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lampeterexile
22nd Dec 2005, 18:29
I bet the troops really enjoyed his visit today. Must have made up for having to spend Xmas away from family and loved ones.

markflyer6580
22nd Dec 2005, 18:47
Yep can't think of a better present than that lying two faced bag of sh1t appearing at work,where are the snipers when you need em?:E

Fg Off Bloggs
22nd Dec 2005, 19:33
Standby for Defensive Posturing and instant response from Noo Labor Fanatic Mr Pr00ne!!

plans123
22nd Dec 2005, 19:53
And you don't think that we would be in the same position if we had a Tory Government??? get real!!!

If that mad old witch was still in power we would have most probably invaded Iran by now (rather than in 18 months or so!)

You think the lads in the desert the first time round enjoyed meeting John Major? All politicians are cheats and liers by their very nature and should be ignored at all costs regardless of they beliefs.

:ok:

Onan the Clumsy
22nd Dec 2005, 19:58
...but more so for Tony Blair

pr00ne
22nd Dec 2005, 20:32
Flying Officer Bloggs,

Sorry old chap, but if I saw him now I'd probably throw stones at him and holler a lot!

He did seem to go down rather well with the 4,000 who listened to him though, still, I don't suppose they are allowed to throw stones and shout, are they?

If he hadn't have gone you lot would have castigated him for that, it's his 4th time out there and he didn't have to go.

Brian Dixon
22nd Dec 2005, 20:43
He didn't have to come back...

soddim
22nd Dec 2005, 23:08
Bad enuff being stuck in the sandpit for Christmas without visits from the chap responsible for it.

Jackonicko
23rd Dec 2005, 01:24
If he'd gone on Xmas day, thereby demonstrating his willingness to give up his own Christmas, and if he'd helped serve dinner to the troops, then I'd be impressed.

Perhaps he'll be at Coningsby that day, serving the QRA groundcrew their lunch?

highcirrus
23rd Dec 2005, 06:26
http://www.private-eye.co.uk/pictures/covers/small/1148.jpg

A small gesture from an admiring public just before departure for the Sand Pit - as kindly expressed by Private Eye

tablet_eraser
23rd Dec 2005, 07:08
Anyone remember, first hand or otherwise, the story about Hoon's visit to Iraq in 2004? I suspect people might feel the same way now that Bliar has visited them.

Private Eye ran a story that a local Brit magazine ran a front page with the following (ISTR) headlines:

HOON VISITS BASRA IN MAJOR COUP FOR MORALE

In other news:

All bears are Catholic
Pope conducts toiletary activities in forest
Salmon live in trees and eat pencils

:p

t_e

Gainesy
23rd Dec 2005, 08:37
Reckon the Meeja Ops folks cocked it up, the clip I saw had all the usual ethnic mix of troops cept for a Gurkha.


PS. Why don't they use Gurkhas in the 'Stan? Born & brought up in that high alt environment.

PPS Merry Chrismas to all, wherever you may be stuck.

jstars2
23rd Dec 2005, 09:52
http://www.private-eye.co.uk/pictures/captions/blair_chirac.jpg Blair makes surprise Iraq visit http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41149000/jpg/_41149544_blairiraq2_203.jpg

Same guy - right? (Maybe same shirt as well)

oldfella
23rd Dec 2005, 11:01
I've seen Station Commanders and Squadron Commanders do the Christmas and New Year routes, especially during Gulf Wars. I would have been more impressed had this circus gone out during the festive period.

jstars2
23rd Dec 2005, 11:50
http://www.private-eye.co.uk/pictures/captions/bush_exit.jpg
IRAQI EXIT STRATEGY REVEALED

And I think this is his best mate!

RileyDove
23rd Dec 2005, 12:20
It's either: A heartfelt thank you to the servicemen for their efforts this year.

Or : A good photo opportunity and the chance to get Cherie and family some cheap gold and duty free.

lampeterexile
23rd Dec 2005, 14:56
its the latter:mad: :mad:

Hilife
23rd Dec 2005, 15:12
I cannot help but smile at the degree of discomfort that Mr. Sophistry himself exudes whenever he is surrounded by the troops.

Human Factor
23rd Dec 2005, 22:27
Should have gone on a TriShaw, would probably still be there!! :E

Tigs2
23rd Dec 2005, 22:39
I just wish that somebody could have stood up at his briefing and told him that he is a lying tw@t. Sleep well this christmas Mr Bliar because the families of all the servicemen that have died this year in Iraq wont.

movadinkampa747
23rd Dec 2005, 22:52
Do you think Blair and his side kicks shared a tent and one large toilet and shower room?

Anotherpost75
24th Dec 2005, 00:35
http://us.news3.yimg.com/us.i2.yimg.com/p/afp/20051223/capt.sge.qmy00.231205061308.photo00.photo.default-384x243.jpg

Back home now and another "mission accomplished"

plans123
24th Dec 2005, 07:39
Tigs2, We would have been there if we had a Tory leader or even a Liberal, so quite a pathetic post I think.

We get paid a good wage to do what we do and sign up knowing the risks involved. If you think otherwise - you are naive at best.

