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flyboyUK2003
28th Mar 2006, 06:43
Hi all,

I was just wondering if anyone has heard anything about or has studied at Aerospace Aviation? Just trying to get some background info :)

PM me or just reply to this post, cheers guys and gals:)

assymetric
28th Mar 2006, 08:58
:confused: :confused: :confused: can you be more specific :confused: :confused: :confused:

RV6
28th Mar 2006, 10:36
Do you mean the organisation of that name at YSBK?

flyboyUK2003
28th Mar 2006, 23:59
Yes, i mean the guys at Bankstown. I'm thinking of doing some training with them, and wud just like to hear from anybody who's flown there before, what are the instructors like, aircraft, that sort of thing :)

Aussie
29th Mar 2006, 02:22
Mate,
I never trained there, however i do know 2 guys that have. They are now jumping ship to other places at Bankstown airport. They only have 10 and 23hrs each. They are dissatisfied with the outfit.
Aussie

Capt Fathom
29th Mar 2006, 03:31
Aussie,
What is the basis of their dissatisfaction? With such limited training under their belts, what are they comparing it to? Have they trained with another organisation?

turbantime
29th Mar 2006, 03:35
I'm not surprised with the "jump ship". Do a search on these forums for this company and you'll see why.

Doctor Smith
29th Mar 2006, 04:06
Avoid them like the plague. They pay their instructors peanuts, and on substandard conditions, ie contractor when you're not a contractor (there fulltime).
You want to do a flight test? Book it for 0900, lucky to have it start by 1300 if 1 particular person is doing your test:yuk:
Be very careful with your choice. I would not choose this mob.:suspect:

wdn
30th Mar 2006, 02:18
i agree with doc smith.

capt fathom - you only need to be kicked in the head once to realise its dissatisfying. waiting for a comparison would make these students the fools. congratulations to them for their early decision.

GetOffMyBack
30th Mar 2006, 03:07
flyboyUK2003,

I trained there about six years ago and found the standard of flying training and briefs to be very good. In saying that they are sausage factory and I'm sure you will find most schools at the YSBK are!.

When I was there the aircraft were well maintained and I never had any problems with them. Do they still have the PN68?

Doctor Smith is right, some instructors are contractors and dont get paid as much, this is no different from other jobs in GA. Just because your not in a higher paid flying job doesnt mean their standards have slipped all the instructors that taught me were contractors and are now flying for the White Rat or Jet*

I'd suggest doing more research into the company just remembering there not the bees knees of training schools but it got me where I am today.:ok:

Aussie
30th Mar 2006, 03:41
Capt Fathom,

Reason they were dissatisfied, was due to it being a sausage factory...

They didnt get any quality time with the instructor and in turn didnt learn much.

There words, not mine.

Cheers

Aussie

Captain Starlight
30th Mar 2006, 11:16
GetOffMyBack,

I agree with you, and would be surprised that SD would allow her very high standards to slip.

Most chief pilots are interested in where their fresh new CPL's were trained.

And there is a family connection towards QF.

This school used to rank in the top 3 at BK, and I'm sure it still is up there.

Did the disappointed ones discuss their concerns with SD?

If there is a problem developing she would need to know so that she can fix it.

Voting with your feet is an effective signal to send, a frank and personal discussion is more likely to resolve any unwelcome trends.

I've used their services a number of times, good people, good aircraft, friendly family type atmosphere.

I often recommend the school to others, and hope I haven't been giving bad advice in the last year or so.

There is a very good operator at Camden to consider if the desire to bypass the sauage factory is strong.

CS

Bort Simpson
31st Mar 2006, 03:10
Flyboy UK
It depends on what your looking to do. I.e. PPL CPL instrument renewal. What info are you after?

I have been training there the last couple of years. Every so often instructors leave and new ones start. So old knowledge of the school may not be accurate. It is like most of your flying. You need to find an instructor that suits you. (if that is the info you looking for). There is a wide selection of instructors there. What was said about the delay in the test time is common but how often do you actually sit a test. The real relationship you should be after is with your instructor. Although company considerations obviously should play a part.

Tell me more specifically what you want and I'll be happy to give a more specific recommendation.

To the person the asked about the PN68s. Yes, Z and R are still there. going strong:ok:

Bort.

Wheeler
31st Mar 2006, 04:18
I'm not a fan of that outfit, but in fairness, if the question had been something more like 'who are the best flight schools at BK'?, it might have been a bit more sensible. Asking if Aerospace is any good is just asking for anyone who is slightly disgruntled to 'name and shame'. Be fair, they have good points and bad points - as they all do. They are one of the biggest, well established and CASA don't seem to mind them. Makes you wonder why such posts are there and where they originate from at times.....

disco_air
31st Mar 2006, 23:47
The woman who runs it is a disorganised clown at best.

Spend your money elsewhere. It'd be nice if she got no customers AND no instructors willing to work for her. :E

...Disco

twentyelevens
1st Apr 2006, 00:57
Disco,

SD

Clown no, disorganised no. Dishonest...mmmmm what do you reckon

Flyboy....please avoid like the plague.

Getofmyback said:

"I'd suggest doing more research into the company just remembering there not the bees knees of training schools but it got me where I am today."

True but may I suggest that where you are today was much more of your own doing, hard work and dedication. Perhaps even a touch of honesty and integrity. I suspect you did not learn these at "the space".

Cheers

disco_air
1st Apr 2006, 01:06
Ok, i'll retract the clown comment, but I maintain "disorganised"!

Anyone who gets fired for turning up late if at all to lecture classes, failing to mark assessments properly and punctually, and when in lectures going on about useless tripe not relevant to the subject is "disorganised".

Then again, I'm only referring to SD, not her husband. Maybe he's the organised one.

