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neilmac
27th Jun 2006, 17:00
Been supporting the Dawn to Dusk Spitfire challenge which requires a PA28 to visit as many airfields connected with the Spitfire as poss in 15 hours. Its for a charity called Flying Scholarships For the Disabled. Being in the RAF, even though a groundie with a mere PPL I thought what a top idea. One of the early Presidents of the charity was Sir Douglas Bader so you would have thought the MOD with all that connections RAF/Bader/Spitfire would have waived landing fees?................not on your nelly they are being charged landing fees of £15 a time plus VAT. I hope the extra income is used wisely..............sorry I ll slap myself for that last comment!

gashman
27th Jun 2006, 17:54
Try talking to the Press Relations Officer at each station. If they can use it to keep the RAF in a positive light they may be able to influence the fee decision. It used to amaze me who used to get pax trips because they had good media connections (ex-footballers, tv presenters, navigators...). YOu may have to put up with the local media taking a piccie or two.

Good luck with the event, hope the weather holds for you.

GM

Pontius Navigator
27th Jun 2006, 19:20
I think it is an insurance issue. I think the landing fees pay the insurance; if fees are waived then effectively we would not be paying the insurance. The fees for insurance as a total collective and not based on individual risk.

At least that was my understanding.

fantaman
27th Jun 2006, 20:16
You might find that it’s all down to one person, the station business manager! All stations have thema nd its their duty to get as much cash for the MoD as possible, charity or no charity!

I recently helped out at the Northolt Photocall last month where we were raising money for the station charities fund. The witch there still charged us for the use of the station knowing fine well all she was doing was taking £600 away from childrens charities.

:ugh: :mad: :ugh: :mad: :ugh: :mad:

Confucius
27th Jun 2006, 20:19
I think it is an insurance issue. I think the landing fees pay the insurance; if fees are waived then effectively we would not be paying the insurance. The fees for insurance as a total collective and not based on individual risk.
At least that was my understanding.

Maybe they could waive the fee once the '28 has landed + taken off without crashing?

Jucky
27th Jun 2006, 20:58
The landing fee is an insurance issue. To avoid it you need to have a Crown Indemnity Clause written into the aircraft's insurance policy to the appropriate value for that weight of aircraft. The Clause must then appear on your insurance certificate. You then apply for a MOD Waiver certificate from some gadger at High Wycombe. (PM me for details) This certificate will then let you land at MOD airfields without having to pay a landing fee, but only at airfields that you specified when you applied for the certificate. It is not blanket cover to fly to any MOD airfield. You will also need security cleared as well this not a problem if you are employed by MOD just fill in your service/staff number on the form. If you are a member of a military flying club and the aircraft belongs to a club or is already kept at an air station the waiver certificate should already be squared away.

Hope this helps.

Regards,

Jucky

Pontius Navigator
27th Jun 2006, 21:24
Confucius, as jucky has explained accurately and confirmed my memory, it is an insurance issue.

How about us going on holiday. When we get home safe and sound how about the insurance company waiving our premium as we didn't claim?

No, it is all about collective insurance risk. Everyone pays a little, the insurance company makes a lot, and everyone hopes no one claims.

helidriver
27th Jun 2006, 21:43
Maybe ask a specialised aviation insurance company such as Haywards to sponsor you? I think Adrian Farmer is the man you want to get friendly with.....check him out in the aviation section of about us at the bottom of the page.

http://hayward.ait-s03.avondaleit.co.uk/index_flash.php

They have sponsored the British Helicopter Champs and the British Helicopter Team in the World Champs and you couldn't meet a nicer bunch of insurers!

By the way, this is not an ad, only passing help. I do not work for Haywards.

Hope this helps,

h

vecvechookattack
27th Jun 2006, 22:46
You don't need to pay landing fees. All you have to do is to present the following letter to the Ground authorities.


Dear Miss Wade (She's the editor of the Current Bun),

Are you aware that the MOD is charging landing fees for a Spitfire to land at certain airfileds even though this project is in the name of a registered Charity.


Your

Bluntie

That should do the trick

neilmac
27th Jun 2006, 22:57
Guys cheers for really helpful replies, Im sure insurance is not an issue because I can remember a casual user fee plus most light a/c have there own insurance around 7 mil the standard but of the top of my head(bald that it is) I cant remember the rules on mil airfields. Im pretty sure now there is no crown indemity? Just seems a shame that we cant help an aviation charity when all the civilian airfields seem to help them. It just annoys me so much how much we waste and when it matters.............Last Thurs was the launch of the event and we werent sure the BBMF Spitfire was gonna make it x winds etc, some chap obviously had a few bob said well wait I ll go and get my Spitfire! In the end we had 2 Spitfires plus OC BBMF supporting and a disabled lady who went solo for the first time that day. You just wonder at times has the services lost the plot to civil servants with no grip on reality!! Once again guys thanks for advice/support.
www.dawn2duskspitfirechallenge.co.uk

Confucius
28th Jun 2006, 14:13
Confucius, as jucky has explained accurately and confirmed my memory, it is an insurance issue.
How about us going on holiday. When we get home safe and sound how about the insurance company waiving our premium as we didn't claim?
No, it is all about collective insurance risk. Everyone pays a little, the insurance company makes a lot, and everyone hopes no one claims.

My tongue was rather in my cheek while typing.

FJJP
28th Jun 2006, 15:06
The civil servants involved in this type of thing don't need a grip on reality [at one time I had a lot of contact with them on the subject of display fees].

They have a rule book and they follow it religiously; if they don't, they stand the risk of someone higher up cutting their careers off at the knees if they don't agree with the miscreants 'discretion'.

Besides, saving money is the holy grail of the civil servant with aspirations of a career. That it's for a charity counts for nothing...

r supwoods
28th Jun 2006, 15:19
You just wonder at times has the services lost the plot to civil servants with no grip on reality!! Once again guys thanks for advice/support.
www.dawn2duskspitfirechallenge.co.uk

The airfield ops are probably contractorised to SERCO ....

tmmorris
28th Jun 2006, 20:21
neilmac, if the MOD can waive landing fees for RAFFCA aircraft on prior production of an MOD insurance waiver certificate (which they certainly do for Benson club ac) then they certainly can do so for yours too. Keep trying.

Tim