View Full Version : Chinooks in the Dark
pulse1
13th Jun 2006, 22:27
I don't normally post to ask about a particular aeroplane flying over my house but, a few minutes ago, I was intrigued by two Chinooks. They came low, right over the house but only one of them had any nav lights on. I had to stop Ppruning and rush outside.
Is it normal, in a formation at night, for the lead aircraft to be the only one with lights, especially in controlled airspace as these two were? I have seen this before, near Odiham when a darkened Puma (I think) passed very low just infront of me as I drove down the M3 - made me jump as I was looking at the strobe lights of the other one.
I must say that the noise of two Chinooks at night, when you can't see them until they pass overhead, is quite awe inspiring and I love it.
ase engineer
13th Jun 2006, 22:32
It's a requirement that if you want to go flying without lights (eg to practice your NVG flying) that you are accompanied by someone with lights so that the rest of the world without NVG can avoid running into you!
pulse1
13th Jun 2006, 22:51
Thanks ase. I thought it might be something like that but I had also thought that a number of aircraft flying close together, all with nav lights and strobes, would look very confusing to conflicting traffic.
ShyTorque
14th Jun 2006, 00:33
It's a requirement that if you want to go flying without lights (eg to practice your NVG flying) that you are accompanied by someone with lights so that the rest of the world without NVG can avoid running into you!
This must be a relatively new rule. Why would anyone flying a non-NVG aircraft be down at 150 feet by night, lights or not? :confused:
ShyTorque
14th Jun 2006, 00:35
It's a requirement that if you want to go flying without lights (eg to practice your NVG flying) that you are accompanied by someone with lights so that the rest of the world without NVG can avoid running into you!
This must be a relatively new rule and makes little sense. Why would anyone flying a non-NVG aircraft be down at NVG heights by night, lights or not? :confused:
SASless
14th Jun 2006, 02:17
In flight....what matter if your position (nav) lights are on anyway while using NVG's? The Strobes can be a real pain...and the red anti-coll can also become bothersome but nav lights not at all. In very dim light conditions the green nav light works great as a landing light (while on NVG's).
No wonder there is a need to cut the budget if you require two aircraft to complete a single NVG sortie.:ugh:
arthurwellington
14th Jun 2006, 08:33
Wild stab in the dark, if you'll pardon the pun, could be they were on a night tac formation sortie. Yes, lights on one ac is a rule thing.
vecvechookattack
14th Jun 2006, 08:57
It is a legal requirement that ALL aircraft display Navigation and Anti - Collision lights during the hours of Darkness. Aircraft in a formation are deemed as one aircraft and so the No2 always displays his lights. He will be formatting on the leader via his Goggs and the IR station keeping lights.
chevvron
14th Jun 2006, 09:04
These aircraft were operating under military regs - nuff said?
pulse1
14th Jun 2006, 11:14
Does that apply in a CTR as these particular Chinooks were? Although it was outside normal operating hours, most nights there are a few civil aircraft which carry out procedure approaches.
jimgriff
14th Jun 2006, 12:55
One often gets mil helos (Wokkas and CH53's) landing in a fields near here during the dark stuff. Have been told that they are dropping off FAC's who have to head for the hills by a certain time for mil ex's.
One has been in the field when one of these has landed and they didnt have any strobes or nav lights on at the time. :8
vecvechookattack
14th Jun 2006, 17:48
It applies in all airspace. Even at 50' in the middle of the Atlantic. However, It doesn't apply when on the ground i.e. when in a field as thats not classed as flying.
Basil
14th Jun 2006, 19:21
We didn't have lights on during an exercise (other than very dim formation lights)
One of the more interesting of my flying experiences was during a stream assault following a penetration when the stream leader called for lights on.
Sky illuminated with hairyplanes - ooer missus :eek:
It is perfectly permisable for any military aircraft to fly with no lights whatsoever at night providing the required NOTAMN action has been carried out through AUS at CAA. Otherwise a minimum of one aircraft must show lights in a formation.
HEDP
Kim Il Jong
14th Jun 2006, 23:42
It applies in all airspace. Even at 50' in the middle of the Atlantic. However, It doesn't apply when on the ground i.e. when in a field as thats not classed as flying.
vecvechookattack, Thats not true for military aviation, read the mil low flying handbook!
HEDP, nearly right, but there are areas where NOTAM action is not required, even in the uk.