Long Distance Offshore Ops

[Geoffersincornwall]

What is the longest offshore operation (distance from operating base) you know about. What machine was used and where was it?

:ok:

[SASless]

Chinooks for BAH probably Geoffers...out of Aberdeen, or ERA offshore in Alaska.

[GLSNightPilot]

I don't have the exact figures at hand, but I've done many of more than 200NM, out of Galveston, TX and Houma and Morgan City, LA.

[handysnaks]

The Hibernia must be close to it I would have thought
Hibernia (http://www.hibernia.ca/index2.html)

[SASless]

Teeside to the Ekofisk was a long slog in the S-58T single pilot with no autopilot was a long slog in the S-58T. Two pump stations along the way with fuel if needed. If memory serves me right...something like 225nm to the near edge and 245 nm to the far edge.

[tascats]

Bond and Bristow used to fly Pumas from Aberdeen to the Magnus platform - must be around 300NM? ooooooooohh those Magnus stickies were nice:}

[mallardpi]

How about a SAR mission in May 1990.

From RAF Brawdy in Pembrokeshire West Wales, UK, the Sea King and crew flew first to Cork then onto the RFA Argus vessel for a refuel, food and a wait to get into range. Then they continued to meet the yatch with an ill crewman at midnight, some 9 hours after the original lift. The recovery of the casualty went without a hitch and the the Sea King returned to the RFA Argus which had since been cruising towards the scene. The helicopter was refuelled again and returned to Cork to hand the casualty over to the hospital authorities. Landing was at about 6.00am, some 15 hours after the original departure from Brawdy. In all the crew covered nearly 1200 miles during over 11 hours of airborne time (7 hours at night). The yacht was, if I remember correctly, at about 47N 19W - which is approximately 550 miles from base (300 from Cork) Those figures may not be that accurate - bear with me it was 16 years ago. Somewhere in the loft I have the map the route was planned upon. Be interested to see if any more of the crew read this (DC, JB, DS, VD(V2D)). Remember the lunch in London!

[NickLappos]

The absolute longest offshore rescue was this one:

"In 1994, the 106th Rescue Wing received national and international recognition when the aircrews and PJs of the 102nd successfully completed the "longest over-water rescue with an helicopter in aviation history." In December 1994, the 106th launched two HH-60s from Gabreski Airport on a mission that would take them to Halifax, Canada and then, 750 miles out over the Atlantic to search for survivors of the Ukrainian merchant vessel Salvador Allende. The freighter had foundered and sunk in heavy seas almost 800 miles at sea. By the time the two helicopters and their crews arrived over the search area, most of the ship's crew had perished. A merchant ship picked up one survivor. After searching the sea, a survivor was spotted by an helicopter crew member and the two HH-60s prepared to put a pararescueman in the water to save him. TSgt. james Dougherty jumped into the water and retrieved the last living member of the crew. Then, the two helicopters began the arduous seven-hour return flight to Halifax, Nova Scotia. During the 14-hour mission, the two HH-60s had been refueled in flight 10 times by the wing's HC-130s. The pilots in both helicopters spent 14 hours without relief at the controls, all to save one life."

http://www.philippecolin.net/106thRQW.html

[Camp Freddie]

when I went direct to the magnus from aberdeen and back some years ago, I recall it being 276nm, seemed a long way at the time as we were only doing 125kts. (unless of course i have remembered it all wrong)

regards

CF

[Blackhawk9]

Lloyd Helicopters (now CHC Australia) were operating almost 300 miles off shore out of Darwin with 214 ST's(with 3x 90gal tanks in cabin) about 10 years ago (was told at the time it was the longest single leg offshore operation in the world) the, ST's were replaced with Super Pumas's all with 600L internal tanks, the ST's and S.Pumas would go out and back with about 6-7 hours techlog time and 2 landings!

Longest off shore rescue I Know of in Oz was in the early 90's out of Rockhampton QLD, 2x S70A-9 Blackhawks from 5 AvnRegt rescued two Dykes(women in comfortable shoes!!) and a cat over 400 miles off the coast supported by C-130 and P3 to do the job.

