How wide is your average farm strip?

[bencoulthard]

I guess about 60feet or 20m.

Does this sound about right?

How narrow can you go?

Ben

[bubbers44]

How wide is your gear? I use to land a Super Cub in pickup truck tracks in the snow when towing sailplanes in Tehachappi, Ca. My Dad planted two rows of barley so I could land my Stinson on the farm. Plenty wide.

[WorkingHard]

Mine is just wingspan wide. High wing aircraft used to avoid standing crops at this time of year.

[rogcal]

Mine is 18m wide at it's narrowest point and I have no problem with my T'Hawk even with 15kt xwinds.

[Humaround]

Lockyear's excellent farmstrip guide gives runway dimensions (width and length). And of course, since ppr is de rigeur, you can always ask the owner.
After a year of landing at Croft Farm, Defford, I still find 18m looks small on finals, but it's fine when I get there...
hum....

[gcolyer]

Try pererlee or upfield farm. They are 7m wide, i find it hard to judge the approach on narrow strips.

[stiknruda]

9m wide in summer

50m after harvest!

[chrisN]

Too often too narrow for gliders. I had to land out last year and thought a farm strip was wide enough for my 15 meter span glider - it wasn't. I later found that the resulting ground loop (as one wing caught the adjacent crop) did some minor damage. :hmm:

Chris N.

[shortstripper]

Too often too narrow for gliders. I had to land out last year and thought a farm strip was wide enough for my 15 meter span glider - it wasn't. I later found that the resulting ground loop (as one wing caught the adjacent crop) did some minor damage.


Yes, you'd think that there would be more work done on a high wing glider for that very reason? I know T tails were often used with that in mind but why not at least shoulder height wings like older gliders? There must be drag reasons I suppose? but you'd think that could be reduced with good design and a modern glass build?

My strip is either a single up and down pass with the topper, which equals around 16 feet when grass growth is slow, or two passes (32') when fast.

SS

[Lister Noble]

A pal who farms next door has told me I can put a grass strip in one of his fields if I want.
I would have to pay for the loss of income, but that is all.
Could get one around 7-800 metres long in a field adjoing our little paddock,in which I could erect a small hangar.

Plus points
Very handy.

Negative points

On my own-safety and no company.
Cultivating and sowing correct grass mix £250
Mowing once or twice a week,I have a little grey Fergie tractor but would need to buy mower £1000
Tractor fuel £100+
Rental of land,estimate 1 to 1.5 hectares to include taxiway's etc £150-225/annum
Cost of hangar and concrete floor £15000?

Spread hangarage over 10 years =£1500/yr

Say total £2000 /yr
Plus initial capital cost of £15-18k.

I can rent good local hangar space for a lot less than that and be with other pilot pals and interesting aircraft.

Lister:)

[bencoulthard]

But then lister, you could get a few buddies to come n fly from yours and charge them :-p

disregarding the 28 day rule of course ooooops did i say that out loud

[rogcal]

A hangar need not cost the earth to build and I picked up a good second hand triple gang mower for just under £300.
Despite the cost of setting up and maintaining a strip, the real bonus is having a plane just outside your house ready and waiting whenever you want to go have a jolly. You can't put a price on that!
and with that, I'm off for a flip right now (well, the sun is shining and there's a whole lot of scattered cumulus to go play in).

[YesTAM]

about nineteen feet.

[Genghis the Engineer]

The one I fly from is 18m wide, but I'd say having flown from quite a few that the average is probably around 12m.

G

[LowNSlow]

Ours is about 12m or so.

[foxmoth]

Is there such a thing as an "average" farm strip?

[LowNSlow]

By definition yes, but drivers, aeroplanes for the use of, must beware of the fact that to make an average there has to be at least one wider and another narrower. ;)

[chrisN]

SS wrote: "Yes, you'd think that there would be more work done on a high wing glider for that very reason? I know T tails were often used with that in mind but why not at least shoulder height wings like older gliders? There must be drag reasons I suppose? but you'd think that could be reduced with good design and a modern glass build?"

