Hercules comes to heart transplant rescue

[safe single]

How about a bit of good PR for Lyneham.....?


From the Wiltshire Gazette and Herald:

Mercy flight crew help save life
by Zoe Mills

A HERCULES from RAF Lyneham took part in an eight-hour mission to transport a heart for an emergency transplant on Thursday.

Flight operations at the airbase received a late-night crisis call from London's Great Ormond Street Hospital, which needed assistance to transport four surgeons plus equipment to Belfast.

The team had to prepare and collect a heart to take back to London for the operation.

A Hercules C130J standby crew was called out and ready to leave within 40 minutes.

The heart was picked up from Belfast and thanks to the co-ordination and hard work of air traffic control in London, the Hercules was given a straight route into Heathrow to deliver the heart.

Flight Lieutenant Paul Flusk, co-pilot for the journey, said: "It feels good to do a job that can help to save someone's life.

"The mission was completed in under eight hours and ran very smoothly which was all down to the work of the captain, Flight Lieutenant Mark Raymond, and the rest of the team in operations and air traffic control."

[C130 Techie]

Good old (or not so old in this case) Albert - Always there when you need him:ok:

[snaggletooth]

Good work fellas, job well done.:D

[BEagle]

Well done, 'Chalkie' and crew!

[Always_broken_in_wilts]

Thanks Beag's, that's the first mention of the "Crew" I have seen:mad:

all spelling mistakes are "df" alcohol induced

[C130 Techie]

Sorry when I said 'Albert' I meant the complete package including crew.

A cracking job by all involved at Lyneham as always:ok:

[Always_broken_in_wilts]

C130 Techie,
No dig at anyone in particular fella, it's just that the GE and ALM would have been running round with their hair on fire getting the frame ready for a prompt departure, round the route etc etc and as usual 50% of the team never get a mention. Ho hum:( Still job well done as usual!!

all spelling mistakes are "df" alcohol induced

[4fitter]

As per SOP Lyn personnel pull out the stops. Is this the Mark Raymond I flew with on 115 sqn ? If so, glad you're still alive !!

[BEagle]

Can only be the same chap - 'Mark, the ILS calibrator' as our ULAS students called him (when they weren't quite brave enough to call him 'Chalkie' in front of the other QFIs!). Nicht wahr, StopStart?

Now - lets have no more bitch-slapping. This was a good result for Team Lyneham - and everyone involved deserves equal praise.

[4fitter]

I'm with you there BEags.

Hi Mark, glad you're still alive and Mrs 4f sends her love. Are you managing the imprests better these days :)

[Now a 'J' Bloke!!]

. This was a good result for Team Lyneham - and everyone involved deserves equal praise.

AAaargghhhh!!!!

Thought we had killed all that 'Team Lyneham' B*ll*cks.:ugh:
You must be a buddy of our ex Staish.....!!!

Managed to use the trip as an example in a lesson to the stick monkeys today!!!:D

Well done the boys and the ground crew involved!!;)

Regards;
'J' Bloke!!:cool:

I blame the speeling on the red wino!!

[SASless]

Accolades to the ground crew for being able to get the aircraft ready along with the rest of the people involved in the evolution.


That being said, however, what a shame the hospital has to call upon the RAF.


In the USA, the Hospital would have a standing contract with a Bizjet firm (or dedicated EMS service), have a fly team geared and trained, kit prepostioned at the airport, the aviation side would be on standby as is the RAF, and the flight would have been done under a "Lifeguard" flight plan which provides for expedited service by ATC in all phases of ground and flight operations. Helicopters would be in place at each end of the flight if needed, 24 hours per day. In most cases, organ harvesting is done and the flight begins from that location.

[BEagle]

Ah - but in the UK our wonderful government can't afford to use all the money we piss away on the National Health Service for anything useful - they're more interested in useless computer systems which don't work, hospital administration programmes and looking after free healthcare for illegal immigrants with fraudulent National Insurance ('Social Security' for our US readers) numbers......

[Talk Wrench]

Hmmmm, Beags In ten thousand posts, cynical you may be.

Hmmmmm, correct you are.

But well done,nice to see a heartwarming story "ahem";)


Talk Wrench

[ExRAFAC]

Ahhh... how sad....So a C130 did some good...for once.