[John Eacott]

Geoff,

Mayne-Bristow operated a Wessex 60 from Derby, Western Australia, to the Ocean Digger out North of the Ashmore Reef: closer to West Timor than Oz! Early 1979, then moved to Broome.

We'd leave from Derby to Cape Leveque, refuel, on to Browse Island, refuel, then to the rig, refuel, back to Browse, refuel, then home 7hr 45 minutes later :ooh: At the pedestrian 100kias, it was about 380nm each way, all single pilot with the bears downstairs sleeping off their hangovers from the midnight special flight up from Perth.

Hot as Hades, we'd get truckie's tan on the right arm only: refuelling was from drums in 36C+, and nav was an original VLF with a volatile memory which dumped at each start. We dare not shut down both engines during refuel, as Browse Island is a lump of coral in the middle of nowhere, the only visitors being the Indon fishermen looking to see if we'd left anything useful to steal :=

[hbpfly]

I work from a ship with a Hughes 500d, and spend most of my time over water - maybe 150 hours a year. For long distance, it wasn't over water, but from Juneau in Alaska to Cancun in Mexico. Took me 42 hours in the 500. A truly memorable flight. The first 2 days were all over water to get to Seattle, then it was through the Rockies, Grand Canyon, and on down to Brownsville before the transit through Mexico. We live in a beautiful world, and only with a heli you can see it !:)

[Brian Abraham]

Wessex 60 from Derby
John, the story has it that you used to shutdown one engine in flight to enhance range/fuel reserves. Is that correct, or just a story?

[John Eacott]

John, the story has it that you used to shutdown one engine in flight to enhance range/fuel reserves. Is that correct, or just a story?

Just a story! I knew of certain Junglies who ferried a cab or two back on one, though :ok:

The old girl had no problems flying on one in temperate climes but northern Oz, even in winter with low 30C's, was another story :=

[Mikila1A]

Handysnacks,

Hibernia is the short hop in our daily operation, it sits a comfortable 170 nautical off the coast. Our Puma's and 61 can do the trip without the aid of any aux fuel, (wind permitting). The farthest rig of Newfoundland right now is currently drilling 280 nautical, still doable with the Puma (full aux, crappy payload) but more comfortable for the S92.

[Geoffersincornwall]

OK, now we have some background can anyone enlighten me as to the rules by which they got to a platform 280-300 nm miles away? I guess that was PNR and offshore diversion ......... or maybe no diversion at all.

Rgds

Geoff

[Jayrow Pilot]

Goeffers

Alternate was Suai in Indonesia. Australian requirement to carry alternate plusc30 minutes (inter) or 60 minutes (tempo) fuel. This was done by installing sponson tanks (Bristow) or an internal seat / tank combination (CHC Lloyd) which increased fuel capacity to just over 5000lbs. Parking the aircraft on a slope in Darwin allowed the sponson tank equipped 332L to carry about 5400lbs of fuel!! It also had a slightly higer TAS than the internal tank equipped machine due to less turbulence from the back of the large sponsons.

Payload in the wet season was 3-4 pax outbound in the Super Puma.

[NorthSeaTiger]

Surley the longest offshore flight without re-fuelling must go to the BV234 ? Was their diversion airport not something like Paris ?

[sox6]

Surley the longest offshore flight without re-fuelling must go to the BV234 ? Was their diversion airport not something like Paris ?

A long diversions capability is not realy IMV the same as long scheduled flight.

BV234s out of Nome for ARCO may have been more interesting!


Geoffersincornwall

Is this just a theoretical interest or is Petrobrash trying to push the envelope?

[SASless]

UK rules required "On Shore Diversion" fuel in my days...not sure what it is now. PNR flights with an offshore rig for a diversion is fine if you have excellent weather reporting, flight following, and no aircraft malfunctions that would endanger the rig itself during an emergency landing.