The sooner we distance our selves from American Foreign Policy, the better.

highcirrus
24th Dec 2005, 08:55
plans123

Err…..don’t think so old bean. In 2002/03, the Lib Dems were then and remain to this day, vehemently opposed to the latest Iraq foray (perhaps they looked at the thing historically – Post 1918 break up of Ottoman Empire, Treaty of Versailles, arbitrary drawing of Iraq national boundaries by the Western Powers and the resultant series of violent insurrections/coups from the early 1920’s to the present day).

Similarly, it remains debatable whether a Tory administration would have been sucked into the present imbroglio with the alacrity facilitated by Tony Bliar’s very special and remarkably close relationship with Dubya.

I do, however, agree with your sentiment that service personnel should be prepared for the kinds of situation currently faced in Iraq by Coalition Forces and with which, I am sure, you are all coping magnificently. The mantra that sticks in my mind from a number of lives ago was to the effect that if I couldn’t take a joke, I shouldn’t have joined!

A very Merry Christmas to you and all other Pprune readers/contributors.

CUNIM
24th Dec 2005, 10:32
Just a point on parliamentary protocol. When the Government of the day announce that they are declaring war on a country, the opposition party is honour bound to support the Government having been pre-briefed on the reasoning. No Government can afford to make such a declaration without firstly obtaining support - however reluctant - from HM Opposition.

Was out in Baghdad and Basra two years ago and was not impressed. Summer temperatures, no adequate water, no adequate electricity supply, locals quite reasonably getting annoyed. The Baghdad mistake was allowing the looting and wholesale destruction to make a return to normality almost impossible to achieve. Was staying outside the Green Zone with Iraqi colleagues and saw from first hand the effects on the locals. I agree with Highcirrus re Dubya

BEagle
24th Dec 2005, 11:00
"......sucked into the present imbroglio"

A situation which would, however, be extremely pleasant to experience with Natalie Imbruglia, one would venture to suggest.....:E

Colonal Mustard
24th Dec 2005, 11:38
I heard a rumour from a well placed source that all the peeps seeing BLAIR were vetted before hand in order to do a number of things

1:- Hands stiched into pockets via the sleeves

2:- cable ties used to "cuff" to the rear

3:- Hands stiched in a front folded arms position

4:- Food and non alcoholic drink handed out


The above results give the impression that all those listening either had their arms folded, at the stand easy position or in their pockets

The food prevented anyone from shouting obscenities, i`m not surprised it is probably the first time they`ve had a decent meal.

Lads and lassies....keep up the good work, youll always get a free drink from me:ok: except (i dont drink.........much)

BossEyed
24th Dec 2005, 13:04
Short and to the point letter in today's Daily Telegraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/main.jhtml?menuId=1588&menuItemId=-1&view=DISPLAYCONTENT&grid=P8&targetRule=0#head6)

RileyDove
24th Dec 2005, 14:53
Plans 123 - Very true that the servicemen and women sign thier lives away on the dotted line. However the old sense of it was to defend Queen and Country.
It latterly added the Commonwealth to that list and NATO commitments . However the justification for going to war was based on a number of factors which were over emphasised to say the least. To say there was a clear and present threat to the U.K from Iraq is doubtful .
Whether anyone in the future will wish to commemorate the events of GW2 remains to be seen - certainly I don't think the military leaders deserve any glory neither the politicians that sent them there. If in the long run Iraq has a democratic and free
country remains to be seen - I sincerely doubt there will be any tears lost over there for the British servicemen and women that made it happen for them.

vecvechookattack
24th Dec 2005, 17:37
Very true that the servicemen and women sign thier lives away on the dotted line. However the old sense of it was to defend Queen and Country and of course when you joined you were prepared to die for Queen and country.

If you take the kings shilling then you must be prepared to suffer the ultimate sacrifice.

oldfella
24th Dec 2005, 19:00
I've been collecting my shilling for decades but that doesn't mean that I have to respect any politician or his policies.

The main thing that annoys me about these sort of visits is that they do little good for the troops involved but results in more bu***ration factors for them in the preparation.

WE Branch Fanatic
24th Dec 2005, 19:24
Perhaps they were looking forward to playing pin the tail on the donkey?

JessTheDog
24th Dec 2005, 20:05
At this stage, his photo-opportunity (with extras courtesy of MoD Central Casting) is pointless as the Dear Leader is unlikely to see out 2006, as even Prezza has the knife out for him. The minature Nazi Blears only offered lukewarm endorsement of the Celestial Navigator's education vision.

Perhaps the photo-op was so his future masterpiece of the written word could have a few more Maoesque staged adoration photos.

jstars2
26th Dec 2005, 03:51
BossEyed

Would this be the letter to The Telegraph of 24 Dec 05? The link provided led to a number of different letter subjects. Has Bliar decimated the Scottish infantry regiments yet or is he waiting for the resignation statistics to become a little more spinable in the New Year?

Army overstretched

Sir - The Territorial Army is losing 600 volunteers a month. Some 800 Territorials have just been called up for service in Afghanistan. A TA member can be called up for only one year in three.

An exceptional number of serving soldiers have indicated a wish to leave the Army. It is obvious they are underpaid, but the real problem is clearly crisis-level overstretch and the worst recruiting figures in living memory.