The RAF SAR crews do this regularly. Not just hearts but all sorts of casevacs...without looking for accolades!!!!

Accolades to the ground crew for being able to get the aircraft ready along with the rest of the people involved in the evolution.


ITS THEIR JOB!!!


As per SOP Lyn personnel pull out the stops.


There's a first time for everything!


C130 Techie,
No dig at anyone in particular fella, it's just that the GE and ALM would have been running round with their hair on fire getting the frame ready for a prompt departure, round the route etc etc and as usual 50% of the team never get a mention. Ho hum:( Still job well done as usual!!



Spoken like a true "I havent a clue what I'm talking about" chum

What a fantastic load of bollocks this thread is!!

[snaggletooth]

You have got to be trolling ExRAFAC, I can see no other reason for your vitriol.

I was one of the first on this thread to say a heartfelt (no pun intended) 'well done' to the team from Lyneham for a job well done.

As a front line SAR Winchman for the past 11 years I just can't see where you're coming from.

Get over yourself. The boys and girls done good.

What a fantastic load of bollocks you are...

[Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh!]

AAaargghhhh!!!!you called?

[unclenelli]

It's Not just Lyneham that do these good deeds for Gt Ormonds
BZN bent a 3* into Paris only a few weeks ago to do exactly the same thing

From what I hear, heart recovered and child doing fine

[Pass-A-Frozo]

In the USA, the Hospital would have a standing contract with a Bizjet firm (or dedicated EMS service), have a fly team geared and trained, kit prepostioned at the airport... Helicopters would be in place at each end of the flight if needed, 24 hours per day. In most cases, organ harvesting is done and the flight begins from that location.

Yes, and the hospital would add $60,000 to your medical bill.

[FJJP]

EXRAFAC

It was a job well done by all involved - a life saved directly by their actions.

If you can't say something lauditory [sorry, big word, I know] then please keep quiet.

Now, I suggest you remove your post; when it disappears, I scrub this one...

[nigegilb]

And Mark is one of the nicest guys you will ever meet. Congrats Mark to you and your crew. Hope you got to meet Zoe!

[Daysleeper]

I'm confused as to why a C130 had to do this flight. There are a whole host of biz-jet and turboprop companies in the UK able to do this work and a long way cheaper than the air force.

I guess on the night in question they had already called all of the civil lift.

[Nibbled2DeathByDucks]

From the Wiltshire Gazette and Herald:

Mercy flight crew help save life
by Zoe Mills

A HERCULES from RAF Lyneham took part in an eight-hour mission to transport a heart for an emergency transplant on Thursday.

Flight operations at the airbase received a late-night crisis call from London's Great Ormond Street Hospital......



I'm sure that Great Ormond Street Hospital called ASCOT Ops who then sorted out the Herc. This is what happened with the Tristar into Paris.

Either way, good job :D

[Daysleeper]

'm sure that Great Ormond Street Hospital called ASCOT Ops who then sorted out the Herc. This is what happened with the Tristar into Paris.

Which makes you wonder why we bother with a co-ordinated UK transplant set up. Bit of a waste of £15 million a year if every hospital that feels like it just phones up the military for a favour.

IF there was no civil lift that could possibly have got a team of surgeons to BFS and back in that time frame THEN there might be a justification for using the RAF otherwise its a dubious use of resources.

And as for the cost of taking a Tristar to Paris.....

[airborne_artist]

And as for the cost of taking a Tristar to Paris.....

I read:
BZN bent a 3* into Paris only a few weeks ago to do exactly the same thing

that the Timmy was diverted to Paris - which may not have cost very much more than some marginal fuel?

[nigegilb]

Come on guys lighten up! There is nothing better than being involved in this kind of thing. I remember sitting round a pool in Lilongwe when a lady from the Embassy came rushing down asking for the Herc crew. There had been a terrible train crash in Malawi and we were asked to help out. We did try and contact the UK??!! Involved flying into a grass strip near Lake Malawi to pick up the "boys" They sorted the wounded and we evacuated the injured to South Africa. The Lear Jet cleared our way, we had no dip clear and some had no passports. It ranks as the best thing I ever did. Funny thing is HQ thought we had gone to SA on a jolly!

:O NG

[Rev I. Tin]

Who gives a t*ss how much it cost, who took it or why?
Daysleeper, I am sure if you were lying in hospital waiting a new part you wouldn't complain who brought it to you!

[nigegilb]

To this day I have no idea who paid for our jaunt from Liliongwe,Malawi strip, Blantyre, Lanseria. We just did it cos 12 people desperately needed help!

[Daysleeper]

Who gives a t*ss how much it cost, who took it or why?

OK Before I get flamed to death here are some thoughts..

People on this forum are always bleating on about how overstreatched the RAF Air transport fleet is.....there are a limited amount of resources to go round, and an even more limited number of transplantable organs...

In the UK we have a co-ordinating body that is supposed to promote organ donation, match up donors with bits and arrange for transportation.

Now the complicated bit.

It costs MONEY to get surgeons to corpses and organs to people, if the Airforce are doing it every day thats fine I have no issues with that, other than the fact that as a taxpayer, it costs over twice as much for the airforce to do the task as it does civil air, thus we can only do HALF the number of operations. (even if you claim its "training")

If its a question of response time, several UK civil operators can get airborne in 40 mins, to keep that capability costs money if the airforce are going to do these jobs then as a civil operator there is little point in keeping the capability so it gets dropped. Now when UK transplant call up there are no civil aircraft avaliable at 40 mins because they are under utilised so they have to go begging back to the RAF for help.... a vicious circle ensues and the Beurocrats in the Airforce start charging 12K an hour for the herc and even fewer transplants get done.

Flying surgical teams around is not a core military capability, no one is going to shoot at you, it does not require any specialist skills, your too expensive and it diverts military resources that should be elsewhere.

As I said elsewhere, if the transplant co-ordintaion people had tried ever civil operator and they were ALL busy then yes a last chance call to the airforce is justified.

On the other hand if Gt Ormond Street are having to call ASCOT directly themselves there is a serious problem at UK Transplant.

[Rocket2]

And Mark is one of the nicest guys you will ever meet. Congrats Mark to you and your crew.
Seconded - I spent many happy hours in the back of an Andover playing bridge with Mark & the other crews; is there ever going to be a 115 Sqn reunion?:ok:

[Rev I. Tin]

As I said elsewhere, if the transplant co-ordintaion people had tried ever civil operator and they were ALL busy then yes a last chance call to the airforce is justified.


Um, we are the last chance which is why we are doing it.

On the other hand if Gt Ormond Street are having to call ASCOT directly themselves there is a serious problem at UK Transplant.

The chaps at ASCOT have to have approval from duty adult in order for MACA to be implemented. I am usually unconcerned with problems at UK Transplant, more concerned with launching the task.

Flying surgical teams around is not a core military capability

:confused: Always wondered why we had those Aeromed Teams and stretcher fit lying around.

Understand where you are coming from, however, it needs to be taken up with UK Transplant.
How do the think the headline 'RAF Refuse Child Life Saving Transplant' would go down with the British Public?

[Nibbled2DeathByDucks]

.... a vicious circle ensues and the Beurocrats in the Airforce start charging 12K an hour for the herc and even fewer transplants get done....



I think you'll find that this is classed as MACC C Cat A (emergency life-saving operations) that are conducted at no cost.

As the good Reverend says, if it were me awaiting a spare part, I know what I'd like to happen!!

[SASless]

Most of you skip over the salient point here.

Ask yourself why the medical authorities do not have a standing contract with an EMS provider for Learjet or similar aircraft and associated helicopter EMS operators for a 24/7 service capability.:ugh:

[Daysleeper]

RAF Refuse Child Life Saving Transplant' would go down with the British Public?

I never suggested you shoulden't take the task, just that you shouldn't have been asked.
I'm sure the airforce PR dept would never refuse, it deflects attention away for a moment from all the unpopular thankless tasks.


And I would have thought your stretchers/aeromed teams are lying around for your own patients, or for getting UK citizens out of places civil air CANT go.

MACA should be used where civil resources cannot, there is nothing here to suggest that the cost to the MOD of at least £15K is justifiable against the cost to the NHS of £5K for a bizjet, ultimately its the same people paying.

(its been a few years since I did charter brokering so those figures will have gone up)

Anyhow my congratulations to those involved in navigating UK airspace, must have been a toughy.

[FJJP]

OK, then. At what point [in GB£] do you draw the line? If it costs more than, say, £5000 do you refuse the task as an excessive cost to the taxpayer? Or shall we make it £7500? Or £10,000?

No? So why don't we just stop all this nonesense about money and just say 'bloody good show'?

If it was my wife or son, I know I would be awfully grateful and sod the cost...

[MarkD]

Perhaps a better question might be why something smaller is not available in say a Dash 8 size. A C-130 seems a lot for such a small package, especially when the RAF is one less of that type as of recently. C-17 is there and A400 on the way but what plans are there for sub C-130 lift, something like a C-27 or the aforementioned Dash?

[Fourfans]

I believe the critics of this operation have picked the wrong forum to complain about it. (Try an NHS Money-Wasting Forum) While there are some valid points raised, pooh-poohing congratulations of a crew and station that did its job well is unwarranted and misplaced.

There may very well have been other RAF aircraft that might seem better suited for a medevac role, such as a Dominie or a Jetstream. However, Lyneham maintains a standby posture with its aircraft that allow them to get airborne 40 minutes from the call, and they are configured for medevac missions. As for whether or not it is a core military capability, I think you will find that "Aid to the Civil Power" IS a core military capability, and always will be.

As for the aircrew, they do not go looking for congratulations after making flights like this. As one who performs missions such as these from time to time, I go to sleep at night secure in the knowledge that I helped save a life (or at least try to). That's all the congratulations I need.

Fourfans.

[Jobza Guddun]

Some good news from Lyneham for a change! Haven't seen any news today, but I would hope the PR department has gone national and squeezed out every bit of positive publicity from this - too many people associate the military with bad news these days. I know everyone was just doing their jobs, but what the hell?

With due regard to the SAR Force too. :ok:

[C130 Techie]

Slightly off topic but it was always reassuring to know that whilst in the Falklands, Albert or the Vicky 10 would be on hand to get you away if there was a compasssionate problem back home and no Timmy around. (Accompanied a few as tech support on Albert) (I assume this service is available the sunnier climes as well?).

Also did a number of Medevacs for locals and fishermen etc.

It may be a simplistic view but if the capability is there and the crews are able then why not provide the service. If nothing else its good PR, and good for morale.

[StopStart]

Can't believe people are whinging about this. Rubbish. Go away.

Well done boys, it's all good PR and Mark is the the most splendid of all our pilots. Except me.

:8

[Cragrat]

Lads and lasses of the crew and techies, well done, and I believe that was the purpose of this thread originally! ExRAFAC pull your head out of your backside mate, I'm sure the crew aren't looking for any praise but credit where credit's due. I'm sure that PR wasn't at the front of everyones mind at Ascot when the task came in. There's nothing more pleasing than the sense of achievement from any successful Comp-A/Medevac when you're sat on the apron back home, yes you're right ExRAFAC, it is part of our job. On a personal note, with a member of my family having had a major transplant I'd like to think that patients/families on waiting lists around the country could rely on the lads and lasses in the mob to assist in these highly time critical taskings in the future if asked to do so. Can we please stop all the s**t stirring!
Good work guys

[DummyRun]

Stoppers,

And me you fool.....

Load Moving......

speshly splendid at the mo!!

[Samuel]

I thought the purpose of this thread was to give a well-deserved "Well Done" for a job well done? What could have been done as an alternative is totally irrelevent, because it wasn't, and who gives a fat rat's arse anyway. The RAF were asked to do it, and did it well. End of story.:D

Some people could start a fight in a phone-box!

[unclenelli]

Like Samuel & Rev I. Tin have said before:
Well done to all concerned
As for those who stir la merde, F**k you
We do the donkey work and get the job done (when we can) at short notice
See previous posts about a Russian request to rescue a USSR submarine crew & a <90 minutes request to get some Harley St Docs to Paris to recover a heart (obtained EuroControl slot-exemption and re-routed aircraft, aircraft held on ground awaiting the Docs blue-light transit from London to Oxfordshire) - (Successful result in the end - well done to the medicos, all we did was provide the transport! Best of luck and condolences for the families concerned, whoever you are - we normally never find a name of the "customers" concerned)
Give us your name & address & in future we'll make sure that the stops remain in place next time - when maybe one of your rellys needs an organ yesterday!!!!!!
PS - I should know - I took the inital phonecall request to the RAF from Gt Ormonds on this one! Dr - Cpl. So Wind Your Neck In!!!
Re: using HS125 instead of C130/VC10/3*/ C17
The 2 UK HS125 RAF units, Cranwell & Northolt) do not operate 24/7 and require 14hr crew rest before a crew can be brought to readiness
Same as for all heavy jets!
3* into Paris was en-route BZN-AKT(slip), so the down-route crew were told to stay in their cypriot beds for an hour (Crew duty was not a problem in this case). As for costs, the 3* was already routing about 15miles to the west of Paris, so diverting only cost the UK tax-payer the difference in fuel price between BZN-AKT & Orly-AKT ) (ALL FIGURES APPROX) (around 15T @ 0.78/litre = £2400 - or 0.00005p for every person in the UK!!!!!!!!! (all figures rounded up!))))
WHAT PRICE WOULD YOU PUT ON THE LIFE OF YOUR FAMILY??????? (by the way 0.00005p is the equivalent of 20,000 Lottery scratchcards)

[chappie]

i'd like to add my congrats to all involved in making the process possible to help the patients and their families. why anyone has managed to say anything negative is beyond me. the fact is at the end of the day the job done and there's nowt that can change that....so do us a favour and wind your neck in.

i know from personal experience all to well how incredibly stressful the whole process can be and the fact that there was help when needed would have been a significant help to all parties involved. i work in an intensive care setting and the gift of life is not something to waste. please be aware that the patient being harvested is not a corpse yet....they will still be seen very much as a patient.i have prepped these patients to be ready for theatre and and taken care of their families who have had to make the decision i'm very mindful of the fact it is not a corpse that i am dealing with. yes they are brain dead but please show respect for them and their families. the amount of work that goes into getting the whole transplant completed is phenomonal and timings and availability of staff and resources etc can make or break someones life and the whole process can collapse. then the organs wasted and imagine having to tell the recipient that no i'm afraid we cannot continue with the surgery. imagine what that does to someone and their family.

it is not for us to wonder how the money gets spent or why it's wasted and what can be done to rectify the problem. that is the jobs for the bean counters and countless plebs that unfortunately make up our government.

good work everyone!!!

[air pig]

Hi Chappie.

I work in a Cardiac Transplant Unit, I am meerly at the receiving end. Those who deal with the recently bereaved have the hardest job far. I know because I have done it in the past.

Thanks to all in the chain, without you some people who are alive at present would be able to be here now.

[cazatou]

I remember in the late 60's being in the bar at RAF Salalah with a day off in front 0f us when, at about 2300, the SDO came in and announced that there had been a major fire on a merchant vessel where one of the 5hips Officers had received severe burns and required immediate Aeromedical evacuation to the hospital in Bahrein - which was the only hospital in the Gulf.

There was no alternative, we had to go. That, incidentally, was our decision because,at that time of night,there was no way we could get in contact with HQ Gulf to get approval.

The Patient survived; and I got to meet the only person who has won a VC & Bar and lived - but thats another story.

[Samuel]

You met Charles Upham then?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Upham

[Taildragger67]

Who gives a t*ss how much it cost, who took it or why?
Daysleeper, I am sure if you were lying in hospital waiting a new part you wouldn't complain who brought it to you!

Not long ago, two yachties in a race got into trouble two-thirds of the way down from Australia to Antarctica. The call went out and the ADF swung into action. Constant rotations of Orions (three in the air at times) to check on the victims whilst a frigate was tasked to work-up and head south.

Got both boys back safely. Then some raised questions about cost. Defence minister's quick response: this is what we do, this is what we've paid for, you couldn't ask for better inter-operability training than this - you an exercise all you like, but when it's someone's life in the balance, it tends to focus the mind.

They still talk about it as a job extremely well done. The message - get into trouble in our patch and we will try our best to get you out of it.

I also seem to recall some distant memory of a transplant organ or material being sourced in Paris, flown to LHR where a QF 744 had already been pushed back, the organ put aboard and expedited clearances given right through to Sydney.

What it does show is that the human race can work together now & then. A bit of hope.