[Geoffersincornwall]

The clients are located somewhere other than S. America but I'm just doing some background research courtesy of all the well-informed guys and gals out there. I haven't come across any surprises yet but some blanks have been filled in to help me get the whole picture - for which I'm grateful. Any more thoughts/comments/experiences are always welcome.

Geoffers

:ok:

[212man]

I'm sure the BHL Australia 332 boys are doing a leg in excess of 300 nm using PNR, and have been for some time.

[Droopy]

I believe they were doing so in the S-61 in the early 1980s..

[SASless]

212man,

How does that square with JAR requirements....under what conditions can one plan to make an emergency landing on the rigs (ie tail rotor problems) or OEI for an S-61?

[212man]

SAS,
I think you'll find CASA is not JAR: call me old fashioned, but something to do with 8000 miles and all that. BHLA is not BHL as their pilots will frequently remind you (something to do with working 2 on 2 off and having 4 weeks leave PA, but still earning enough to have a ranch etc)

[212man]

SAS,
under a more serious note, you can nominate an offshore alternate if there is no land alternate. i.e. you cannot nominate an offshore alternate to increase payload if you could have used an land based alternate.

[TeeS]

Hi Sas

From memory, offshore diversions in the UK were allowed for aircraft that could demonstrate single engine cat A (as was) helipad approaches. Bo 105 and AS 365C are two types that spring to mind, the S61 never came into this group. I'm not sure I would have wanted to take a tail rotor problem all the way back to shore in any case! A 105 single engine approach wouldn't have been an awfull lot of fun either!!!!

Cheers

TeeS

[Woolf]

I'm not sure I would have wanted to take a tail rotor problem all the way back to shore in any case!

If it was a tailrotor control malfunction (i.e. stuck pedals) then returning to an airfield for a run on landing might be your only option. A safe offshore landing with this malfunction would be near impossible.

[TeeS]

Good point. Although the onshore alternate did not need to be an airfield, it usually was.

TeeS

[GLSNightPilot]

Offshore US the only requirement is an alternate landing site, which can be another platform, and this is just in case the destination deck becomes unusable for some reason. Some operators require a beach alternate for some aircraft, but the FAA doesn't really care. There are no legal requirements for an onshore alternate for any aircraft. The FAA's only requirement is fuel for destination plus 20 minutes.

[Odi]

The longest single trip from Aberdeen is PD - Magnus. From memory (measured on many boring night shifts) is about 280nm.
I recall one weekend round trip being:

PD - Magnus
Magnus - Fulmar
Fulmar - somewhere else
somewhere else - PD

Mind you, the routing of a Bond Mk2 a couple of afternoons ago was involved:
PD - GA4 (nr Claire)
Claire - PM
PM - PB
PB - Schiehallion
Schiehallion - PD

We have a standing joke in the tower that anyone doing such an arduous routing (and we see some really convulted routings at weekends) has been caught doing unmentionable things to the chief pilot's daughter (apologies if he really does have a daughter!).

Odi

[jbrereton]

Yes we do get some long old trips on the weekends.
Do tend to be round robins.
We always use Onshore Alternates.
For the Magnus(284nm), North Alwyn(246nm) we used the (ERA) Enroute Alternate which allowed you to discount the extra 10% of fuel required up to an abeam point of Sumburgh which was 165nm from Aberdeen.
The Magnus/North Alwyn nearly always went through Longside/Sumburgh or the MCP rig because of the distance and Old Super Puma Mk1 aircraft.
The Norweigans did previously use an Onshore alternate until they were on station and then used Offshore diversions until going back onshore. Do not know if this still happens.
As was stated earlier there is no point in having an Offshore alternate as you do not know what sort of emergency you are liable to have, i.e. tail rotor control problems.