Overstretch stopped a previous plan to cut regiments. A petition with 155,000 signatures, requesting an urgent review, was taken to Number 10 some weeks ago. So far only silence.

British sailors, soldiers and airmen will do their duty without question, while they experience demotivating, unfair, excessive stress. I wonder if the politicians will begin to do theirs.

D H MacRae, Edinburgh

Anotherpost75
26th Dec 2005, 04:18
http://www.number10.gov.uk/files/gallery/2005122214455_MOD%202.jpg

"Latest one to resign, Prime Minister"

BossEyed
26th Dec 2005, 10:21
BossEyed Would this be the letter to The Telegraph of 24 Dec 05? The link provided led to a number of different letter subjects.

Yes, it would. The link worked when I posted it but the DT pages have been faffed with since. It is now to be found here (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/main.jhtml?xml=/opinion/2005/12/24/dt2401.xml#head6), and reads:

Morale-sapper

Sir - I fail to see how the morale of the average British soldier serving in Iraq would be improved by a visit from this particular Prime Minister.

Quite the reverse, I would have thought.

David Ellis, Shenzen, China

Maple 01
26th Dec 2005, 10:49
I and 3,998* inmates of HMP Mount Pleasant felt the same about Maggie's visit - so what does your letter contain that's new other than a bit of Blair bashing?:hmm:

*CBFFI enjoyed the visit, according to the RAF News

JessTheDog
26th Dec 2005, 11:47
The Dear Leader is happy to visit "our boys" for the purpose of a photo-opportunity, sorry for building morale, but somehow cannot seem to take some time out from his busy schedule (August in the Caribbean) to visit those injured as a result of his willingness to pay (someone else's) "blood price".

www.thescotsman.scotsman.com


4,000 soldiers flown home for treatment, but no visit from PM

GETHIN CHAMBERLAIN
CHIEF NEWS CORRESPONDENT


Key points
• Blair criticised for not visiting injured soldiers
• 4,000 troops have failed to recieve recognition
• PM accused of 'lack of respect' for troops

Key quote
"They feel that they have been treated disgracefully," she said. "They have done their bit and it is a disgrace that they are being treated in this way. But from the way Tony Blair treats the families of those who have been killed in Iraq it doesn't surprise me that this is how they treat the wouned." - Rose Gentle


MORE than 4,000 British soldiers have been flown home from Iraq for medical treatment since the start of the war in 2003 - but not one has received a visit from the Prime Minister in hospital on their return.

The previously unreleased casualty figure reflects the true human cost of the war in Iraq. It is the equivalent of eight infantry regiments, or half the army's current strength in Iraq.

US soldiers flown home for treatment have received regular visits from senior figures in their administration, including the president, George Bush, and vice-president Dick Cheney.

Britain's wounded have been denied any such recognition, with only the Defence Secretary and a handful of junior defence ministers bothering to visit the Selly Oak hospital in Birmingham where the injured are treated.

Downing Street refused to discuss the reasons for the Prime Minister's decision to stay away from the hospital.

But opponents of the war said the government's failure to acknowledge the growing number of casualties reflected a lack of respect for the soldiers who had been sent to the Middle East to fight and they accused Mr Blair of being afraid of the negative publicity which might be generated by images of injured soldiers.

Rose Gentle, who lost her son Gordon in a bomb attack on a Royal Highland Fusiliers patrol in Basra last year, said she had spoken to soldiers who had returned injured from Iraq who felt that they had been ignored.

"They feel that they have been treated disgracefully," she said. "They have done their bit and it is a disgrace that they are being treated in this way.

"But from the way Tony Blair treats the families of those who have been killed in Iraq it doesn't surprise me that this is how they treat the wounded."

The SNP leader, Alex Salmond, said: "This situation is a damning indictment of a failing Prime Minister who is refusing to confront the horrific consequences of his own actions. While he is happy to go on triumphalistic media-friendly tours of Iraq, the fact that he has failed to meet those soldiers who have put their own lives on the line for his unjust cause, speaks volumes for his lack of honour and integrity."

Andrew Burgin, a spokesman for the Stop the War Coalition, said soldiers deserved more respect. He said: "Because of the difficulties of the government in Iraq they are trying to hide not only the casualty figures but the wounded themselves."

He said he believed that Mr Blair was afraid to be photographed with the injured in case the images were later used against him by protesters.

Exact casualty figures for the British Army in Iraq are hard to come by because the Ministry of Defence claims that it does not keep a log of injuries.

The picture is further muddied because many of those injured in action are treated in Iraq and return to duties without having to seek medical attention back in the UK. However, defence sources said about a third of those evacuated from Iraq are understood to have sustained their injuries in action.

The latest available figures for show that up to the end of September, 3,836 soldiers had been brought home for treatment, an average of four soldiers every day. Army sources said that at that rate, the figure was now expected to have passed the 4,000 mark.

Challenged previously on the subject of his failure to visit injured soldiers at the Royal Centre for Defence Medicine at Selly Oak Hospital, Mr Blair told the Commons that the armed forces were courageous people who had done an immensely worthwhile job in Iraq.

Some members of the Royal Family have made visits to the troops, however, including Prince Charles and the Duchess of Cornwall.

foldingwings
26th Dec 2005, 12:23
Jess,

You beat me to it. No media opportunity or perceived danger in visiting soldiers back in the UK, is there??

