RAF - Flight Ops Asst Selection?

[Martin4]

In about a month recruitment will be open again and i should get a interview at the AFCO for FOA.

Im wondering what this interview involves?

and also, i believe there is a second "interview", a few days at RAF Cranwell...?

What does that involve?

Many thanks,
Martin

[Jambo Jet]

In about a month recruitment will be open again and i should get a interview at the AFCO for FOA.

Im wondering what this interview involves?


This interview will assess your motivation to join the RAF (Why? Have you been a space cadet or a scout, team sportsman?) How well up you are with current affairs (newspapers, probably not the Sun though) and what you know about the armed forces and RAF in particular (Where in the world are we?, what hardware we use? etc).

The interview will last about 45 mins and there will be an opportunity to ask lots of questions. There will be an aptitude test too.

The second interview, this seems new to me, but I would guess that it will be similar to the first and will assess you amongst other like minded candidates. Perhaps even a few teamwork exercises.

Good luck with the app.

[FOMere2eternity]

Martin4

I think you're getting Flt Ops Officer and Flt Ops Asst (FOA) mixed up. FOAs are enlisted airmen, while Flt Ops Officers are commissioned officers. If you're not sure what the difference is you need to look at that bit first.

In essence, FOAs generally know what they're doing and Flt Ops Officers get nicer hat badges. :}

Without boring you too much with history, Flt Ops Officers are a relatively new invention, originally intended to take aircrew out of ops-type jobs. This worked to a point, except it was decided that some ops jobs couldn't be put in the hands of non-aircrew and then other jobs were just created for them, so in a number of cases they weren't necessarily needed and worked alongside an already established FOM (Flight Ops Manager - sergeant and above). Problem was, excess officers sent to work alongside sergeants are normally referred to as 'holding officers' and the branch carried a stigma.

It's settled down a little nowadays, except some do still refer to the branch as the 'telephone answering branch'. Moreover, the professional training didn't help with credibility - it tried to be everything and achieved little due to the diversity of FOO posts. Add to that a 100% course pass rate - despite a more than average spattering of morons - and it was always going to attract derision.

If, on the other hand, you do mean FOA - joining as a junior rank airman - your initial training is a little more established. FOAs used to be known as Assistant Air Traffic Controllers and nowadays come in two brands. Firstly there's the run-of-the-mill FOA who joins and will only work in ops-type jobs. The other type is FOA (Q-ATC), which although it sounds the same can be a totally different job. Particularly it means you will do a Air Traffic Controller (ATC) aptitude test at the careers office. If accepted you then join as a regular FOA, but about 4-5 years in you'll be offered the chance to convert to ATC and if you pass the course, rocket to the rank of sergeant. The downside is (unless they've now changed it), if you fail ATC training that's you out, so it can be a short career!!

I'm not sure I'd advise anyone I knew to join as FOO, simply because there's been some doubt as to it's continued future recently - many FOOs I know were surprised not to see the branch mentioned in the 3rd batch of redundancies. However, if you do get offered it, it's easy money, you can't fail the course and us sergeants do the job for you. :8

[Martin4]

Thanks guys :ok:

Yep its FOA im refering to. When i spoke to the RAF advisor at the AFCO he said he was at the selection board at RAF Cranwell. So... is that few day course/selection only for the flight ops officers?

As for the interview, iv been reading up about RAF aircraft, a little history of where they have been in the past, a little about where they are now and ops in iraq, anything else you recomend reading up on?

Thanks,
Martin

[FOMere2eternity]

Martin4

Not totally sure about the Cranwell bit - it could be necessary for FOA (Q-ATC) because the controller aptitude test equipment is there. Moreover there are some similarities to NCO aircrew with it being nearly direct-entry at sergeant. An enhanced interview wouldn't be a total surprise.

[A good headin]

Martin4
The Cranwell bit is to test your aptitude for Air Traffic Controller training. It's worth doing just for accelerated promotion and obvious financial advantages, albeit far behind our civil ATC counterparts. You won't know unless you try as they say.
If you want to do Flt Ops then stick with FOA and get some civil flt ops qualifications under your belt, the RAF will help towards the cost. If you really want to be an air traffic controller then try the CAA or Eurocontrol. A good friend of mine was told by the AFCO that he would be a Controller within 3 years after joining. 5 years later he left the RAF and is now a civil controller at Maastricht in Holland earning big bucks and enjoying his work too.
As a ex Flt Ops/Controller I would suggest you opt for this route.:ok:
If you need any advice feel free to PM me.:)

[Martin4]

Thanks alot guys, been a big help :ok:

[LookingDownFromAbove]

With regards to what to read up on for Cranwell, as well as the current AND FUTURE aircraft, and where the RAF are at the moment, current affairs and your own life are the main things to gen up on.
Your life should be fairly easy, make sure that you plug yourself as a leader and a motivational do-er (oh, feel the management phrases!, it's like a little game of b*llsh!t bingo). For current affairs the interviewers may ask you for one story from the last 12 months in detail, they might ask you for x from home and x abroad or they might ask you for major/interesting news from around the world. Something like, "In headline form, give me some news stories that have caught your attention in the last 12 months."
Sounds like a hell of a lot to learn but the BBC website (other news sites are available) has a good section about past history of the countries around the world. It's probably a good idea to avoid anything in the last two weeks, although obviously be aware of them, and avoid the major RAF things like the Iraq/Afghanistan situation, or they could well as you some REALLY nasty questions about those areas. Something like the expeditionary air wings set up could be good, but don't try and BS your way into a problem.
The Week is worth reading as it covers the world in helpful chunks, but remember they read it as well and interview people either every day or every other day so they now the last two weeks/months news inside out, if you can come up with a news story that is a bit different, like the Veniswalian (sorry for the spelling) flag changing direction, they might perk up a bit and remeber you well.
Hope this helps.

