RN JPA Rollout

[HEDP]

It's your turn now, how about sharing your experiences? It's gonna bite us green guys and gals eventually!

[Always_broken_in_wilts]

"It's gonna bite us green guys and gals eventually!"

Considering you need an average or better IQ to be able to use a computer to input your data your statement is a real "no brainer":p

all spelling mistakes are "df" alcohol induced

[Data-Lynx]

Isn't it encouraging that a Google on 'JPA' puts a PPRuNe link in the first 10 hits. Meanwhile, had a nasty surprise this morning on opening a sealed brown envelope addressed to the small section that employs me. The cover note stated its requirement in 14 point bold font: 'Please distribute amongst your personnel'

Gravity and a nudge emptied 110 small, stiff, mostly purple, plastic items onto the desk. These 42mm x 24mm tallies were titled 'AFPAA (JPA) Urgent Enquiries' on one side and 'Routine Enquiries' on the other. I could just about read the one telephone extension under 'Urgent': it was the number that the briefing had advised the RN not to ring as it could only do passwords. I needed my spectacles for the rest of the advice.

As the package had been forwarded from the Unit that has precise knowledge of the RN establishment for the whole site, and my section only needs one hand (or foot for the green jobs) to count them, I was prepared to be horrified. So imagine the relief that flooded over me when I re-read the 'With Compliments' chit: the entire package was for the RAF element instead - all one of him.

[airborne_artist]

DL - maybe that's the problem - JPA is paying 110 times as many people as the RAF currently employs.

No wonder the help-lines are always busy :}

[LHtoLT]

Having visited the brief last week am a little concerned as im currently on lots of extra bonuses for the job im in and will i get them straight away. anyway that is my reason for this post.

I noticed on the main screen there is a link to submit your notice to leave the service!?! imagine some young lad just had a good telling and a is a little disgruntled and logs onto JPA and see that link! Dont think i need to say anymore!

Click the button if you wish to leave the RN!

[Wader2]

I don't think you will have a problem. If they can write clear concise instruction or explanations like the one below who worries?:{

<<IMPORTANT ! A system software change is being developed to prevent incorrect applications being made but until this is actioned, if a person selects to have their claim paid in a foreign currency but does not have the foreign bank account selected to receive it, or if a bank account is selected for which there is no process of making payments, Expenses will allow them to submit the claim but JPA will be unable to complete the transaction and so it will not be paid! Similarly, if the selected Expenses account is a UK bank account, but details are incorrect, payment cannot be made. It is therefore essential to follow the instructions given below.>>

IMPORTANT ! A person can enter an Expenses claim but if they do not have a UK or foreign bank account to receive the expenses JPA will be unable to make the payment. A software fix is being developed. Until then follow the instructions given below.

[PompeySailor]

I don't think you will have a problem. If they can write clear concise instruction or explanations like the one below who worries?:{

<<IMPORTANT ! A system software change is being developed to prevent incorrect applications being made but until this is actioned, if a person selects to have their claim paid in a foreign currency but does not have the foreign bank account selected to receive it, or if a bank account is selected for which there is no process of making payments, Expenses will allow them to submit the claim but JPA will be unable to complete the transaction and so it will not be paid! Similarly, if the selected Expenses account is a UK bank account, but details are incorrect, payment cannot be made. It is therefore essential to follow the instructions given below.>>

IMPORTANT ! A person can enter an Expenses claim but if they do not have a UK or foreign bank account to receive the expenses JPA will be unable to make the payment. A software fix is being developed. Until then follow the instructions given below.

Which sadly says - "Oi! Prat! If you tell us to pay you in foreign currency, but you haven't got a bank account which accepts foreign currency, surprisingly enough you won't receive any money! Also, if you get your bank details wrong, don't be surprised when nothing turns up in your bank. Salute, about turn, go away and think about what you have just tried to do."

Perhaps I should apply for a job turning the notices into crystal clear English.....

