Epilepsy

[paul 2007]

I know that epilepsy is normally a medical condition that automatically prevents you from getting or holding a license.

Obviously there are different levels and types of epilepsy.

I have read some of the information on the web pages of some [US] aviation medicine companies, who specifically deal with all sorts of medical conditions, and on your behalf - approach the FAA and lodge the necessary documents / medical opinions / etc. They claim to have a very high success rate.

They claim to have success with some epilepsy cases as well - with a number of licenses re-instated.

Does anyone have epilepsy, and still fly ?
Anyone dealt with these companies (with success) ?
Are the sort of services available in Australia ?

The reason I ask is that my son has been flying for some time - but now does not. He had a couple of what was described as an epileptic type spasm a while back, with no re-occurrence.
He has minimal medication, in fact the doctor indicated that if he took any less, it would no longer have any medical value.
He has recently had all the tests where they try to induce an epileptic occurrence with no 'event' happening.

I look forward to ANY feedback or info - thank you.

Not many places to go and get information on this as it relates to aviation.

:cool:

[cabbagecrate]

You say your son had a couple of epileptic type spasms. Has it been clinicaly confirmed that he has epilepsy, because, and forgive me if you are already aware of this, it is possible that these were non epileptic seizures. If he is on anti-convulsants, then he has been diagnosed as having epilepsy.

[paul 2007]

Hi Cabbagecrate

Yes he is on Tegrotol. As the dose is very small, his doctor said that he could go off them and 'see what happens'. Catch is that no one knows what will happen. I guess the doctor just wants to play it safe.

He had all the tests done, and they tried to induce a fit with flashing lights etc but with no effect. My son had been working on an electric motor (which he thought was switched off) and got zapped with 240v. Was thrown across to other side of small shed he was in. Next day - he had a 'turn'.

I don't know if the electric shock was the trigger - or was it mere co-incidence.

I am curious as to what 'epileptic' categories were assessed as acceptable for license to be re-instated.

[cabbagecrate]

Hello Paul 2007.

I have a link that might be of use to you. It takes you to the UK Civil Aviation Authority's site, and in particular to the subject of Epilepsy, and the restrictions that are applied, in relation to the National Private Pilots Licence.
www.caa.co.uk/docs/49/SRG_Med-NPPL_epilepsy.pdf (http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/49/SRG_Med-NPPL_epilepsy.pdf)

Hope this is helpfull.:ok:

[beamer]

One problem seems to be that if a person has a fit of some kind, they seem to be automatically deemed to be epileptic pending further investigation. Even if scans show nothing untoward the same seems to be the case - 'we don't know the cause so we'll call it epilepsy and hope for the best. Take a couple of tablets a day, no driving for a year to prove we are controlling the matter and as for flying, forget it'.

A member of my family had a fit when he was about 17 - at the time he was down with flu and stressed about forthcoming examinations. About a year later he had another and hurt his back in the process (fell out of bed !). Scans showed nothing untoward but he was put on a very low level of medication and touch wood..............! Once on the medication its difficult to come off it because one does not know whether its doing any good or not - if you take the risk and another fit does occur its back to square one.

I guess life goes on - there are a great many people who suffer from this problem - I could quote an English Cricket Captain and a British Lions Prop Forward for a start - unfortunately some occupations will always preclude sufferers and flying falls into that category.

Good Luck

[paul 2007]

One problem seems to be that if a person has a fit of some kind, they seem to be automatically deemed to be epileptic pending further investigation. Even if scans show nothing untoward the same seems to be the case - 'we don't know the cause so we'll call it epilepsy and hope for the best. Take a couple of tablets a day, no driving for a year to prove we are controlling the matter and as for flying, forget it'.That's what I thought - wondered if there is anyway of proving that it was /was not epileptic, after all the doctors could not induce an epileptic episode in tests when trying to diagnose the problem.
For that matter, does anyone know if an electric shock can trigger a fit ?

One of the aviation medical companies I spoke about in my opening post claims the following:

Nuerology
Condition / Pathology ...................................................1st ...2nd... 3rd
TIA / Stroke ............................................................ ..........195 .. 250 ..747
MS ? Chronic Brain Syndrome, Degen. Nerve Disease ............. 32 ... 34 .... 81
Parkinson's Disease ............................................................ ..16 ....20 .....65
Seizures ............................................................ ..................46 ....50 ...159
Narcolepsy ............................................................ .................2 .....3 .....14
Migraine ............................................................ .................488 ..821 .2424



being number of cases successfully handled with the FAA, in each medical class.
Does anyone know of anyone that has had epilepsy and been able to continue to fly ?

Thanks

[capt.]

hi

yes,

i dont agree with people flying with epilepsy, or who have had fits in the past. i was discussing this the other day with my friend, who said if a person does have a fit, it would only be a hole in a field, but what happens if you crash into a town full of people?

