Rental of N-reg in the UK

[B2N2]

Tried the search engine...no luck.
A couple of customers are looking for N-reg rentals in the UK.
Did a search on the FAA database, 381 N regs on file.
A lot of them with aholding company so that's no help.
Any flight schools, operators or private owners that rent out N-reg?
Thanks....

[172driver]

Don't know what your clients want, but you can fly a G-reg (day VFR; I believe, but not 100% sure, geographically limited to the UK) on the FAA license.

[IO540]

Most N-reg planes are owner-pilot planes and tend to be well looked after classy well equipped etc, not something most owners would rent out. You might be able to rent such a plane if you are a current ATP, although I have seen some groups doing it with less.

[B2N2]

Thank you for your replies.
I am aware of the day VFR on a foreign license, however I am under the impression that a lot of schools or clubs will not rent an airplane to a foreign license holder, therefore the question about N regs.

[3PARA]

Seem to remember seeing a school training with N reg a/c at Southend a few months back. Don't know if they rent but may be worth further investigation

[n5296s]

I am under the impression that a lot of schools or clubs will not rent an airplane to a foreign license holder, therefore the question about N regs

West London Aero Club at White Waltham (~30 miles west of London) were happy with my FAA PPL/IR for day VFR and IMC. You need a checkout and a couple of hours of dual to get comfortable with the minor differences e.g. in radio technique and pattern technique. I've always run out of time in England before doing any serious soloing, but the club is happy to let you do it. You do have to pay an annual membership which iirc is about UKL140 or so, though I don't really remember.

n5296s

[p290951]

Why would you want to rent an N reg aircraft in the UK in the first place??

[Chilli Monster]

If you were an FAA IR holder who wanted to fly IFR in Europe, or Class 'A' airspace in the UK. (FAA licence holders being limited to VFR in 'G' reg aircraft).

[fltcom]

There are two N reg aircraft for rent at Fairoaks, one is a B36TC and at the expensive end of the market. The second is a very well equipped PA28.

[B2N2]

Thanks for the replies so far, anything more out there?

[IO540]

Another reason for these being scarce is that many/most pilots think renting out an N-reg is illegal.

This is one of countless bits of disinformation that have been spread (and clearly not unintentionally, on occassions, where foreign reg planes are concerned) around the UK.

I have checked this out, even contacting the DfT, and have not found anything suggesting this, or even suggesting that a dry lease (another very enduring piece of disinformation) is required to make it legal.

The problem with X renting a foreign reg plane is that X will never meet the DfT criteria for getting permission for aerial work. This is on their website but briefly IIRC you have to be an owner, a member of a group not exceeding four people, in the case of a Ltd Co owned plane you have to be a Director and there must not be more than four Directors, and the permission will be granted only for you getting training for yourself. These rules must have clobbered a lot of groups that exist/existed around N-reg planes.

So, when you come to needing training, or even a BFR or an IPC, you have to do one of the following

a) find an instructor who doesn't charge for it

b) do it in a G-reg. This, if he charges for it, implies him having to be FAA+JAA rated because I think you need an FAA CFI for a BFR and an FAA CFII for an IPC, and the instructor in a G-reg is always the PIC even if the "student" would be legal as PIC under some existing license he has. There are dual rated instructors around but they are very rare and usually expensive.

c) do it outside UK airspace (it is OK for the instructor to be present as a mere passenger, on the UK side of the FIR boundary)

One curious twist, not relevant to N-reg, is that a well known journalist recently wrote that the DfT told him that foreign reg planes that are JAA reg are exempt from this stuff. However, the ANO (Article 140 in the 2005 version) doesn't say that. I suppose it depends on what "foreign" means.

Checkrides are another problem. The DPEs that used to come over to the UK to do checkrides (at anything up to $1000 a time :O ) have more or less dried up.

All good protectionist stuff :O

The "holding company" is in fact the trust arrangement which is required if the beneficial owner is not a US citizen. Only an American citizen living in the UK could own an N-reg under his own name over here.

[BFMD]

B2N2

There's a chap who was advertising an N-reg PA-28RT-201 at Sheffield. I have some contact details for him, so if you're interested PM and I'll pass your details onto him.

[pheeel]

..but does anyone know if, for some curious and strange reason, I wanted to fly an N-reg in the UK on a NZ licence, i could?
I've looked at all the literature I could find on this, CAA Lasors, NZ CAA info etc., thought someone may have had previous experience of this strange question.

cheers for any answers,
ta-
pheeel

[mm_flynn]

..but does anyone know if, for some curious and strange reason, I wanted to fly an N-reg in the UK on a NZ licence, i could?
I've looked at all the literature I could find on this, CAA Lasors, NZ CAA info etc., thought someone may have had previous experience of this strange question.
cheers for any answers,
ta-
pheeel
I think FAR 61.3 gives the answer - No you can not use a NZ licence to operate an Nreg in UK airspace.


§ 61.3 Requirement for certificates, ratings, and authorizations.
(a) Pilot certificate. A person may not act as pilot in command or in any other capacity as a required pilot flight crewmember of a civil aircraft of U.S. registry, unless that person—
(1) Has a valid pilot certificate or special purpose pilot authorization issued under this part in that person's physical possession or readily accessible in the aircraft when exercising the privileges of that pilot certificate or authorization. However, when the aircraft is operated within a foreign country, a current pilot license issued by the country in which the aircraft is operated may be used;

[pheeel]

thanks for that, one place I didn't look but should've...