The man, as are his lying, spineless todies, is a shyster. None of them are worth the ink in the pen when it comes to the next election!

Maple 01
26th Dec 2005, 17:28
a spokesman for the Stop the War Coalition, bla.......

This would be the same Stop the War Coalition that previously described British soldiers in Iraq as baby killers and rapists? They've found a new respect for our Armed Forces? Or is this rampant political opportunism? No, surely not - strange bedfellows - those that miss the stomp of the jackboot of 'Marvellous Maggie' and the hard-left soap dodgers.

SilsoeSid
26th Dec 2005, 18:13
Anyone who agrees with the pathetic comment of vecvechookattack,
If you take the kings shilling then you must be prepared to suffer the ultimate sacrifice. should look at their (or if civi, any soldier, sailor or airmans), first pay statement and realise that the first deduction made is in fact the Shilling they gave you in the first place.

As soon as that deduction is made, surely that level of expected commitment has been bought back!

Anotherpost75
27th Dec 2005, 04:54
http://www.private-eye.co.uk/pictures/captions/bush_ipod.jpg

BUSH IPOD CONFUSION

highcirrus
27th Dec 2005, 06:33
I do believe that Scottish National Party leader, Alex Salmond, has beautifully encapsulated the continuing mendacity, shamelessness and utter dishonour of our Great Leader:

"This situation (not one of the more than 4,000 British soldiers flown home from Iraq for medical treatment has received a visit from the Prime Minister in hospital on their return) is a damning indictment of a failing Prime Minister who is refusing to confront the horrific consequences of his own actions. While he is happy to go on triumphalistic media-friendly tours of Iraq, the fact that he has failed to meet those soldiers who have put their own lives on the line for his unjust cause, speaks volumes for his lack of honour and integrity."

Meanwhile - BBC Website, Monday, 26 December 2005

Blairs take Red Sea winter break

Tony Blair has begun a family holiday in the Egyptian resort of Sharm- el-Sheikh, Downing Street has said.

The Blairs will be paying all their own transport and accommodation costs during their vacation
.
"The prime minister is now on holiday for a short winter break," a Number 10 spokesman said.

This is the fourth Christmas running that the Blairs have holidayed in the Red Sea resort, which was hit by a series of suicide bomb attacks in July. More than 60 people died in those attacks, including 11 Britons.

Last year, Mr Blair faced some criticism for choosing to stay on holiday in Egypt instead of returning to deal with the Asian tsunami crisis.

But Foreign Secretary Jack Straw said Mr Blair had been directly involved in decisions and was in regular contact, even while on holiday.

Downing Street imposed a news blackout on the Blairs' summer holiday in Barbados. The blackout was broken when Mr Blair visited a public war memorial service on the island.

RTR
27th Dec 2005, 13:57
And I would like to see Mr Bliar read some of the critics on this thread and others. Who can believe him when he ignores the wounded. That is unforgivable. The guys at the front are, sadly, nothing more than Bliar's media fodder. With the greatest respect for all of them. His sancitimonious BS is so obvious it should choke him. As for honour and integrioty Alex Salmond has got it just right. He thinks only of himself.

RileyDove
27th Dec 2005, 14:24
In all fairness there are some good deals to Egypt at the moment and we all know how Cherie loves a bargain!

JessTheDog
27th Dec 2005, 16:47
I understand that they will be taking a trip to Giza.

The Dear Leader is looking for architectural tips for his posthumous palace. Watch for ASBO breachers working out their community service in the construction of the Eighth Wonder of the World, the Pyramid of Blair!

Unmissable
27th Dec 2005, 22:39
Without wanting to sound like a supporter,.... what would you all have said if there hadn't been a visit?

Couldn't be bothered to .....
Doesn't care about.....
Always sends his cronies.....
Not in touch with the man on the front....

or would you all be saying

Look, he mised a golden photo shoot...

He was flying that way anyway, why didn't he pop in?...


If every political leader ALWAYS visited their troops on Christmas day, how long do you think it would take before some half brained terrorist worked out the sequence??

PLEASE lets think realistically. Any visit was better than no visit.

highcirrus
28th Dec 2005, 06:41
Unmissable

I really don’t think any of us would have noticed or cared much whether Bliar turned up or not in Basra on a pre-Christmas “morale boosting” visit to the troops he (or his successor) is intent on decimating in his ongoing “rationalization” of UK forces, once out of his present little spot of bother. Certainly his non-attendance would have made not the slightest jot to events in that city.

In the event, his attendance drew our attention, yet again, to his nauseating smugness, lying hypocrisy, cant and the utter cynicism of his latest trawl for good press and eye-catchingly “caring and compassionate” photo opportunities.

Further, we are all scenting “blood in the water” and our baser predatory instincts are rising like sap in a late spring. You may well be aware of the following, recently culled from the Spectator:

• Bliar failed to secure the assent of the House for the proposal to detain terror suspects for 90 days without charge.

• Bliar’s pension reforms, proposed by protégé Lord Turner, were recently contemptuously demolished by the Treasury (prop. G. Brown).

• Government has now backed down on its proposal to abolish juries in complex fraud trials.

• Bliar’s Racial Hatred Bill has been substantially rewritten in the Lords as the government is terrified of New Labour rebels and is therefore happy to collaborate quietly in the emasculation of its own proposals.

• Bliar is in full retreat on his proposals to reform disability benefit, which were announced in ringing tones in his party conference speech in the autumn.

• Charles Clarke’s (Bliar groupie Home Secretary, in case any of you have forgotten) proposals for identity cards, currently being torn to shreds in committee in the House of Lords, are due to be debated on the floor of the Commons in the New Year.

• The Education Bill, expected in the spring, looks doomed, for all David Cameron’s earnest protestations of support.

In short, Tony Bliar has lost the ability to govern and the smart money is on him being out by next Christmas, so grandstanding in Basra this Christmas is a bit like fiddling while Rome burns - and attracts the same contempt.

No visit would have been better than any visit!

plans123
28th Dec 2005, 07:56
Highcirrus,

Blimey - you standing for the Tories at the next election then???????

Bliar failed to secure the assent of the House for the proposal to detain terror suspects for 90 days without charge - why was that exactly then?

Mrs Plans, works for those unmentionable people that wanted it, the police wanted it, every body concerened wanted it.

It was a basic attack on TB and nothing else, the needs of the country were ignored, plain and simple and IMHO we are now weaker for it.

Just a point though..........what if that smiling simpleton the Tories have just elected as leader wanted to bring it in..........:}

StopStart
28th Dec 2005, 10:12
Well, I thought he was rather pleasant actually :p
Get him on intercom away from his minders and hangers-on and he's quite a laugh.

:)

Lafyar Cokov
28th Dec 2005, 12:31
Private Eye ran a story that a local Brit magazine ran a front page with the following (ISTR) headlines:quote:HOON VISITS BASRA IN MAJOR COUP FOR MORALE

In other news:

All bears are Catholic
Pope conducts toiletary activities in forest
Salmon live in trees and eat pencils

Ahhhh yes - that'll have been the world-renowned "Forked Tongue" produced by Puma Crews to the utter hilarity of everyone else......

I personally think that although Bliar would have been 'damned if he did and damned if he didn't' visit - the timing, straight from his fairly poor effort over the European give-away was a little cynical.

Yet again, troops being used to further Bliar's personal standing methinks.

RileyDove
28th Dec 2005, 15:01
Plans - I seem to remember that MI6 said that they hadn't championed the case for 90 days ! Nor is it the right of the Police
to engage in political statements to help government policy !
I think in the current case where the government even denies the purpose of the CIA 'black flights' landing in the U.K it was prudent that 90 days wasn't approved.

Letsby Avenue
28th Dec 2005, 17:09
If you give up your freedoms in search of security you end up with neither... Just look at how ACPO want to invoke anti terrorist legislation to gain access to private property in order to police hunting.

JessTheDog
28th Dec 2005, 17:21
Blair does not draw a single breath without thinking "what's in it for me".

Blair, Clarke and Blears acted disgracefully over the ridiculous 90 day detention proposal. As mentioned, they lied by claiming the security service wanted 90 days. Clarke manipulated the grief and outrage over the London bombs to try and browbeat opponents into voting for the unprecedented measure (which was not in demand prior to the London bombs - the words "knee" and "jerk" spring to mind) and used the police as lobbyists in a disgraceful breach of the principle of impartiality - I doubt the same encouragement was used with regard to the views of the police on force mergers.

It is easy to claim that the powers would be used sparingly and appropriately - however, ask a Mr Walter Wolfgang.

Hilife
28th Dec 2005, 18:00
Mr. Blair is not renowned for his negotiating skills, but what in heaven's name was he thinking when he single-handedly gave up over seven billion pounds of tax payer’s money - more than enough to pay for the FRC/SAR(H) Programme - in return for what, nothing more than a promise from the French to look again at farm subsidies in the distant future.

This must surely be the biggest defeat the British have suffered against the French since the ‘Battle of Carillon’.

Oh how I love an opportunity to kick a bad man when he’s down.

Letsby Avenue
28th Dec 2005, 19:18
The Times ran a quick article on that £7Bn, apparently it would reduce every single council tax bill in the UK by two thirds every year - nice...

highcirrus
29th Dec 2005, 05:36
plans123

No, I’m not standing. I’ve probably more in common with the old style Tory (and some Labour) MP’s, who now seem to be out to grass, rather than the young eager beaver voting fodder required of the modern day sound-bite and photo-op. I would guess that my quota of “care and compassion” would not be up to the required mark and that my sympathy with the Tebbit “on your bike” philosophy of social mobility, coupled with unfashionable views on strong UK defence and small government would not see me past even a Tory selection committee.

In respect of your point alluding to David Cameron, I personally would have the same reservations that I held towards Bliar’s attempted 90 day detention without charge legislation and would similarly have excoriated any Cameron attack on our ancient rights and freedoms had he attempted such legislating in the event he had been in power.

Anotherpost75
31st Dec 2005, 03:25
The Dear Leader has given his New Year (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/4570346.stm) message to his adoring public.

Nowhere can I see a reference to the UK armed forces, the great job they are doing around the world and the greatful thanks owed by him and the nation.