[whitelabel]

Untill last year EEG was an important test subject in a medical examination. They scrapped it from the programm because it was not that re

[StillStanding]

About 2/3rds of the way through my PPL I suffered a couple of instances of aura, the first time with loss of consciousness for about one second. Thankfully the episodes were minor. However, I owned up, took a year off driving, had all the tests such as strobed EEG, MRI etc. Nothing was found. By the time I had been through all of the tests 6 months had passed without problems, but the docs still wanted me to take an anti-epileptic drug (Valproate) before they would sign me off for driving again. I have had not the merest hint of a problem since.

The 'diagnosis' was that the symptoms that I had described and the tests I had were indicative, but not diagnostic of a partial seisure of the temporal lobe. BTW, I found a definition of epilepsy to be "more than one unexplained loss of awareness"!

Thanks to great encouragement from my flying school I continued my training and successfully got an NPPL with the obvious endorsement that I can't take passengers. The club allowed me to rent after I got my licence, and I now have my own aircraft.

I would recommend taking a look at the JAA Manual of Civil Aviation medicine, not only for the rules (basically you will not get a JAA medical) but also for one of the best descriptions of epilepsy and the recurrent risks. If you have looked at this before, it has recently been updated.

http://www.jaa.nl/licensing/manual_civil_aviation_2006.html

Epilepsy is in Chapter 12, section 12.

I hope not to end up in a hole in the ground. As far as safety is concerned I often wonder how many lorry drivers admit to problems knowing they will lose their HGV licences for 10 years?


That's what I thought - wondered if there is anyway of proving that it was /was not epileptic, after all the doctors could not induce an epileptic episode in tests when trying to diagnose the problem.
For that matter, does anyone know if an electric shock can trigger a fit ?
One of the aviation medical companies I spoke about in my opening post claims the following:
Nuerology
Condition / Pathology ...................................................1st ...2nd... 3rd
TIA / Stroke ............................................................ ..........195 .. 250 ..747
MS ? Chronic Brain Syndrome, Degen. Nerve Disease ............. 32 ... 34 .... 81
Parkinson's Disease ............................................................ ..16 ....20 .....65
Seizures ............................................................ ..................46 ....50 ...159
Narcolepsy ............................................................ .................2 .....3 .....14
Migraine ............................................................ .................488 ..821 .2424


being number of cases successfully handled with the FAA, in each medical class.
Does anyone know of anyone that has had epilepsy and been able to continue to fly ?

Thanks

[paul 2007]

Hi Stillstanding
Thanks for the info

Thanks to great encouragement from my flying school I continued my training and successfully got an NPPL with the obvious endorsement that I can't take passengers. The club allowed me to rent after I got my licence, and I now have my own aircraft.Did you need to finish your training with a safety pilot, what about SOLO NavEx etc. ?

Currently digesting the contents of JAA Medical manual you referred me to for further background.

[StillStanding]

Hi Paul,

I waited until I got my drivers licence back and could drive again, which enabled me to fly solo as well as with an instructor. When you fly solo prior to a licence then all solo flights have to be approved and under the supervision of an instructor whatever your medical condition.

During my 'time off' without a drivers licence I flew at least an hour a month with my instructor to retain the level I had reached before this problem (just prior to qualifying cross country).

I did initially ask the CAA if I could continue training with a safety pilot while undergoing tests but the reply was that my medical was suspended and that was that.

I've never researched the FAA rules. When I started flight training one idea was that when in the US (I visit 4 or so times a year) I would rent a plane for the weekend. This involves getting an FAA licence which I don't believe I can now get based on the NPPL licence. So I still fly when I'm in the US - I just have an instructor as a nanny and let him do the radio and I can enjoy the flying. If I want to fly somewhere and stop for breakfast or lunch the instructors are normally delighted if you buy then a meal.

Hi Stillstanding
Thanks for the info
Did you need to finish your training with a safety pilot, what about SOLO NavEx etc. ?
Currently digesting the contents of JAA Medical manual you referred me to for further background.

[YSSY]

Hi Paul,

If you are still keen to apply for a medical then one possible avenue to explore would be to claim that your son had a head injury as a result of the electrocution. This would then put your son under the post-traumatic epilepsy section of Australia's DAME HB:

http://www.casa.gov.au/manuals/regulate/dame/080r0205.pdf

However there are strict rules as you can see in the recertification sections with regard to being off the anti-convulsants prior to any assessment by CASA.

Unfortunately true epilepsy precludes certification on the whole.

If there were only one or two seizures associated with the original event then you may be able to make a case for recertification if off anti-convulsants. However a fit off the medication will have implications for driving etc... let alone flying.

Hope this helps