View Full Version : Second hard disk failure implications
JamesT73J
21st Dec 2006, 08:42
Hi All,
I've got a 150Gb SATA drive as additional storage on my machine, with a half-dozen applications installed on it. It's started to fail in the last couple of weeks (seizes with a familiar 'clunk..tick' periodically. Had another Maxtor HD do this last year, but it has since behaved itself). The problem I've got is the installed programmes on it. Windows has them registered to that drive. Of course, if they're not there (I.e. drive cannot be accessed) it cannot uninstall them.
Am I limited to hand-editing the registry to get rid of them?
I've run chkdisk. On the one occasion it actually managed to complete a cycle it did identify a corrupted cluster, but the problem appears mechanical, and I fear I will have to replace the disk. Not in itself a problem, but I want to reinstall said software.
James
I'm not sure, but ccleaner might help? http://www.ccleaner.com/download/
JamesT73J
21st Dec 2006, 09:40
BOAC,
Thank you - I shall try this when I get home. This sounds like it should do the trick!
James
Since it's not your "primary" boot disk, I would think that if you bought a replacement and copied everything across, and then assigned the new one the same drive letter, then all should still work OK.
That might in the end prove easier than trying to persuade a sickly drive to limp on.
JamesT73J
21st Dec 2006, 10:12
Why not just uninstall the programs and applications from the HD before it fails and reinstall them to the new HDD which I presume you'll be buying to replace the one thats about to fail?
I mean don't wait for it to fail and then find you were right all along about what would happen.....
This is my first avenue - last night I didn't have alot of luck; there's about 40GB of application data on there and it simply didn't work for long enough to try - tonight may be different though; it's that kind of problem!
As I had a similar problem this time last year I'm wondering if the drive make isn't handling the heat cycle of the room very well - cold room during the day when I'm out, heating on in the evening, ambient temp + about 10 degrees (inside the case) when the PC's on and working...perhaps I should just leave it on.
The OS is on a 20GB five-year old western digital HD that has never skipped a beat...
James
Aplogies for thread 'drift' but are we seeing a lot more HD failures these days? Has quality been sacrificed for quantity/price?
JamesT73J
21st Dec 2006, 11:57
I don't know if it's a trend, but it's quite possible. When my 120gb drive failed after 13mths (just outside of warranty - wouldn't you know it!) last year, I was quite miffed and did a bit of reading. I couldn't find anything that suggested the brand (Maxtor) were any less reliable than their competitors.
The newest drive has been installed for less than 3 months and is failing in precisely the same manner. Bloody annoying, but I suspected I've just been unlucky.
The other thing to consider is that both drives were not expensive - around fifty quid, so I do wonder if I simply got what I paid for.
When I have the time I'm just going to buy two and get them going in RAID '1'. At least then if they fail occasionally I don't have the hassles that I do now!
James
Mac the Knife
21st Dec 2006, 12:25
"Since it's not your "primary" boot disk, I would think that if you bought a replacement and copied everything across, and then assigned the new one the same drive letter, then all should still work OK."
Keef is right.
Do you not have SMART* turned on in the BIOS of your PC? If your disk is failing SMART will notify you on bootup long before you notice any symptoms.
HDTune - http://www.hdtune.com/ - is one of several free utilities that will tell the SMART status of your disk and various other parameters.
Mac
*http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-Monitoring,_Analysis,_and_Reporting_Technology
BDiONU
21st Dec 2006, 13:55
I don't know if it's a trend, but it's quite possible. When my 120gb drive failed after 13mths (just outside of warranty - wouldn't you know it!) last year, I was quite miffed and did a bit of reading. I couldn't find anything that suggested the brand (Maxtor) were any less reliable than their competitors.
Stepson had a Maxtor external which failed recently. Took it back to Novatech who're going to send it back to the manufacturers (inside guarantee). The chap there said he might be lucky as Maxtor were often replacing failed units with larger ones, up to 500Gb although it took up to a month. Bit worrying I thought.
BD
I have 'been through' a few Maxtor IDE drives in the last 2-3 years, with 2 failures inside 1 year from purchase. NB I think Maxtor warranty is 3 years although most purchase points will only offer 1 year in my experience.
Spitoon
21st Dec 2006, 18:39
The problem I've got is the installed programmes on it. Windows has them registered to that drive. Of course, if they're not there (I.e. drive cannot be accessed) it cannot uninstall them.
Am I limited to hand-editing the registry to get rid of them?I think some versions of TweakUI (not the one I have here unfortunately) or one of the other PowerToys lets you manually remove entries from the list of installed applications.
