GA STINKS

[Disgrantled]

I have just left a job because of dissatisfaction with conditions .I was paid well below awards rates, received constant abuse from a nutter of a boss and had too much labour unrelated to flying, if this is what General Aviation is about I think I should go back to my previous occupation.
Are there any GA organisations in southern Victoria that pay a liveable rate?

[Apophis]

be good to know who you worked for so i can avoid.

[Winky Dink]

HEAR HEAR!! Crooked industry!!

[Disgrantled]

At the moment I'm not prepared to post because of the repercussions, as has happened to others who have left in the past.
PM me

[Incloud]

You werent working up the top end by any chance????

[Gnd Power]

A few guys I know work for a Queensland Capital City Operator who fits that very same description.

Unfortunately there are still a few of these unprincipled ars.. holes about.

Anyway good on you for having the "balls" for snatching it.

Trouble is, someone else will just walk right in the door and so on and on, and on, it will continue.

[I Love This Show]

Been there, believe me!
I even had the 'privilege' of flying a skydiving plane for free, and had the hide to ask for something in return! Bah! Fortunately, the business has changed hands and the new boss is fantastic:D
In stark contrast, I recently tried out for military aircrew, and got through quite well. It's amazing the lengths these people will go to (considering the very lengthy application process) to keep me on the boil. I've received many base visits, both official and unofficial, almost weekly phone calls to find out if there's anything they can do for me... :ok:
It's nice to have your skills as a pilot appreciated for once, as opposed to just 'tolerated'.

[rmcdonal]

Ga Stinks..You should try Dingo Baiting :yuk: :yuk:
All fun and games. Wouldn't trade a **** flying job for a good desk job thou.

[Gnd Power]

Ga Stinks..You should try Dingo Baiting
All fun and games. Wouldn't trade a **** flying job for a good desk job thou.

There you go, as I said, someone will just walk in the door and on and on it goes.

Thought about a quadruple puck icon for those comments but decided this was probably more appropriate. :ok: (good onya..... now wonder conditions are so damm great).

[rmcdonal]

Actually Gnd Power. That job paid well. The conditions were very good considering the work involved, and the only reason I’m not there now is due the Wet season and a new job flying twins.
How much is a low hrd pilot worth? With the ability to hold a CPL in less then a year, you spend less time in training then any degree/ apprenticeship/ trade.
Sure some of your work may involve mowing lawns and heaven forbid washing planes, but I bet that a first year apprentice mechanic spends most his/her time cleaning up after the boss whilst watching and learning. Saying something like “Lets give the 300hrd pilot the Baron and send him of on an IFR Charter to Woop Woop.” Would be the equivalent of getting the first year mechanic to replace the engine of your car. Sure he could technically do it, but do you think he may just need a little more experience in the trade first? While I well agree there are some operators out there who well abuse a newbi pilot, what kind and how much work was actually at this job? If it’s a slow season in some places then all you can do is sit and wait. Obviously the more experienced pilots are going to be sent out to fly first.
As for the dingo baiting, never had more fun. The :yuk: well you’ll just have to try it to understand :} .
There are some good operators out there if you just look. And I don't mean just look down the street. Some parts of Australia are VERY hard to get jobs in with low hrs (and I’m guessing you have low hrs Disgrantled?). These places include any capitol city, the East coast, and Southern Australia.
Note to readers: I in no way condone underpaying pilots, or undercutting other pilots for work. The Award is the Award (all thou with the new system coming in to play in the near future I’m not to sure about that) but perhaps its just a bit out of date.
:} :} :} :ouch:

[onya]

I know of many '300hr pilots' that did the job just fine in the 'IFR charter in the baron', some with a lot less. Comes down to the individual and the training. For mine there would'nt be a lot of difference between the 300hr pilot and the 900hr pilot. I've flown with many cadets that would make the 2000hr pilot look green. Good training, good attitude, good driver. Nuf said.:ok:

[Charliethewonderdog]

Are there any GA organisations in southern Victoria that pay a liveable rate?

Victoria is covered by the "Award" under common rule. So make sure you put in for back pay. Ring wageline and they will sought it out. If you dont do it now no worries but remember you have 6-7 years to put in a claim.

[777tinpis]

Good training, good attitude, good driver.

Onya i totally agree with you there and i'm sure that coming from you flying with these cadets that you're quite experienced. But the question i ask is that what makes a "good driver"? Is it not stuffing up radio calls, smooth control inputs or just getting there on time??

[Capt Fathom]

GA Stinks ?
Judging by a lot of posts around here, Airlines stink just as much!:ugh:

[touchncloth]

Departing with enough fuel to complete the flight is a good start 777:E

[Reverseflowkeroburna]

Good on you Disgrantled for having the intestinal fortitude to knock back this dirtbag's kind offer of continued exploitment!!!

Fingers crossed that a trend may have started. :rolleyes:

[RENURPP]

Get used to it. It DOES NOT get any better as you move up the so call food chain.
Jetstar have seen to that!

you may end up with more $$$, the flying is boring, way too much time away from home.