Drag and, I think, handling characteristics and view out, are why not, plus no real need. The modern glider fuselage is very low profile to minimise drag. The rape I landed between was about 5 feet high; some crops are higher still. A high wing would add profile drag, probably more pendulum and/or dihedral stability than required, and impede lookout in turns (of which gliders do a lot). There is no need in most UK areas I fly in, because with good performance, landable fields or aerodromes are almost always within glide range. I would rather keep the performance and forego the high wing. My mistake was to discard options of large fields with short crops and go for what I thought was a safe option of a strip - but misjudging its width as seen from about 1500 feet when I reduced my choices. ILAFFT.

Chris N.

[airborne_artist]

Lister N - remember that your farmer won't be able to claim set aside on any of the land that you use for the strip, or access to it.

You could surface the area inside the hangar not used by the u/c with really well rolled in tarmac scrapings. I've also seen portal frames s/h (plus carriage) at sensible prices.

[Lister Noble]

a-a,
Maybe permanent pasture.;) ;)

[QDMQDMQDM]

There's a strip in North Devon where I can only, only just turn the Super Cub around on it, so that's what 20-25 feet? I have been reduced to the ignominy of stopping the engine, getting out and pulling it round. Luckily I was on my own.

QDM

[tangovictor]

interesting thread, I'm thinking about purchasing either a fixed wing micro or a vla. However living on the Bucks / Oxfordshire boarder, hanger fee's, if you want to join a queue is just plain stupid, in this location.
So before I commit, I'm after a farm strip and barn to store ( wings folded or not ) in the M40 corridor or thereabouts, any info greatfully received

[Whirlybird]

Just to get things in perspective, Welshpool Airfield's runway is 18m wide, and the approach is between the hills and over a main road which tends to have high trucks driving along it. And I learned to fly there, as did many others. Just thought I'd mention it.

Oh, and another interesting point. A few people fly from (or into) Ashbourne disused airfield. The runway is full of ruts and potholes, with just a narrow strip at the side that is sort of flat, that you can land on. How wide is it? About the width of the wheels of most light aircraft.

Not farm strips, I know, but interesting, so hope no-one minds the digression.

[bencoulthard]

No worries WB I used the words "farm strip" as I may have the opportunity to rent some land in which i deem to be a cracking flying spot. I've measured it 630m but I was wondering theres about a 1m tall wall or so to one side, are there any rules n regs regarding that?

All in I reckon the whole area I'd like is 15 acres or 60,000m2 all I need to do now is calculate what I think it is worth before I commit some readies to planning. I've made some enquiries and arable land is leased at around £100 per acre per year which seems ridiculously cheap.

Any carrot crunchers here know better?

Ben

[QDMQDMQDM]

The only rule or reg is the 28 day rule and you had better just hope your neighbours aren't counting.

Could you not have a strip down the middle and let them grow turnips at the sides?

QDM

[shortstripper]

I've made some enquiries and arable land is leased at around £100 per acre per year which seems ridiculously cheap.

Ah yes, well ... That's the agricultural value, and usually on a rather more substantial area than 15 acres. Try renting a pony paddock for that!

You may be lucky if you find a friendly farmer willing to rent at near agric rates ... but don't hold your breath!

SS

[Monocock]

Having not been here for a while I have just read this thread with interest. I could qualify as a carrot cruncher I suppose but those who know me are aware that I prefer lightly steamed asparagus.

To revert back to the original question, there is no real minimum or maximum. I put mine in at 24 metres wide because that is the width of my crop sprayer. My view is that if I ever have to treat it I will have an easy job on my hands. However, since installing it (1989) I have made one end wider. This is because there is a camber half way down heading west and I have seen flying buddies veer dangerously close to the neighbouring crop on more than one occasion.

I have been to strips that are undercarriage wide and others that are 300 acre fields so there is no hard and fast rule. I am in the process of (gradually) installing a new one not far from Newbury and it will only be 6m wide and 400m long but will have less use than my base and will not be accepting visitors.

On another subject, someone mentioned a good point earlier about the lonliness of having your own strip. It can be pretty borong and I often find I miss the rainy day atmosphere at places like Popham when I go to the strip and it's pouring down. Also, the concerns I have about having an unwitnessed accident grow year by year and this is something that I feel uncomfortable with.

This time of year, strip ownership is a nightmare while the grass is growing like it is. I was mowing until 2145 last night and am praying for the growth to slow down. It's ok for the more wealthy type of "gentleman farmer" like stiknruda as he will have dedicated people to do this kind of thing for him but unfortunately this isn't the case for me:rolleyes:

I actually get more pleasure from going to the strip to escape from things than actually flying sometimes! It takes about 10 minutes to wander the length and back and its amazing how calming that can be after a day of hassle.

Finally, things have changed in farming. Until 18 months ago a strip was seen by a farmer as a waste of productivity and a waste of land that he could claim production subsidy on. Commodity prices are surpressed and the new subsidy regime is based around being paid for meeting strict rules of compliance for responsible land care etc. Therefore, an acre of wheat that used to attract £95 subsidy (grass attracted none) can now bw grassed down and the farmer can still claim the subsidy subject to a few criteria.

There are many fields now being taken out of production permanently and I personally feel that there has never been better scope for the establishment of new strips around the country. It might be that microlighters will be able to put their own in rather than visiting unannounced in future....:*

Farmers are an good bunch despite their reputation as gun-weilding boundary pacers. They are businessmen/women who want to make a sustainable profit from their land and will not welcome proposals that clearly do not reward in any way. I believe that sometimes life isn't all about using money to do a deal and you will be surprised what kind of mutually convenient situtaions can be put in place so that both parties are happy with their lot without a pound exchanging hands.

With regard planning permission, lease a 50 metre wide length, split it into 5 x 10 strips with electric fencing and use each strip 28 times a year. This gives you 140 flights a year. Have seen it done in several places and am yet to hear it hasn't held water with the men with clipboards.

If this isn't in your nature then just make sure you fly sensibly. "Take off and bugger off" is the best way to summarise responsible strip flying. On your return just spiral in from 2000 ft with a trickle of power and nobody will hear you return. Deliver a few Christmas hampers with aerial house shots in envelopes to the owners of very closely situated houses. It all helps keep the neighbours happy.



Off to crunch a carrot...

[stiknruda]

It's ok for the more wealthy type of "gentleman farmer" like stiknruda as he will have dedicated people to do this kind of thing for him but unfortunately this isn't the case for me


Oh Mono - you should have tried harder at school:E

Yes it is true that I have a peasant per 20 acres but over here in Narfalk (and good) they are plentiful. I find that they prefer an annual wheelbarrow of sugarbeet to a handful of my "estate currency" which can oly be spent in the farm shop - obviously at retail rates:D

On a serious note, I totally agree with the "take off, bugger off and no aeros or circuits". In 8 years of operating from my front garden I have only ever received one complaint from a neighbour and that was because a chum elected to do his aerobatic display over her garden with smoke on. I'll take anyone who lives close by flying as they all then become good ambassadors for what is widely perceived as a costly, dangerous and environmentally unfriendly activity.

As Leighton, the postie has just delivered my very large SPS cheque, I think I'll go and order a new John Deere with those lovely hydrostatic drive 7 gang mower sets. That'll improve the farmhand's productivity, one pass up and one pass down and the strip will be cut in a conservative 11 minutes. Shame you live so far away mono as I'll let the ag machinery ring know about it and you could hire it and my peasant!!

Stik

[chrisN]

Mono wrote: "With regard planning permission, lease a 50 metre wide length, split it into 5 x 10 strips with electric fencing and use each strip 28 times a year. This gives you 140 flights a year. Have seen it done in several places and am yet to hear it hasn't held water with the men with clipboards."

Sorry, but the men with clipboards have fought and won cases which courts have upheld that there is a concept of a "planning unit" - any or all of the land under one operator's control has only one 28-day ration.

As I keep saying on various fora, beware free planning advice from non-specialists (including mine now if you wish - but this happens to be true.)

Chris N.

[mikehallam]

West Sussex, Jackrell's Farm nr. Horsham, & in Lockyear's Guide (Pooleys don't care to ask !).
550m x 11m= 1 1/2 acres to cut -takes the Fergie an hour - set in the middle of a 16 acre hay field.
Used by Jodels, Emeraude, Cubs, Miles Messenger (once), Cherokee 6 & microlights.