Pentagon to retire U-2 by 2011

[ORAC]

UPI (http://www.upi.com/SecurityTerrorism/view.php?StoryID=20060104-035558-8823r): WASHINGTON, Jan. 4 (UPI) -- A classified budget document approved by the Pentagon Dec. 23 calls for the termination by 2011 of one of the most heavily relied-upon reconnaissance planes in the Iraq war.

The storied U-2 spy plane would commence retirement in 2007 under the strictures of Program Budget Decision, or PBD, 720, according to Pentagon, defense industry and congressional officials familiar with the document. All spoke on condition of anonymity because the decision is classified. PBD 720 would retire three U-2s in 2007, six in 2008, seven in both 2009 and 2010 and the final 10 in 2011.

The document, one of a host of similar decisions approved in an annual ritual by senior defense officials as the finishing touches are being put to the department's budget request, does not explain the rationale for terminating the program, which has been unsuccessfully targeted for retirement multiple times in the last 10 years.

The decision emanated from the Quadrennial Defense Review deliberations, officials told United Press International. The review will be published early this year.......

[maxburner]

It's not surprising with the RQ-4A's capability and loiter times. Open press sources say 24 hours loiter at 3000 miles range from base. It's pretty impressive.

[Washington_Irving]

Not a bad innings, all things considered.

Not sure I'd have liked to have had a go at it. Who wants to spend 10 hrs slavishly trying to keep the airspeed within the 3 kt window between stall and Mach 1 and what other aircraft needs to have another pilot running alongside it in a corvette to talk them down.

No doubt NASA will be hanging onto theirs for a while yet.

[ORAC]

Global Hawks aren´t cheap, have a much lower payload, and are still relatively unproven - look at the loss rate for the few procured to date. I have my suspicions we will see the Dragon Lady in the skies for a few more years yet.....

[Regie Mental]

Why don't we make them an offer, ideal Canberra replacement!

[BEagle]

That'd take ages - Boscombe would have to evaluate the Corvettes!

Plus the infrastructure requirements for the U2 are probably far more than the tiny little air force of today could ever afford.

[brickhistory]

Unfortunately, I believe my service is starting down the road to becoming a "tiny little air force." Probably within what's left of my lifetime.

Same comments I see on pprune about contracting out work to private enterprises; what seem to me to be inherently military functions going to contractors; constant, unrelenting drawing down of continually aging aircraft; lots of chiefs, shrinking pool of 'rode hard, put away wet' Indians, yada, yada, yada.

It's been done before, why can't we see it?

[LowObservable]

Will believe it when I see it. G-H has been a long program, and although it has done good work it has yet to become fully operational due to difficulty of doing three things at once - deployed operations, standing up squadron and developing rather different RQ-4B bird. Compared to the U-2 it also lacks power and cooling - last plan I heard was that the MP-RTIP birds would have no other sensors for this reason.
The other yet-to-be-settled question is: what does the G-H do that a smaller UAV (Predator B for instance) doesn't?

[Archimedes]

How about starting production of the BAE/Lockheed Martin Canberra PR23/RB-57H as a replacement?

We can but dream.... :)

[wingman863]

I always wondered that; why does a U-2 have cars escorting it?

[H Peacock]

The accurate speed control needed when flying the U2 was, I believe, in the very narrow band between it's stall speed and Mcrit, and not Mach 1. Mcrit is the speed at which the local Mach number on the airframe (wing!) reaches Mach 1, but the aircraft itself is still subsonic (or is that transonic?).

H Peacock

[FJJP]

The landing chase car is to assist the pilot in the descent over the last 10 feet or so [it is manned by U2 pilot with radio on tower freq]. The vision from the cockpit is dire in the landing attitude and the height countdown helps the pilot to a smooth landing, preventing the stall on and heavy airframe damage.

[DET1]

Still regard it as one of the best platforms that I have ever come across. I know that there are 'problems' with the set up however they still get the job done. Not a lot you can do with a GH if you lose the link. At least the Dragon has a pilot to recover it in the event of a problem.

[The Helpful Stacker]

I always wondered that; why does a U-2 have cars escorting it?
I believe its also so someone can jump out and fit the little outrigger wheels before the a/c slows down too much and dinks the ground.
They use to use Subura Impreza's rather than Corvettes in Cyprus where the U2's weren't, honest.

[Seloco]

Try Google-earthing to 51*41'11.60" N 1*46'21.26" W.

Can anyone spot the Corvette?!

[diginagain]

It'll be tucked out of sight in a hangar somewhere - can't have people taking photos of such sensitive equipment, can we?

[KPax]

The vehicle with the pilot in is called 'Mobil' the pilot in the tower is called 'Air Boss' both essential for deps and arrivals for safety reasons. The truck with the 'wheels' is called 'Pogo' is manned by techies who put the outriggers back in once the ac has stopped prior to the taxi back. The wings can slide along the ground as the underside of the wing tip is made of titanium or something equally as strong. Lovely ac lovely people. Scrap the UAV keep the U2.

[Zoom]

But I thought the U-2 had been replaced decades ago by the TR-1.

And I think Mcrit is when shock waves first form over any part of the aircraft, usually over the cockpit or some other proud part where the air has furthest to go and so is going fastest.

But I might be wrong on both counts. :confused:

[k3k3]

I think they changed the nomenclature (septic speak) back to U-2 again, U-2R and U-2S according to role if my memory serves me right.

[Dan Winterland]

And TR1 was a mistake by President Ronald Macdonald, er...sorry Reagan. He had been given a brief which he misread and referred to it as the TR1 wheras the brief mentioned the RT1. Nomatter, they just renamed it TR1 and reprinted all the manuals to save dear old Ronald any (more) embarrassment.

[BEagle]

Are you sure about that, Dan?

It wasn't true of the President and the SR-71 either, despite popular myth.

Originally the R-12 (developed from the YF-12A prototype for the cancelled F-12 interceptor), the USAF wanted to term it the RS-71 to follow the RS-70, the still-born 1960's alternative reconnaissance-strike version of the B-70 Valkyrie bomber. But the meddling LeMay had preferred 'SR' to 'RS' for the RS-70 and then lobbied for Lyndon B Johnson's 'unveiling' speech to be modifed to term the new aircraft the 'SR'-71. This duly happened on 29 Feb 1964; however, the media transcript still referred to 'RS'-71 so the false rumour grew up that the change of nomenclature was the result of a mistake by LBJ, rather than by LeMay's interference.

The TR-1A was originally a 'tactical reconnaissance version of the U-2R with side-scanning radar, new avionics, and improved ECM equipment; the U-2S was an improved version of the U-2R with a more powerful and efficient engine, GPS and additional sensors.

The TR-1A first flew in Aug 1980, Ronny Raygun didn't become Mr Pres, until Jan 1981.

[Biggus]

In the best traditions of pprune the thread could move off at a tangent by including the EHI 01/EH101 'incident' in a discussion of the misnaming of aircraft by senior neddies.

Still, I digress ..........

[BEagle]

And the rumour of the "Is ya' 'ere for the 748 'andover, mate....", spoken by some erk to some dimwitted journo, leading to the HS748 being named the Andover in RAF service?

[Gainesy]

And the ATP nearly making it into print as the "80p". Dictating copy over the phone to a temp could be fraught.

[BEagle]

Hence, it is said, the Mitsubishi 'Starion' which should have been the 'Stallion' :rolleyes: .

There was a Chinese take-away in Lincoln called 'Regal Food'. But the impressive neon sign outside said 'Legal Food' - the order had been placed by phone :uhoh: !

Back to the plot - Mitsubishi also made an aeroplane called the U-2. Well, OK, MU-2!

[The Rocket]

Often saw that "Legal Food" sign, and wondered what on earth possesed them to name a Chinese restaurant "Legal Food":confused:

Not withstanding the fact that it's only a few hundred yards away from the Magistrates Courts:p

[LowObservable]

TR-1 (tactical reconnaissance) was a diplomatic term used when the USAF envisaged placing U-2s permanently in Europe in numbers - it was a way to avoid the "spyplane" stigma. At one point "TR-1s" and "U-2s" were being built on the same line. The fiction was abandoned because the tactical mission - which was to carry a pasive locating device to pinpoint SAM radars - went away and all the TR-1s and U-2s ended up in the same outfit.
I don't know that I have seen a final version of the RS/SR story, but I have always suspected MacNamara. RS was Reconnaissance/Strike and had been coined as a way to save the B-70. The SR-71 retained the weapon bays of the YF-12 and could have been modified and cleared to carry SRAMs or B61s. But there were people who did not want that to happen, so the change to SR - Strategic Reconnaissance - was more than a typo.
Not sure of LeMay's involvement - by the time the SR was disclosed he was out of the USAF, having run as Goldwater's VP candidate (EEEEKS!) in 1964.

[LowObservable]

The one that always makes me do a double-take is Hunan Cuisine. But then my eyesight is bad.

[Green Flash]

I had the very good luck to get a trip in the talkdown car at a base in, er, Europe. The mount of choice was an AMG. Given a massive runway and a Teutonic autobahn destroyer, well, you can guess :O Ferk me, but it didn't half go .....:ok:

[BEagle]

Only the best people drive AMGs....:cool:

I also had a trip in the chase car at a 'location in USA'. We were given the full tour of the 'facility' and the U-2 the previous day, then were invited back for a very early launch the next day. Interesting to see the pre-flight preparation, including the guy in his space suit pre-oxygenating. Then watched the crew-in - if I recall correctly, another U-2 mate had already done the pre-flight prep (and engine start?). Matey in his orange space suit climbs in , waits for the 'go' signal and we set off for the runway in the car - nothing like as cool as a Corvette, I have to report, this was some horrid Yank tank. Belt down the runway to have a last check for FOD, then back alongside the jet on its right. The driver gives him the thumbs-up, the pilot slams the engine to max thrust and the U-2 goes belting down the runway whilst we follow in the Yank tank to collect the pogos.

Then back to the 'facility'; by the time we'd driven back the U-2 was a distant speck, already up at Flight Level Lots!

Highly dangerous though - not one of us was wearing a natty yellow road-digger's vest...:yuk:

[Archimedes]

BEagle,

I've seen the documentation (sad git that I am) at the PRO for the Andover name, and it was chosen well before any 'andover of a 748 to Her Majesty. IIRC, there were some other er... interesting alternatives that were rejected.

[The Rocket]

Yeah,
But that was probably a REAL AMG, and not some sort of hairdressers Mercedes BEags:ok: :p :p

[BEagle]

Oooh - bitch! Get her! :p

354 bhp and 0-60 in 4.8 will do for me!

And the seats are 'Bordeaux', I'll have you know, NOT pink. Not at all, not in any way pink...:*

[Spurlash2]

Biggus
In the finest of traditions... have a looksee at this (http://avia.russian.ee/vertigo/agusta-101-r.html)
You'll no doubt see a link somewhere (if not in the similarity of design:hmm: )

[skygeezer]

That looks nothing like a Corvette to me.......must be the Subaru!!

[Lyneham Lad]

The Defense Department plans to accelerate retirement of key Air Force aircraft, including nearly half the B-52 bomber force and the full U-2 spy plane and F-117 stealth fighter fleets, in a bid to save $2.6 billion and boost spending for the services' prized F-22A fighter aircraft program. Full article at:-
http://www.military.com/features/0,15240,84991,00.html?ESRC=airforce-a.nl
???How does one insert text in place of the URL? The new version of PPrune doesn't seem to provide this option when inserting a link (at least, when using Firefox).