You WILL remember your GA days fondly, trust me.

[QFinsider]

Whilst I understand the desire to feel a little secure, I think no matter where you are it is insecure, both in and out of aviation. The ramifications of this will be borne out in the fullness of time.

I remember my GA days fondly. I enjoyed being my own boss, the fact I could fly as often as the charter business permitted. I had a degree of control over my own destiny and thoroughly enjoyed the aircraft I flew...I know that is not always the case.

I like most GA people couldn't wait for the jet job...I enjoy the remuneration, the perceived status(not from the company) and I like the fact that I was able to tick the box, achieving what I set out to do...

The problem with an airline, is that unfortunately it is run not by pilots and engineers as Qantas used to be. It is run by accountants and all manner of non flying types...I beleive there is a lot of institutional jealousy, some generated by some of my colleagues arrogance, but a large part due to the fact that ACCOUNTANTS count, they can't fly....

It is this that sours the airline environment. There is a constant berating of our long term employee status, an undermining of our position driven I belive by factors other than cost...We can't just go do something else, they can(but they can't fly :E )

So as hard as the road appears in GA, look around when you are up there flying single pilot...All that view, no boss and passengers...Think of that and the fact that you are an hour closer..Even better is take time to think how much it costs if you were still paying to fly...Having been through two bouts of unemployment I understand the frustration...

But you will look back when you each get where you intend and say....Gee that was great flying!

[blade root]

Disgrantled,

I sympathise with your situation, the biggest problem is that there will be ten
guys/gals waiting to take your old job.

Thats the problem with GA to many people ready to exploit and to many ready to be exploited.

100 years ago the waterfront workers were some the lowest paid, then they united, now some of the highest paid.

The only way an operator makes money is when the aircraft is flying, no pilot, no money.

I applaud you on leaving, good luck in future.

[Towering Q]

Good on you for moving on. From my observations more GA drivers are voting with their feet.
There are decent GA companies out there that do pay the award as a minimum and it is these operators who will prosper as the dodgy ones go out of business.:ok:

[Disgrantled]

Hi had words with WageLink looks good.

[Dogimed]

Thats the problem with GA to many people ready to exploit and to many ready to be exploited.


Okay, I'll go out on a limb here... Perhaps the problem with GA is the pilots.

Would you stick with your great paying 40k a year twin job if an offer came from the airlines? No wonder operators pay nothing, they know that is there no loyalty from pilots looking for a better offer.


Oh dear...

Dog

[pakeha-boy]

Dog mate.....according to all involved in the aviation buisness......from the CEO down to the fueler/ramper.....its ALWAYS THE PILOTS FAULT!!!!.....buggered if you do,buggered if you dont....good point tho....PB

[Towering Q]

Dogimed... pilots are only part of the problem. If those operators you speak of paid better salaries then they may receive that loyalty. However, most GA companies are struggling to make ends meet so the large salaries are simply not going to happen.
Unfortunately it's a vicious cycle.

[Chimbu chuckles]

TQ if your average GA operator paid it's pilots 65-70K a year they would still dissappear out the door as soon as a jet operator called...only difference would be the pilots could more easily afford the 737/A320 type rating:}:E

Don't believe me?

15 yrs ago I was a Talair pilot flying Otter/Bandits/402s/Islanders etc and we were on about 4-5K/mth net + accomadation, fed at work, provided with transport to and from work, full interline staff travel, leave fares for entire family once a year to point of recruitment (for one or two that was the UK, Canada etc), 6 weeks annual leave etc.

That's a 65k+ package when 65K was still a lot of money.

And every single one of us was beavering away on a Senior Com subjects and applying for airlines.

The only real difference was we were having a bloody good time and a great lifestyle in the meantime...but it didn't change the overall situation for 95% of the pilots...only the top 4 or 5 guys had been there for decades...everyone else probably averaged 3-5 yrs.

[blade root]

Dogimed,

I agree with your comments. Why would an operator pay a pilot 50-60k when he can pay someone peanuts.

I get annoyed when I hear people willing to sell there grand-mother for a job.

Just makes it hard on other pilots to get a decent wage when pilots prostitute
there services.

[thekite]

Lots of thoughts here:

I got my start in commercial flying because I was an engineer. I noticed that helicopters tend to fly into the bush then do something foolish and need rescuing.

I was paid the proverbial 'minute noodles' as a new pilot, but when the beast died in the bush I (as an engineer) charged like GANGBUSTERS!

So if you have any supplementary skills, work them for all they are worth.

Now I work as an LAME for an NT airline and see the 'minute noodles' pilots come through here, and I will say this: If you stick to it you will end up with turbines under your right palm.

Better yet: do not do it! If you are already a dentist or some other well paying professional, ply your trade and grow rich.

Then, buy an ultralight or glider or warbird. I am into all of these.

Screw the shonky employer (Hi Bob).

Show him a view of the world, vertically, of the jungle, going straight down, at full throttle, through Wet Season thunderstorms, and say the magic words: 'You have control'

As if.

thekite