[JayPAC Frontliner]

Ah yes, the Operational Bulletins!

Would help if it was all in English, but after seeing JPA, would anyone actually believe it would be that simple ? Surely not!

Pompeysailor - that sounds like a plan! Maybe I should try your idea and apply for that post too!

Just hope RN roll-out goes better than RAF. Who'd like to discharge now, before JPA gets it's hands on your pay ?

Oh yes, I'd like to know - how do you all feel with the knowledge that JPA will handle your pre-Christmas (Nov) pay ? Confident as we all are, I bet!

[PompeySailor]

Ah yes, the Operational Bulletins!

Would help if it was all in English, but after seeing JPA, would anyone actually believe it would be that simple ? Surely not!

Pompeysailor - that sounds like a plan! Maybe I should try your idea and apply for that post too!

Just hope RN roll-out goes better than RAF. Who'd like to discharge now, before JPA gets it's hands on your pay ?

Oh yes, I'd like to know - how do you all feel with the knowledge that JPA will handle your pre-Christmas (Nov) pay ? Confident as we all are, I bet!

I have transferred all the Direct Debits to the wife's account, and set up my slush fund ready to go. I go outside in December, and I have no faith in the system to get this right, despite what should be a straight forward evolution. Final pay - pension payment - lump sum, all in a 14 day period - well, that's what is supposed to happen. I am also disappearing off the plot early, picking up some casual work for Nov/Dec so that I have a nice big cushion to work from. I am fortunate in that I know I can make the transition outside no matter what sort of cock up they throw at me. I would hate to be AB Smith, deployed for 8 months on a minesweeper with no internet access and only a 20 minute paradire phone card to sort out my problems.

Then compare that to the potential for the Tom in a dusty ****e hole in 'stan, under attack for 35 days out of 40 with all the associated logistic problems, death and injuries, not knowing if his wife has enough money to pay the mortgage or feed the kids, because she can't phone the help line because DPA means that no information about her husband's pay account can be released...

Not quite as simple as replicating the Barclay's Bank payroll system, is it?

Failing that, I have a Government Procurement Card in my wallet with a ridiculous limit, which I may "forget" to hand in until I have been paid correctly....I wonder how I would stand legally if I decided to spend the money on that on a "buy now, pay back later" basis?:ok:

[JayPAC Frontliner]

That Procurement card sounds like a wise idea. I'm sure Centurion could happily forget you have that!

Hate to mention it regarding final pay - terminal benefit - pension but maximum timeframe is up to 30 days. Within 5 to 30 is the general with an aimed for 10 working day turnaround.

Thought it best to mention that in case anyone isn't prepared for that!

[Strictly Jungly]

Attended a brief recently and at ensuing question time I asked............"Have you had ANY positive feedback from our RAF colleagues?"

Refreshingly, the JPA bod went on to say that forums such as PPrune advocated bad news frequently..............however this was due to several reasons...............blah blah blah. So your comments are acknowledged , whether it makes our impending transition any smoother remains to be seen.
Watch this space.

[ricardian]

Attended a brief recently and at ensuing question time I asked............"Have you had ANY positive feedback from our RAF colleagues?"

Refreshingly, the JPA bod went on to say that forums such as PPrune advocated bad news frequently..............however this was due to several reasons...............blah blah blah. So your comments are acknowledged , whether it makes our impending transition any smoother remains to be seen.
Watch this space.

But if there was good news I am sure people would be posting here out of sheer amazement!
--
Bruce Fletcher
Stronsay, Orkney
http://www.stronsay.co.uk/claremont

[JayPAC Frontliner]

Oh, but there IS good news!

The Operational Bulletins on the AFPAA InfoCentre say things are getting fixed.. that's good news.... not propaganda or lies of any sort.... heaven forfend.... *end cynical, sarcastic mode*

[Mr Blake]

JPA ROLL-OUT UPDATE - OCT 06

1. It is 2 months since I wrote to you outlining the status of JPA. In that time significant progress has been made in some key areas and I now hear from many people very positive reports on the benefits of JPA. However, there is no avoiding the fact that there are still far too many individuals who have pay and allowance problems that remain unresolved, new issues arise in areas that have previously performed satisfactorily, and the increased workload on HR specialists, career managers and line managers remains a serious cause for concern. Given this background, the Department faced a tough decision on RN rollout. From a purely parochial perspective, I wanted more time to improve the level of service to the RAF, before stressing the system further, but both the RN and Army are keen to embrace the benefits that go along with JPA, particularly the enhanced separation allowance and disturbance allowance for single personnel, and so, subject to a few conditions designed to ensure delivery to the RAF is not degraded, the green light has been given to RN rollout on 23 Oct 06.

2. So where are we today with JPA performance? My personal view is that we are probably past the nadir, but it will be some time before we are sufficiently high on the recovery slope that all our people relate to the benefits of JPA rather than their bad experiences over the last six months. Now, whenever I listen to issues on JPA in my many discussion groups, I ask for specific details of the individual and their issue so that I can add my weight to ‘encouraging’ the resolution of these problems that seem to be enduring; I ask that you take a similar personal interest with your staffs. What follows in the remainder of this letter is an update on progress and residual concerns; if you believe we have missed any key aspects please let me know.

3. JPAC and JPAC Enquiry Centre. RAF staff support has allowed the JPAC EC to clear the backlog of over 6000 Service Requests (SRs) outstanding before 1 Aug 06, excepting just short of 200 SRs which require further technical change to JPA. Some of these have been ‘bulk clearances’ where reported issues have been overtaken by events, others have been dealt with individually and others have been solved by ‘fixes’ to the system which have been introduced since the SR was logged. All of this work, including authorisation for ‘bulk clearances’ was carried out in conjunction with my Focal Point team. SRs reported since 1 Aug 06 are, in the main, being cleared within the 10 day period allowed by the AFPAA Service Level Agreement, with the exception of some 800 which are either waiting further input from the customer or a technical change to JPA. The support given by RAF Administration personnel to the JPAC has been nothing short of exceptional, but I am aware of the pain the absences of the 9 RAF personnel has caused on their units. In addition, 2 of this number will continue to work in the JPAC until mid-Oct 06, to make sure that the knowledge that they have gained of JPA/AFPAA’s system, is fully embedded before their departure. Work continues to explore how best to allow experienced RAF HR staffs to interact with and support the JPAC.

4. Training. The new training package for Self Service Users and Line Managers has now been launched[1] (http://www.pprune.org/forums/newreply.php?do=newreply&noquote=1&p=2878281#_ftn1) and I hope that those who still find difficulty with certain functions are retraining themselves. Additionally, a new knowledge-base has been published (available from the same link) with specific sections for Self Service User, HR Professionals and ICT/UCT specialists. AFPAA are planning to offer an enhanced training package for professional users and we await further details of this initiative.

5. Pay. Pay accuracy improved in August, although confidence was undermined by the single error that resulted in 600 RAF personnel serving in Europe being paid in early August rather than on 31 Jul 06. This has been traced to a human error within the AFPAA boundary and systems have been put in place to prevent re-occurrence. A number of ongoing pay issues concern the current inability to make arrival changes to the system dating back more than 3 months. A technical fix for this major issue was completed on 28 Sep 06 and user instructions are being developed now. It is unlikely that changes to individual accounts will be completed before the closure of the Oct pay run (on 6 Oct 06) meaning that individuals will not see the benefit of this major fix in their pay until 30 Nov 06. Other work on specialist pay, Medical Officers’ pay, Commitment Bonuses and Get You Home allowances continues.

6. Flight Sub Imprest (FSI) Administration. It has now been agreed - and promulgated to those directly affected – that for those operating under FSI arrangements they should return to in-country fixed rates for subsistence and also for Incidental Expenditure (IEs). This was agreed on the basis that the administrative burden of operating under the actuals rules was having an adverse impact on operational capability. This ruling applies until 30 Sep 07, by which time a thorough review of the FSI processes and system will have been undertaken. Further work is now on-going to review the scope for extending the flat rates for IEs outwith the FSI arena and for aggregating subsistence allowance for TDY in excess of 24 hrs.

7. Continuity of Education Allowance (CEA). While there were inevitably some teething problems, a high proportion of CEA claims were paid on 31 Aug 06, as planned, by JPA. Others, including late claimants were paid in early Sep 06, although I have recently become aware that there might be some issues over the transition of educational stages that AFPAA are now addressing. On this first use of the CEA system, I am aware that the level of HR input was higher than ideal, but now that such issues as mobility certificates and production of receipted bills are better understood, I am optimistic that the system should work more smoothly for next term’s payments.

8. Audit. It has been agreed that the Centre will provide tri-Service advice on audit procedures, supported by specific requirements from individual TLBs. These will be cascaded to stns as soon as they are available. In the interim, I am determined that this should be “light-touch”, and would encourage your staff to adopt this approach in their checking of claims called for audit, but that those who are clearly transgressing should be dealt with firmly.

9. Management and Financial Information. JPA has not yet been able to produce management information to satisfy my responsibilities as the TLB Holder, nor across the Department, particularly in respect of control account reconciliation. I am certainly not confident that current forecasts of output are accurate. Under close and personal scrutiny from 2nd PUS and the Finance Director, CE AFPAA has urgent work underway to provide a number of fixes in this area, although these are deep rooted issues within the JPA system, as the Oracle package simply does not discriminate in the way that the Department hither-to requires. A Tiger Team with Centre, AFPAA and EDS representation has been established to tackle these issues. Early demonstration of enhanced capability in this area is essential to JPA being rolled out to the RN.

10. Planning for RN Roll-out and Mitigation of any Impact on the RAF. The JPA Programme Management Board met recently to take stock of the current situation and to determine whether or not roll-out of JPA to the RN should proceed as planned. From my perspective this was not an easy decision to reach. More time building on the incremental progress thus far made would ensure that the RAF remained the focus of AFPAA’s attention and that we could resolve all the outstanding pay issues. There might also be scope for bringing in substantial programme improvements, thus potentially providing a quantum leap in our people’s experience. However, the realty is that such improvements take time to plan and install, and that the quickest way to introduce these changes is to press on through RN rollout. In these circumstances, my focus was to ensure that the improvements that we had seen in the JPAC (EC and back office) continued and was not undercut by the addition of RN personnel. I have received specific assurances from senior EDS and AFPAA personnel that service provision to the RAF will be protected. Two key issues are:

a. JPAC Telephony. Additional telephony is being installed to allow calls to the JPAC to be streamed. The effect of this is that RAF and RN calls can be separated and a throttle applied should there be too many calls for the JPAC to handle; in such cases, the RN have agreed for RAF personnel to be given priority. I have also been assured that the RAF will have access to the more experienced operators and extra staff have been recruited and are being trained prior to the roll-out. RN Writers will be present in the JPAC from RN JPA launch.

b. Technical Update. Pre cut-over trials have gone well and AFPAA assess the risk of any extension to the cut-over period as low. A bulletin has been published[2] (http://www.pprune.org/forums/newreply.php?do=newreply&noquote=1&p=2878281#_ftn2) detailing activity surrounding RN roll-out and the RAF Focal Point will issue further instructions through the JPA Ops Room. RN access to JPA will be phased in from 13 Nov 06 to reduce the likelihood of surge loading that affected the RAF launch. System performance improvement measures have been introduced and more are planned prior to Army roll-out in Mar 07.

11. Resolution of a myriad of JPA issues remains at the top of my priority list. I will continue to press hard to keep the incremental improvements flowing. In the meantime, if you are concerned that the cumulative effect of any single issue is affecting your stn disproportionately, then you should not hesitate to contact the RAF Focal Point staff (Gp Capt Ogg). It is important that he and his team, in pressing our case with AFPAA, are aware of the latest issues, not least so that they are able to engage the appropriate level, rather than your staff potentially feeling isolated without knowing who best to turn to.

Extracts from the latest JPA bulletin. Some interesting comments, especially regarding the next guinea pig's willingness to "enjoy the benefits" that JPA will bring! This is Planet Earth.:bored:

[PompeySailor]

JPA ROLL-OUT UPDATE - OCT 06

1. It is 2 months since I wrote to you outlining the status of JPA. In that time significant progress has been made in some key areas and I now hear from many people very positive reports on the benefits of JPA. However, there is no avoiding the fact that there are still far too many individuals who have pay and allowance problems that remain unresolved, new issues arise in areas that have previously performed satisfactorily, and the increased workload on HR specialists, career managers and line managers remains a serious cause for concern. Given this background, the Department faced a tough decision on RN rollout. From a purely parochial perspective, I wanted more time to improve the level of service to the RAF, before stressing the system further, but both the RN and Army are keen to embrace the benefits that go along with JPA, particularly the enhanced separation allowance and disturbance allowance for single personnel, and so, subject to a few conditions designed to ensure delivery to the RAF is not degraded, the green light has been given to RN rollout on 23 Oct 06.



Extracts from the latest JPA bulletin. Some interesting comments, especially regarding the next guinea pig's willingness to "enjoy the benefits" that JPA will bring! This is Planet Earth.:bored:

For "green light" read "don't put your mortgage on the go live date". It is still not 100% guaranteed that this is the date we will pick it up, there have been movements behind the scenes relating to some high-level unhappiness with the system and what it was supposed to provide, what it does provide, and there is an element of "'kin hell, can we really run the risk of this not being right?"

Whilst many of the problems are being ironed out, those problems are by and large specific to the RAF and your system. When we get on, there are going to be a whole raft of new problems that will need fixing. When the Army come on line, there will be more specific problems to be addressed.

How on earth we ended up with a critical system that was not run in parellel for 6 months, no-one seems to know.

The comments about the lack of ability to forecast financial planning is relating to an earlier post about over- and under-payments. Because there is no ability to cross-check payments, the system has to rely on the user to flag up problems, whereas with the current system, variances of 10% are investigated with an exception run.

And what, exactly, was the HUMAN AFPAA error which cause the cocking up of the European RAF personnel?:=

[Wader2]

Hate to mention it regarding final pay - terminal benefit - pension but maximum timeframe is up to 30 days. Within 5 to 30 is the general with an aimed for 10 working day turnaround.

Thought it best to mention that in case anyone isn't prepared for that!

And don't forget you have to apply for it.

I got mine on the due day. Drew the whole issue out in cash and walked it round the corner to the high interest building society account. The alternative was pay £35 for a bankers' draft or allow the blood suckers to use my money, interest-free, for 3-5 days.

Nice feeling, especially as the bank had to get an emergency cash top up.:}

[Wader2]

How on earth we ended up with a critical system that was not run in parellel for 6 months, no-one seems to know

This is undoubtedly the dual database problem, especially when each database has different names for datasets or even different datasets. To maintain dual running would have created a huge workload for the old, labour intensive system, would not have released manpower but the new, manpower efficient, system would have demanded extra manpower which we do not have.

Well that is a logical answer.

The other project that has seemingly disappeared without trace is MFMIS. Due for roll=out in April it was going to go stand-alone but with ALFENS ready to take over if it fell over. One newsletter early this year, deferred success, and nada nada.

[PompeySailor]

And don't forget you have to apply for it.

I got mine on the due day. Drew the whole issue out in cash and walked it round the corner to the high interest building society account. The alternative was pay £35 for a bankers' draft or allow the blood suckers to use my money, interest-free, for 3-5 days.

Nice feeling, especially as the bank had to get an emergency cash top up.:}

All forms completed, all bank accounts nominated. Just waiting to hand my ID card into the sprog on the "goodbye desk".

[On_The_Top_Bunk]

On this months pay run 1 of our guys was paid 7x his normal wage....

This was due to 1000 days LOA being paid for Oct. How many days has October and why didn't it automatically flag up? Error was due to our HR staff inputting a date wrong.

Has to be repaid at only 3 days pay per month.

Another has received 3x his normal mount and there are no clues why.

It's still a shambles. I expect the extra sub-mariners pay and other special rates the RN receive will also be a complete balls up. This month will no doubt prove interesting.

[PompeySailor]

This is undoubtedly the dual database problem, especially when each database has different names for datasets or even different datasets. To maintain dual running would have created a huge workload for the old, labour intensive system, would not have released manpower but the new, manpower efficient, system would have demanded extra manpower which we do not have.

Well that is a logical answer.

The other project that has seemingly disappeared without trace is MFMIS. Due for roll=out in April it was going to go stand-alone but with ALFENS ready to take over if it fell over. One newsletter early this year, deferred success, and nada nada.

Should have been a 10% confidence check, with minimal double entry required, but a wide enough variance of personnel and entitlements to see what would happen "if". The errors that have come to light are appalling, and if it was you or I making these sort of gaffes, we would be in for a chat without coffee at the very least. From what I can see, we ended up giving EDS more money for not doing the job properly!

I suppose we should be grateful that EDS are not in charge of refits, repairs or actual warfighting. Yet.

[DICKYMINT]

I think it's a vast improvement, streamlining office procedures..... S**t wrong thread:)

[Data-Lynx]

Tolerance please. In honour of the impending arrival of the RN, a recent bulletin has provided a feature called "splash screen" to make us sailors feel welcome. Here is an example from a new application called User Access Control System:

What will users see?

When the maximum number of users has been reached, new log in attempts will return one of the following on screen messages;

Maximum number of JPA users currently logging on has been reached. Please try again in a few minutes.

OR

The JPA system is currently experiencing high levels of usage. Please try again later.

During periods of extended access control further information will be posted on the JPA Log On Messaging Screen (“splash screen”).

Does extended access control mean what I think it means?

[PompeySailor]

Tolerance please. In honour of the impending arrival of the RN, a recent bulletin has provided a feature called "splash screen" to make us sailors feel welcome. Here is an example from a new application called User Access Control System:

What will users see?

When the maximum number of users has been reached, new log in attempts will return one of the following on screen messages;

Maximum number of JPA users currently logging on has been reached. Please try again in a few minutes.

OR

The JPA system is currently experiencing high levels of usage. Please try again later.

During periods of extended access control further information will be posted on the JPA Log On Messaging Screen (“splash screen”).

Does extended access control mean what I think it means?

Yep. "Computer says No".....

[BleepBleep]

On this months pay run 1 of our guys was paid 7x his normal wage....

This was due to 1000 days LOA being paid for Oct. How many days has October and why didn't it automatically flag up? Error was due to our HR staff inputting a date wrong.

Has to be repaid at only 3 days pay per month.

Another has received 3x his normal mount and there are no clues why.

It's still a shambles. I expect the extra sub-mariners pay and other special rates the RN receive will also be a complete balls up. This month will no doubt prove interesting.

I wouldn't be so sure about the 3 days pay bit! A recent PMA/JPA bulletin mentioned that the overissue reclaim rate was now capped at 50% of your takehome pay. That could casue some real headaches.

On the subject of the 23 oct rollout for the RN, is the fact that everything is ready for you "dark blue" chaps to be bought into the system the reason that us "light-blue" chaps will not have access tothe system for 10 dyas before your rollout date?!!!:ugh: :ugh: :ugh:

[PompeySailor]

I wouldn't be so sure about the 3 days pay bit! A recent PMA/JPA bulletin mentioned that the overissue reclaim rate was now capped at 50% of your takehome pay. That could casue some real headaches.

On the subject of the 23 oct rollout for the RN, is the fact that everything is ready for you "dark blue" chaps to be bought into the system the reason that us "light-blue" chaps will not have access tothe system for 10 dyas before your rollout date?!!!:ugh: :ugh: :ugh:

Yes, although there should still be a way to access the system via the higher level HR accounts for serious problems. Make friends with a Chief Clerk, but if he insists on tongues, wait until the 10 day period is up - it won't be worth it!

The recovery rates are shrouded in grey mist. If you ever find that you have had a large lump of pay taken off you, you need to get to the RAO/UPO and plead financial hardship. If, of course, they have overpaid you, then you should have kept hold of the cash and not been out and bought a conservatory with it.....

[mbga9pgf]

I wouldn't be so sure about the 3 days pay bit! A recent PMA/JPA bulletin mentioned that the overissue reclaim rate was now capped at 50% of your takehome pay. That could casue some real headaches.



No its not. This is a complete myth, that unfortunately some would like to believe. I had major issues with my pay, and had a substantial overissue. If yor refer to JSP 754 [02.0606] you will find that a MAXIMUM deduction of 4 days Gross pay still stands. I informed AFPAA, in no uncertain terms, that unless my overissue was repaid at the 4 days Gross pay, they would have yet another redress on their hands asking why exactly they were not following the regulations set out in JSP754. (this was after they deduced a previous overissue at a rate of 9 days Gross!!! After that Scottish thief who lives next door to the PM has a go, that didnt exactly leave me with much in the way of pay!)

I am currently repaying the overissue back at the correct rate (4 days Gross), and since all the problems I outlined to AFPAA in two snotograms (the first was obviously not worthy of response), I have had trouble free pay and would say that for those with corrected pay issues, the system is working far better and is far more accessible than the old scheme. (So far at least).

[Wader2]

Just thought I would pop in and see what operational bulletins were on JPA today and . . .


I gave up waiting.


Good luck.

[PompeySailor]

Impending problem that is not solvable (seriously). Not all JPA's fault, but will be hitting snagsville at the same time as JPA rollout to the RN.

Two words.

Submarine Pay.

:} :uhoh: :} :uhoh: :} :uhoh:

[Wader2]

Submarine Pay would not seem to be a problem.

I pulled down the 'Pay' tab and Flying Pay was not listed so clearly no problem.:}

[Wader2]

Just seen the latest JPA advice for RN joining. If you are on an RAF Unit then the RAF HR Staff will be there to help.

some RAF personnel will be administered by RN Clerks (and vice-versa for RN personnel in RAF units. administered by Unit HR Admin staff who are not of their own Service.

At least there are no submarines at Cottesmore

[PompeySailor]

Just seen the latest JPA advice for RN joining. If you are on an RAF Unit then the RAF HR Staff will be there to help.

some RAF personnel will be administered by RN Clerks (and vice-versa for RN personnel in RAF units. administered by Unit HR Admin staff who are not of their own Service.

At least there are no submarines at Cottesmore

Ah-ha. That's what you think. You just can't see them.

[LOTA]

JPA 'is exciting step forward' - Navy News, page 31, October edition.
'Worst system I have seen in 19 years' service' - RAF News, page 12, October 13 edition.
To tinker with a well-known phrase, is this the triumph of experience over hope?

[PompeySailor]

JPA 'is exciting step forward' - Navy News, page 31, October edition.
'Worst system I have seen in 19 years' service' - RAF News, page 12, October 13 edition.
To tinker with a well-known phrase, is this the triumph of experience over hope?

It is a superb deal, almost as good as Des Browne and his "tax rebate that isn't" deal. They tell you it's what you hope it is, and by the time you find out that it is something else altogether, it's too late.