Nato Travel Order - Any Use At All??

[Joe Black]

Hey guys,

Not a very interesting post I know but has anyone ever made use of thier NTO? Be it flying civilian or military travel?:hmm:

[Roland Pulfrew]

Yes!!

Gets you into the BX in the States.:ok:

Gets you into the States through the "Military Personnel" channel.:ok:

[Joe Black]

Nice one, I didn't know whether or not they would accept that. I take it's a worthwhile document to have when clearing immigration and entering the states too then!

[ZOFO]

Had to use one of these many a moon ago to get back to Cyprus at short Notice, No real problems encountered on the way..:ok:

[Joe Black]

Another thought to ponder...if there was a snag with a visa waiver programme application, would the NTO be taken into account? I'm not a criminal!:ok:

[ZOFO]

Thinking back now in the Cobwebs of time etc. the only problem that I did encounter upon my return to Cyprus was having to prove my place of residence in Cyprus, as I had to travel with no Passport. So I politely showed Cyprus immigration my Living Out address (In Cyprus) at that time via a Cypriot bank statement along with my ID Card, and was duly waived through the gate to my Taxi. I am really not to sure about the States though, as long as you can prove your place of residence, and happen to be a card carrying member of (We are a NATO Force), then you should be okay.. Any body else have any thoughts/Problems they can share...:confused:

[Pontius Navigator]

Not the NATO, I kept that in my pocket, just flashed my 1250.

[k3k3]

A NATO Travel Order will also get you Government (Cheap :) ) rates at most hotel chains in the U.S..

[14greens]

$4000 fine for not having it available if asked for it when passing through military port of entry as crew!:= Dont even look at the passport
so yep it is pretty important

[movadinkampa747]

What happens when you pass through a Civvy POE?

[k3k3]

It still helps. I went to Mexico for a day trip from San Diego once, when I tried to re-enter the USA my UK passport was not sufficient to permit entry, a quick flash of my Travel Order and it was "Welcome and have a nice day sir".

[14greens]

civvie POE is normal Passport usually!
Depends where to be honest and the mood of the guy who comes to the door

[movadinkampa747]

It still helps. I went to Mexico for a day trip from San Diego once, when I tried to re-enter the USA my UK passport was not sufficient to permit entry, a quick flash of my Travel Order and it was "Welcome and have a nice day sir".

So a flimsy piece of paper that you could print off at home got you into the USA and your passport wasn't good enough? I think you are making that up. You just wanted to tell everybody that you have been to San Diego and Mexico.:hmm:

[tablet_eraser]

My NTO got me through the diplomatic channel at Houston in June, keeping me away from the 300-strong queue of other travellers. I like it!

[GlosMikeP]

Never knowingly recognised in USA.

I was once asked by the immigration guy at Seattle, to whom I'd offered the NTO, 'what's wrong buddy, don't you have a passport?'. He was serious and I was a step away from the return to UK queue. Fortunately I did have my passport and I escaped with 'hard stares'.

Second time I was going through somewhere like Phoenix. Got the severe 3rd degree from the Immigration woman even after I'd pushed over the passport, 1250 and NTO inside.

Didn't bother with them after that and paid for a Visa, which solved everything.

[brit bus driver]

So a flimsy piece of paper that you could print off at home got you into the USA and your passport wasn't good enough? I think you are making that up. You just wanted to tell everybody that you have been to San Diego and Mexico.:hmm:
Why would he want to do that? Not like it's a novelty is it? Oh, hang on, has HM never sent you there?.........:}

[Confucius]

You just wanted to tell everybody that you have been to San Diego and Mexico.:hmm:

Haven't we all? :confused:

[Steve Austin]

NTO VERY useful when travelling out to the US via civilian air, but leaving the US in an RAF ac (therefore not clearing customs on departure - it can be very difficult entering the US if you didn't officially leave the last time!) Recently went to the US to pick up an RAF/BAES aircraft. Used the NTO to enter the US; no passport required, no Form I95, no fingerprints or photographs just a pleasant 'have a nice day'. Had also been informed that you could use the US residents channel with a NTO but didn't try that this time.

