View Full Version : Halifax Question
snchater 28th July 2006, 12:51 Does anyone know why the Handley Pape Halifax is so called?
I live in the Pennines and have often wondered how such a magnificent bomber was assosciated with a grey wet Yorkshire mill town.:confused:
BEagle 28th July 2006, 13:02 Manchester, Lancaster, Sunderland, Hastings, Hereford, Lincoln, Washington etc etc are a possible clue?
DH106 28th July 2006, 13:37 Does anyone know why the Handley Pape Halifax is so called?
I live in the Pennines and have often wondered how such a magnificent bomber was assosciated with a grey wet Yorkshire mill town.:confused:
Cos the Handly Page Heckmondwike/Liversedge/Brighouse don't kinda roll off the tongue in the same way ;)
Perhaps because it delivered Hell from its Hull it was named Halifax? (To mangle the saying...)
There was a rule girt by exceptions which explains all. RAF Bombers were named after industrial cities; flying boats after ports. So the triumvirate of Handley Page Halifax, Avro Lancaster (sired by the Avro Manchester) and Short Stirling.
The Saro London is named after the port city, not the industrial city aspect of London, causing much confusion. Its confreres were Supermarine's Southampton, Stranraer, Saro Lerwick, Short Sunderland and so forth.
There's a preference, but no rule, for alliteration - but presumably the Avro Armagh or Avro Albans didn't seem right then either.
And there were lots of exceptions.
HTH
ORAC 28th July 2006, 13:44 It began with a H....
Hanley, Hyderbad, Hendon, Hamilton, Hampstead, Handcross, Hamlet, Hinaidi, Hare, Harrow, Heyford, Hampden, Hereford, Halifax, Hastings, Hermes, Herald.
Theyd did it for individual aircraft early on:
H.P.42
G-AAGX Hannibal
G-AAUC Horsa
G-AAUD Hanno
G-AAUE Hadrian
H.P.45
G-AAXC Heracles
G-AAXD Horatius
G-AAXE Hengist
G-AAXF Helena
They did stick a few others in just to confuse: Clive, Gugnunc, Eastern, Western, Sweden, Brabazon and Victor - but I don't think they got a choice with at least the last two...
Handley Page Aircraft (http://www.handleypage.com/Aircraft_hp19.html)
BEagle 28th July 2006, 15:29 But I still think that the A400M should be the 'Bristol Bureaucrat'!
Kieron Kirk 28th July 2006, 16:41 What about Halifax, Nova Scotia.
Good grief there is even one in Queensland.
snchater 28th July 2006, 17:06 LoL DH 106 :)
If bombers were named after industrial cities why the Wellington?(farming town in NZ) :=
Even more confused now but thanks for the replies:ok:
Kieron Kirk 28th July 2006, 17:24 Before the Wellington there was the Wellesley.
Sir Arthur Wellesley later became the "Iron Duke", the Duke of Wellington.
Geographical location to be more specific, rather than an industrial city.
A book could be written on the subject of a/c naming and at least one has (am I allowed to advertise ?).
Names with Wings/Gordon Wansbrough-White/Airlife/1995/ISBN 1 85310 491 4
jabberwok 28th July 2006, 19:28 A book could be written on the subject of a/c naming and at least one has
Was it subtitled "What a stupid name to call an aircraft."? Approximately something along the lines of what Mitchell said when he heard his beautiful machine was going to be called the Spitfire. I've no idea who actually gave it this name..
Kieron Kirk 28th July 2006, 21:22 All will be revealed as to how, it is alleged, the "Spitfire" became such if you read the book.
How about the name "Shrew" for R J Mitchell's creation ?
jabberwok 28th July 2006, 21:28 How about the name "Shrew" for R J Mitchell's creation
Hmmm. Not the most inspiring name to escape one's lips.. Almost as bottom of the barrel scraping as the Short Mussel..
Oh, I don't know. A rose by any other name...
Names acquire their credibility by the deeds of their subjects. A 'Shrew' has a lot more credibility than a 'Spitfire' before the aircraft's naming, IMHO; the fame for Spitfire was all earned by its crews.
Had it been named the 'Shrew' people would have been just as happy to laud it as an inspired choice, and wonder what idiot would even think of calling it a 'Spitfire'.
From Wikipedia:
Cacafuego, a Spanish treasure galleon captured by Sir Francis Drake, euphemistically translated as Spitfire.
(The euphemism swaps the Spitfires' 'p' for an 'h'. Doesn't smell so good now, does it?)
Spitfire, a slang term for a highly-excitable or passionate person, especially a woman. Actress Lupe Vélez was known as "the Mexican spitfire"
jabberwok 29th July 2006, 12:11 I'm still not convinced that "Achtung, Shrew!" would have become as quotable.
Trivia Quiz.
The Short Mussel didn't exactly go down in the history books as a well known aircraft but what bit of it DID go on to better things?
BEagle 29th July 2006, 14:04 Actually, auf Deutsch it would have been "Achtung, Spitzmaus!", believe it or not!
So it would still have been a Spit! Rather better than 'Scheißefeuer'!
Ach, himmel!
Sedbergh 31st July 2006, 08:38 Wasn't there some strange naming system laid down pre-war by the MoD or Air Ministry or whatever it was? i.e. names had to be alliterative
Hawker Hart, Hind, Hurricane
Supermarine Spitfire (Shrew!)
Gloster Gauntlet, Gladiator
Handley Page Hampden, Halifax
Bristol Blenheim, Beaufort, Beaufighter
Short Stirling, Sunderland
Westland Whirlwind
Percival Proctor
but then clearly the wheels fell off the system (Vickers Wellington, Hawker Typhoon, Avro Lancaster etc etc)
There have been explanations in past "Aeroplane" but I can't remember the exact details
Yellow Sun 31st July 2006, 14:09 "From Hull, Hell and Halifax good Lord deliver us"
From an old Yorkshire prayer.
YS
A2QFI 31st July 2006, 15:37 Slightly off thread but quite amusing. The NATO system for naming Eastern bloc aircraft worked very easily on F for fighter, B for bomber, H for helicopter and so-on. The Russians introduced an aircraft whose role translated as Multi-purpose Fighter Interceptor (MFI) A junior officer who suggested calling it Flatpack was denied his claim to fame!
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