[Attila]

I recall that Bristows, when the AS332 first came into service, were able to use offshore alternates. Later on, in the late 90's, only 332's flying for one particular client, in one particular field, (the Beryl, I think??), could use them, and that was only under specific circumstances. Memory is fading with advancing years, so no doubt someone out there will correct my misconceptions. :confused:
We also used to use offshore alternates for the Bell 212 in the early 80's.
The S61 was never allowed to use offshore alternates, well, not while I flew it, 89 - present. :)

[Odi]

Out of interest, how do you define "abeam Sumburgh" on a trip from PD to, say, North Alwyn?
Do you take it as the point at which you are nearest to PB before you then start to move away again, ie roughly south east abeam?
Odi

[P2bleed]

Interesting thread. Around the time John Eacott was referring to with the Wx-60, the Queen of the Skies (S61) was flying similar legs with offshore alternates. The alternates were not rigs but areas of sheltered waters (reefs) and the crews were at the time required to demonstrate single engine water landings as part of the training. Never required operationally.

[John Eacott]

The alternates were not rigs but areas of sheltered waters (reefs) and the crews were at the time required to demonstrate single engine water landings as part of the training.



And didn't we use to file "AOS" as an alternate with Flight Service: Any Open Space/Surface :confused:


http://www.helicopterservice.com.au/photos/pprune/S61N%20water.jpg

[soggyboxers]

TeeS
You didn't have to have Cat A helipad. Back in the late 70s, early 80's in Bristow we used to have to be qualified for SEDLs (single engine deck landings). When the offshore-based 212s got very heavy with all the fixed SAR gear, like doppler, we often used to take off without any shore diversion fuel. In the event of an engine failure you had to burn off fuel down to your (pre-calculated) single engine weight and then you basically flew a fairly steep approach to a point at which you overpitched on to the deck (we had no single-engine hover ability). There was an approved graph for calculating the weight and pilots had to be checked out on single-engine landings every 90 days (I think it was). Many of us were unhappy as to what we'd have to do in the event of, for example, a tail rotor failure.

[Tail-take-off]

From www.skyweaver.co.uk (http://www.skyweaver.co.uk)

http://209.196.171.35/article_Ianclark.htm

ANOTHER BRISTOW FIRST

By Ian Clark. (Originally written 1968)300 Miles North of the Tropic of Capricorn (that mysterious line that marks the southernmost declination of the sun), lies the little township of Broome. Situated on the North Western coast of Western Australia, Broome - present day multi-racial population 1,500 - was until recently the crowded, colourful and rowdy centre of the Australian pearling industry. It now houses the base camp for a unique Burmah Oil Company drilling venture, and is the site of the latest operation of Bristow Helicopters.

In September 1967 an advance Bristow crew arrived in Perth, WA to commence assembling a Wessex 60 twin turbine Helicopter, G-AVEW. This helicopter similar to those used on the North Sea by Bristows but with an additional long Range tank fitted, had been crated and shipped from the UK a couple of months earlier. After assembly and test flying, the aircraft was ferried the 1,300 miles North to Broome and in early October operations for Burmah began.

The Wessex 60 which cruises at 100 Knots and is cleared for operations in temperatures of 115 F, is supplying the offshore Drilling vessel ‘Investigator’ drilling Burmah Oil’s first wildcat well in Western Australia. Floating in the Timor Sea on the edge of the Ashmore Reef, the Investigator is drilling in 130 ft. of water, 365 nautical miles north of Broome and less than 80 nm. from Indonesia The flight between Broome and the Ashmore Reef is the longest offshore rig supply flight ever undertaken by helicopter and is another first for Bristows. To achieve this flight, unmanned refuelling stations have been set up along the route on two tiny, conveniently situated, coral islands. The longest sector is 140 nm and refuelling is undertaken by designated crews from the 13/14 passengers carried. Initially a crew of 2 was carried but dispensation was eventually obtained from the Australian D.C.A. for single pilot operations. The pilot is in contact on HF radio at all times with Broome or Darwin and 24 hour Non Directional Beacons situated at the refuelling points, are used for navigational purposes.