Surely some mistake?

oldfella
31st Dec 2005, 14:35
No mention of armed forces etc.

No mistake - just nothing to be gained from it

vecvechookattack
31st Dec 2005, 14:40
The UK begins 2006 in a strong position. Despite a more challenging context our economy is enjoying its longest period of growth while employment is high, interest rates and inflation are low. Hospital waiting lists and times are falling, crime is down and our children have had the best-ever exam results.

Britain today benefits from record police numbers and fear of anti-social behaviour is falling. We have successfully combined productivity higher than Germany and Japan, with a minimum wage of over £5 and lifting 700,000 children out of poverty since 1997. We are trebling the UK aid budget; for every pound of UK aid spent in 1997, we will be spending three pounds by 2008

The UK-chaired G8 Summit this year saw commitments to double aid by 2010 - an extra US $50 billion globally, including $25 billion for Africa - and to provide debt cancellation for up to 38 heavily indebted poor countries worth US $55 billion.

Everyone in our country who has worked hard to achieve this can feel proud of the progress we've made this year. Our achievements are being acknowledged across the globe, a fact recognised by the international community when we won the 2012 Olympics for London,

But 2006 is a year in which critical decisions have to be got right if we are to sustain prosperity and fast-improving public services for the long-term.

On schools, local health services, pensions, welfare, the Respect agenda and energy, we face big choices which will decide how prepared we are for the challenges of the future.

In public services like education and health, the challenge will be to ensure continuing investment is matched by greater responsiveness to the needs of the people who use and pay for them. Investment will continue but it must be matched by further change to meet the ever-higher expectations of the public.

In the Respect agenda, the success of the Action Plan we are publishing in January will be vital if we are to make a lasting difference in reducing

anti-social behaviour and effectively tackling the problem families who do so much to damage communities.

Meanwhile, in welfare, pensions and energy, we have to get right the decisions that will affect the prosperity and security of the people of Britain for the next 50 years. None will be easy, all will have to balance what is best for the future of the country with what is affordable now. But in each case, the decisions taken will affect the future for generations to come.

These reforms at home will be matched by the necessary agenda internationally as we continue to fight terrorism and bring hope and democracy to Afghanistan and Iraq. We will not let our resolve slip to tackle the dangers we face, both at home as so tragically illustrated on 7 July, and abroad.

2005 was a vital year for progress both on global poverty, especially in Africa and on climate change. But in 2006 the challenge will be to push further progress in lifting aid, in bringing the WTO to a successful conclusion and turning the agreement reached at Montreal into practical reality.

Britain in 2006 will continue to be one of the most successful countries in the world with a strong economy and good public services. We live in a beautiful, prosperous country where most of us work hard and live decent, honest lives. In an age of rapid change new challenges and threats will emerge constantly but we should always be grateful for what a great country Britain is.

We are one of the largest economies in the world. We have rising living standards and this is the only Government of any major developed nation investing more public money in health and education every year as a proportion of national income. We have strong alliances with the world's only superpower, America, and the world's largest economic market, Europe. The challenges we face are similar to those of every major developed nation in the world. But our capacity to meet them is well proven and 2006 will demonstrate this yet again.

WE Branch Fanatic
31st Dec 2005, 14:42
And how is Egypt this time of year Mr Blair?

vecvechookattack
31st Dec 2005, 14:48
why mention Egypt?

RileyDove
31st Dec 2005, 15:25
Vec - Are you dreaming or something ? We have a country which is constantly undermining the industrial base and exporting manufacturing jobs abroad . Likewise service jobs are being exported to the developing economies in the Far East.
Farming is being cut to the bone and some crops which were high profit are now hardly worth seeding. It is by far the most difficult times ahead for U.K farming and if the major U.K supermarkets don't stop needless imports of food we will eventually have a farming industry which cannot recruit new workers.
As for the health system - progressive PFI's and hospitals having their own budgets have now given us the vista of bankrupt trusts which will need to be bailed out by central government. Regards waiting times - the numbers have indeed been reduced -however speak to some old people and there is a genuine fear of going to hospital because of MRSA and a wealth of other bugs that have developed through lax cleaning standards.
The posibility of addressing global warming has been helped by the U.S agreeing to talk . However that is all it amounts to.
The growth of SUV ownership in the U.S is truely frightening - there still isnt an understanding of the peril the planet is in by the U.S leadership and as long as that is the case the problems
won't be dealt with.
Africa and it's problems cannot be addressed by pop concerts and wearing rubber bands on your wrist. Regime change of the type that removed Saddam from power is needed in Africa. Witness the mess that Zimbabwe is in ! - a country that not so long ago was vibrant and forward looking. Similarily South Africa now a multicultural country has some very big problems with crime and people wishing to get out of the country .
To deal with Africa - the leaders of the G8 need to stop selling arms and business jets to the continent. Rampant corruption
won't be dealt with through words.
Mr Blair has fronted many projects - however if you look at the actual gains you will see a burgoning civil service and debt levels increasing . The economy certainly isn't sparkling . Add to this the debate over education reforms with his cabinet unable to publically agree and I think the future for P.M Blair is looking remarkably short.

movadinkampa747
31st Dec 2005, 15:26
Are you all running for Parliament?

Hilife
31st Dec 2005, 16:03
As a result of giving away £7bn pounds in rebates during 2008-13 and rising to £2bn a year within a decade, I see no mention of how much the average household tax bill is likely to rise from 2008 onwards in order to compensate for such a major show of brinkmanship, no doubt this will be left to dear prudence or his successor to explain away.

With dwindling support from the electorate, the Labour Party and even his own Cabinet, it would appear that old "demon eyes" – only too aware that his days are numbered – is increasingly desperate to leave us a political legacy to be immortalised in our Nations history – not for services to foreign policies I suspect – or sell us out in the process for not supporting him in his final term.

I would not be surprised if Tony’s last decision will be to approve funding for an ‘Abraham Lincoln’ style memorial to be built in his honour next to poor old 'Winnie' in Parliament Square.

Must dash, I’ve a party to go too.

Letsby Avenue
31st Dec 2005, 17:07
According to the Times - That £7Bn giveaway is the equivalent of a two thirds reduction of council tax for every household in the country - nice...

And now for the facts; Unemployment rose for the 10th month in succession in November to 902,000, the longest stretch of increase for almost 13 years. More worryingly, the unemployment rate, regarded internationally as the best guide to the jobs market, rose to 4.9 percent, the highest level since 2003.

This is coupled with a massive influx of migrant workers on an unprecedented scale, who are prepared to accept low wages thereby suppressing inflationary wage pressures (300,000 since last May) – That’s why most of us, despite earning huge amounts of money, can no longer afford to go on holiday any more. We don’t need a 2.5% pay-rise, more like 11% just to keep up.

Inflationary pressures are also capped by removing anything from the RPI that was likely to push it up, house prices and council taxes for example, and when that wizard wheeze starts to burst at the seems redo the calculation of the RPI and trade it for the European RPX.

The massive imports of cheap Chinese goods are also having a deflationary effect but only at the expense of our own manufacturing industry which in turn is killing our pensions. (Plus the £5Bn annual raid)

So for all the apparent short term ‘feel good factor’ long term lasting damage is being done by NuLab and the sooner we can get shot of them the better – Unfortunately generous DLA, unemployment and a raft of other generous long term benefits buys just enough votes to keep these clowns in power.

This country needs to wake up before it’s too late.

Anotherpost75
2nd Jan 2006, 00:46
RileyDove

Perhaps vecvechookattack should have preceded his post with an acknowledgment that he was quoting the Dear Leader’s New Year message verbatim. Only then would you have been able to realize that, far from dreaming, you were in fact reading the latest fantasy from an office barely surpassed in brass-necked spin by the former cold war Kremlin.

pr00ne
2nd Jan 2006, 19:10
RileyDove,

Undermining our manufacturing base? EVERY developed economy is exporting low tech assembly and manufacturing jobs to low wage economies, not just the UK. If you want to HAVE a manufacturing economy then it is the only way to survive, try and compete with an economy that pays its work force in a year what you pay in a week and see how long it is before you go bust!
We have subsidised farming for decades, no other industry has been so mollycoddled and artificially supported in the history of capitalism.

I agree with what you say about the USA but regime change in Africa? Are you mad? Just look at the popularity of Bush and Blair over Iraq, if they tried it in Africa I think there would be hell to pay, regime change is illegal and rightly so, any tin pot imperialism displayed over Africa would quite rightly be condemned the world over and most probably result in mass civil disobedience here at home.

Hilife,

Germany is increasing its contributions to the EU by 40% more than the UK to make it the largest net contributor, the UK will in fact see a decrease in its net contributions after 2013 even if the growth figures achieved are half what is being forecast.

Letsby Avenue,

My you are desperate, unemployment? We have the highest number of people in work in our history and a record number of vacancies. I remember what it was like under Thatcher in the eighties, we would have given our right arm for figures anywhere near 4.9%, ask the French how they feel about it! An unemployment figure of 902,000? There were over a million out of work in 1940!

Without those migrant workers our economy would be stuffed, we can’t find our own Bus drivers, Dental assistants, Waiters or a whole host of jobs as there are not enough people available in the labour market to do the jobs as they can all find higher paid work elsewhere.

Those massive imports of cheap Chinese produced goods are actually being manufactured for the likes of Hornby, Compaq, Dell, Intel and a whole host of Western companies, they earn profits for them and tie China into the capitalist system which can only be a good thing for all of us.

Generous long term benefits? You are having a laugh, I have clients who live in abject misery on “generous benefits” Don’t believe all you read in rags like the Mail…….

Whilst agreeing that Blair has peaked and his style is now a hindrance to good Government, please leave the histrionics aside.

BTW,

I think Brown will make mincemeat of the Tory Blair clone that is Cameron.

JessTheDog
2nd Jan 2006, 20:06
It is good to see that, in our Workers' Paradise, the proletariat enjoys the same level of healthcare to us proles as the Dear Leader!

From the BBC:

When Tony Blair had treatment to correct an irregular heartbeat he was back running the country within days looking, as aides said at the time, "fresh and alert".

For Stephen Eeley, who needs the same procedure, the outlook is far less rosy.

He has been kicked off the waiting list at John Radcliffe Hospital, Oxford, and now faces a future feeling "tired and breathless".


The independence granted to the Bank of England by Gordon Brown after the 1997 election was a bold and inspired move. It is a shame that it was the only wise economic decision taken over the last 9 years. Leaving aside some social justice tinkering (such as parental leave, which was a positive step) there will be precious little of any New Labour legacy. No great problems have been tackled (the NHS and pensions both require radical and fundamental reform) and a few billions (and many lives) have been squandered in Iraq.

RileyDove
2nd Jan 2006, 22:56
Proone - The idea of exporting manufacture offshore isn't new as you say . However the problem we get is that it also errodes our ability to retain gifted
engineers who can problem solve. That is a national trait and several U.K companies retain U.K engineers to problem solve foreign manufacture.
As for farming - well then yes U.K farming has benefitted from EU assistance. But farming used to be seen as an essential industry in the survival of our island. The supermarkets have the ability to airfreight from Egypt and the likes but how long can this continue in an increasingly fuel starved world. The crazy thing is that the subsidies continue at a reduced level and actually promote lower production levels which is directly against
what successive governments have promoted . The level of government personnel employed to make sure that this has happened has also spiralled.
Regards employment - it is completely meaningless to compare unemployment with the past. The only way to get any reality to the figures
is to examine the age of the population and what percentages can be employed. Interestingly you mention that influxes of immigrants help to do the jobs that nobody is prepared to do at the wage level. This also is erroneous - I have a Brazilian friend working here at present - he won't do some of the hotel work because the wages are that low. Therefore Polish
workers do the work at a low rate . The hotel however is financially secure -
it's greed that dictates the low wages - not the ability to pay a better wage. Eventually the Polish workers will get fed up with the wages and another group of immigrants will move in. Pay good wages and the number of people relying on the state will decline even more .

Anotherpost75
3rd Jan 2006, 10:40
http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41175000/jpg/_41175530_eeley203.jpgBLIAR http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41174000/gif/_41174974_blair_video203.gifEELEY


BBC Website, 3 Jan 2006

'A lifetime of feeling breathless'

The Oxford Radcliffe Hospitals NHS Trust has stopped performing a routine heart procedure - a move which wiped around 100 people off its waiting lists.

Only those judged to be desperately in need of cardiac catheter ablation - which corrects irregular heartbeats - will be seen at the John Radcliffe hospital in Oxford.

The trust says it needs to make budget savings but critics accuse it of putting waiting list targets before patient welfare.

When Tony Blair had treatment to correct an irregular heartbeat he was back running the country within days looking, as aides said at the time, "fresh and alert".

For Stephen Eeley, who needs the same procedure, the outlook is far less rosy.

He has been kicked off the waiting list at John Radcliffe Hospital, Oxford, and now faces a future feeling "tired and breathless".

pr00ne
3rd Jan 2006, 20:08
JessTheDog,

I agree, what started out with great promise has indeed delivered very little, Blair will for ever be remembered for the Iraq war, much as he would wish it otherwise!

RileyDove,

By far the majority of products manufactured in low cost locations are conceived, designed and engineered in the UK, it is something that we are very good at, even the Renault Clio is UK designed! There are still three and a half million people employed in the UK manufacturing industry, while indeed lots has gone abroad an awful lot is still here.

Farming is no longer an essential industry, it has not been for a long time now, we have long imported a huge percentage of what we eat, why else do you think we had rationing in WW2?

Your Brazilian friend has obviously grown accustomed to a UK standard of living, there are millions in Brazil whom would not dare dream of earning what even the lowest UK hotel work pays-millions earn nothing in Brazil.
Your argument about paying good wages is laudable, however if you are competing against rivals paying what the Chinese and Vietnamese pay, you will go bankrupt, it’s as simple as that.

highcirrus
17th Jan 2006, 10:26
Bit late, but from Private Eye No 1149, 6 Jan 2006 to show what is happening in what I'm sure Bliar would like to be a "forgotten army".

SANDPIT NEWS

“Delighted British troops in Iraq cheered Tony Blair yesterday after he gave then the perfect Christmas present – news that they are going home”. Oh how many of us choked on our tinned sausages when we read this in the Sun.

After all, some of us had just returned from a two-week deployment in the dodgier bits of Basra and were less than “delighted” to swap a proper rest in our bashers for extra guard duty around the completely safe Divisional HQ watching the prime minister mugging to the cameras.

The only people who got close to him were part of a carefully selected mix of sycophants, gurning squaddies and “soldiers of colour”, including a Fijian choir. Most of these had only been in Iraq for a few weeks.

Those of us who have been here on extended tours know full well that we’ll only be going home when the Iraqis (or Iranians if you’re in the south) can provide their own security, not to mention a police force that is not in cahoots with the insurgents. And that’s going to take years.

As for the perfect Christmas present, some decent kit would be good: we are still having to buy much of our own gear on eBay. Oh and the arrival of our Operation Telic medals, delayed over and over again, would be a welcome seasonal gesture.

’Square Basher’

http://www.number-10.gov.uk/files/gallery/200512221451_MOD%203.jpg
"SMILE FOR THE CAMERA - IT'S GREAT FOR MY POLS"