[C130 Techie]

Always use an NTO accompanied by my passport when travelling to the US on duty using civ air. Never had any problems using the diplomatic or US citizens channel.

[Jimlad1]

IIRC if you travel over to the US on regular visits you can get an A2 visa through MOD - this entitles you to use the US citizens line at the airport. Last time I went through Dulles there were more Brits in the US line than Americans.

[Fatjoff]

When I was LO to the French Air Force a couple of years ago, I had to go back to Strike for a meeting. I left my passport at home but got through UK passport control on my 1250 no bother. At Strike, I went straight round to SHQ, got issued a NTO which I presented with my 1250 to the French passport control and was waved through straightaway.

Thing is, I don't know if the NTO really worked or not, 'cause in the EC, we seem to be the only country that really bothers about passports. It's entirely possibly that all the Frenchman wanted to see was some sort of identification.

[Dan Winterland]

If you're operating an aircraft to the USA and don't have a NTO, then you need crew Visas. So, yes - it's useful.

[Roadster280]

Isn't the point of the NTO to verify one's credentials to be actually on NATO business, in conjunction with one's service ID card? In other words, it validates the use of the service ID for international travel within NATO countries.

I'd guarantee trying to use a MOD90/F1250/Navy whatever at a US POE without the NTO would be fruitless, and result in a) a long trip back and b) difficult questions next time.

As for the "eye scan" and bit of paper to give back, it's a) a photo, and b) a departure record, as it says clearly on it. If you overstay, you are likely to be banned, length of ban varying by length of overstay. Since the departure record is the document that determines whether or not you overstayed, it is a tad important. Of course people genuinely lose them, and don't get screwed, as long as they report it and do the paperwork thing. The airlines won't accept you for travel without one, if you need one.

[HTB]

I visited a B52 base in Georgia - Robbins AFB - in 1982, on NATO business to brief crews on MRR techniques. Flew in on civilian airlines via JFK, then the other NY airport (La Guardia?), Atlanta, Warner-Robbins. This must have been pre-visa days, although I was carrying a valid NTO that I do not recollect showing to anyone.

After a week of intensive training ;) of the crews (alright, took a couple of days and the remaining time was more usefully filled) , I flew back in a B52H (I think it was a H, tail gunner sat with the rest of the crew up front, but irrelevant to the point) to Fairford. So according to the US system I am still in the country, having overstayed by 24 years.

Subsequently managed to sneak back undetected to Las Vegas for a couple of flagex in the mid-80s, despite going through immigration channels at Washington airport; so maybe the system was not so tight back then, or was I just lucky?

[SaddamsLoveChild]

K3K3 - Also returned from Tijuana with 6 mates from the Desert Survival Cse very drunk without passports and the NTO got us through.

Mova - I really do worry about you, it is clear that a state education was totally wasted in your case...............

[WhiteOvies]

Totally agree with above, passport with NTO sticking out, through empty channel, quick glance from customs, no finger prints/eyescan/questions. :ok: Wish I could have one for holidays as well as work!

[AvTech]

I regularly use my NTO combined with my F1250 for:

1. At Virgin check-in use the Premium Economy desk which is usually quieter. The staff say its because they recognise our need for privacy????

2. On arrival in the US use any queue you want Oh and you won't need the green visia waiver form.

3. When going through the security screening at Washington Dulles flash your NTO and you won't get selected for the full shoes off, body search. When I went through, the supervisor told the searcher to leave me alone as 'He might be carrying'. I was, 2 days dirty washing!!

4. My NTO also got my luggage upgraded to Upper class although I remained in cattle. The girl at the desk said it was the least she could do for the HM Forces. It did mean my bags were off first which combined with para 2 saved loads of time.

All that from a form that you can download off the intranet.

[tripplespin]

Had to use Tne Nato Order recently,after the professionals at the home office lost my passport in the mail..the only problem i had was actually trying to leave and reentering Heathrow,even after producing my I.D. The good people at U.K border Agency didnt let me down with the lamest question i've ever heard,(how long have you lived here?)
Is it me,or is it they recruit a bunch of morans at these desks? Funny i could enter the U.S on my Army I.d without any problems....