...Disco

turbantime
1st Apr 2006, 03:36
Then again, I'm only referring to SD, not her husband. Maybe he's the organised one.

Organised or not, just ask qf guys who've flown with him what they think about him. :yuk:

podbreak
1st Apr 2006, 04:15
They pay their instructors peanuts, and on substandard conditions, ie contractor when you're not a contractor (there fulltime).


unfortunately this is commonplace, likewise paying staff casual and requiring full time hours. Its a disgusting practice many flying schools now undertake to remain competitive. I'm supprised the government hasn't regulated this somehow, moreover monitored the many illegal activities that these operators get away with. Its a sad story because the victoms don't want to speak up for fear of a blemished record (managers in bed with bigwigs elsewhere?), and their desperation for flying hours justifies this slave labour in their eyes!

zepthiir
1st Apr 2006, 14:12
unfortunately this is commonplace, likewise paying staff casual and requiring full time hours. Its a disgusting practice many flying schools now undertake to remain competitive. I'm supprised the government hasn't regulated this somehow, moreover monitored the many illegal activities that these operators get away with. Its a sad story because the victoms don't want to speak up for fear of a blemished record (managers in bed with bigwigs elsewhere?), and their desperation for flying hours justifies this slave labour in their eyes!


Looking at the new IR laws it seems more like the government monitored the practice of paying casual and requiring full time and thought it was a good idea!

Of course they dont call it being ripped off, they call it being flexible and I am sure that soon enough we will see how much of an advantage it is for all of us :yuk: :yuk: :yuk:

KLN94
2nd Apr 2006, 08:21
OK, then, which flight school is recommended at Bankstown to complete a CPL? I'm not talikng about aircraft, but the quality and standard of instruction from the instructors for CPL. BAsair? Whitworths? Schofields? AFTS? Aerospace? Any others?

Avid Aviator
2nd Apr 2006, 12:44
I've worked/flown with dozens of flying schools in Australia and believe Aerospace provides one of the higher training standards in Australian GA. They're not perfect - some aircraft are a bit old, some instructors are better than others, but standards are overall higher than most BK schools. They have an outstanding record of progression for staff and students to major airlines; doubt any flying school at BK would come close.
Shop around and make sure you're happy with who you choose, but don't discount AA on the basis of PPRUNE vitriol - I recognise one poster above as an instructor who was asked to move on for lack of flying and instructional ability.

disco_air
2nd Apr 2006, 14:47
Avid Aviator are you kidding?

You cant have worked for AA then have you?

Captain Fun
2nd Apr 2006, 15:33
Beyond the normal negative spin most topics on PPrune gain, just have a chat to those in the know around Bankstown. You will learn pretty quickly just what sort of reputation Aerospace has. I have never flown there or had any negative experiences with the place.
Away from heresay and speculative repuations, make a judgement on the place based on the pay and conditions of their instructors. It is well known around BK that AA has some of the poorest working conditions on the field. Now would an organisation with this notable characteristic be more concerned with;
- generating quality students that will be tomorrows leading aviation professionals or,
- the bottom line of the bank statement??
Make a judgement on the place from the facts, not PPrune attitudes.

RV6
2nd Apr 2006, 17:56
I can't believe I'm reading about the same organisation. Have things really changed so much? I did some training at Aerospace and flew the Partenavia and found S and Z D very nice people. I guess that was a long time ago, when they were a much smaller outfit, but I'm amazed that people are getting such a poor impression. Hopefully just a disgruntled minority.

Sunfish
2nd Apr 2006, 21:23
Perhaps the question ought to be rephrased as in "what schools would you recommend?"

1224
3rd Apr 2006, 01:49
FlyboyUK2003, have a look at General Flying Services at Bankstown. Also have been told that Witworth Aviation at Bankstown isn’t too bad either. Aerospace isn’t all bad, however the lack of standardisation and relatively
poor management doesn’t work well with an organisation of its size.

Like This - Do That
3rd Apr 2006, 02:12
Flyboy your signature says you're from Melbourne. Fly up for a weekend and get around to all the schools at BK (if it's at BK you're determined to train). After each school has given you their dog & pony show, ask them who ELSE they think is OK.

Some places will tell you "Noone else - the rest are crap" - thank those places for their time and wave good bye. The schools who are more on the level will probably mention a couple of other organisations. Over time you'll hear some of the same names popping up.

Check those ones out. Is there a reason it must be BK? Hoxton and Camden are also worth a look, particularly Camden.

Good luck, which ever way it goes.

Bort Simpson
3rd Apr 2006, 07:07
So Ladies and Gents
what about ME CIR at BK. I have done my CPL training at AA (not disgruntled like many others) but now a few senior instructors have moved on from there since my CPL days. (good luck to 'em). So I don't think AA is good for starting CIR training any time soon.

What are some recomendations for this? YSCN is prob. too far for me.

Bort

assymetric
3rd Apr 2006, 11:42
It has been a while, but my experience says you can't go past Whitworth for a ME CIR.

Flyboy. You might want to try Crane Air, my info tells me their flying school is ok. And dealing with Rod C. has always been a pleasure


Good Luck

Bort Simpson
4th Apr 2006, 14:28
It has been a while, but my experience says you can't go past Whitworth for a ME CIR.

So Assymetric, why was/is whitworth good for a ME CIR? What a/c do they have for this? How's the sim? and is CW still the CFI there?

Bort

Ps I've heard some good stuff re crane aswell. Although the instructors sometimes cancel your flight cause of better charter flight opportuities that this company gets.

Inter-turbine
26th Apr 2006, 12:08
I would'nt recommend anybody to learn at Aerospace. I have first hand knowledge that their aircraft are always breaking down!
The pay is crap which means the instructors dont really care.
My tip dont go there!!!!!!!!