View Full Version : Will CX take Direct Entry F/Os in Pax Fleet
Trashed Aviator
29th Aug 2006, 10:35
I just want a better job and already being type rated would rather not start as an s/o...
The Messiah
29th Aug 2006, 12:18
It is being negotiated right now but only to the pax fleet on an Oz base otherwise its the frieghter pal.
sizematters
29th Aug 2006, 12:52
the Oz base is being quoted as an "Example" actually it will be across the board with an "Integrated" pay scale...............................
Mr. Bloggs
29th Aug 2006, 15:30
Only if the current AOA members vote for it. If not, it will be DEFO on Pax fleet at a higher pay level.
BusyB
29th Aug 2006, 17:11
Don't think thats very likely Mr Bloggs. I would bet on CX implementing what they want for new joiners.:suspect:
cpdude
29th Aug 2006, 17:15
Only if the current AOA members vote for it. If not, it will be DEFO on Pax fleet at a higher pay level.
That would create a host of problems with all those DEFO on freighters!
Nope, can’t see it happening.:=
Mr. Bloggs
29th Aug 2006, 21:57
Cpdude: That’s their problem not yours or mine. Fix it at the higher pay scale and give the Freighter F/O’s a pay rise. None have seen one of those in a long time. Let them hire on the two different pay scales, ring any bells.
BusyB: If that is going to happen, may as well not vote for it and let them implement it. Same thing will happen with RP07. This will show if they want a way forward or has the Tiger not changed his stripes. IMHO the Tiger has not changed.
I believe most will vote for it as the next thing on the agenda is YOUR pay talks. We all know CX pilots will set others adrift in order to think of themselves.
I hope a time comes to vote on an even pay scale for Captains and their benefits.:ok:
cpdude
30th Aug 2006, 03:28
Cpdude: That’s their problem not yours or mine. Fix it at the higher pay scale and give the Freighter F/O’s a pay rise. None have seen one of those in a long time. Let them hire on the two different pay scales, ring any bells.
I agree it is their problem but I still believe it won't happen across the board. DEFO for all base areas will only happen when freighters are absorbed back into the PAX or Mainline operation and I don't think that will happen.;)
BScaler
2nd Sep 2006, 04:03
Trashed Aviator,
I understand your reasons for not wanting to slide back in your career progression and accept a Second Officer position here at Cathay. Cathay are aware that this is a problem for them in that they cannot get people like you to join as a Second Officer, or as a Freighter First Officer on the deal they are offering at the moment. They could attract guys in the past when there was a glut of pilots, but the market has now tightened up. They are missing out on really good recruits at a time when they really need them!
What Cathay proposes is to make a Direct Entry First Officer (DEFO) stream available to guys like you, but they don't want to pay the money that they currently pay First Officers on the Passenger Fleet, or have to deal with Bypass Pay issues for Second Officers here in Cathay.
They want to pay you less for doing the same job, and carrying the same responsibilities, as almost every other First Officer currently serving on the passenger fleet in Cathay. And there are other degradations in Conditions of Service (CoS) they would like to bring in at the same time such as leave and basings restrictions. See my thread on the hot oil for these details.
Trashed Pilot, I will not vote to allow the Company to offer you these reduced pay scales and Conditions of Service. I would like to welcome you to Cathay on the same terms the majority of the rest of us enjoy.
It is important to realise that DEFO can still happen under existing CoS. I hope the rest of the pilots here at Cathay feel the same way and vote the deal down.
cpdude
2nd Sep 2006, 05:14
What Cathay proposes is to make a Direct Entry First Officer (DEFO) stream available to guys like you, but they don't want to pay the money that they currently pay First Officers on the Passenger Fleet, or have to deal with Bypass Pay issues for Second Officers here in Cathay.
They want to pay you less for doing the same job, and carrying the same responsibilities, as almost every other First Officer currently serving on the passenger fleet in Cathay. And there are other degradations in Conditions of Service (CoS) they would like to bring in at the same time such as leave and basings restrictions.
You're right, they don't want to pay which is typical!
To hire a DEFO onto PAX at the current PAX FO pay would undermine the recruitment of Freighter pilots which are at a lower pay. Some say so what but you don't solve a problem by making another problem. What I believe they should do is hire DEFO as they did years ago at PAX FO pay and give the same pay to the Freighter FO's.
Oh, I just caught site of the Cos 07 pay scales USAB. What a joke. This is a bad deal. :*
whodunnit2
2nd Sep 2006, 06:29
BScaler - You have my vote. Certainly is a crap deal. :eek:
gtale77
13th Sep 2006, 14:26
Is the book for CX interview still out there? DEFO interview coming up.
any help would be appreciated.
Sqwak7700
14th Sep 2006, 06:56
I don't think the DEPFO is necessary. It certainly won't be put to use in Australia. The reason they say the first DEPFO will be in Oz is because that region's proposed pay scale is only marginally below the current pax scale. Australia is taking the least hit on pay from current pax pay. :hmm:
The base region that will see the most DEPFO recriutment is North America. That is where the pay scale is the ****tiest. Its like the old trick of "look at this hand, I'm gonna do something with this hand...." then they punch you with the other hand right in the face. :ouch:
Don't be fooled! These proposals affect EVERYBODY. No one is spared. It is like a cancer. It does not discriminate; It might not affect you now, but it will kill you in the end when it spreads and grows big enough. If you vote for this piece of ****t proposal, you will be bitching and moaning a few years from now wondering why the company wants to bring your pay down to C scale terms, just for the sake of "commonality".
That is the best reason they could come up with for this proposed pay scale - commonality. They claim this will bring all the other bases in line in regards to pay increases and percentages according to rank. I got an idea...why don't you bring the low bases up instead of lowering the rest?? That would bring the bases in line with industry standard, which is a much more resonable aim for a world airline.
Learn from the past, don't immitate it. Protect your young, they are the future. As corny as that sounds, it really does apply.
If you start pissing in the pool at one end, eventually the water will taste funny and warm at the other end. Vote NO!!!:=
Touch'n'oops
22nd Dec 2006, 12:07
You guys are right! DEFOs for CXs bases.
http://www.flightglobal.com/Jobs/2006/12/05/9001172/A340+First+Officer+-+Europe.html
:ugh: :ugh: :ugh: :ugh:
Jose Jimenez
25th Dec 2006, 19:18
Friend of a friend was successful in interview and was offered AMS A340 FO position
angryblackman
25th Dec 2006, 21:37
I'm fifty and only interested coming in as a DECAPT on the freighter fleet since I won't want to waste time sitting in the DEFO seat before retirement.
Five Green
26th Dec 2006, 04:19
Tha is what I like, a pilot with high expectations. Go for it ! Quit your job, apply for Rapid Command FO position go through a rather intense course where there is lots of discrimination (for what ever particular category you fall in) . Then if you make it to the line, you can fly with the FOs who were not good enough to pass command and who will be very happy to see you walk into their seat !!
You think you are angry !!
Ahh what a beautiful thing ! Merry Christmas !