Drilling crews leave Perth by DC3 at 9 o’clock on the evening prior to the crew change. They arrive at Broome 8 hours later where, after a hasty breakfast, they board the helicopter for the 4 hour flight to the rig. Refuelling and a quick lunch for the pilot on the rig and the helicopter takes off for the return flight. Two refuelling stops and 4 hours later the helicopter is back in Broome and the drilling crew boards the DC3 for the 8 hour flight back to Perth. Crew changes take place twice weekly and extra service flights bring the total flying to over 100 hours each month. The long flight is further complicated by the uncertain weather conditions, since the whole area lies in the Australian Cyclone belt. During the months of December through February winds in excess of 100 mph can sweep across the route of the helicopter. Flying however continues during this period with the help of Darwin Meteorological facilities who accurately plot the Cyclones courses and give ample forewarnings for shipping and aircraft.

After completion off Ashmore Reef the operation will be moving 250 miles south to Point Samson to drill 2 wildcat wells 70 miles off the coast, which compared to Ashmore will be a relatively easy task for the helicopter pilots and rig crews. At the end of 1968 present plans call for further exploration in the vicinity of Ashmore Reef with a possibility of locations even further out from Broome, which will be yet another challenge for Bristow Helicopters.
http://209.196.171.35/images/ozwess.jpg

[Farmer 1]

What about the shortest, then? Mine was about ten yards - well, maybe a bit more - from the rig on which we were based to the platform to which it was attached. If the bridge between the two installations was out of service, we had to shuttle people to and fro.

The first time I did it, immediately after take-off, the copilot put the heater on full (in summer), and switched on the radar. I managed to stop him retracting the undercarriage.

More time spent on deck than in the air. Flight planning was a bitch.

[SASless]

ERA in Alaska did some long distance flying out to the Chukchi Sea as I recall along with doing IFR/IMC sling load work.

Perhaps an ERA hand can provide some details of the early Alaska work with Chinooks.

[detgnome]

Seem to remember Captain Cardiac (you know who you are!) doing some long range epic from the FI several years ago to pick up a woman with heart problems from a cruise ship. Involved refuelling from one her majesty's grey funnel war canoes and anecdotal evidence suggested that the co-pilot touched the controls for about 15 mins in some 8 odd hours! I don't know the range, perhaps someone with closer knowledge might have an accurate figure....

[IrishSarBoy]

Tut tut, you shouldn't talk about Capt Cardio in that way, I flew with him on many occasions and I must have held the controls once or twice in that time! I did a long ranger from FI, even though it was only 150nm odd, it still seemed a long way as the chinook was u/s and the only other nearest 'friendly' SAR asset was somewhere in south america! Boy does the south atlantic look big when you can't see land in any direction. :)

[TorqueOfTheDevil]

78 Sqn Sea Kings have done both rescues and pick-ups of compassionate cases from South Georgia, starting from MPA, which is about 900nm each way, though in fairness a large part of that was spent on the back of a Grey Funnel.

Seem to remember Captain Cardiac (you know who you are!) doing some long range epic from the FI several years ago to pick up a woman with heart problems from a cruise ship. Involved refuelling from one her majesty's grey funnel war canoes and anecdotal evidence suggested that the co-pilot touched the controls for about 15 mins in some 8 odd hours! I don't know the range, perhaps someone with closer knowledge might have an accurate figure....


From what I know, that would be 15 mins +0/-15! I heard an amusing tale from a D Flt RadOp who arrived there under a bit of a cloud while the by-now Major Cardiac was in command...the RadOp said that MC blanked him for the entire first shift they did together, and even when they got a job the RadOp wasn't allowed to speak - he says that, when they arrived on scene, MC did all the briefs including the recce and method brief, and the first thing the RadOp managed to say on the sortie was "Winching Out"!

[Fareastdriver]

I remember when I first started on the North Sea with the old AS330 Puma that had an offshore alternate facility. It was essential at Teeside for the Ekofisk otherwise there was no other way you could get there. One day at Aberdeen the whole of Scotland was socked in but I departed because I could find the runway and I had nominated the Claymore as my take-off diversion. It must have been legal because my chief pilot told me to do it

[212man]

Did he kindly round down your figures for you too? (just in case you were being overly conservative!)

[nymagee]

Hi all

I guess 730nm in a R44 single leg Niue to Nadi would rate up there with the better distances:E

[bolkow]

maybe he needed the stick practice?