[billynospares]

A2 visa all the way. Used the Diplomatic line at Atlanta jumping a 2 hour immigration wait. Sweet :ok:

[HaveQuick2]

Exactly the same with us. Day trip across the border to Tijuana, never thought about passports. On the way back into USA NATO travel order was all we had, got whisked through the throng trying to get into the USA with no problem at all, so worked well for us.

[dallas]

I've a sneaking feeling the NTO works well in/around US facilities because Americans equate it to 'orders' - their official tasking letter to go somewhere and do something - so whether you're after a room in the Ramstein Inn, or arriving at Newark Intl, they think you're on official business and therefore afford the holder some priority.

I'm sure in many other places it's not worth the paper it's written on...

[Monkey Madness]

I've used a NTO various times to get in and out of Cyprus/Italy/USA.... but the only time I have had a problem has been at Heathrow, when they took 40 minutes and half a dozen phone calls before they let me in to the UK! After that my boss paid for a passport out of the section fund.

[On_Loan]

Be warned though - we were informed that a NTO would mean you don't have to enrol in the ESTA programme when flying to the states, even civvy. However, when just flying via LAX Air NZ couldn't print a boarding pass without the ESTA number, regardless of me showing them the NTO and ID - I had to go online and do all the mickey mouse questionnaire to get the number before they'd let me board! :ugh:

[Seaking93]

Slightly off topic, but it would be even better if the ESTA system was up and running, last month flying LHR to LAX after producing the ESTA number was told to fill out the green I-94 as the ESTA system was still not in use.:ugh:

[Flik Roll]

^^I had to do the same last week. Bit annoyed as I had already filled it in online and been approved... apparently the system will be up and running paper free soon. Luckily they'd informed us this would be the case so didn't lose my space in the line or anything.

Any more gen on the A2 visa? Do you have to be on 'business' or has the MOD got some deal going with the US?

[Impiger]

Yes its a very useful document even though you can print it out yourself - has to be accompanied by a F1250 or F90 for the brown-jobs to make it valid.

As well as USA it gets you in to Turkey without paying the £10 for a visa at the entry port which normal EU peeps have to fork out for. I've also used one on BA from LHR to Frankfurt when my passport was away getting visa'd up for a different trip and for entry to Romania when arriving by Crab-Air.

Top tip for US trips (or visits to US bases in Germany et al) make sure you have a specific NTO for the duration of the trip and that it specifies the locations you're visiting. Blanket orders such as All Countries, All Borders and valid for a year (all perfectly kosher elsewhere) don't cut so much ice with The Cousins - all akin to US Mil Orders as has been mentioned.:ok:

[Laarbruch72]

has to be accompanied by a F1250 or F90 for the brown-jobs to make it valid.

The F1250 became the MOD F90 some years ago now. All servicemen now carry an MOD F90.

[Mister-T]

A wise word of caution:

I went through the fast channel at Washington once with ID and NTO and the officer asked if I had a passport too? I replied yes and he asked to see it. Once handed over he promptly stamped it with his immigration stamp and then wrote in big blue pen NATO right across it.

Interestingly I have used the NTO in this way about 20 times and he was the only one to ask and I have never had a problem getting through.

[BEagle]

A Flt Cdr on a large aircraft squadron (ex-F4 pilot, who went by the nickname 'Thrombo' or 'AWF' - you would have known him at WTM, Impiger), got himself all wound up and hot under the collar at a squadron meeting once about how important the NTO was and the dire penalties which one would face were it to be lost. After several minutes of this nonsense, a Wise Old Air Engineer interrupted by saying "In that case, Sir, perhaps we'd better take a few spares in the imprest pack-up whenever we go away!".

Collapse of self-important personage!

Another of his paranoias was people using the Sqn Ops direct line for private phone calls. To the extent that he demanded that the phone was to be locked up after working hours, in case those nasty,oily groundcrew people used it....:rolleyes:

One day the boss landed late and went to use the phone. Finding it missing he asked "What silly bugger has pinched the phone?". Having been told, he said "Well, plug another one in then - I will be in the deep and smelly if I don't tell my wife that I'm going to be late!"

It seemed that 'Thrombo' had no idea that the phones were fitted with new-style BT plugs and sockets - and had been for some time...:hmm:

NTOs - only really of any use to placate Spams who need written 'orders' for everything they do (including going for a dump, probably) and can't understand that the RAF doesn't.....

[tezzer]

Had to use one once, as a civilian, asked to go to he Azores at very short notice, ( I happened to be on a tasking in Glasgow at the time, so was nearest to my point of departure).

Not sure if it did any good, but the det commander used to wave it as we went on and off the base, if we were challenged, as my passport was in my desk in London !

[Mr C Hinecap]

The F1250 became the MOD F90 some years ago now. All servicemen now carry an MOD F90.

*checks in wallet*

Nope - still F1250 here

[Monkey Madness]

Quote:
The F1250 became the MOD F90 some years ago now. All servicemen now carry an MOD F90.
*checks in wallet*

Nope - still F1250 here

Ditto, and it doesn't have a pesky expiry date like the new MOD90's do.:ok:

[brickhistory]

BEagle:


NTOs - only really of any use to placate Spams who need written 'orders' for everything they do (including going for a dump, probably) and can't understand that the RAF doesn't.....


Didn't stop you from using Uncle's nicer facilities though, did it?

[deltahotel]

Offshore sailing exped in France - satisfied the French Customs Officer

[BEagle]

Didn't stop you from using Uncle's nicer facilities though, did it?

Certainly at Incirlik, it was a requirement to show one's tatty old NTO to the person on the checkout if buying alcohol at the Class 6, to prove that you hadn't exceeded the ration allowance which she'd stamped on the back the first time you visited. This could be a nuisance it you went back more than once a year, as was often the case, as it meant getting the Adj to produce another NTO.

The French had a simpler solution. They just photocopied their NTOs if they ran out of ration points - and had made their own stamp. The Class 6 folk never noticed......:ok:

[Satellite_Driver]

My experience was that NTOs were dead handy transiting through Washington Dulles (where they recognise them and send you through the fast track) and worse than useless anywhere else.

[Laarbruch72]

Mr C Hinecap / Monkey Madness: Granted, you have really old ID cards, what was your point? My point still stands, the F1250 has gone, years ago now, and everyone is now issued the MOD F90, which looks identical to the 1250 but has a different form number.
Do catch up.

[scottpe]

I can quite believe that the NATO travel order helped at US Border and Customs, the first question asked of any US Military personnel at any "official" establishment is: "where are your Orders?", the same officials assume our NATO TOs are the equivalent. Also very good for admittance to cheap accommodation in BOQs, N.Island San Diego for example! Any self respecting "Herc" operator carried a spare, blank copy in his/her wallet, for emergencies!!!

[Flik Roll]

The 1250 only stopped in 05/06! That's not *that* long ago ;)

[D-IFF_ident]

I always carried half a dozen blank spares in case one of my crew forgot or lost theirs. I got through quite a few - although nearly always so that we could all get into the BX.

The yanks consider them as your 'orders' - which they can't go anywhere, or do anything, without.

[saudipc-9]

Hit and miss going into the States. Normally if going to a civilian AOE the customs guys are far more interested in seeing a passport. However, I had more grief once coming back into Canada as I was asked why I was travelling internationally without a passport. I had a good smile when I said being on a NTO I did not need a passport...long silence at the other end before hearing...Oh!

[monkeymanagement]

NTO also useful to show in US if your luggage is over the weight limit. Since on official military business the excess charge often waived. MM

[scpc]

the F1250 has gone, years ago now, and everyone is now issued the MOD F90

I don't!!!!!!!

Therefore I cannot be everyone
Therefore I am no-one
Therefore I don't exist
Therefore the quoted text is correct and I have just vanished in a sea of fundamental particles...........:eek: