Buying in America, practical aspects

[VOD80]

Hello, my first post here. So, Merry Christmas everyone and here's to a jolly festive season.

Things are quite cheap in America at the moment and it seems to me to be a good time to become an aircraft owner again (of course, my wife would disagree...)

I've done a search in the archives but haven't seen these practical aspects discussed yet so could I please ask the knowledge for some guidance!

What happens when you buy an aircraft in America? I guess that there is duty and VAT to pay but how is this calculated? Is there a big HMRC book with the values? Or is it invoice value? Is it worth getting "xtras" fitted before or after?

I hope these questions are clear! I have about a thousand questions but we'll see how the discussion goes!

Thanks in advance,

VOD

[SkyHawk-N]

Hi VOD,

To start with a couple of questions for you. Do you plan to keep the aircraft on the FAA register? Is it to be used in the UK or France?

[scooter boy]

Dear VOD80,
Buying direct from the USA is the only logical way to purchase a new aircraft at present.
The weak dollar makes it far better value for you than lining the pocket of a european dealer.

You would generally be better keeping it on the N-register.

You will have to pay import VAT for it to be in free circulation within the EU. There are 2 ways you can make this less painful - 1, pay the Danish lawyers who will process an EU VAT paid certificate for a fraction of what the VAT cost would be. 2, register the aircraft through a (VAT registered) US based trust and rent it to yourself - this means you would be able to claim VAT off fuel, maintenenace, landing fees, but would need to pay VAT on the hourly rental rate you charge to yourself.

Crazy world, eh?

Best of luck with your plans.

PM me if you would like further info,
SB

[Flyin'Dutch']

Unless you are buying something exotic or expensive you could do worse than sourcing something in the UK or EU.

Prices are very soft at the moment and a quick hop locally in the UK or Continent is a lot cheaper than a ferry across the big pond.

[VOD80]

Hi VOD,

To start with a couple of questions for you. Do you plan to keep the aircraft on the FAA register? Is it to be used in the UK or France?

I had thought on the UK register. And it would be kept in France mainly (for the moment at least...)

[Flyin'Dutch']

What sort of aeroplane are you thinking of getting?

Transferring an aeroplane onto the G from an N will cost wonga; if there are no non-EASA approved mods to take off and everything else is straightforward allow somewhere between 5-10k; more if things need taking off/adding (remember an EASA transfer will require an engine of less than 12 years old)

Add to that the cost of ferrying or containering the aeroplane; depending on what type/size; at least between 5-10k.

Add to that the VAT or the cost for the non VAT route.

Do realise that keeping an aeroplane in France on the G-register is possible and that the maintenance might be able to be done in France, however if you have to bring the machine back to the UK for the maintenance that is an additional hassle as it will have to happen at timed intervals which may well not coincide with the rest of your time-table/weather etc.

Also requires extra flights for you to drop off/collect.

Add to the hassle of not being able to oversee the transfer/maintenance especially when you do the initial transfer.

I think that if you want to source something in the States that is not or difficult to get over in Europe and you want to keep it on the FAA reg then there is probably some mileage in going the direct route of buying in the States and getting the thing over here.

As soon as transferring onto an EASA reg comes into it you have to add up all the issues involved and be honest with yourself if they all weigh up against the hassle and cost involved.

[VOD80]

Unless you are buying something exotic or expensive you could do worse than sourcing something in the UK or EU.

Prices are very soft at the moment and a quick hop locally in the UK or Continent is a lot cheaper than a ferry across the big pond.


Thanks for that. All good and relevant advice and I'll consider it. It is true that I'm not interested in the exotic... Too many "other" issues with that kind of thing. I just want something popular and well supported.

So, what strikes my fancy is a C172 of mid 1970's vintage. The reason for looking to America was for the choice as well as the "interesting" prices (although I understand that there are all sorts of hidden costs, which is what I'm finding out here! An additional 10-20k GBP changes things!). And, although prices may be soft in Europe for the moment, they are still quite a lot higher than the USA - there is only one C172 that I have seen for sale and that is about 35k GBP - which gets an awful lot of aeroplane across the big pond!

But the question remains - how id VAT calculated? Book value? Sale receipt value? "Fair" value?

[PCentR]

It is a buyer's market in the US now.
Try this link for info on keeping it N- registered.
http://eaac.us/

[Flyin'Dutch']

4 pages of 172s for sale here (http://www.avbuyer.com/AircraftSales/AircraftResults.asp?ListId=4&AircraftManufacturerId=157&subList=657&NumberPerPage=10)

After a quick google on aeroplanes for sale, a whole page of links for further 'For Sale' sites (http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=aircraft+for+sale&meta=)

Good hunting!

:)

[IO540]

pcentr

That's a very interesting URL you posted. Most useful.

However I disagree with his statement

the holder of a full-fledged European JAR certificate must stay within the European borders

[when flying an N-reg within Europe] because IMV each JAA country issues in effect its own license.

If he got this from the FAA, that would be something else though.