PPRuNe Pop
24th Dec 2006, 07:03
In the last 3 years I have had three HDD failures. Two Maxtor and a Hitachi.
Backing up seems to be more vital these days than ever before and I do it frequently.
Mac, I have never bothered to switch SMART on so I am going to take your advice on that. For sure, a HDD failure is a trauma we can do without so whatever there is out there that gives a warning I am all for it.
matelot
24th Dec 2006, 08:04
I'm not sure what the OP is getting at. If a back-up drive is failing, and it has installed programs on it, what's the point of wanting to uninstall those programs? Recover created files, yes. But uninstall the progs? Are you saying you haven't got those program install disks and somehow need to mirror the disk to the new one?
If you do install a new disk exactly as the old 150Gb, the same drive letter should be assigned, the same shortcuts should work, and the registry shouldn't care a hoot. :ok:
If you're NOT wanting those progs again, then, yes, some sort of registry cleaner, or if you're feeling brave (where's Keef?) do it by hand. :)
Oceanz
25th Dec 2006, 13:12
Are you sure that it is the hard disk failing on its own and not a faulty disk controller causing the hard disks to eventually fail? I have a vague memory about the early SATA controllers causing these sorts of faults.
I haven't used Maxtor for several years, but the Western Digital & Seagate drives I am using have proven super-reliable (touch wood), including the main external Firewire drives which are being used for professional audio/video - they get extended poundings most days.
Bo Nalls
26th Dec 2006, 16:08
Have you tried re-seating the power/data cables into the MB & drive? I had a similar problem about 2 months ago in that one of the secondary drives would make a 'clunk..tick' occasionally, as though powering down. Note that 'clunking' in hard drives is usually is the sound of the heads parking suddenly. The drive would be removed from the list of available drives in windows and would not be recognised on re-boot.
Removing the PC cover & re-seating the cables has stopped this occuring. It is possible for connectors to work loose due only to thermal expansion/contraction as the PC is powered up/down.
JamesT73J
30th Dec 2006, 20:10
Have you tried re-seating the power/data cables into the MB & drive? I had a similar problem about 2 months ago in that one of the secondary drives would make a 'clunk..tick' occasionally, as though powering down. Note that 'clunking' in hard drives is usually is the sound of the heads parking suddenly. The drive would be removed from the list of available drives in windows and would not be recognised on re-boot.
Removing the PC cover & re-seating the cables has stopped this occuring. It is possible for connectors to work loose due only to thermal expansion/contraction as the PC is powered up/down.
After uninstalling and backing everything else up, I tried this out of curiousity. It seems to be working at the moment - I reformatted and chkdsk'd the drive successfully without any hitches. The SATA cables that I'm using came with the motherboard. They've got quite a sturdy termination/connector piece, but perhaps they are the problem?
I'm going to buy another cable and run some burn-in tests with Maxtor's diagnostic software to see if that bears fruit. It never occured to me that this could be an issue - PATA ribbon cables coming unseated are usually straightforward to suss out - I never thought these nifty serial connectors could suffer the same problem, but this is my first experience with SATA stuff, and I must admit I didn't think of it.
Thanks for everyone's input - I'll post the result in the new year.
James
JamesT73J
7th Nov 2007, 08:55
Sorry for the rather late post script, but I sorted this out, and it turns out it was totally unrelated to the HDD, and also a little school-boyish on my part.
The SATA drive's 12V power cable was shared with a chassis fan. I can't believe I didn't spot this...Either:
A) The fan was overloading the 12V rail (it was getting on a bit)
B) The 12V rail from the PSU was inadequate for both devices.
The clunking I could hear was the heads parking in the drive, probably a reset condition occuring when the voltage dropped below a prescribed amount.
It's been fine ever since I disconnected the fan. An interesting solution I thought I'd share should anyone else have a similar config. I was all set to take the drive back.
James
Avtrician
7th Nov 2007, 10:35
A good solution, and a problem/fix to keep in the back of the head.
With reference the installed progs, these are not a real concerne, as a reinstall can be done placing them else where. the main thing to recover/protect is the data connected with these programs. A trick that sometimes works with clicking drives, is to place it in the freezer for a while. This sometimes allows the drive to work long enough to recover the data.
Parapunter
7th Nov 2007, 10:50
It never xeases to amaze me that those of us who build & fiddle with PC's & think we know what we're doing, come up with new solutions to problems all the time. Nice one James, good find:ok: