.
Hope this helps !!!

[narom]

Hi Dave 4444

I've been listening for 5 years or so - I bought 2 books by Graham Duke, "Air Traffic Control" & "Air Band Radio Guide" the second one is far and away the most informative, with pages of Airport Decodes and frequency listings. Hope this helps!

[Blues&twos]

I was given a scanner for Christmas - I found this webpage listing lots of UK frequencies.
http://www.javiation.co.uk/vu.html
However, I've just noticed this was from 1997.....is this list still likely to be accurate, or do these frequencies change ... errm...frequently?

Also, what sort of range do the ground based transmissions have (e.g. tower)? Can only hear very weak tx from LHR. Mind you, I am in a known signal blackspot (need a booster for TV and can't get local radio unless I stand on the roof) and I am a good few miles from Heathrow.

Happy new year!

[Callsign Kilo]

I'm off on my holidays tomorrow and I am bringing my receiver. Can anyone tell me the VHF frequencies for Tenerife Sur Reina Sofia?

Many thanks

[Ontariotech]

Did a search, and found nothing on this topic.

Now, we have all seen Die Hard 2, the one with John McClean, the cop, taking on 50 bad speacial Forces Guys, who hijack Dulles airport.

Now, the dumb ass reporter, on board an airliner, low on gas, circling overhead, has a friend, who has a scanner in his carry on. He apparently is able to pick up the beep beep beep, and eventually communications fro the ATC folks.

My question is, can a scanner pick up anything from the aircraft your in, Tx or Rx?

If it could receive, would it be allowed as a carry on item in todays security mad world?

No, I am not traveling anytime soon, and no, I don't own a scanner. Used too, but it broke. I just watched the movie, and my wife asked me if they could do that.

Cheers:ok:

[HEATHROW DIRECTOR]

In principle a scanner should receive both the aircraft and ground transmissions on an aeroplane, although you'd have to have the antenna very close to a window. I have communicated by amateur radio with flight crews on several ocasions when they have been using handheld gear on the flight deck - on one occasion as I was driving to work along the M4 and the aircraft was above me approaching Heathrow!

Whether it would be a good idea to use a scanner on an aeroplane would be open to debate and you would need professional advice. The vast majority of such gear is very cheaply produced and may well produce undesirable RF intereference.

[Ontariotech]

Did a search, and found nothing on this topic.

Also posted in Spectators forum, with little response........



Now, we have all seen Die Hard 2, the one with John McClean, the cop, taking on 50 bad speacial Forces Guys, who hijack Dulles airport.

Now, the dumb ass reporter, on board an airliner, low on gas, circling overhead, has a friend, who has a scanner in his carry on. He apparently is able to pick up the beep beep beep, and eventually communications fro the ATC folks.

My question is, can a scanner pick up anything from the aircraft your in, Tx or Rx?

If it could receive, would it be allowed as a carry on item in todays security mad world?

No, I am not traveling anytime soon, and no, I don't own a scanner. Used too, but it broke. I just watched the movie, and my wife asked me if they could do that.

Cheers:ok:

[Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh!]

I haven't seen it

[R4+Z]

I suppose it depends on the frequency range of the scanner. But I can see no reason why it would not be feasible (sp?).

[sir.pratt]

the biggest issue would be your scanner position in relation to the vhf aerial on the aircraft - if you are immediately under or over the aerial you may be skipped out. you should certainly pick up atc, however if it is HF you won't, and if you are 50 NM out, surrounded by aluminium and wires, and high, the signal to your scanner may not be be very strong.....

[matt_hooks]

I would think the airframe would work rather well as a Faraday cage, effectively blocking most radio transmissions from getting through, so I would imagine you would struggle to actually get any RF through it. This is why antenna are mounted on the exterior.

Not sure on the transmission pattern of the antenna used for ATC but I would think they are capable of being recieved directly above the station, wouldn't make much sense if RT to the ATC cut out directly above the airfield!

As for taking a scanner on in hand baggage, I thought all electrical/electronic goods had to be placed in hold baggage? Or has that rule been relaxed?

[HEATHROW DIRECTOR]

I refer to my early posting, which proves that radio waves can escape from and enter an aeroplane! A captain friend of mine who is also a radio amateur often used a small handheld transceiver to speak to amateurs in countries he was flying over.

As for the "cone of silence" - at close range it would not prevent reception.

[rhodesa]

Hi all, just found the website and its exactly what I`ve been looking for. Always loved planes and dreamed of becoming a pilot but hampered by parents who told me dreams never come true.

Have just got the above scanner and have tuned it into East Midlands and Birmingham. Trying to set up the auto scan function where it scans though my saved frequencies. Somehow i had it scanning through 1 every second which was brilliant, but now it only switches every 5 second which is too slow. Have gone though the instructions but it says nothing about it. Anyone got any idea, just got my scanner and I`m desparate to listen in to the action but am struggling at the moment.

Welcome rhodesa. However, as with all new clubs you join, please read the club rules first. They are in big red letters at the top of the forum.

[gingernut]

Have you turned the "DELAY" function on inadvertantly?

[sholva]

Hello All,

Been trying to listen to the ATC at the local airport but am havin trouble with gettin good reception and am gettin a lot of interference. Any ideas on what I can do to get a better signal and to reduce the interference.
Thanks in Advance!!

Sholva

[FlyerFoto]

I hope that, if it IS a tranceiver and not an air-band scanner, you aren't tempted to use the transmit button - a definite no-no!!!

Best speaking to someone like Air Supply (you can find them easily enough on a search) - they should be able to advise you - are you using it mobile, or as a home base station?

[Routair]

Hello all,

Is there an on-line scanner freq list that is up to date that anyone can give me the link for at all please?

I know you can buy scanner freq books.

Sorry if this has already been posted before e.t.c..

Many thanks :ok:

[ADTRANGER]

EEEving All,

Can someone supply tower and radar freqs at Murcia,
Flying Jet2 this weekend

Ta

[west lakes]

Try

http://www.worldaerodata.com/

just enter airport name

[jkeely]

hi!
i hope my question is in the right forum! i've just bought a uniden bc72xlt scanner and wanted some advice. i bought it to listen to air freqs just as an interest really. strange but i can't get any of these on it
approach 119.65
tower 124.00
ground 121.90
these are all for east midlands airport (i'm in leicester at the moment). but strangely i can get 134.425 which is London ATCC.
why is this? something to do with the supplied aerial, do i need an outdoor one?
thanks.

[Simtech]

East Midlands Approach frequency changed to 134.175 MHz some years ago!

[jkeely]

bingo, got it, thanks! i was following this http://www.radios-uk.com/airfrequencies.htm

but can still only hear the aircraft, not approach control. must be lousy aerial!

[Quarto]

To answer the question at the beginning of the thread re the use of receivers onboard aircraft, the CAA published a document about devices emitting RF signals. It can be found here (http://www.caa.co.uk/application.aspx?catid=33&pagetype=65&appid=11&mode=detail&id=2062).
I don’t own a scanner at present but am thinking about buying one. Does anyone know if the more expensive ones are better is it just the same electronics but in a different box?
Should I shell out for a more expensive one or just buy the basic variety?
Cheerio,
Quarto

[Gulf4uk]

HI

Depends on what and where you want to use it . At your local Airfield
a basic scanner VHF is ok covers the full VHF airband but if your into
mil then one with UHF Mil is for you . Some real nice second hand ones
can be found on the Auction sites. Small ones you can fit in an inside
pocket with headphones are what i use less obvious you have one
Home base scanners cover all sorts of freqs and modes again
depends on what your interest is but with a base scanner dont
neglect to buy a decent Antenna and co-ax loads of places
on www to browse : if your into MODE S receivers and software
is readily available but very Costly .



Tony
farnborough

[darrylj]

is it possible to take an airband scanner airside to listen in on aircraft etc?.
something to listen to whilst awaiting inbounds etc.
wonder if BAA would let it through :=.
something like an ICOM IC-R5!.
i know a blind eye is turned landside, but airside.....:uhoh:

just a thought.

thank you.

:\

[Hostie from Hell]

I am taking my daughter to DUB airport tomorrow to watch a very important and special plane land.

Have dug the old radio out but have no idea what the frequency's are that I should be tuning in to.

Can any of you help, please?!!

[jethro15]

Check your PM's

[Famouswhendead]

G'day one & all.

Visited my local friendly Maplin store today, and the very unhelpful & quite rude assistant could not help me with my question. So, I do hope one of you will have more knowledge to assist please.

I have a maycom AR108, but want to add a new telescopic aerial. I live about 2 miles from my local international airport and can pick up some transmissions on a clear day, but would like it much clearer if possible on any given day, without going down the huge rooftop aerials route! The terrain is very flat between us! Would xxxx suffice?? Can you recommend any others to me please?

Many thanks if you are able to give me a shove in the right direction.

FWD.

Duly shoved

[Ken Borough]

Does anyone know where there's a list of Air/Ground/Air Company frequencies used by airlines at Sydney (YSSY/SYD)?

Any help will be appreciated. Thanks in advance. :ok:

[jaycee58]

I regularly travel to various African or Indian destinations from LHR with a Yaesu handheld transceiver in my hand baggage. I mainly use it abroad for listening to the BBC world service but as I hold an amateur radio licence I can use it to transmit on the 50, 144 and 432 MHz bands. It receives everything from 504 Khz to 999 MHz and with a simple software mod will transmit on airband, marine band etc. Security at LHR, or abroad, has never shown the slightest bit of interest in it. Toothpaste or my cigarette lighter is of far greater concern to them!

When on an aeroplane, I remove the battery pack so there's no chance of it being switched on accidentally.

[dfc jr]

thanks for the information