[FOMere2eternity]

...I would also suggest you avoid JPA - it's not really a talking point in polite circles...

[scroggs]

Martin, I think that some of the chaps above are giving you advice based on the Officer entry interview process.

As a cursory inspection of Martin's posting history will reveal, he is a keen young lad who is a bit lacking in the academic qulaifications department. He has an ambition to eventually be a pilot, but seems unlikely to pass a military aircrew medical, so is looking perhaps towards the civilan world in the medium-term. To give himself the best possible chance at both being involved with aviation and working for an employer who will encourage and enable him to gain the qualifications he needs to progress, he has chosen (after sensibly taking a great deal of advice) to try to join the RAF as a Flight Ops Assistant - which role, conveniently, requires no specific academic qualifications for entry.

I hope this background will help in your efforts to advise him.

Scroggs

[LynehamMuppet]

Well, Finally something i can comment on...

I joined up 3 years ago as an FOA but decided to re-trade to something more suited to my abilities i.e, Misplacing bags and generally making self loading freight's life a nightmare. :}

The interviews cover all usual things that are required from a job interview:

Leadership abilities,
How you work in a Team, (They'll want examples of both.)
Previous Job experience,
Clubs you've been involved in,
Hobbies. etc

The questions more specific to the Airforce:
What are your finances like (Are you a security risk?, Debt etc),
Your knowledge of the Airforce and what it does/when it was founded,
Family history ("Are your Parents divorced?" etc),
Aspirations("Do you want a career or do just wanna do 9 years?"),
and the Favorite. "Why do you want to join up?"


Both interviews will be at your AFCO, 1st interview is normally with a Cpl and the 2nd interview should be with a Flt Lt (Mine were). Just remember to Dress smart and have plenty of enthusiasm. It's already been mentioned but make sure you keep upto date on the news/headlines.

Hope that helps.

LM

[Martin4]

Thanks very much guys, also good to hear from someone thats been there and done the same selection/interviews and job as im trying to get into! :ok:

Thanks!
Martin

[ProfessionalStudent]

Your ability to join into the Flt Ops Branch will depend on your ability to say "No" to aircrew in as many ways as possible.

Also, you will take part in an Empire Building Exercise and a further exercise whereby you see how many hoops you can hold up for aircrew to jump through.

:E

[BEagle]

I'm surprised the whole of the Phone Answering Branch hasn't been outsourced to Mumbai by the cash-strapped MoD by now. Much as the phone system itself is run from Dumbarton..:rolleyes:

Meanwhile, just practise saying "Computer says naaoow!"

:E

[ProfessionalStudent]

Repeat after me...

"Hello, this is Station Ops. How can I hinder you?"

:E

[ratty1]

Well, Finally something i can comment on...

I joined up 3 years ago as an FOA but decided to re-trade to something more suited to my abilities i.e, Misplacing bags and generally making self loading freight's life a nightmare. :}

The interviews cover all usual things that are required from a job interview:

Leadership abilities,
How you work in a Team, (They'll want examples of both.)
Previous Job experience,
Clubs you've been involved in,
Hobbies. etc

The questions more specific to the Airforce:
What are your finances like (Are you a security risk?, Debt etc),
Your knowledge of the Airforce and what it does/when it was founded,
Family history ("Are your Parents divorced?" etc),
Aspirations("Do you want a career or do just wanna do 9 years?"),
and the Favorite. "Why do you want to join up?"


Both interviews will be at your AFCO, 1st interview is normally with a Cpl and the 2nd interview should be with a Flt Lt (Mine were). Just remember to Dress smart and have plenty of enthusiasm. It's already been mentioned but make sure you keep upto date on the news/headlines.

Hope that helps.

LM

So how did you get on?

[FormerFlake]

Repeat after me...

"Hello, this is Station Ops. How can I hinder you?"

Your ability to join into the Flt Ops Branch will depend on your ability to say "No" to aircrew in as many ways as possible.

Also, you will take part in an Empire Building Exercise and a further exercise whereby you see how many hoops you can hold up for aircrew to jump through.

Ignore the negative posts like above, and get used to aircrew wanting you to worship them etc etc.

The important thing in the interview is to be yourelf, and be honest. If you do not know the answer to the question say so.

Good luck

[ProfessionalStudent]

Former Flake

No. You're right. Good luck to Martin. The more OpsOs we have, the less piddly little pointless jobs us aircrew have to do.

And all the more people there are to worship us...:E

[Martin4]

lol.


Thanks FormerFlake, Thanks ProStudent... i think.... :p

[LynehamMuppet]

So how did you get on?

In what way?

My interview or Trashing pax bags?

If you meant my interview, funny enough i did ok as i've been in the RAF for 3 years now... Trashing bags? dunno, you tell me... come through LYE often? :} JOKE :}

LM

[ProfessionalStudent]

Always remember that selection for FOO is amongst the toughest in the military... You need to have failed at least 2 other courses before you'll be considered...:E

FOAs on the other hand... salt of the earth.:ok: